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Gorilla Glue #4
- Thread starter RB26
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More Pics of DUDS... If your ladies ever look like this... toss em
Here is a pic of a 60 day and a 38 day veg plant. So far I have had no issues with her. Every cut I have taken look just like these do. I have cloned her since 12/2012. When I got her dialed in the yields have been very similar. The only 1 that had a major diff in yield was the plant that got a 87 day veg. Since all the dudd cuts of GG#4 have been replaced no one has reported it happening again ??. I know the duddisim is real. I hope the cause is found..
The s1
The s1
nice post
very well worded and thought out
but you have no experience with dudds.
you get some dudd experience, you will change your mindset.
YOU WILL. hahahahahaha
i am not discounting your gardening experience or your knowledge base that you have locked in your cabeza - you have probably forgot more than I will ever remember about gardening. but you don't have ANY hands on experience with dudds.
in my own, and others' horrible experience with dudds, it's been found that it is not relegated to liquid fertilizer fed plants. a first cousin of mine in ca runs an organic grow where he works with soil he's been working with/on for 10+ years. all he does is add water. no cal mag. no silica. no nothing. he doesnt even check the ph. He's not the only one getting dudds - there are other organic growers who despise bottled products having the same issues. Because of that I cannot not buy into the "sold on gimmicks" or "blame the nutrient market" line of reasoning. Its a 'feel good' theory, but it just doesnt hold hippy tears very well.
have you been over to the farm? theres a thread about this topic, and member Delae632's post (#96) details things quite well. the pics whatthe215 posted here are from delae632's post, but the text (of that post, as well as the thread as a whole) you may find interesting and informative, too. Or it could solidify your opinion on N toxicity. Either way it wouldn't hurt to check out more perspective derived from experience. whether its "just" laymen's experience, or controlled.
aloha
ps: another organic grower with dudd trouble!!!!
https://www.icmag.com/ic/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=6440880
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Never mind, I'm not use to that area. It starts out with the pm box at the top..
Never mind, I'm not use to that area. It starts out with the pm box at the top..
Here is a pic of the OG Mango X GG#4. This looks like the SB genetics from the GG#4?..Both are stinkers...
That plant looks very purdy PF..
S1's look great! What are you feeding these ladies?
OMG this thread is about to implode now milky....
It could all go to shit in a most gg4 or not...but why ask for it?
Oh huh cuz some one else paid for the shipping ....
And it uh won the cup, bro..lol
Oh huh cuz some one else paid for the shipping ....
And it uh won the cup, bro..lol
@PF
Leafs are looking very similar to SB. And they look pretty stocky from what i can tell. And stinky is a good sign too.
I wouldnt mind poppin some of those man
.
Leafs are looking very similar to SB. And they look pretty stocky from what i can tell. And stinky is a good sign too.
I wouldnt mind poppin some of those man
.
Keep in mind that no one has got duds from any other cuts of gg#4 except for the ones at the La cup. After those where replaced none have recurred. I'm not worried at all about getting dudds from her..
I agree, those that are running the gg#4 x SB look just like mine. It is a bit hot out in the veg room. I started it back up sooner then I would have liked..
I agree, those that are running the gg#4 x SB look just like mine. It is a bit hot out in the veg room. I started it back up sooner then I would have liked..
Yours look like theyve got a hell of a lot more vigor. And theyll probably yield alot more.
Are you sure I'm pretty sure some non cup gg4 growers were talkin dud?
Right, Greyskull, the link you posted, I clicked it....
You want my opinion?
I got as far as page 5 and already I can see some glaring errors in judgement have been made.
Plants which, at one glance, you can tell have not been treated properly, from being overfed to not being given a chance to reveg, to being grown in poor light conditions to being allowed to expand from growth which should have been cut back. And that is in just four or five pictures.
But what's most interesting and honestly, from my perspective - knowing full well exactly what those problems are and how easy they are to solve, and that they are definitely 100% not the result of an infection or a pest or a genetic anomaly - is that no sooner have those pictures been posted with a theory attached, than there is a frenzy of people clamoring to cure this mystery sickness. Treatments are being recommended, oils prescribed... and for what? Because all that exists on or before page 5/6 are plants which have not been treated properly. It is as simple as that.
That's what's most interesting to me - the people, not the plants.
You can take this whichever way you want, and I mean no offense by it, but it wasn't so long ago you could start a rumour that someone in your village was a witch, and before long the whole town would hunt them down to burn them at the stake. Fear is a strong force and people are strange creatures. Logic alone is not what a lot of us use to determine what is or what isn't.
So let me clarify my stance.
I'm not concluding that there is nothing else in that thread that will be of interest to me, and I'm still not dismissing the possibility that there might be a problem somewhere that can't be as easily explained as what's on those first few pages.
But what I am saying is that, despite what's on those opening pages being nothing to do with dudding, it was already accepted, after such a short time and with such weak evidence, that dudding is exactly what it was.
I'm not saying I'm right or you're wrong, but people have got to be more critical than that. There's a strong irony about people wanting to send in samples for testing. The underpinning philosophy of scientific research is to prove yourself wrong, not to prove yourself right. You've got to look for every possible reason for something happening and analyse whether your theories stand up to the first obvious question. But people are willing to skip right past the logic and knowledge which already belongs to us and go right to testing. It's their prerogative I suppose.
The scientist in the lab isn't going to look at the cut and say `this plant shouldn't have even been flowered` because that's not his job. It's yours. It's the job of growers who should know better, but don't.
The credibility of this argument, if not completely shattered, is massively weakened when you see someone who has obviously flowered a plant which never even got to re-veg properly, overfed it, calls dud, and has almost everyone in the thread in agreement with him.
But only Tonygreen pointed it out.
Nobody else mentioned it.
This is something any gardener should have been able to spot as soon as the picture loaded on his screen. But they didn't.
You're right when you say I have no experience with this cut. So I can't conclude for definite that there is nothing to the rumor/idea. So I use the pictures on my screen instead, and what I can say for certain that already, after only 6 pages of that thread, every one of those plants had issues which were related to basic general practice, and also that I would be in the minority by having that opinion.
If you take into account the part which variables play in making a judgement then you can't conclude that something other than nutrient damage is to blame when a plant is waxy green and showing obvious signs of burn. I mean you can, but it won't hold weight with people who know that the judgement is invalidated by that one variable alone. You can't say for sure that one stress factor caused something specific to happen, while another stress factor is also present.
Plants go through stages before they burn. By the time they burn they will usually have been over fertilised for a period of time before. If the pictures are shots of fully mature budding plants, then it's safe to assume that they have been overfed for a long and important stage of their life. Nitrogen and overfeeding in general retards growth and what constitutes overfeeding varies from one plant to the next, even with clones, depending on so many things.
I'm keeping an open mind on this but it's getting late and I'm knackered so I can't type any more and I'm not even sure if I've made the point I wanted to initially, but so far I can tell you for sure that the pictures in that thread are nothing I am not already familiar with. They can be easily fixed and are nothing whatsoever to worry about.
You want my opinion?
I got as far as page 5 and already I can see some glaring errors in judgement have been made.
Plants which, at one glance, you can tell have not been treated properly, from being overfed to not being given a chance to reveg, to being grown in poor light conditions to being allowed to expand from growth which should have been cut back. And that is in just four or five pictures.
But what's most interesting and honestly, from my perspective - knowing full well exactly what those problems are and how easy they are to solve, and that they are definitely 100% not the result of an infection or a pest or a genetic anomaly - is that no sooner have those pictures been posted with a theory attached, than there is a frenzy of people clamoring to cure this mystery sickness. Treatments are being recommended, oils prescribed... and for what? Because all that exists on or before page 5/6 are plants which have not been treated properly. It is as simple as that.
That's what's most interesting to me - the people, not the plants.
You can take this whichever way you want, and I mean no offense by it, but it wasn't so long ago you could start a rumour that someone in your village was a witch, and before long the whole town would hunt them down to burn them at the stake. Fear is a strong force and people are strange creatures. Logic alone is not what a lot of us use to determine what is or what isn't.
So let me clarify my stance.
I'm not concluding that there is nothing else in that thread that will be of interest to me, and I'm still not dismissing the possibility that there might be a problem somewhere that can't be as easily explained as what's on those first few pages.
But what I am saying is that, despite what's on those opening pages being nothing to do with dudding, it was already accepted, after such a short time and with such weak evidence, that dudding is exactly what it was.
I'm not saying I'm right or you're wrong, but people have got to be more critical than that. There's a strong irony about people wanting to send in samples for testing. The underpinning philosophy of scientific research is to prove yourself wrong, not to prove yourself right. You've got to look for every possible reason for something happening and analyse whether your theories stand up to the first obvious question. But people are willing to skip right past the logic and knowledge which already belongs to us and go right to testing. It's their prerogative I suppose.
The scientist in the lab isn't going to look at the cut and say `this plant shouldn't have even been flowered` because that's not his job. It's yours. It's the job of growers who should know better, but don't.
The credibility of this argument, if not completely shattered, is massively weakened when you see someone who has obviously flowered a plant which never even got to re-veg properly, overfed it, calls dud, and has almost everyone in the thread in agreement with him.
But only Tonygreen pointed it out.
Nobody else mentioned it.
This is something any gardener should have been able to spot as soon as the picture loaded on his screen. But they didn't.
You're right when you say I have no experience with this cut. So I can't conclude for definite that there is nothing to the rumor/idea. So I use the pictures on my screen instead, and what I can say for certain that already, after only 6 pages of that thread, every one of those plants had issues which were related to basic general practice, and also that I would be in the minority by having that opinion.
If you take into account the part which variables play in making a judgement then you can't conclude that something other than nutrient damage is to blame when a plant is waxy green and showing obvious signs of burn. I mean you can, but it won't hold weight with people who know that the judgement is invalidated by that one variable alone. You can't say for sure that one stress factor caused something specific to happen, while another stress factor is also present.
Plants go through stages before they burn. By the time they burn they will usually have been over fertilised for a period of time before. If the pictures are shots of fully mature budding plants, then it's safe to assume that they have been overfed for a long and important stage of their life. Nitrogen and overfeeding in general retards growth and what constitutes overfeeding varies from one plant to the next, even with clones, depending on so many things.
I'm keeping an open mind on this but it's getting late and I'm knackered so I can't type any more and I'm not even sure if I've made the point I wanted to initially, but so far I can tell you for sure that the pictures in that thread are nothing I am not already familiar with. They can be easily fixed and are nothing whatsoever to worry about.
As far as I know they all started from the LA cup. The whole dudd issue started with the cuts sold or handed out by SL.. I never herd of it until then.
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