Ed Rosenthal Say's CFL's May be Better than HPS for Micro Growing

[journeyquest]

This isn't a "Grow for less than $100" thread.

If you're going to do this, take your time and do it right. Save cash while you read more. Anything else is just taking tickets for frustration sessions in the future. Why bother?

Take your time. Learn as much as you can. Be fully prepared and then grow for a lifetime. It should take around 6 months to be fully prepared through reading for your first grow. You should easily be able to save well over $100 in that amount of time.

In this type of race the turtle wins huge.

It was mentioned in this thread and was in relation to ed growing with cfl lights for less then 100 dollars. so i wasnt out of context. im not here to kiss ass im here to learn. no disrespect intended.

 

[journeyquest]

I will stick to the 250w cool tube setup for small cab. For veg i can use mh bulb and swap to hps for flower on same ballast. I can build my own cool tube reflector cheap. Bulbs are cheap if you know where to look. If 250 is too much use 150w. CFL need multiple fixtures more bulbs and plants grow slower. The price for 60w CFLs isnt cheap when you add up what you need to compare to the output of hps or mh. Sure you use more power but plants grow faster too. I will only use CFL for supplimental lighting and beginning veg time. Im joining the 250 club for now and later add anouther 250. These guys are getting 170 grams and better off one 250 lamp in roughly 3 months in 2 by 2 space. Thats about a pound and a half a year one light.

 

[Thundurkel]

I will stick to the 250w cool tube setup for small cab. For veg i can use mh bulb and swap to hps for flower on same ballast. I can build my own cool tube reflector cheap. Bulbs are cheap if you know where to look. If 250 is too much use 150w. CFL need multiple fixtures more bulbs and plants grow slower. The price for 60w CFLs isnt cheap when you add up what you need to compare to the output of hps or mh. Sure you use more power but plants grow faster too. I will only use CFL for supplimental lighting and beginning veg time. Im joining the 250 club for now and later add anouther 250. These guys are getting 170 grams and better off one 250 lamp in roughly 3 months in 2 by 2 space. Thats about a pound and a half a year one light.

Don't spread lies in my threads please, the plants do not grow any slower and finish just as fast under CFLs

 

[outdoe]

The LED experiment High Times just did was interesting to say the least, UFO yielded 5% less than a 400w HPS and it produced much more resin for a more potent product...

well the LEDs have yet to match the HPS lamps intensity. It isnt worth it until it does. I have also seen youtube videos side by side comparison the HPS creating better grows the LEDs are causing alot of stretch and less yield. I wouldnt jump on the bangwagon yet. The Reward for HPS is so much greater with HPS.

 

[Hydro-Soil]

The price for 60w CFLs isnt cheap when you add up what you need to compare to the output of hps or mh.

You haven't been reading. Anything over 27watts in the self-ballasted screw in CFLs is a waste. Use more of them, they're extremely cheap anyway.

 

[Rudedewd]

As far As I'm concerned the jury is still out as to whether HPS will out perform CFLs in a small area. I'm growing in a small area now, about eighteen inches square. My first crop in that area was with three 42 watt CFL's and I have to say that I was impressed with the results as I got about a little less than two an a half ozs using the CFL's from start to finish. The CFls absolutely rocked during veg and they did a very nice job in flower as well. One thing though, I had the CFLs hung vertically and I had all of the plant's main buds tied within a couple inches of the bulbs so they had great light. Then I decided that I simply couldn't pass by all the extra lumens that a 150 watt hps would give me so bye bye CFLs, lol. I hung the 150 and the first thing I had to deal with is all the extra heat that the HPS brings to the table. Also I had a very low ceiling on the cab which was actually an advantage using the cfls but it was a huge drawback with the hps. So right away I had to raise the roof and install some more air intakes to try to cool my cab off. It's very hard for me to compare the two lights though as I have changed my growing method to a perpetual and I had some unrelated garden issues as well but I think it all comes down to using the right space for the right light. My space was about eighteen inches square by about two foot tall and it was perfect with 126 watts of CFLs but didn't work well for me with the 150 hps, now my space is over three foot tall and the 150 hps works perfect. I think in the long run I'll be happy with the switch but I have to say that I was very impressed with CFLs, I loved being able to get those buds within an inch or so of the light and the buds loved it as well, lol. The HPS is alot less work though, with the CFls it is a constant battle to keep the buds just where you want them but the rewards are great. The CFLs do have an advantage over the HPS's in terms of less heat produced but I guess with a cool tube that would be a non-issue. Bottom line is that I'll stick to the 150 HPS for now but CFLs can and do have great results especially in limited areas.

 

[journeyquest]

Hanging a bunch of bulbs in a space not much bigger than a shoe box is a waste of time for me. And this is not your thread its our thread. None of us would be shit on here by ourselves. you will NEVER hear me claim i own a group of people. Its the collective that makes the whole. I wonder just how micro, micro can get? Ill admit it. I probably dont belong here in the extreme micro section. After seeing rooms full of plants under 1000s of watts i thought i was micro. Maybe not.

 

[banjobrain]

...Ill admit it. I probably dont belong here in the extreme micro section...

No one's making you stay here.

Anyways, I am posting here to take advantage of the knowledge that people have here. I'm a first time grower and am planning on using CFLs.

• My cab is 24x24 (40" tall) and I'm looking for input on how I can run my lights. I plan on running a swc ScrOG grow.

I was thinking of building a plywood "reflector," with walls...think - a 22" square piece of wood with 4-6" walls on it. I was going to mount sockets for screw-in CFLs horizontally on each side of the "reflector" and attach a chain to it, so I could lift it as the plants grow.

Does this sound like a decent idea?

For now, I'd like to stay away from anything other than screw in CFLs, I think that would be easier and more reliable than anything else for a first time grow.

Look forward to all of your comments and replies!

 

[Green Smoke]

Hanging a bunch of bulbs in a space not much bigger than a shoe box is a waste of time for me.

Then what the hell are you doing in here. Just making trouble I suppose.

 

[islander420]

For micro grows, CFL's would be a better bet since heat issue would definitely be a problem. As far as quality is concerned, I don't think I've tried any herb that's been flowered and harvested under CFL's so I can't really comment.

It would be nice if someone could do a comparison of 2 plants of same strain and identical nutes with different lights, just to put the whole issue to rest that a CFL (or even floros for that matter) is capable of producing high quality buds.

 

[theratings]

Honestly, if anyone doubts CFLs they should use them and find their own results. I once used four 42w 2700k in a space that was much less than 10 ft2 and plant growth was satisfactory. For small spaces, CFLs have their advantages, as when I was doing this heat was easily removed during peak summer months with computer fans and a fan blowing on the bulbs.

For small spaces, an HPS would also be great if you can accommodate everything you need to run it.

The biggest disadvantage for CFLs from my side was that we had to keep them extremely close to the plants. Meaning adjusting their proximity was an every day thing. But growing with them had great growth.

 

[stink.whistler]

I was thinking of building a plywood "reflector," with walls...think - a 22" square piece of wood with 4-6" walls on it. I was going to mount sockets for screw-in CFLs horizontally on each side of the "reflector" and attach a chain to it, so I could lift it as the plants grow.

I know you said you would like to stay away from anything but screw ins, but i really think you might consider the pl CFLs mounted on your walls. Take a look at this thread if you haven't already:

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=92259

The screw in cfls would work well for you, I'm just eager to see more pl CFL grows :smile:

 

[banjobrain]

I know you said you would like to stay away from anything but screw ins, but i really think you might consider the pl CFLs mounted on your walls. Take a look at this thread if you haven't already:

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=92259

The screw in cfls would work well for you, I'm just eager to see more pl CFL grows :smile:

I did take a look at that thread, as well as the bulbs from htg.

My main concern was...what if a bulb burns out? Anything other than a screw in would be hard to replace! I guess that if I used those other lights, I could just buy a few additional bulbs in the beginning and be prepared for bulb failure.

Looks pretty sweet.

Now I just need to figure out the bulb/socket/ballast combo and I'll be ready to order!

Any ideas for set up regarding the BIAX F55T5 sockets and ballasts? I don't know anything about ballasts and these bulbs.

Since my room is 2x2, I thought I'd run 6 bulbs.

Help!

 

[ultrastealthgro]

This is an awesome thread! Stinky, your right, saltwater fish/coral is an overpriced hobby. I do a lot of DIY to save myself some money and a lot like this hobby it can more than pay for itself if you want it to. knna, thank you for the answer about using actinic lighting for mj, a lot of very useful in depth info! I still may use one small actinic bulb near one "test" plant for shits and giggles? Again, this is an awesome thread!
Another thing I use for my saltwater stuff is protein skimmers which take a lot of junk out of the water in the system. Just wondering if the hydro guys might use themto keep there resivour water cleaner? Although they are designed to be used in saltwater? There are a lot more links to lighting and other equipment on a reef forum I frequent quite often called reefcentral dot com/org that can provide links to equipment/supply places. Thanks again for everybody thats been supportive and helpful in this thread!

 

[catman]

Hanging a bunch of bulbs in a space not much bigger than a shoe box is a waste of time for me. And this is not your thread its our thread. None of us would be shit on here by ourselves. you will NEVER hear me claim i own a group of people. Its the collective that makes the whole. I wonder just how micro, micro can get? Ill admit it. I probably dont belong here in the extreme micro section. After seeing rooms full of plants under 1000s of watts i thought i was micro. Maybe not.

Congratulations to the first post I negative repped!

 

[stink.whistler]

Banjo,

Any ideas for set up regarding the BIAX F55T5 sockets and ballasts? I don't know anything about ballasts and these bulbs.

Take a look at this thread:

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=112670

But you do make a good point about availability, if you live in a big city you might have a pet store that sells the lamps, in the event of a burn out. People use them on their aquariums.

 

[knna]

Ive had PLLs conected using regular pieces of electrical conection. Not as confortable as sockets, but works perfectly. Only problem is you need to unscrew and screw for each pin (you just need to wire 3 of the 4 pins) when you want to change the bulb. But it only happen little.

 

[smokeymacpot]

Hanging a bunch of bulbs in a space not much bigger than a shoe box is a waste of time for me. And this is not your thread its our thread. None of us would be shit on here by ourselves. you will NEVER hear me claim i own a group of people. Its the collective that makes the whole. I wonder just how micro, micro can get? Ill admit it. I probably dont belong here in the extreme micro section. After seeing rooms full of plants under 1000s of watts i thought i was micro. Maybe not.

similar here, i split a cab, cfl on one side hps on the other, OMG at all the wires and chains and plugs the cfls used. 1 light, 1 power cord, carbon filter and ducting on a cool tube and your set, no fucking about adjusting light distance like cfl, its just easier and yeilds better.

in my eyes you are micro if you are in a smallish cab with or without HID, you are perfectly entitled to be in this forum.

 

[smokeymacpot]

For micro grows, CFL's would be a better bet since heat issue would definitely be a problem. As far as quality is concerned, I don't think I've tried any herb that's been flowered and harvested under CFL's so I can't really comment.

It would be nice if someone could do a comparison of 2 plants of same strain and identical nutes with different lights, just to put the whole issue to rest that a CFL (or even floros for that matter) is capable of producing high quality buds.

the best way is to see it with your own eyes. but... i split the cab in 2, so basically.. 6x20w vs 70w hps, 3 plants. 1 plant cfl only, 1 hps only and one getting half of both. the cfl only plant was smaller, the cfl+hps plant was small on one side and big on the other, showing where hps really kicked it into gear, and the hps only plant was far far bigger than either.

bud quality was good for both, but looked nicer with only cfl. that has never been disputed... but it all looks and smokes the same when dry.

the problem is when people dont have enough experience and preach how cfls are better. i just wonder if some are lazy and cant come up with a decent cooling system and dont care that they get 5gram colas.

 

[stink.whistler]

Hey Smokey,

similar here, i split a cab, cfl on one side hps on the other, OMG at all the wires and chains and plugs the cfls used. 1 light, 1 power cord, carbon filter and ducting on a cool tube and your set, no fucking about adjusting light distance like cfl, its just easier and yeilds better.

I'm not sure how you had your CFLs wired, but there is no reason to use more than one power cord for a couple hundred watts of CFL, and if you have the right sockets - no chains are needed either. Do a SCROG, and there isn't any messing around with light distance. Do a perpetual SOG, where you move the plants as they grow from left to right in your cab, with the CFL's hung at the correct height for each stage, and there isn't any messing around with light distance either.

But sure, you can grow with either HPS or CFL and get good results, no doubt. Just slightly different techniques with each.