Coco and pH, what do you like yours set at?

[slowandeasy]

Ok, so I am new to Coco. I am having some minor issues using GH 6/9. Rez says to use pH 5.5, H3ad says 5.6-5.9, Canna says 5.8-6.2, I have even heard of starting at 5.2. Obviously each plant is different, but what seems to be the best range overall? Some say feed the same everytime, some say fluctuate.

Water, environment, genes, plant size, etc all will effect growth...but I want to know what everyones favorite pH and the nutes they use. Please share your experiences, I am going to experiment...but want to see peoples opinions. Thanks!!

 

[Work2much]

Base nutes: Nova bloom, CNS17 bloom, and now Maxibloom. There all very good stand alone one bottle or bag nute.

Jack of all trades additive: Fluorolicious plus

Rooter: H&G excelerator

Flower booster P/K enhancer etc: Nothing really, I just go heavy on the main nute and call it a day.

Foilar: Dyna-Grow Pro-Tekt [just started this, for the silcone]

I aim for 5.8 most of the time and it works very well for me although it can vary strain to strain but is a solid base line.

 

[Work2much]

Also, and this is different then what most people do, I water twice a day in late veg through flower. The first watering when lights go on is my main nute only. The second watering eight hours later is FP and Excel so it acts as a light flush and re moistens the main nute up in the coco so whatever amount of it is left can be released and used.

 

[2Lazy]

Canna Nutrients Coco A & B with Rhizotonic, CannaZym, PK 13/14, and CannaBoost. Botanicare's Cal-Mag+; Dutch Master's Silica, Add.27, and Zone; Humboldt's Own Gravity; Humboldt Nutrients Honey ES; General Hydroponics Diamond Nectar.

Obviously not all at the same time, there is a time and a place for each, some I do run throughout the grow, some I only use once a week, or maybe once a grow.

I go with a very low pH Cal-Mag solution to expand my coco, something around a 4.0 to expand with. Then I allow it to rest a few days before running through a 1/2 strength nutrient feeding. I allow it to dry another 2 days or so and then I use it to transplant my seedlings with. I'll use water cal-mag+ solution for the initial transplant and then I'll allow the coco to go dry before beginning the real regiment. I'll start feeding at around 5.4 pH, then every couple of feedings I'll gradually bring up the pH until I get to 5.8 sometime during flowering. Watching the run-off pH is how I determine when and how much to change my pH. So long as the runoff is between 5.5 and 6.2 I haven't seen many problems that I didn't cause myself in another way.

 

[SOTF420]

Coco is ideal for me at a PH of 5.8 - 6.0, that is where the best overall uptake occurs regardless of nutrient line.

 

[L-Immortal]

I use pretty much the whole house and garden line and a few other additives are AN big bud, pure flowers, bud candy, great white that’s pretty much all. From my experience I usually set at 5.7 and ride the drift up to 6.1. I run drain to waste so a new rez is mixed weekly. I can tell you it takes a bit of time to get your nutes dialed ppm/ec wise. Normally the manufacturer’s directions would have you at 2-2.5 times what your girls probably need.
As a precautionary measure I always mix 1 gallon of manufacturers recommended dose and get ppm/ec value. That way I can calculate my target Ec/ppm before I add to my 100 gallon rez. This helps when your mixing up a fusion of nutes. Keep a chart so you can reference it for future runs

Also I always add A then B then any other nutes then adjust PH last. This is contrary to H&G recommendations. They say mix A then B then ph, next add all other stuff on their feed chart. Well that goes out the window when I’m adding other companies additives. The only thing I add at the very end after the ph is done is my beneficial bacteria/mycorrhizal product.

My best is advice is what I was given and ignored like a fool. In coco start off with a simple 2 part nute, or one part for that matter, a cal/mag supplement, and one bloom booster of your choice maybe something like bloombastic. Food for thought ayway…

 

[ScrubNinja]

H3ad says 5.6-5.9

Yeah that, using DM Gold a+b.

 

[chr0nicxs]

5.8-6.1

 

[wiklund]

canna nutes
ph 5.8-6.0

workes great

 

[boroboro]

PH 5.8-6.0, as close as I can tell using the GH ph test drops. That's the ph I end up with after mixing up the nutes in my well water (well water around 200ppm, 7.2 ph). I never use ph-down unless I'm just feeding plain water, and don't even own any ph-up.

GH FloraMicro (hardwater version) 6ml/gallon, FloraBloom 9ml/gallon. Plenty of cal-mag in the same nute mix to rinse and pre-treat the coco, an important step IMHO. I also use a bit of cal-mag the first week or two, but not after that. Watered once per day, in #2 Smart Pots. Almost always water with the nute mix, my last grow might have had 3 waterings with plain ph 6.0 water.

 

[Mudguts]

Canna Nutrients Coco A & B with Rhizotonic, CannaZym, PK 13/14, and CannaBoost. Botanicare's Cal-Mag+; Dutch Master's Silica, Add.27, and Zone; Humboldt's Own Gravity; Humboldt Nutrients Honey ES; General Hydroponics Diamond Nectar.

Obviously not all at the same time, there is a time and a place for each, some I do run throughout the grow, some I only use once a week, or maybe once a grow.

I go with a very low pH Cal-Mag solution to expand my coco, something around a 4.0 to expand with. Then I allow it to rest a few days before running through a 1/2 strength nutrient feeding. I allow it to dry another 2 days or so and then I use it to transplant my seedlings with. I'll use water cal-mag+ solution for the initial transplant and then I'll allow the coco to go dry before beginning the real regiment. I'll start feeding at around 5.4 pH, then every couple of feedings I'll gradually bring up the pH until I get to 5.8 sometime during flowering. Watching the run-off pH is how I determine when and how much to change my pH. So long as the runoff is between 5.5 and 6.2 I haven't seen many problems that I didn't cause myself in another way.

I like your thinking as I began using brick (unbufered ccoco) recently and had initial problems with lock outs due too high ph buferring from the brick stuff.Its a bitch too get down! Looks like you have thought out a way too combat this with your own buffering regime. Cheers for the info. I might try it.

BTW I guess the extra low ph you use ofsets the unbufered coco's naturally high ph which brings things into where we want it.

ok back too bed

 

[JamieShoes]

5.8 .... until I start PK boosting, then I'm looking for 6.1,6.2 as thats where Phos is better absorbed

 

[*mistress*]

if want k.i.s.s...

gh maxi grow/bloom

1-2 tsp gal... fresh water...
in tap, maxibloom settle @ ~5.7...
that also ~.5-1.0 ec/500-700ppm (wand meter)
if new to coco, that (bag instructions) get thru entire season...
end.

*optional*
ca-nit, k-nit, epsom salt, protekt

prefer to ph-down to 5.0...
more iron, manganese & boron & calcium available.
prefer feed calcium separate,
mag separate
& nitrogen thru-out life...
phosphorus not needed in large amount, ~1:3 nitrogenotassium
or...~1:.5-1:3-4 n:k:... lots cal+mag...

due to more nitrate nitrogen content, ph drift up (in medium) as cation exchange occur...
see maxibl00m, 4.5:.5 nitrate:ammonium nitrogen maxgro, 8.5:1.5 n03:nh4... so available nitrogen, that may make ph of media & run-off increase...

found that if ph kept lower, & nitrogen thru-out... they happy.
& not mix cal w/ phosphates, too much potash or mag.
as these elements may antagonise ea other...

also, cal primarily immobile, but moves w/ water thru xylem, so when rh lower, plant able to transpire more (push water into atmosphere), which may help cal translocation.
the veins of the leaves are where the water is carried out of shoots & into leaves & out into air...

this why lots find that plant become pale yellow @ top... this cal deficiency. as only small amount of translocation from old to young leaves...

mag deficiency appear on lower leaves, 1st... may be caused by too high levelpotassium, or calcium... or too high content of ammonium nitrogen, etc...
mag also work best if balanced w/ other cations (k+, ca++, nh4++(ammonium nitrogen), h+)...

iron deficiency may look like mag deficiency... then chlorosis goes to veins of plant, then leanves turn yeloow to white... too high ph induce fe deficiency... along w/ too much manganese...

manganese immobile & build up in lower leaves...veins stay green, but leaves develop necrotic spottings...

boron not mobile & more available @ lower ph... leaves become brittle during flowering, death of growing tips, etc...

zinc become >available as ph rises, too much phosphates may form insoluble zinc phosphate...

etc, etc, etc...

full strength nutes & keeping micronutrients in solution, w/ slightly acidic ph, +!

if find that plant in coco likes ph 5.8-6.0 & fed 3+x/day, then that is what work for your plants... maybe, check ph of media & run-off, too...

 

[SOTF420]

Last time I did coco coir and hydroton mix, I used the two part Advanced Nutrients Conny line and the 3 part fox farm bloom booster at recommended intervals or so & always kept the PH around 6.0 or slightly below with ppm's around 800 - 1000, the plants had no problems at all and if anything grew too fast and too big but then again I feed the whole time the lights are on so there is zero salt build-up as it's always flushing itself.

 

[2Lazy]

if want k.i.s.s...
phosphorus not needed in large amount, ~1:3 nitrogenotassium
or...~1:.5-1:3-4 n:k:... lots cal+mag...

found that if ph kept lower, & nitrogen thru-out... they happy.
& not mix cal w/ phosphates, too much potash or mag.
as these elements may antagonise ea other...

So close! Not quite right for coco though. Really good effort on your behalf, but according to Canna you're confused about the phosphates when it comes to how much coco needs.

Coco fibre typically contains little calcium and even less phosphate; on the other hand it does hold a lot of potassium compared to other growing mediums. These are just some of the nutrients plants need but they are not present in the proper amounts in coco coir to meet the needs of your plants. For this reason CANNA Research developed a COCO nutrient that supplements the CANNA COCO medium to exactly what the plants need. It is quite obvious that when using COCO medium, lots of calcium and phosphate and very little potassium need to be added to the coco, and this is exactly what the CANNA COCO nutrient line contains.
The amounts of calcium and phosphate that have to be present for the nutrient to do its job properly are quite high. When you put such highly concentrated elements in one bottle they will conflict with each other sometimes resulting in a slimy residue of sorts. The design problem is: your plants still need both elements and they need them in large amounts, in spite of their conflict.
COCO is divided into a two-part nutrient solution known as COCO A and COCO B. There are two bottles but it is actually only one fertilizer, so you need both of them to work as a complete nutrient.

Left: COCO A Right: COCO B
If you find a brand of COCO nutrient sold in only one bottle with no residues in the container, this should be like ‘writing on the wall’ to you. You now know that there cannot possibly be high enough amounts of both calcium and phosphate present: you’re probably being ripped off. The fact that we divided it into two bottles is actually clever thinking and proof that our formula is strong enough to be effective and cannot be put into one bottle.
Let us illustrate what would happen when all ingredients are put together in one bottle anyway:

COCO A + B mixed
The residue doesn’t appear instantly; and it will take some time to settle.

 

[Mudguts]

Im having issues with untreated coco that wont budge of its high buffer of 6.8-7 . Getting iron deficiencies because of it and fucked plants. HOw do I bring it down. Ive been putting mu nutes in at 4.0 ph but does nothing nor does soaking the pots in ph'd water with constant adding of phosphoric acid. Fucked if I know . What can I do too bring the core coco buffer down to an acceptable level or is it too late?

Great info here. IM still in my infancy of understanding the science of coco but have been studying hard the last few weeks. I goota read things 20 time before i half understand them though. ANd I never even tested ph runoff or core coco ph(using distilled water with root zone coco) before using untreated coco. Life was a dream and so were my plants. At least having all these issues using untreated coco has sparked me into learning about it .

 

[GrnMtnGrwr]

I'm running a drip setup with no runoff, I start the reservoir off at 5.5 and it drifts up over a few days. If it gets higher than 6.0-6.2~ I add PH down, but usually by the time it gets that high it's low enough that I'm adding in a fresh batch of nutes @ 5.5, and that brings it back down within range.

 

[dunkybones]

5.8 - 6.0 with Canna nutes. Runoff values tend to be erroneous with coco, so I concentrate more on what goes in then what runs out.

 

[Calimed]

6.0 or whatever yellow is on the liquid test kit.

 

[*mistress*]

if want k.i.s.s...
phosphorus not needed in large amount, ~1:3 nitrogenotassium
or...~1:.5-1:3-4 n:k:... lots cal+mag...

found that if ph kept lower, & nitrogen thru-out... they happy.
& not mix cal w/ phosphates, too much potash or mag.
as these elements may antagonise ea other..

So close! Not quite right for coco though. Really good effort on your behalf, but according to Canna you're confused about the phosphates when it comes to how much coco needs.

The amounts of calcium and phosphate that have to be present for the nutrient to do its job properly are quite high. When you put such highly concentrated elements in one bottle they will conflict with each other sometimes resulting in a slimy residue of sorts. The design problem is: your plants still need both elements and they need them in large amounts, in spite of their conflict.
COCO is divided into a two-part nutrient solution known as COCO A and COCO B. There are two bottles but it is actually only one fertilizer, so you need both of them to work as a complete nutrient.

?

that tech only state what *mistress* posted...

the plant does not require much phorphorus... maybe 50-100 ppm, same as nitrogen, much less than 200-300ppm potassium required.

phosphorus reported as (p205).
so... if, for example, gh flora nova bloom,

4-8-7 n-p-k...
is not really actual element% that get to plant...

as actual phosphorus is only ~43% of the label #, or

8% phosphorus on label is actually only 3.46% phosphorus...

.43*8%=3.46%...

so, if feed fnb, profile is 5-3.46-5.81 npk... or almost 1:.75:1 profile...

nitrogen reported as actual ppm, or mg/l, but other chems react, form phosphates, reduce from oxides, etc...

also, mixing calcium w/ phosphates cause precipitation, or, maes insoluble calcium phosphate. this basically white film, that may be on sink nozzle.

fert mngt:

...always remember that concentrated solutions containing calcium that come in contact w/ phosphate-containing solutions can result in insoluble calcium phosphate... which blocks the irrigation system...likewise, magnesium sulfate should not be mixed in high concentrations w/ phosphate-containing feeds.

chem fact.
most plant require 2x more k+ than phosphorus, seems... could be incorrect. if your plants need more p, give to them! 1:1:3+, or 1:2:3+, ratio seem work thru-out.
the chemical reaction of mixing calicium w/ phosphates is precipitation...

maybe, read link?...