Fungus gnats or WINGED ROOT APHIDS???

[sheik_yerbouti]

Anyone know of a good treatment that wont stunt the plants? Im at end of week 4 and plants look very healthy but they are definitely infested. Crawlers and flyers. Not looking for a total kill because i plant to totally reboot once these are harvested, but would like to try and kill as many as possible without making things worse.


Also what are the best cleaners for around the room? Can i just bleach and peroxide or do i need to spray some kind of pesticide? Ive seen grangers post about the cedar oil, but i thought neem did a good job of killing flyers so I imagine it will kill any crawlers hiding out on my floor or wood framing around the room. Any other ideas? Was going to ozone their asses too!

imidiclorprid and OG biowar. Both do a good job of killing root aphids and have no side effects on your plants.

 

[Granger2]

Imid does have side effects on you though. -granger

 

[king oscar]

Imidacloprid doesn't work very well for these anyways, IME..

Go kontos or orthene when you need a systemic

 

[spaceboy]

I went orthene on them a few years ago and it worked for me, but these are so far along i would rather try insecticidal soap or a neem root drench. At this point just trying to control them until harvest then new pond liner and full reboot. Hoping that will do the trick. Anyone know the life span of these crawlers? Wondering how long they can survive in my room without a food source. Ill tell ya what though, im not messin around, going to hang my tables from the ceilings...

What do u guys recommendto treat cuttings taken from infected plants?

 

[king oscar]

A physan dunk would be a good idea for your cuttings. Kontos is a great preventative when they're rooted, works well and lasts a long time

I don't think the crawlers live very long without food, several days maybe

 

[ozzieAI]

been away for a while...but really how much information do you guys need...

don't won't to sound like a snob...but check the neat search function on this thread...it is really easy to use and works well...

just saying...

 

[Miraculous Meds]

Anyone know of a good treatment that wont stunt the plants? Im at end of week 4 and plants look very healthy but they are definitely infested. Crawlers and flyers. Not looking for a total kill because i plant to totally reboot once these are harvested, but would like to try and kill as many as possible without making things worse.


Also what are the best cleaners for around the room? Can i just bleach and peroxide or do i need to spray some kind of pesticide? Ive seen grangers post about the cedar oil, but i thought neem did a good job of killing flyers so I imagine it will kill any crawlers hiding out on my floor or wood framing around the room. Any other ideas? Was going to ozone their asses too!

Id stay clear of triaz, or imid that late in the game. Id use bti (gnatrol is the best ive found), mosquito dunks will work to, but not near as concentrated. That will slow down n kill the larvae naturally which is what do the damage to ur plant. Hang a bunch of sticky fly traps. Especially the yellow ones staked in the plant medium. That will help trap and kill the adults so they cant lay more eggs. Then u can use a pyrethrin area/room spray to kill off rogue fliers. Don't spray the flowers though. gl

 

[Granger2]

MM,
I presume you're talking about Fungus Gnats, not RA's. -granger

 

[spaceboy]

Would weekly neem drenches in coco at least keep the flyers down? I just need something that wont hurt my roots and that will keep the population somewhat down so that flyers dont spread to my veg. Neem seems promising, but was also wondering about insecticidal soap.

 

[Granger2]

Insecticide soap will burn roots. -granger

 

[Old Fogey]

Don't waste money on pathetic products like Gnatrol, you're getting around 20 cents worth of the active ingredient Bacillus Thuringiensis Israeliensis serotype H14 (BTi) in a bottle that costs $30 or more.

If you live anywhere near mosquitos you should be able to source your BTi in powder form under the trade name Vectobac.

Vectobac or the same product under another name can be bought in 5kg tubs for around $200. BTi in powdered form has a shelf life of 2 years.

Use 1 gram per 2 gallons (7-8 litres) in every new nutrient tank for several weeks and you will completely erradicate a particular infestation of Fungus Gnats.

I obtained a tub 3 months ago and haven't seen a Gnat for weeks.

I tried the BTi at 1 gram per 2 1/2 gallons (10 litres) and found that to be too weak because I always had a few gnats around. I then tried 1 gram per 1 1/4 gallons (5 litres) and found that the BTi was leaving a gooey residue on the tray/pots etc.

I then moved to 1 gram per 7.5 - 8 litres (2gallons approx) and have killed all Gnats without any problems with sludge on my equipment etc.

There is no chance of me using all 5kg I have inside of 2 years and I'm running a 2 x 600w grow.

Peace

 

[DocTim420]

Don't waste money on pathetic products like Gnatrol, you're getting around 20 cents worth of the active ingredient Bacillus Thuringiensis Israeliensis serotype H14 (BTi) in a bottle that costs $30 or more.

If you live anywhere near mosquitos you should be able to source your BTi in powder form under the trade name Vectobac.

Vectobac or the same product under another name can be bought in 5kg tubs for around $200. BTi in powdered form has a shelf life of 2 years....

Ahhh, the old question, which is heavier: Pound of feathers or a pound of lead?

BTI potency in International Toxic Units (ITU) is what you want to investigate.

Gnatrol: 3000 ITU per mg @ 37.4% BTI
Mosquito Bits: 7000 ITU per mg @ 2.86% BTI
Mosquito Dunks: 7000 ITU per mg @ 10.31% BTI
Vectobac (G,GS,GR): 200 ITU per mg @ 2.8% BTI

To calculate equivalent ITU of BTI for each gram in your product: Multiply ITU number by the percent of Active Ingredient (BTI).

Gnatrol: (3000 X 37.4%) = 1,122 mg
Mosquito Bits: (7000 X 2.86%) = 200.2 mg
Mosquito Dunks: (7000 X 10.31%) = 721.7 mg
Vectobac (G,GS,GR): (200 X 2.8%) = 5.6 mg

To calculate the cost for 1 ITU "unit" requires the price and weight of the product you are comparing.

Gnatrol: 16 lbs for $400....or $0.000049123/ITU of BTI
formula ----> [(3000 X .374) X (16 X 453.59)] / $400
Mosquito Bits: 20 lbs for $120....or $0.000066073/ITU of BTI.
Mosquito Dunks: 20 dunks (3/4 lb) for $20....$0.000081460/ITU of BTI.
Vectobac (G,GS): 40 lbs for $150....$0.001476310/ITU of BTI.

The above list is in the order of cost--lowest first.

I use Mosquito Bits to control fungus gnats, for me it is a question of laying out $400 vs $120 for a bucket of BTI--and ease of use: Bits vs powder.

BTW...BTI does NOT control root aphids.

 

[DocTim420]

Also...BTI in Bits & Dunks remain active longer, 14-30 days whereas Gnatrol is only a few days, maybe a week at the most. BTI is applied to corncob bits with vegetable oil (hence this particular product is disqualified for "organic fanatics") while Dunks are mostly calcium sulfate (gypsum) with cork and approved "organic" source for BTI.

 

[Old Fogey]

Would weekly neem drenches in coco at least keep the flyers down? I just need something that wont hurt my roots and that will keep the population somewhat down so that flyers dont spread to my veg. Neem seems promising, but was also wondering about insecticidal soap.

I can assure you that if used at the rate of 1gm per 2 gallons (1gm per 7.5 - 8 liters) Bacillus Thuringiensis Israeliensis [BTi] - serotype H14 in water soluble granule form (Vectobac WG is one trade name) will cause no damage whatsoever to any roots, plants, animals, equipment etc etc etc. Zero.

And it will eliminate, entirely, any Fungus gnat infection.

I drench with every feed by hand and have no problems at all and I haven't seen a gnat for weeks now.

However, if you can only source the material in, say, 500 gram amounts at 20 cents a gram (around 4 cents per gram when buying 5kg) and you want to make it last the full two years of its shelf life there is plenty of information on the various grower's boards, detailing the life-cycle of Fungus gnats and prescriptions on when to drench.

Most recommend drenching each 7 days for a total of 3 events in 14 days, but I found that schedule didn't eradicate the Gnats completely. Drenching every 4 days seemed to miss a few, ditto for once each 3 days. So I began drenching daily and my grow has shown no ill effects.

BTi is a perfectly safe bio-agent and if you use it to nuke those Gnats time and again over several weeks you should be able to see them off.

To be honest, I'm continuing to drench with each feed because it's now a part of my routine and is certain to prevent any future infestation getting a hold on my coco/perlite 1 gallon pot grow.

Peace

 

[Old Fogey]

Also...BTI in Bits & Dunks remain active longer, 14-30 days whereas Gnatrol is only a few days, maybe a week at the most. BTI is applied to corncob bits with vegetable oil (hence this particular product is disqualified for "organic fanatics") while Dunks are mostly calcium sulfate (gypsum) with cork and approved "organic" source for BTI.

BTi is used for keeping mosquito infestations in check. All sorts of agencies and industries use it for bio-control, it shouldn't be too difficult to source.

BTI in water soluble granules, it is usually noted on the label as being BTi - WG or sometimes WAG.

Same product in liquid form has a very short shelf life and needs to be kept in optimum conditions. The powdered, WG form of BTi will keep at room temps or below (but never refrigerate, it kills the bacteria) for 2 years from manufacture.

Peace

 

[Old Fogey]

The weight for BTi in water soluble granule form?

I paid 4 cents per gram for a 10 pound tub of it. I use on average about 2 grams a day. In total, and that is in a 2 x 600w HPS grow.

I have zero gnats at the minute.

I originally purchased the precise same product from a grow shop and they are charging $1.60 per gram, or 40 times the price that I ultimately paid for 2 year's supply.

Peace

 

[Old Fogey]

The label on what is actually a 5kg tub says "Minimum Potency 3000 ITU/mg".

And the instructions are to use at 1 gram per 10 liters as a drench with 1% slurry. I use at 1 gram per 7.5 liters.

It costs me under $2 a week to keep Fungus gnats completely out of my grow, and I'm happy about that.

I should have mentioned that it is almost impossible for me to source mosquito dunks with any type of convenience and the prices for liquid Gnatrol that I see are enough to send a man to the poor house.

Peace.

 

[Old Fogey]

Here is an information sheet for the product I'm using.

I purchased 3 to 4 times more than I will ever use over its two year shelf life because I didn't have anybody to split the buy with me.

I was paying $75 for 50 grams and at that price I was having to be really frugal with it, meaning I never quite got rid the gnats completely, there was always one or two hanging around.

But in the washup, I paid $200 for 5kg of VectoBac WG and it allows me to drench like my life depends on it, giving me total eradication of Fungus gnat infestations and stopping new infestations from invading forces well before they have a chance to get started. And all for the next 100 weeks.

For the first time in 18 months or more I can say I haven't seen a Fungus gnat for at least a fortnight, it truly feels like closer to a month and it might be that long - I never thought to make a note of it. Anyway, this is after three months of regular use (every feed, which is done by hand).

So $9 a month it's costing me, when I was spending maybe $40 a month on the same product in smaller amounts from a grow store and labelled as Gnatural. If I was able to split the purchase with another couple of growers I could get my costs down to 1/10th or better of what they once were and with total satisfaction with the results.

I run a lot of light but I don't harvest large amounts and it is all for personal use. I absorb 100% of my growing costs and I have only a meager income - every saving counts and I am saving significant sums with fantastic results using this product.

Peace

 

[DocTim420]

The label on what is actually a 5kg tub says "Minimum Potency 3000 ITU/mg"...

Perhaps we are not talking about the same product...as I can not find Vectobac WDG/WG available for sale anywhere, at least not on Google/Amazon.

According to Valent Bioservices website-- https://publichealth.valentbioscien...lth-resources/vectobac-wg-technical-use-sheet

VectoBac WG Biological Larvicide is available in the following package sizes:
• USA only
– 1 lb (0.45 kg) HDPE plastic canisters, packaged 24 per case
– 25 lb (11.3 kg) drums
• International only
– 0.5 kg HDPE plastic canisters, packaged 24 per case
– 25 kg drums

Are you sure you bought 5 kg for $200? or was it 0.5 kg? If so, I would like to know where I can buy some.

 

[Old Fogey]

It is available in Europe on ebay. Also available in Pacific countries. I'd be most surprised if you cannot source it. See the bottom of the tech sheet that I attached to my post, there is an address and number for Valent BioSciences, whom I presume is operating the patent world-wide.

Peace