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HQI's...
- Thread starter Cannarado
- Start date
... So does anyone else have something to add? Its not "Just another name". CMH is different then MH. Otherwise, it wouldnt have the C. It also wouldnt be different if you cant run them all on all the same ballast. Of course its the same "Technology" but its different. Like i said... more light, more UV, different spectrums.
This isnt "Which bulb is better" this is just like the CMH thread - something totally different that i find no information on other then heat. Looks like it could lead to heat issues but otherwise looks like a great idea to try... if the bulbs werent like $80 lol.
This isnt "Which bulb is better" this is just like the CMH thread - something totally different that i find no information on other then heat. Looks like it could lead to heat issues but otherwise looks like a great idea to try... if the bulbs werent like $80 lol.
Im not to sure you know what your talking about... they are some of the MOST expensive bulbs i've seen - Period.
Search '400w HQI' - http://www.google.com/products/cata...TLulGYb0MZSAlYUF&sa=title&ved=0CBoQ8wIwBTgA#p
Cheapest bulb is $30... plus S&H. I paid $15 out the door for my bulb. How are they cheaper again? And i actually end up contradicting myself... looks as tho HQI produces LESS heat. Reading aquarium stuff it does allow more light penetration because of less heat and you can get them closer.
Growing a reef > Growing pot. If aquairums say HQI are a better light - i'd believe it over some stoner telling me its a different name for a MH lamp.
After a bit further on reading, looks like you can really push some P.A.R. with these things. Tons of different set ups. Im also learning a ton about bulb specs and such... Looks like many people on here are very damaging to bulbs - Some require igniters and some dont, some should have UV glass some dont... all sorts of crazyness.
The energy effectiveness comes from ballast - not bulb. And as i found over and over and over, HQI is actually cooler then T5's. You get less depth on it and a smaller footprint (thus why GREAT for aquariums) but i think it'd be perfect for micro grows and such.
P.S. - How could it be a cheap quick fix when A) The bulbs are super expensive and B) Most HQI's are DE bulbs. Sooo.... huh?
Search '400w HQI' - http://www.google.com/products/cata...TLulGYb0MZSAlYUF&sa=title&ved=0CBoQ8wIwBTgA#p
Cheapest bulb is $30... plus S&H. I paid $15 out the door for my bulb. How are they cheaper again? And i actually end up contradicting myself... looks as tho HQI produces LESS heat. Reading aquarium stuff it does allow more light penetration because of less heat and you can get them closer.
Growing a reef > Growing pot. If aquairums say HQI are a better light - i'd believe it over some stoner telling me its a different name for a MH lamp.
After a bit further on reading, looks like you can really push some P.A.R. with these things. Tons of different set ups. Im also learning a ton about bulb specs and such... Looks like many people on here are very damaging to bulbs - Some require igniters and some dont, some should have UV glass some dont... all sorts of crazyness.
The energy effectiveness comes from ballast - not bulb. And as i found over and over and over, HQI is actually cooler then T5's. You get less depth on it and a smaller footprint (thus why GREAT for aquariums) but i think it'd be perfect for micro grows and such.
P.S. - How could it be a cheap quick fix when A) The bulbs are super expensive and B) Most HQI's are DE bulbs. Sooo.... huh?
energy efficiency is a bulb thing too dude.. a 400w bulb producing 130w of light is more efficient than a 400w bulb producing just 100w of light - simple thing
and about your other salad, comparisons with just one attendant? i dont get it.
HQI = phase-out models - no but no if no super nice new technology stuff.
and about your other salad, comparisons with just one attendant? i dont get it.
HQI = phase-out models - no but no if no super nice new technology stuff.
Salad? Phase out? hmm... have anything other then your word tho? I hear nothing but priase from aquairum users...
Ok... so can you tell me just how much energy each bulb is putting out vs. what its using? I cant - but i can with ballast. and im pretty sure the larger difference is going to come from there, rather then the bulb. And im not worried about wattage - i care how it works for what im using it for. I dont care if my option was a 400w bulb that uses 200w, or a 400w bulb that uses 40000w... but the latter is better to grow with -- I'll take the energy consumption for the useage.
Of all my research, everything goes against everything you have to say. So why should i take you're word over the other one's im reading? Your not proving anything, just telling me...
P.S. - Never said anything about being new technology. Just trying to discuss possible useage and application. I claim it to be the leading edge as it seems in salt water HQI > MH > T5 where as fresh water T5 > HQI > MH -- Unless you want to get into the nitty gritty and talk about what coals work with better light... then at times MH > HQI and even T5 > everything. Pending depth of tank, canopy or not, ect ect - But im talking pot here, not aquairum.
Ok... so can you tell me just how much energy each bulb is putting out vs. what its using? I cant - but i can with ballast. and im pretty sure the larger difference is going to come from there, rather then the bulb. And im not worried about wattage - i care how it works for what im using it for. I dont care if my option was a 400w bulb that uses 200w, or a 400w bulb that uses 40000w... but the latter is better to grow with -- I'll take the energy consumption for the useage.
Of all my research, everything goes against everything you have to say. So why should i take you're word over the other one's im reading? Your not proving anything, just telling me...
P.S. - Never said anything about being new technology. Just trying to discuss possible useage and application. I claim it to be the leading edge as it seems in salt water HQI > MH > T5 where as fresh water T5 > HQI > MH -- Unless you want to get into the nitty gritty and talk about what coals work with better light... then at times MH > HQI and even T5 > everything. Pending depth of tank, canopy or not, ect ect - But im talking pot here, not aquairum.
everything goes against everything i have to say?
please enlighten me and show me my mistakes so i can learn.. im honest
and btw; your not going to grow plants under water, do you?
once again:
HQI = MH
CMH = BETTER THAN MH (LONGER LIFE, BETTER EFFICIENCY)
T5 = ALMOST ON PAR WITH MH BUT LESS LAMBERT (LONGER LIFE, CLOSE TO MH EFFICIENCY)
please enlighten me and show me my mistakes so i can learn.. im honest
and btw; your not going to grow plants under water, do you?
once again:
HQI = MH
CMH = BETTER THAN MH (LONGER LIFE, BETTER EFFICIENCY)
T5 = ALMOST ON PAR WITH MH BUT LESS LAMBERT (LONGER LIFE, CLOSE TO MH EFFICIENCY)
I'll chime in here, as I have several SPS Saltwater tanks for the last 10 years.
Plants underwater.. actually yes sort of, coral. Hard coral specifically (SPS coral, small polyp stony coral). Although they are not plants, but animals that can behave like plants, they require INTENSE lighting to keep them alive in optimal circumstances (as well as proper PH levels, nutrient levels, phytoplankton etc etc). So lighting can directly relate with growing as well. I am absolutely floored with how much EQ i could carry over from my saltwater tanks, and methodology. DIY RO/DI systems, hydro systems (ours we can compare to sumps and skimmer box with returns), all the pumps I have laying around, some 2600 gph and higher, lighting the list goes on, its amazing.
HQI = Hydrargyrum Quartz Iodide
So an HID mercury vapor bulb, as Hydrargyrum is latin for mercury. So in essence, yes an MH.
So, main difference with HQI we care about in SW and for growing, are the double ended bulbs. You "can" get single ended HQI. Regular setups are mogul based. It is true that in the SW industry, HQI DE setups are pretty much the top of the line when it comes to lumens and PAR and penetration. Heat and size are a HUGE factor as well. you can get 3 or 4 HQI units under 75 gallon tank better then you can 3 or 4 MH single ended bulbs and reflectors. Most HQI units are enclosed with UV glass and can come with built in fans.
Generally a good 250w double ended HQI setup puts out as many lumens as a standard 400w MH bulb. AT LEAST WITH THE BULBS WE TEST. Which are generally quite a bit more blue, and can run in the range up to a 20k bulb. We also use a 10k and sometimes 6500k for the more light demanding coral. And the units are generally smaller.
We also care about PAR, NM range and how far the light can penetrate, not just lumen output. Larger (taller) tanks need stronger light to reach the bottom of the tank, which can be 48" or more on larger tanks.
This is our general rule for sizing the right lights for our tanks so that enough light reaches the bottom of the tank when using proper reflectors. HQI adds to these numbers for our tanks.
150w: up to 20" deep
250w: up to 30" deep
400w: up to 48" deep
Ushio's 250w HQI 4200k can put out 20,000 lumens on an m80 ballast. Tested to death to actually generate this as well. And also, a 400w HQI is not a common thing to come by, and neither are decent bulbs.
Ushio 250w HQI Double Ended 10k is around 20,000 lumens.
Ushio 250w MH Single Ended 10k is around 18,000 lumens.
Hortilux 250w MH 6500k is around 18,000 lumens.
Hortilux 250w HPS 2100k is around 30,000 lumens.
Ushio 400w MH Single Ended 10k is around 18,500 lumens.
Hortilux 400w HPS put out, what? 58,000 lumens?
Make what you will of the numbers.
Im not saying either is better, just adding some info to the thread is all.
HQI > MH/T5HO >T5SO
T5HO can be on par with MH as long as you use individual reflectors, debatable with HQI. Won't get into it. Ongoing debate amongst SW enthusiasts is lighting.
As far as T5 being on par with MH, only if they are high output IMO. Standard Output T5 to me doesnt hold up to any comparable MH application with proper reflector and bulb. BUT price is a huge factor between them all. T5SO are the cheapest. T5HO and MH can run nearly the same depending on the unit.
Heres a nice pic. Guy had some kalk problems (thats why it's cloudy), no biggie, but this shows a nice little piece of of info. On the two ends of his tank are 250w single ended MH bulbs. In the middle is an HQI bulb. All the same wattage, 250w.
That was a great read... and deffinitaly makes me want to try this. I have a Lumatek that dim's to 250w, so maybe i'll just stick with that and try for S&G. I like doing S.O.G. grows, so thats why i was so interested. My biggest worry seems to be coverage.
Good to finally hear from someone with some use with them. Im jelious that you've played with many saltwater's... I just had to get rid of my lil freshwater 55gal. I want to do a nice freshwater plantscape and then have a few small saltwater's. Thanks again.
Good to finally hear from someone with some use with them. Im jelious that you've played with many saltwater's... I just had to get rid of my lil freshwater 55gal. I want to do a nice freshwater plantscape and then have a few small saltwater's. Thanks again.
G
guest456mpy
You know Canarado, Mercury Vapor lights were the first HID's I used in the early 80's, very old technology. Mercury is in the Halide column of the periodic table of elements. We couldn't wait for the color balanced HID lamps to be more readily available back then. The double ended style lamp is the only advantage, and then mostly for aquarium work, unless you also happen to own some older scientific equipment lile microscopes, etc. If you want to take a backwards step, be my guest!
OSRAM, for your information, is Siemens lamp division. They make a lot of unusual and discontinued type lamps for scientific use.
Have fun stepping backwards in time.
OSRAM, for your information, is Siemens lamp division. They make a lot of unusual and discontinued type lamps for scientific use.
Have fun stepping backwards in time.
In many ways... i wished i could. Was paying less for much better buds. Not to mention, then parts i would need for my vehicles and such would be much more available and my tool set could be better and not made in china... I wished i could take ya up on that.
Newer doesnt always equal better. How double ended is a advantage is beyond me. But other then being old... why would it be a waste? From what i see... its at least as good as a standard MH... so what am i losing? It seems the double ended are a bit better, but at that all i would need is the bulb and socket - nothing else would change. And considering what people get with CFL's... i just dont see how it wouldnt be worth my time just to play with it.
It seems the only argument against it is that its old. Well, i sure hope none of ya'll are using magnetic ballast cause gee, i'd hate to have to use that old crap technology. And dont forget you're digilux bulb because standard HPS lamps have been used in street lights for many years.
G
guest456mpy
originally posted by Cannarado...
Carbon rod arc lamps and lime light spots are even older technology, that just has to make them better right?
No, as I previously posted, we couldn't wait for the color corrected HID's to become available...READ THE WHOLE POST BEFORE POSTING.
It seems the only argument against it is that its old.
Carbon rod arc lamps and lime light spots are even older technology, that just has to make them better right?
What do you mean by "Color corrected"? To me, thats like looking for "Full spectrum" which you just cant quite get with lamps... thats all the sun. Theres a reason most use MH veg, HPS flower. What if i dont want "Color corrected"?
Not saying all old things are better, but you act as if what we're using now is state of the art only been around a few months when well... its been use all over.
Im not looking for this to be the end all lamp. Im not acting like the CMH thread where this lamp trumps all. Just a thought. I see great potential in this bulb. Looking for more of a discussion moreso then bashing.
Not saying all old things are better, but you act as if what we're using now is state of the art only been around a few months when well... its been use all over.
Im not looking for this to be the end all lamp. Im not acting like the CMH thread where this lamp trumps all. Just a thought. I see great potential in this bulb. Looking for more of a discussion moreso then bashing.
G
guest456mpy
MHID's ARE color corected to look like the sun. Mercury lamps are blue green.
Look, no-one is bashing them.
They've been available since before the 60's, cheaper than any other halide lamp, yet no-one uses them to grow. Ask yourself why?
I'm done here, use a candle if you want!
Look, no-one is bashing them.
They've been available since before the 60's, cheaper than any other halide lamp, yet no-one uses them to grow. Ask yourself why?
I'm done here, use a candle if you want!
G
guest456mpy
Oh, by the way..
I now use a 500 watt home built LED set that blows away any MHID lamp of equivilant wattage. Notice how I purposely didn't try to steer you to the newest and best technology, just one that provided adequate performance for a good price.
I now use a 500 watt home built LED set that blows away any MHID lamp of equivilant wattage. Notice how I purposely didn't try to steer you to the newest and best technology, just one that provided adequate performance for a good price.
