Broad Mite and Spider Mite IPM for Cannabis (lets get a convo going)
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All I know is that I dont need some random person on a thread tellin me heat doesnt affect "some" plants. Ive seen it with my own eyes. Some varieties are more vulnerable to heat etc. Also the age of the plant and vigorousness will play a part. I think it is careless to say "just turn the heat up" without examining other factors first. Its not alwys so simple and thats why we have a thread about it, so we can make decisions based on others experiences and advice. To say heat your room to 120 degrees for 6 hours and never have a problem again is quite frankly a fantasy. Lot more to it than that especially when you grow in a heavily saturated area of growers. Everyone on my block is blowing it up I aint the only raodeo around here so I gotta throw everything there is all the time. Must be nice being the onlu grower in town must be why you so gassed up
I ordered a Ambyline Bar from http://www3.syngenta.com/global/Bioline/en/products/allproducts/Pages/Amblylinebar.aspx and a shaker of Swirskii's . I will keep you all posted on how I think they work. Also a while back I sent an emial to UCdavis head of IPM and he advised me to get in touch with the schools head entomologist regarding the BM situation in Cali and how to educate and MMJ growers so that they do not develop resistant mites tht will damage food crops. They are very interested in this actually. I own the North America Marijuana Co. check me out on line sometime. We are gonna develop this IPM alongside UC davis that is our goal.
You missed the point, everything we do is not without consequences. And nothing wrong about being informed of potential "unintended side-effects"...which is what I said. The current opinion (not fact...cuz no testing has been done on treated plants) that there is no harm to the plant after heat treatment...which conflicts with science and what I have read about "heat stress".
You will never find a post where I said "heat treatment does not work". Rather I have said it is not for everyone and it is not feasible for a large operation. Those are the facts.
BTW...not a guru, just an old fart that has seen more and experienced more than the average bear....like almost half a century of experience in "all things ganja" (I am over 60 years old).
You will never find a post where I said "heat treatment does not work". Rather I have said it is not for everyone and it is not feasible for a large operation. Those are the facts.
BTW...not a guru, just an old fart that has seen more and experienced more than the average bear....like almost half a century of experience in "all things ganja" (I am over 60 years old).
lol i didnt direct that at you honestly I was agreeing with you actually
Talk to Dr Ray Cloyd...he is the top entomologist in the country and is quite accessible (we spoke several times and will point you in the right direction).
The heated air treatment needs to done with short plants, ideally in a three foot tall space. It seemed like for every six inches in height towards the top would equal a half to a whole degree difference in temp. I lost tops of two foot plants at 123 degrees, so 122 is really max with 120 ideal. Works ideal on mum moms. Multiple thermometers on different levels will show you what you're able to do and what you need to improve on. I used heated fans with the lights and where the fan was blowing leaves were lost, so no fans with heat.
Maybe loading the plant up with water prior to the heat treatment might help with the leaf situation.
Both books mentioned 30 minute treatment with vapor heat at 110 degrees and 100% humidity. Maybe lowering the temp by another 10 degrees might make all the difference in the world for the plant...and 100% humidity (hence "vapor heat") might be the extra kicker. Don't know...but it might be worthy of a test by someone that has Broad Mites.
Both books mentioned 30 minute treatment with vapor heat at 110 degrees and 100% humidity. Maybe lowering the temp by another 10 degrees might make all the difference in the world for the plant...and 100% humidity (hence "vapor heat") might be the extra kicker. Don't know...but it might be worthy of a test by someone that has Broad Mites.
So how can someone achieve a perfect 120 in a 8-10ft high room? any suggestions?
I just cannot figure out a way to get my room that hot and humidity that high at a constant 120 for an extended period of time. If large greenhouses do it, how do they do it?
Steam box, and run a few plants at a time inside. 30 minutes a piece not too bad. Got lots of plants, build either more boxes and/or bigger boxes. Material...maybe those 1 1/2 thick styrofoam 4' x 8' sheets might work, they are white, mold resistance, affordable, high R factor, etc.
Steamer--buy or DIY electric steamer (no flame).
Bet you could build a "vapor box" that can handle 4 5-gallon plants 4' tall (4'x4'x4') for under $100.
Steamer--buy or DIY electric steamer (no flame).
Bet you could build a "vapor box" that can handle 4 5-gallon plants 4' tall (4'x4'x4') for under $100.
how tall would the plants be? While it is not exact, for every 6-8 inches of height you have will be another increased degree of heat by a degree roughly. Assuming that is the case an eighteen inch - two foot plant could be 122 at the top and about 120 at the bottom and still be considered treated. If you can't lower the ceiling temporarily you could put plants as high as possible on a table. The lights without fans running will get it pretty warm usually, and hang some type of additional heaters. Honestly don't think it's attainable on huge plants without some losses, and bigger rooms more challenging for sure. The heater should have a thermostat, plus you just have to babysit the room, checking thermometers.
I think building a 4x4x4 cube outa firring strips and styrofoam sheets whld be great I cld treat half a tray at a time!!! just place the box voer half a tray!! You think just adding a temp/humidity gague and a "steam cleaner" from bed bath and beyond make an attachment tht pumps the steam inside the chamber and monitor for 15 min incriments?
http://www.boscovs.com/shop/prod/di...Stick+Vacuums&utm_campaign=CSE&cid=CSE:Google
or do you think you need more power for a 4x4x4 cube?
or do you think you need more power for a 4x4x4 cube?
No doubt that there is more than one way to kill broad mites with steam, but for sure you're going to need to use lower temps with humidity. The UC Davis IPM program calls for 110.3 degrees for half an hour with 100% humidity. Haven't actually tried this yet but it's easier to maintain lower temps. http:/ www.ipm.ucdavis.edu/ PMG/r280400211.html
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but what about putting em back in the room with bugs here and there? i think its worth mentioning. obvioisly you need a way to really clean the space and every single living plant on your property would have to be treated. its not that i i think you guys dont understand this but if this is for all who ever may be reading this i think that should be said. they can live for a couple weeks and are passable on equipment. theres gonna need to be a staging area for all the dirty plants to be while the room gets cleaned so you can have a place to put them as they get sterilzed. its not like you can just grab them clean them and put them back and then grab the next one. youll just reinfest them., thats kind of almost as much if not more of a pain i the ass as figuring out how to heat the whole space in one fail swoop..
In your haste to discredit me, you missed one very important thing, but you would have to read more carefully and read between the lines to "get it".
I posted:
""I believe something more is going on here, as mine only had a very few RAs. I'm thinking that these things transmit other diseases, perhaps pythium? I'm perplexed."
"I tore my whole room down and performed autopsies on all 21 plants after getting too frustrated trying to save them. I am virtually certain that the RAs also transmitted some other infection, all the more reason to start over"
Well, guess what? There was something else gong on. It was broad mites. That's what killed my plants at that time, not root aphids. This was not "last year", as you posted, but over 4 years ago, just when broad mites were showing their ugly heads, only you couldn't see them, and peeps didn't know what was going on at the time. That's when I ascertained that "I believe something more is going on here", and " I'm thinking that these things transmit other diseases", and "I am virtually certain that the RAs also transmitted some other infection". The "other infection" turned out to be broad mites, which were just making their appearance, and nobody knew what they were, including myself. Root aphids are a walk in the park. Numerous ways to kill them. Easy peasy. But broad mites are another story, especially at that time. And that's what killed my plants at that time, not RAs. So sorry to disappoint you.
Sorry, but you are referencing hot water treatments. Steam or "vapor" are also hot water treatment. Hence the reference of 110 degrees, not coincidentally the same temp often quoted for hot water treatment. That is NOT hot air treatment. Hot air treatment involves no humidity, steam or "vapor", which is steam. Just hot air. No water in any form involved. The hot air treatment for broad mites was first done by me, admittedly out of desperation, as I did not know what the result would be. But your obfuscation is to be expected, just as you posted a link about how heat could potentially damage a pant on a cellular level. This is in reference to plants grown in hot temperatures for their life times, not for one hour treatments. As I and many others who are able to follow simple instructions (ie., no fans blowing hot air on the plants, which can damage leaves, and which I have frequently warned about on many occasions) have used the hot air (not vapor/steam) treatment with great results, and no damage at all to the plants, the biased opinion of someone who has never tried it is meaningless. Get back to me after you try it. What you or anyone else who tries it will find out is that the plants perk right up, and all mites on the plants and in the room are dead, including the eggs.
As to your assertion that I went "ballistic"? Just another lie. I do not go ballistic, especially at something you post, as I know how vast your ego is, and I expect your obfuscation.
Ha, ha! That's so true. The guys using chems don't want to lose their income stream. There is no need to use chemicals to kill bed bugs, which are a big problem now. I have posted many times in the broad mite thread about a company called Pest Heat. They sell systems that heat up your residence/space to any temperature you program it to. Bed bugs require 150 degrees, but these machines can do it. They can also be set to 120, and hence will kill broad/cyclamen mites, without harming your plants.
www.pestheat.com
Check them out. If you have a large warehouse grow, this might be the way to go.
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