Dud Identification Collective Knowledge.

[gaiusmarius]

i suppose one could do a heat treatment on a tray of clones in the kitchen oven if you are careful not to bake them, lol.

 

[prune]

What exactly is "Heat treatment", temps, duration, ect?

Huel, heat treatment is searchable in the Broad Mite thread, but in brief you heat your room to 120f for an hour while avoiding direct light and excessive air movement on the plants. It seems to kill these bugs in places that other methods miss.

It's still new and evolving, and can be destructive - but it's fully organic and has the added benefit of sterilizing your room and equipment.

 

[RetroGrow]

kills mites when you raise temp. I forget what the temp needs to be..

120 F, for an an hour or so. Doesn't hurt plants. Kills broad & cyclamen mites.
Posted this before I saw the previous post. No need to "avoid direct light", as treatment is normally done with lights on, which is what raises the temps, unless you are using a different method to raise temps. Turn fans off, or if plants are raised, you can have fans on floor moving air. Just don't have hot air blowing directly on plants. It's not "destructive" at all, in my experience. If you let temps get out of hand, then yes, you will have problems. 120F? No problem. Temps can get this high in nature, and plants survive.
If you want professional heat treating equipment, which automatically heats room to predetermined temperature of your choice, it's available here:
www.pestheat.com
These are super cool. Just set temperature to 120, and mites are finished. All pests die at a certain temperature. Fortunately for us, mites are temperature sensitive, and die at temps which are not harmful to our plants. As far as heat treating a room with no plants in it, between runs, you can crank this baby up to 150, and nothing can survive that. Your room is sterilized. I have to check the prices for these, as they are not listed on the site.

 

[Hammerhead]

I'm very anal about bugs preventive measures work best for me. I don't get cuts from people very often only 4 in 25 years.. Got mites 1x in that time as well. Didn't even try to save them all where destroyed.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

K from trichome tech mentions a good idea... put clones in a vac chamber pull a vacuum them fill with Co2 it will suffocate those bastards. all bugs dead, no airrrry no liiiiiiiiify lol

Do you think that will kill eggs?
-SamS

 

[Infinitesimal]

I've yet to try it as I have yet need to, I don't shop for clones often, but

good point, No I don't think it would... but that's part of the quarantine... keep 'em separate and repeat the process to account for the pests reproductive cycles.

I guess the next question then becomes what is the life cycle of broad mites and how long can broad mites eggs lay dormant before hatching? in order to know just how many times to suffocate them and how long to keep them in quarantine.

 

[Tonygreen]

UM says this about broad mites, very interesting for clones.

Cultural control: Broad mites are very sensitive to heat. Lowering infested plants into water held at 43 to 49�C for 15 minutes will destroy broad mites without damaging the plants.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

120 F, for an an hour or so. Doesn't hurt plants. Kills broad & cyclamen mites.
Posted this before I saw the previous post. No need to "avoid direct light", as treatment is normally done with lights on, which is what raises the temps, unless you are using a different method to raise temps. Turn fans off, or if plants are raised, you can have fans on floor moving air. Just don't have hot air blowing directly on plants. It's not "destructive" at all, in my experience. If you let temps get out of hand, then yes, you will have problems. 120F? No problem. Temps can get this high in nature, and plants survive.
If you want professional heat treating equipment, which automatically heats room to predetermined temperature of your choice, it's available here:
www.pestheat.com
These are super cool. Just set temperature to 120, and mites are finished. All pests die at a certain temperature. Fortunately for us, mites are temperature sensitive, and die at temps which are not harmful to our plants. As far as heat treating a room with no plants in it, between runs, you can crank this baby up to 150, and nothing can survive that. Your room is sterilized. I have to check the prices for these, as they are not listed on the site.

And does the same heat also kill the hemp russet mite (Aculops cannabicola)? As well as the eggs of all three?
Anyone try?
I am a bit surprised as I have seen greenhouses get over 120 degrees Fahrenheit for more then an hour and I have still found living hemp russet mites as well as broad mites, and cyclamen mites.
I have seen greenhouses over 50 C, not good for plants, seldom kills them, just fucks with them a lot. Flowering plants at these temps get a lot of their terpenes cooked off. Spider mites also do not all get killed at these temps, or their eggs survive.
-SamS

 

[Treetroit City]

Hemp russet mite=shut down.

Been there done that...

 

[bobblehead]

And does the same heat also kill the hemp russet mite (Aculops cannabicola)? As well as the eggs of all three?
Anyone try?
I am a bit surprised as I have seen greenhouses get over 120 degrees Fahrenheit for more then an hour and I have still found living hemp russet mites as well as broad mites, and cyclamen mites.
I have seen greenhouses over 50 C, not good for plants, seldom kills them, just fucks with them a lot. Flowering plants at these temps get a lot of their terpenes cooked off. Spider mites also do not all get killed at these temps, or their eggs survive.
-SamS

Are you speaking of ambient greenhouse temps Sam? What about leaf temps? Personally I've learned to go around my room with an infrared thermometer and scan leaf temps in different areas... and I've found that they vary significantly from ambient temps.

Proteins begin to denature around 110-120F/50C, so I would think that raising leaf temps should have some efficacy.

 

[high life 45]

And does the same heat also kill the hemp russet mite (Aculops cannabicola)? As well as the eggs of all three?
Anyone try?
I am a bit surprised as I have seen greenhouses get over 120 degrees Fahrenheit for more then an hour and I have still found living hemp russet mites as well as broad mites, and cyclamen mites.
I have seen greenhouses over 50 C, not good for plants, seldom kills them, just fucks with them a lot. Flowering plants at these temps get a lot of their terpenes cooked off. Spider mites also do not all get killed at these temps, or their eggs survive.
-SamS

You gotta have a laser thermometer to check leaf temps and usually play around with fans and lights to get it all up to temp. Ive often found that while the ambient temp is 120 various parts of the plant are barely over 100. Pest will naturally hide in the canopy and or soil/media to survive. I have heard it (high temps) kills all mites and their eggs and many forms of pm. They will build a resistance eventually. I think that Koppert has a strain of Swirskii mites that are resistant to high heat, or they at least handle it better.

Thanks to everyone for adding their thoughts and perspectives. Im not sure any testing facilities around here are qualified to test for viruses or bacterial diseases, they are all pretty new.

I use propane and electric heaters along with my lights to raise temps. It usually takes ten minutes. But then you gotta keep a watchful eye, it can get over 120 if your not careful.

 

[RetroGrow]

And does the same heat also kill the hemp russet mite (Aculops cannabicola)? As well as the eggs of all three?
Anyone try?
I am a bit surprised as I have seen greenhouses get over 120 degrees Fahrenheit for more then an hour and I have still found living hemp russet mites as well as broad mites, and cyclamen mites.
I have seen greenhouses over 50 C, not good for plants, seldom kills them, just fucks with them a lot. Flowering plants at these temps get a lot of their terpenes cooked off. Spider mites also do not all get killed at these temps, or their eggs survive.
-SamS

Never tried it with Hemp Russett mites, but they are not likely to be as temperature sensitive. It does kill the eggs of broad & cyclamen mites. They are temperature sensitive. That temperature will not kill spider mites. Hot water baths are the standard treatment for broad and cyclamen mites in commercial greenhouses, and are used extensively in the Netherlands. People are now using them to kill root aphids. But hot water baths don't work well on cannabis above the root zone. They don't like it. Hot air is another story though. I have had rooms of BM infested plants perk right up after a heat treatment, and yes, some terpenes might be lost in this as they do tend to put out a lot of smell during treatment when in flower. But it's only for one hour. Anyway, they should be treated in veg if at all possible. That's why regular scoping is important in areas where these proliferate outside, namely warm weather, tropical areas with an abundance of fruit trees.

 

[Tonygreen]

Has anyone ever tried the cold water treatment with clones?

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

You gotta have a laser thermometer to check leaf temps and usually play around with fans and lights to get it all up to temp. Ive often found that while the ambient temp is 120 various parts of the plant are barely over 100. Pest will naturally hide in the canopy and or soil/media to survive. I have heard it (high temps) kills all mites and their eggs and many forms of pm. They will build a resistance eventually. I think that Koppert has a strain of Swirskii mites that are resistant to high heat, or they at least handle it better.

The temps in a greenhouse are much higher at roof levels 20 feet than ground level, my temp guages are at eye level to make it easy to see.

Thanks to everyone for adding their thoughts and perspectives. Im not sure any testing facilities around here are qualified to test for viruses or bacterial diseases, they are all pretty new.

Davis University has been doing this for years for grape growers, the diseases are not new, nor are the pests.

I use propane and electric heaters along with my lights to raise temps. It usually takes ten minutes. But then you gotta keep a watchful eye, it can get over 120 if your not careful.

I have seen greenhouses much hotter then 120 F, the only plants killed were to dry and lacking water, I noticed the plants in pots had more troubles even if watered well. The ones in the ground, if adequately watered, only lost a few branch tips. Maybe it is the high soil temps that screwed the ones in pots?
-SamS

 

[high life 45]

Sam you think Davis would take cannabis leafs for testing?

Im closer to OSU, which might have some resources available.

 

[FatherEarth]

Has this spread to any other clones or strictly found in the GG4?

 

[high life 45]

Many strains have been known to DUD after having bms.

Only a certain batch of the gg4 seems to have dudded so far.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

Sam you think Davis would take cannabis leafs for testing?

Im closer to OSU, which might have some resources available.

Call and ask them. If the state Agriculture Dept. will help with Cannabis or not. I do not know if the headquarters in Sacramento or one of the local offices in a more Cannabis friendly county are better to call, call Davis and/or call several more if you need to...
Have a phone number to give them, and a name or business name. Maybe an email? Tell us if you get lucky....
http://www.cdfa.ca.gov/Field_District_Offices.html

Or

Address
Oregon Department of Agriculture
Plant Program Area
635 Capitol St. NE
Salem, OR 97301-2532 USA
Hours of Operation 8:00 AM - 5:00 PM
Contact
plant-info@oda.state.or.us
Phone: 503-986-4644
Fax: 503-986-4786

Or

Oregon Agricultural Experiment Station
138 Strand Agriculture Hall, Oregon State University,
Corvallis, OR 97331- 8521
541-737-4251

It might be easier in Colorado and Washington, as well as each different state agris may only help state residents, maybe.
-SamS

 

[gaiusmarius]

sounds logical that the soil in the pots got hotter then the soil in the ground, hence less stressful for the plants planted in beds of soil.

 

[stasis]

When I spot bugs and eggs on a plant, and the saliva is proven to cause the death of the plant, I DO NOT look for viruses, I eradicate the pest, and am now DUD FREE..
Surrounded by People in this locality who are in denial, and producing Duds on a regular basis.

So whatever.... Have a great day. This discussion is bringing out the worst in people, as usual.