Guys, I can taste the chemicals in my food...

[immaculate]

Notice how they say "IF IT IS AVAILABLE". It barely is anymore and soon won't be.

Wake up.

I don't know if I can read that right now. I'd be on some beavis shit. And I'm out of smoke so this shit is making me all hyper. Gotta go hang a lamp, clean the room, pop some beans...

 

[grapeman]

Neem oil can be safely consumed in its own right. Those specialty pestacides can not. Organic is about preserving the part of the food web that plants are evolved to depend on. I'm not saying that I can taste chemicals (except in milk) However if I go to the store and get a chemically fed pomagranite it doesn't have close to the amount of flavor that its organic counterpart would have. Also part of the idea is to produce a healthier plant that can resisit a certain amount of pests on its own. In addition neem oil doesn't cause frogs to mutate and male fish to grow ovaries. It also doesn't kill everything in the ground and require subsequent applications which build up to the point of running off into nearby bodies of water there by poisoning them.

Food poisoning is nothing new. However it is factory farming practices and the distribution facilities attached to them that make it go epidemic.

Your belief that neem oil, by default, is safer then man made pesticides just displays your ignorance of pesticides.

We agree that a healthier plant is more resistent to pests and diseases, a logical statement.

But then you bring the tired old bullshit frog argument to the table. Show me what pesticide in use today on fruits or veggies in the U.S. is causing frog deformities.
sigh.

Then you falsely claim that neem does not require repeated applications. I have organic farmer friends that laugh at peoples contentions that neem is safer then new targeted products. But as long as the "Whole foods" crowd thinks pesticides are dangerous, they have a "false" market for their products.

It would be helpful to your argument if you actually knew some facts other then just regurgitating bullshit from a tired green movement.

Today's pesticides are safer then ever to both the environment and to man. So safe, you cannot give any scientific facts to the contrary. In fact, if you actually knew facts, you would know DDT was a good pesticide also, but that is another argument.

Get some facts together and try again.

 

[immaculate]

The entire U.S. population is exposed on a daily basis to numerous agricultural chemicals. Many of these chemicals are known or suspected of having either carcinogenic or endocrine-disrupting properties. The following sections describe the agricultural workforce, the population group most heavily exposed to these chemicals, and hazards associated with specific agricultural chemicals and veterinary pharmaceuticals.

, From your report

 

[immaculate]

The point is long-term exposure. Of course no one is going to eat a single apple and die. But if you die after eating 20, well, its easier to shift blame and responsibility that way, especially in a bureaucratic clusterfucked corporate monstrosity.

Mark Ruben has been working for Nature's Best Pest Management for 16 years. The company started in 1978, and they have specialized in organic pest control for the past seven years. Ruben is a strong believer in choosing organic and natural pesticides because of the possible dangers associated with chemical pesticides. There's not just the danger of yourself and your family being exposed to a chemical to be considered, but what might happen if the family pet is exposed as well. Most times, he says, consumers forget that a pet can transfer harmful chemicals as well.

"If you spray chemicals on your grass, what happens?" he asks. "Your dog walks on the grass and comes back inside. His feet start getting a little tingly so he starts licking himself. I do not know about you, but my dog
kisses me all the time. There are also the animals that get on people's beds or lay on the carpet
with the children. It is like cross contamination."

Not to be misunderstood, Ruben is by no means saying that having your lawn treated with pesticides and then letting your pet walk on the grass could cause immediate harm. But, he did mention that after a lengthy period of time, a continuous happening of these events could result in some health problems down the road.

"This contamination would be in a small amount and not toxic," he explains. "However, the years build up. These chemicals can build up in the lymph nodes, kidneys, and liver. It becomes harder and harder for you to break the chemicals out of your body."

 

[immaculate]

Regulated chemicals in drinking water include 53 organic chemicals (e.g., atrazine, benzene), 16 inorganic chemicals (e.g., arsenic, nitrate), 7 disinfection by-products (e.g., trihalomethanes), 6 microorganisms (e.g., cryptosporidium), and 4 radionuclides (e.g., alpha particles from radon, radium).
54 2008–2009 ANNUAL REPORT | PRESIDENT’S CANCER PANEL
However, an analysis265 of more than two million drinking water test results acquired from 42 state water offices found 260 contaminants in tap water. Of these, 141 contaminants have no safety standards. Forty (40) of the unregulated contaminants were detected in tap water consumed by at least one million people.

Don't drink the fuckin' water in this country. And if you think your Brita filter does anything, you're wrong.


Explain me this logic, you "debunkers." In a contained weather-system, how is that hundreds of years of blatant abuse to it by the millions of chemicals doesn't produce any impact? You think the 3 million people pissing out antidepressants and getting it filtered back in to the water isn't happening? Smog just "disappears?" That oil from the oil spill "goes away?" No, it's built up in our fucking BODIES!

But I will PROMISE YOU THIS: There are some that aren't worried. There are some that are for all intents and purposes perfectly healthy. You see those numerous $3,000 plates of food they throw away on shows like "Top Chef." You see the asshole judges taking a little pussy bite, moving their mouth quickly like the mandibles of an insect, and then throwing all of that exotic food in the trash. Someone is eating like that for breakfast, lunch, and dinner, and for snacks too. Guess what. All the rest of us aren't. Wake up, assholes. I wish it was 1800 again. We made it this far. Don't say stupid shit in response to that like "we would all have smallpox and toothaches." Please. READ about the AMA. Learn the history. I'm talking go take a few hours and sit up in the library at your local university, browse journal archives, read medicinal histories.

 

[immaculate]

Today's pesticides are safer then ever to both the environment and to man. So safe, you cannot give any scientific facts to the contrary. In fact, if you actually knew facts, you would know DDT was a good pesticide also, but that is another argument.

Get some facts together and try again.

You're fucked in the head. You must be drinking cups of DDT over there.

 

[immaculate]

I mean, that's the same stupid fucking argument that its okay to put rat poison in food. "It's only in small amounts that the DDT would be used effectively" First of all, there's no way to use a chemical like DDT in "small amounts"...what are we talking about here killing mosquitos or spraying hundreds of thousands of acres? i dont want any exposure to potentially harmful shit. several years build up and you're cooked.

 

[immaculate]

In the wake of fears of "West-Nile" and Bird Flu they wanted to bring back DDT...you fucking dipshit, go drink some battery acid. There's no research that needs to be done there.

 

[xmobotx]

bureaucratic clusterfucked corporate monstrosity.

immaculate - you are 100% correct here

the nuances of just how bad a given pesticide alone may be - or some corporate whitewash to make their "product" appear harmless so they can continue to sell it in huge quantity (then gain on the pharma end when you get sick from it) should influence no one's common sense grasp on the reality that "if it is harmful to the bug - it might hurt us too"

i avoid neem, pyrethrins et al on that basis (but will use them if i feel it necessary *unlikely)

i avoid commercial pesticide absolutely - and i will tell people in the store to avoid it

We are poisoning our grandkids - and starting to realize the effects of being poisoned by our grandparents

to quote Lamb of God, "it's only getting worse."

ICC is run by Columbia University’s Presbyterian Hospital in affiliation with Catholic Home Charities through the Archdiocese of New York.

interesting to me that such corrupt org as presbyterian and catholic charities are involved in this madness

 

[grapeman]

The point is long-term exposure. Of course no one is going to eat a single apple and die. But if you die after eating 20, well, its easier to shift blame and responsibility that way, especially in a bureaucratic clusterfucked corporate monstrosity.

Bullshit. And natures best has a vested interest in peddling bullshit. You're just gullible enough to believe their bullshit and post bullshit.

Do some fucking research instead of regurgitating crap

 

[Chief]

fuck pesticides, theyre the next asbestos lol

 

[Quiet_Riot]

Grapeman>>

You wouldn't happen to be a orange (or grape) farmer, would you?

Ignorant? Well, then I guess this countrys different health organisations, government-testing labs, newspapers ect are ignorant too, because this is where I got that info.

2 years ago a study was made, 73% of EU fruits and over 80% of non-EU fruits had pesticides in them.
Maybe not 20-30 different ones, but thats the "record" for how many different strains of pesticides found, and keep in mind, sometimes theres other pesticides on the fruits/greens ect, which the lab testing for it, doesn't know about.
The "standard" for how many is 2-5 different ones.

3 out of 6 oranges contains pesticides. It's said that app 90% of it is on the outer surface, and the rest is in the fruit itself.

Only organic/ECO oranges had non of this shit in them.

You call pesticides "safe" and "more safe" than older forms, well, that may be somewhat true, but don't call them safer, they are "less harmful", not safer.

And if you can't smell that faint chem/soap smell, you properly smoked too much to smell it, maybe your lucky to have non-sprayed fruits, maybe it just odorless. Or maybe my senses are just more developed than yours.

 

[AndreNicky]

Do some fucking research instead of regurgitating crap

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/706374


Other snipits of various studies:
In 1999 European researchers found that Swedish sufferers of non-Hodgkin's lymphoma were 2.7 times more likely to have been exposed to the herbicide MCPA (found in weed and feed type products) and 2.3 times more likely to have been exposed to the herbicide glyphosate (Round-Up).

According to a Health Canada study of 97 Ontario farmers, 2,4-D, the most common weedkiller on Canadian lawns and golf courses, is often absorbed into the semen of men who spray the pesticide and then passed on to their partners during sex.
The Ontario farmers were not so bad compared with farmers in Argentina, whose 2,4-D levels were as much as 300 times higher than those of Ontario men. The men in Argentina had significant damage to their sperm cells. 2,4-D has been used extensively for the past 40 years


Seems like the research indicates danger. We don't even know the long term effects of recent pesticides, so how can you be so sure they are safe? I guess you could always trust the people who sell them

 

[grapeman]

Grapeman>>

You wouldn't happen to be a orange (or grape) farmer, would you?

Ignorant? Well, then I guess this countrys different health organisations, government-testing labs, newspapers ect are ignorant too, because this is where I got that info.

2 years ago a study was made, 73% of EU fruits and over 80% of non-EU fruits had pesticides in them.
Maybe not 20-30 different ones, but thats the "record" for how many different strains of pesticides found, and keep in mind, sometimes theres other pesticides on the fruits/greens ect, which the lab testing for it, doesn't know about.
The "standard" for how many is 2-5 different ones.

3 out of 6 oranges contains pesticides. It's said that app 90% of it is on the outer surface, and the rest is in the fruit itself.

Only organic/ECO oranges had non of this shit in them.

You call pesticides "safe" and "more safe" than older forms, well, that may be somewhat true, but don't call them safer, they are "less harmful", not safer.

And if you can't smell that faint chem/soap smell, you properly smoked too much to smell it, maybe your lucky to have non-sprayed fruits, maybe it just odorless. Or maybe my senses are just more developed than yours.

Most of your fruit and veggies come from south africa or the Mediterranean area. You don't know shit about the testing and controls here in the USA. Sorry, you and the above posters can post all the baloney you want and call me all the names you want, but I know more then all of you combined on this subject. BTW, it's not whether or not is has pesticide, it's the ppm's that are important. Now we test in PPB's. In any event, as I said before, the newer pesticides have short half lives and are not detectable by the time they get to market. But the e-coli from your organic spinach is still there. And I've grown that crop also.

And you are all flat out fucking wrong. And yes, DDT was a good product. And yes it was over used. Mostly by the governments of the world in the '50's and '60's. And yes it did cause problems. but no, it does not cause problems in very low doses. In fact, it saves millions of lives.

You are all stuck in the 1960's with your flowery bullshit. I don't really care. all you do is help the inefficient organic guys stay in business by paying more for less. It's a niche market, and you idiots are the end users of the scam. Spend a little time and see how the organic folks change the rules to use growth regulators and such just so they can stay in business and still call their products organic so they can sell it to uninformed people. The best farmers use both organic and non organic methods.

Sigh. Ignorance bolstered by false intellect is a dangerous combination. It's on parade here.

 

[bipotato]

Are you dead yet?

 

[sackoweed]

As i sit here and look around wearing my tinfoil hat..

 

[m00nchild]

I didn't even read the whole thread for various reasons, but I'm going to go ahead and respond... there's only ONE correct response for your dilemma:

THEN GROW YOUR OWN FOOD!

Seriously. I used to think the same thing, but once you start growing your own fruits and vegetables, you can then start taking your surplus down to whatever local farmer's market you have, and trade it for things that you can't or didn't grow yourself. By doing this, I am able to pretty much eat nothing but organic produce and locally-grown grains. I'm not vegetarian, so I still eat meat, but we get our meat from a little muslim butcher shop nearby, because muslims are very strict about how animals must live, be fed, and be killed, in order to eat them. They also say prayers and stuff, but unless you're an asshole hater, you can't really be put off by that. My point is, the meat you get from muslims tastes WAY better and different than regular old slaughterhouse meat. I'm not a muslim, just thought I'd throw that out there.

So seriously, grow your own food. Fuck whole foods market and all the "organic" aisles everywhere. Grow your own organic food and be done with it. If you think you are unable to grow food wherever you live, like if you live in an apartment or something, then visit www.windowfarms.org to prove yourself wrong.

 

[AndreNicky]

I know more then all of you combined on this subject.

 

[Arkitekt]

If you think that there isn't harmful chemicals or pesticide residue in the non-organic food you eat, then you're just ignorant, as this has been proven in tests, again and again. It's not uncommon. It's not just in food either, it's in water as well.

If you don't know where to find the research papers that prove this, take the easy route, watch a movie. Like For The Love of Water and Food Inc. These are not conspiracy theorist movies, they're not exaggerated.

Seattle PI, January 30, 2008: Andrew Schneider. A study found that the urine and saliva of Mercer Island children eating conventional food contained markers of a family of brain-damaging pesticides.

PDP data from 1994-96 were further evaluated for the presence of pesticides in 19 foods frequently eaten by children. This analysis focused on detections of carcinogenic and neurotoxic pesticides. Twenty-five percent of the samples had detectable levels of carcinogenic pesticides, and 34 percent had detectable levels of neurotoxic pesticides (not shown).

http://yosemite.epa.gov/ochp/ochpweb.nsf/content/food_contam.htm

Saying people should just shut the fuck up, grow their own food, and not complain - that's just dumb. Some of us think bigger than just ourselves, we think about others too. And fact is it's just not possible for everyone to grow all the food they need to sustain life. Most people in the world live in urban areas, most people don't have gardens, if you think a grow in your window or even a couple of rooms will be enough food for you and your family you're mistaken.

Fighting for healthier food is something worth doing.

Do you think cancer happens by magic, do you think cell mutations happen by accident, at random? Well, it don't, cell mutations happen by induction. And what's doing it is the shit in our air, food and water.

 

[johnnyla]

how many people actually have the ability to eat 100% organic all the time?

A lot of people, especially if your living in cali. I get my food cheaper from the farmers market then i could get it at the grocery store and its all organic

cool which one? did you know a lot of the food sold at farmers markets is conventional? just sayin'.