Inside Out Trees, Silo Op, custom RDWC, water cooled

[Ttystikk]

this thread would rock with pics to go along

When I'm invited to private forums that have better picture loading protocols than this site, I give up on it after awhile. I'm also on RIU, find me in the vertical section under 'vertical goodness'. Lots more pics there, hint to the site admin.

 

[Ichabod Crane]

The other thing to know is that the fuckers come packed for shit. Of the three that have arrived thus far, two were damaged and unusable.

Where are they shipped from? Can they be picked up?

 

[Ttystikk]

Where are they shipped from? Can they be picked up?

Manufactured by another firm in Dallas, then sent to distribution warehouses nationwide. From there UPS drop ships to the customer.

Current score is;
One good
THREE BAD!

 

[Ichabod Crane]

That is horrible odds. How is the return policy?

 

[Ttystikk]

That is horrible odds. How is the return policy?

Folks on the phone seem nice enough, but it's been a solid week and I haven't gotten my first call tag yet. Monday I'm going to call back and mention legal action if things don't start moving faster where my credit card refunds are concerned.

 

[Ttystikk]

I'm on the phone with them again now... I'm kind of on the hook because I'm committed to the build. I'm going to see if I can't find another supplier for a similar unit.

 

[LastHurrah]

Greetings Ttystikk and Everyone Else Here...

I stumbled on the "Water Cooled Growers Unite! thread yesterday and after browsing awhile I came across some of Ttystikk's posts that led me here. Post #3 made me skip all the way to the end and make this post. I'll be going back to the beginning but need to get this down before I forget (stoner short term memory thing).

I have a 9x10 bedroom I am going to convert starting in about two weeks. I've hemmed and hawed about ventilation until I saw an article about water-cooling. It made sense to me. I'll ultimately have about 2500-3000 watts of veg/flower lighting going in the room and know for a definite fact I'll also be using the same Sentinel CHH4 as you for environmental control.

Can you provide a "sequence" of what to purchase and in what order to properly ventilate/cool the room? I don't want to waste any time/money/energy on anything that doesn't make an immediate impact. I know some things need to be purchased as a package for any of the items to work... maybe list those items together.

The room shares a wall with the garage if that makes any difference, and I can run ducting/conduit through that wall at will. The washer/dryer "and water" are on the garage side of the shared wall. I can use the garage for anything I want. There is also a window in the room that I would mount the chiller unit like you mentioned in post #3.

Long post (sorry) but I'm trying to stand on the shoulders of those with more experience. Once the room is up, I'm sure I can give back with some of my knowledge of other gadgets and methods, but I know "I MUST GET THE ENVIRONMENT RIGHT FIRST"! Thanks...

LH

 

[LastHurrah]

Okay, I'm about to turn to page 8 but wanted to add this to my previous post...

I'd like to be able to "scale up", starting with just 1200w of bloom and about 600w of veg fluoros, NOTHING AIR COOLED.

Mr. D's radiator/box fan idea sounds like a perfect start. I'll know for sure as I get further into the thread I guess.

Back to reading...

 

[LastHurrah]

Duh,,, didn't finish my thought. I'd like to be able to scale up to max 4k bloom and 1k veg. Should I get that size chiller right off? Or could I add a second smaller unit when lighting exceeds cooling capacity of first chiller? I won't scale up until demand for my product necessitates.

LH

 

[LSWM]

Hey, LastHurrah! I'm not Ttystikk but I think I can give you some relavant advice.

If you aren't very experienced growing, don't invest in lots of gadgets. Start small and scale up as you learn and make $$. You're gonna need cooling sooner or later but a ventilated room is a great place to start while you're getting your hands dirty.

If you are experienced, then I'm sure Ttystikk can help you out with the water cooling system but you're gonna have to figure a lot more out for yourself versus a simple air conditioner. Look at the problems Ttystikk has had in the last month on these last few pages. He's having to create solutions to problems all on his own.

I'm not trying to shit on water cooling, I think it's great, but it's not a plug n play setup, it's actually really far from it.

 

[LastHurrah]

Hey, LastHurrah! I'm not Ttystikk but I think I can give you some relavant advice.

If you aren't very experienced growing, don't invest in lots of gadgets. Start small and scale up as you learn and make $$. You're gonna need cooling sooner or later but a ventilated room is a great place to start while you're getting your hands dirty.

If you are experienced, then I'm sure Ttystikk can help you out with the water cooling system but you're gonna have to figure a lot more out for yourself versus a simple air conditioner. Look at the problems Ttystikk has had in the last month on these last few pages. He's having to create solutions to problems all on his own.

I'm not trying to shit on water cooling, I think it's great, but it's not a plug n play setup, it's actually really far from it.

LSWM, I appreciate that. I've had experience in rooms other folks have set up, and in tents. This is the first room I am building on my own dime in a space I have no worries about. I do know from experience that environment is everything (next to genetics ). That being said, I want to build the room without later saying "dammit, I shoulda...", hence the bit about scalability. I'm starting with around 1200 watts of bloom to see how easy it is to maintain the climate. If all is well, I can duplicate that on the other side of the room.

Seems like the water cooling idea (at least cooling this few watts) would give me the best option of sealing my room without going the mini-split option (still on the table). I just want to do it right. I'm inland NorCal and its arid in the 90s-100s for a very long summer here.

I am very open to other options to consider. I'm very comfortable with traditional in/out exhaust setups. It's finally cold enough to draw in cool filtered outdoor air to cool the room adequately at night (I think... have to test with lights on) while I put together cooling for the warmer months starting as early as late Feb.

Long post, I'm done. Thanks again for the reply.

 

[Ttystikk]

LSWM, I appreciate that. I've had experience in rooms other folks have set up, and in tents. This is the first room I am building on my own dime in a space I have no worries about. I do know from experience that environment is everything (next to genetics ). That being said, I want to build the room without later saying "dammit, I shoulda...", hence the bit about scalability. I'm starting with around 1200 watts of bloom to see how easy it is to maintain the climate. If all is well, I can duplicate that on the other side of the room.

Seems like the water cooling idea (at least cooling this few watts) would give me the best option of sealing my room without going the mini-split option (still on the table). I just want to do it right. I'm inland NorCal and its arid in the 90s-100s for a very long summer here.

I am very open to other options to consider. I'm very comfortable with traditional in/out exhaust setups. It's finally cold enough to draw in cool filtered outdoor air to cool the room adequately at night (I think... have to test with lights on) while I put together cooling for the warmer months starting as early as late Feb.

Long post, I'm done. Thanks again for the reply.

Okay, so minimum requirements from the top; you'll want a 2 Ton chiller, two 2 Ton water cooled air handlers, and some way to get dry heat into the room at night. This can be electric, hot water baseboard heat, whatever. This component is essential to the ability to control nighttime temps and RH, and it cannot be feasibly skipped. Lord knows I tried, LOL! Fail to control nighttime temps and you'll fail to control RH... and then you'll have a powdery mildew problem.

This recognition of the need for nighttime heat is what led me to my recent installation of a heat pump. The good news is that it will provide summertime AC for the household for the first time since the house was constructed, and will heat the house and many other things all winter with the heat removed from my grow. If it sounds like a machine for saving money on HVAC costs, you've got the right idea!

The bad news is that just as you've heard above, this is not a temporary or short term solution. You might as well do as I did and get a unit that will support the house HVAC as well. Therefore, it's permanent and expensive up front, even if it will provide for all of your home and grow related HVAC needs while saving big money on utility bills.

A 2 Ton chiller and electric heat might make more sense. That's not a bad solution; you can use the rejected heat from the chiller to warm any number of spaces in your home, as long as you can get a pair of water lines there.

Next up; you'll need a cold side water circulation system. This will supply your WCAH, cold coils in RDWC and do the condensation part of the dehuey cycle. This requires a drum or tank as a cold water reservoir- should be insulated- and a pump to circulate water. Don't use one of these lil aquarium toys for the job; you'll want a quarter horse waterpump from Flotec or Gould, as long as everything is on the same floor. You'll want a half horse if your setup is in the basement and your chiller is sticking out the window on the ground floor.

Res feeds pump, pump output goes through chiller, chiller output goes to a supply manifold to deliver water to WCAH and cold coils... ..then back to the return manifold, to be sent back to the cold water storage tank.

Still with me? Cool! Now you're gonna want 5 gallon buckets or bigger under your WCAH drain, mine do 5-10 gallons of condensate daily (I have big, thirsty plants!). This is zero ppm, absolutely the best water for plants you'll find anywhere, just use it within 48 hours to keep it from breeding algae. WTF is RO water, again? LOL

Plug your WCAH into your sentinel environmental controller and set it to cool. Whatever you use for nighttime heating, plug in that relay to the controller as well; do NOT attempt to pass the amps needed for electric heat through the unit! Set nighttime temps at the same as daytime.

Forget the RH output for now, because you set that with the water temperature setting on your chiller. I'd suggest 48°F with a 5°F rise as a place to start. Every setup is different so those settings may well change and that's fine if it works.

Oh yeah... there's a lot more- but this will get you started. If I haven't scared you off yet, you're either getting ready to go commercial or you're as crazy as I am!

Finally, remember that the biggest advantage of a water cooling system is that you can use the same chiller and water system to cool two rooms on a flip schedule without the need for an increase in cooling capacity. Food for thought.

 

[Ttystikk]

Aaaaaaaand now for news you can use from the underground dudes;

My builder has all the components for the COB LED build in hand and is doing final assembly. I should have them just in time to blind the Fuck outta Santa!

And a new personal best; the monster bubblegum, nicknamed 'the hydra' for its many huge cola heads, weighed in at 26 1/4oz. That's a rounding error from one and two thirds pounds! That's without CO², without adequate nighttime climate management and certainly without LED lighting.

WITH all of those in place? I'm betting I can hit three. Any takers?

 

[OliverKlozoff]

Congrats, which version of bubblegum are you running?

 

[Ttystikk]

Congrats, which version of bubblegum are you running?

Clueless...

 

[Ttystikk]

Congrats, which version of bubblegum are you running?

Update; mine sounds like the ISS bubblegum description; good bubblegum smell that doesn't disappear in the cure, big and fluffy.

I can add that she responds vigorously to training.

 

[Ttystikk]

Today's update and word of wisdom is to stay away from Eagle Supply. Of the original four air handlers sent to me, EVERY ONE OF THEM was defective in some way. Two could be fixed, the others got scavenged for parts and I already have call tags for their return. Only one is as yet installed, but it does work very well indeed.

The hot side manifolds are in place, parts are coming to complete the main trunk and should be up and ready for hot water circuit installs next week. I'm really looking forward to getting the hot water radiator/forced air circuit going for the main floor, so I can shut off the noisy chiller in my office! Additional circuits will service the hot water storage tank and six separate circuits of baseboard heating throughout the basement.

There's four more valved outlets that will supply hot water for more fun stuff as time goes on and I catch up on current projects.

 

[Ttystikk]

Gotta love you guys; I get a single plant pull of over one and a half I get a collective yawn.

Wondering what I have to do to actually get a reaction out of people around here? LOL

 

[Miraculous Meds]

Gotta love you guys; I get a single plant pull of over one and a half I get a collective yawn.

Wondering what I have to do to actually get a reaction out of people around here? LOL

Its all bout the pics if u want a response. How much wattage did u use to get that?

 

[Ttystikk]

Its all bout the pics if u want a response. How much wattage did u use to get that?

You're right, of course. It's just that this website is such a PITA to load pics on!

5x 860W CDM lamps /6 plants = about 715W. Not gonna set the world on fire, but pretty respectable for less than 30W/ft².