Bill Introduced To Legalize and Tax Marijuana

[dagnabit]

How much has prescription drug use(legal and illegal) dropped since the passing of MMJ in each state?

Bad news either way. If it drops, then you can guarantee they will get those profits back by getting a piece of the mmj pie once possible. If it doesn't drop then it's a huge sign that med may be a gimmick.

I think pushing medical as a way for recreational is the absolutely wrong way to go. Medication in the country is a huge monopoly. Yet most of you want it to go first, just because it's so great in CA.

If and/or when mmj is widely accepted how do you guys purpose getting it legalized for adult consumption like alcohol? You can't compare it to over the counter pills. It is an intoxicant. It will be regulated.

Am I missing something in all of this med before rec stuff? If the government ever does accept MMJ then it's more than likely going to be off the table completely for recreational use by adults.

Nothing medical in this country is taken lightly. Sure mmj is.. right now.. but that's only because big brother would have to do a 180.

If you think Joe blow is going to be able to grow pot without rules, regulations, and competition from 'not small' and 'not organic' with the intent of selling to people, medical patients no less.., then you're out of touch with reality.

Don't say look at CA or give any example of the market right now. I'm talking about later.

Going to be a big mess.

therein lies the problem with the "get it rescheduled first" idea.
schedule II puts MJ on the level of oxycontin and the like. creating new felonies( major argument the same people had 19 against 19) and destroys all state medical laws in one fell swoop.

 

[mean mr.mustard]

yes those same "radicals" from the '60s are the ones voting for palin in 2012 and helped create the "free speech zones" we see set up for protests today.
thanks hippies!
oh and thanks '60s hippies for voting with bush on the patriot act!

yeah hippies were ineffective in their time. i just wish they had stayed ineffective.....they have done WAAAAY more harm than good thus far.

Where do you get your information?

98 Senators voted for that Patriot Act. There isn't any of the peoples' thoughts or feelings taken into consideration during times of emergency... blame it on the hippies lol.

Palin doesn't matter to anyone anymore.... not that she ever did.

The 60's hippies were the last to protest en masse. They marched like we were "supposed" to do. They had numbers and spoke the truth. We are lying and hiding behind medical patients.

We have hate and discord... they had love and hope.

It seems like you love division and you really think you're doing more good than harm... I pity that logic.

If you can't tell any changes were made for the better, civil rights, womens' liberation, etc.. then you are blinding yourself... why, I have no idea.

 

[Hydrosun]

therein lies the problem with the "get it rescheduled first" idea.
schedule II puts MJ on the level of oxycontin and the like. creating new felonies( major argument the same people had 19 against 19) and destroys all state medical laws in one fell swoop.

Uh dropping cannabis from schedule I to schedule II will not create new felonies or touch state med laws.

There are already penalties for possessing schedule II without a prescription (so no new felonies).

Also the great state of Oregon rescheduled cannabis from I to II and OR still has a working MMJ program.

Just saying.

 

[dagnabit]

Uh dropping cannabis from schedule I to schedule II will not create new felonies or touch state med laws.

There are already penalties for possessing schedule II without a prescription (so no new felonies).

Also the great state of Oregon rescheduled cannabis from I to II and OR still has a working MMJ program.

Just saying.

actually with federal rescheduling marijuana will be treated as any other prescription drug.
doctors do not write "recommendations" for schedule II narcotics so every patients rec. would become void upon schedule II
this is not some imagining on my part. look at any otc that was rescheduled for the model.
marijuana manufacture would be regulated by the FDA as well.
do you think they will treat marijuana differently than oxy or any other sch. II?
you want DOW Pfizer and Monsanto? that is what you will get with fed sch. II
where do you think the home grower fits in with sch II?
the same place as the heroin dealer. or the guy flipping scripts of xanax. or the meth lab.

 

[THE PABLOS]

Not the first year, but IMO, if it's legalized nationwide, and Doctors start speaking honestly about it, and the myriad array of symptoms that can be treated by it, then yes, I could easily see it resulting in that kind of loss for big pharma eventually.

What peeps seem to forget....Cannabis like any other medicinal herb....is not used in the traditional sense that pharma meds are. It will not mask symptoms or make it all go away. Cannabis needs to be used with other medicinal herbs....depending on their ailments. Peeps using strictly Cannabis for their med needs are missing the boat...and misled....they are skipping out on what Herbalism is....an how it works.

It may well be used as a traditional medicine after it is refined. Growers and Herbalist will not be the ones doing the refining. That's all I'm saying. The common perception of Cannabis being a wonder medicine....to put the herb in a better spot light....is more or less a form of propaganda.

Poppy....cocoa....much heavier drugs after refinement. On their own...and used wisely....they are as useful as Cannabis. I wish I could cultivate those as well.

 

[Hydrosun]

Dude Dr's don't write scrips for schedule I they write recs and in OR where it is classified as schedule II the Dr's still give out recs. No chages occured in the OR med program when it was rescheduled to II. You are incorrect that the OR patients had their recs voided. This is historical fact, not opinion.

The FDA does not regulate herbs and spices, or natural supplements. The FDA doesn't do shit with cannabis now and should NEVER have any authority over our natural supplement. On a side note one may not manufacture cannabis it is a living organism that is cultivated. Manufacturing would imply that if you crammed enough man hours into a single 24hr period you could create finished cannabis. Well doesn't matter how many people you have working cannabis will not finish its cultivation until nature says so.

I personally don't want Monsanto or Phillip Morris cultivating cannabis because I think they will do a shitty job.

The home grower fits into schedule II as easily as schedule I.

I guess I am worse than a meth cooker because I cultivate schedule I and he cooks up schedule II. Is that what you believe? Is that what you want this community to believe?

The labels attached to me by the government don't bother me in the least, I do however respect the opinions of ICmagers.

 

[dagnabit]

Dude Dr's don't write scrips for schedule I they write recs and in OR where it is classified as schedule II the Dr's still give out recs. No chages occured in the OR med program when it was rescheduled to II. You are incorrect that the OR patients had their recs voided. This is historical fact, not opinion.

The FDA does not regulate herbs and spices, or natural supplements. The FDA doesn't do shit with cannabis now and should NEVER have any authority over our natural supplement. On a side note one may not manufacture cannabis it is a living organism that is cultivated. Manufacturing would imply that if you crammed enough man hours into a single 24hr period you could create finished cannabis. Well doesn't matter how many people you have working cannabis will not finish its cultivation until nature says so.

I personally don't want Monsanto or Phillip Morris cultivating cannabis because I think they will do a shitty job.

The home grower fits into schedule II as easily as schedule I.

I guess I am worse than a meth cooker because I cultivate schedule I and he cooks up schedule II. Is that what you believe? Is that what you want this community to believe?

The labels attached to me by the government don't bother me in the least, I do however respect the opinions of ICmagers.

ok disconnect..

im talking about federal rescheduling to II
thats all..
the repercussions of said rescheduling.
not individual states.
the consequences i listed above are of the fed rescheduling.

[EDIT]
unless im reading you wrong and you believe the FDA would have nothing to do with MJ after sch II..
at which point we can just drop it cuz your in a whole other reality...

 

[Hydrosun]

[EDIT]
unless im reading you wrong and you believe the FDA would have nothing to do with MJ after sch II..
at which point we can just drop it cuz your in a whole other reality...

Just like the FDA had fucking ZERO to do with that K2 / spice crap. In my reality the FDA did not have authority to act on K2 or other over the counter items.

How do you believe that the FDA has governing authority over cannabis but not St. John's Wart?

Why would these two plants be treated differently, besides the governments fucking greed and pension to control peoples lives?

Even if the feds reclassified to II from I Dr's will still retain their first amendment right of free speech. This first amendment right is what allows Dr's to recommend WITHOUT having their medical licence revoked.

If the fed loosens it CAN NOT strip Dr's of the rights they already have.

Again federal rescheduling would do nothing to reduce the rights of Dr's or patients.

 

[THE PABLOS]

99% of peeps want to use Cannabis as an intoxicant....to get "high"

1% wants to use it as a medicine....to treat their aliments.

The government does not want its subjects getting "high" unless they can profit from it.

Cannabis is non addicting so they can't string peeps out with addiction...no money goes into rehabs....no money goes in Pharma companies.

Money comes from LEO budget and locking peeps up in prisons....and whatever deals are made with drug smuggling...as there is no way government has clean hands there.

A deal will be cut.....but a concession will be to do away with Medical status and home production.

We'll get our weed from stores....any medical...will be taken over by the FDA. Everybody will win....except those of us that chose to keep our gardens. That's how I see legalization/regulation.

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

Uh dropping cannabis from schedule I to schedule II will not create new felonies or touch state med laws.
There are already penalties for possessing schedule II without a prescription (so no new felonies).
Also the great state of Oregon rescheduled cannabis from I to II and OR still has a working MMJ program.
Just saying.

Don't mind dag, he lives in fear and delusion and should be pitied. He obviously has lost touch with reality all together and is spewing more flaming garbage. He loves to blame and divide... I think he just has no friends and this is his only social outlet.

Thanks for pointing out a little truth to counter his delusions. Those who are against the rescheduling of Cannabis are the ones against decrim in the general sense. For shame...

 

[dagnabit]

Just like the FDA had fucking ZERO to do with that K2 / spice crap. In my reality the FDA did not have authority to act on K2 or other over the counter items.

How do you believe that the FDA has governing authority over cannabis but not St. John's Wart?

Why would these two plants be treated differently, besides the governments fucking greed and pension to control peoples lives?

neither of those substances are sch II medicines.
apples=oranges?

Even if the feds reclassified to II from I Dr's will still retain their first amendment right of free speech. This first amendment right is what allows Dr's to recommend WITHOUT having their medical licence revoked.

If the fed loosens it CAN NOT strip Dr's of the rights they already have.

Again federal rescheduling would do nothing to reduce the rights of Dr's or patients.

doctors DO NOT WRITE RECOMMENDATIONS FOR SCH II MEDICINES they write prescriptions.
i think you really dont grasp the federal scheduling system and how it relates to the FDA.
if your doctor wrote you a "recommendation" for any SCH II narcotic...
well ask him about it next visit cuz you wont take my word for it.
this is more for the persons who feel our focus should be federal rescheduling based on medical not the free for all types.
you and i seem to agree federal rescheduling would be a bad thing.
i just dont think you realize exactly what it means.
can you tell me one SCH II that is not strictly regulated by the FDA?
why would cannabis be any different?

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

Just like the FDA had fucking ZERO to do with that K2 / spice crap. In my reality the FDA did not have authority to act on K2 or other over the counter items.

How do you believe that the FDA has governing authority over cannabis but not St. John's Wart?

Why would these two plants be treated differently, besides the governments fucking greed and pension to control peoples lives?

Even if the feds reclassified to II from I Dr's will still retain their first amendment right of free speech. This first amendment right is what allows Dr's to recommend WITHOUT having their medical licence revoked.

If the fed loosens it CAN NOT strip Dr's of the rights they already have.

Again federal rescheduling would do nothing to reduce the rights of Dr's or patients.

It sickens me that folks think spewing delusions against the rescheduling of cannabis will help the community. The same flamer who loves to troll you and I for having issues with 19, has issues with federal rescheduling... is this a joke? or does dag simply want to argue because he has no friends, and no valid position. Has he reverted to nonsense anti-rescheduling of MJ rhetoric to "help" prove that we are to blame for his problems. lmao

To suggest that rescheduling of cannabis on the federal level should not be done... for whatever reason... is in reality a position against the eventual decrim of cannabis.

Wouldn't it be good for the cancer patients of America to have access to pharma cannabiniods? Or is that fucking up your "free the weed" agenda? GTFO with all that. Terminally ill come before stoners. This isn't about passing a single law to change everything today, only fools hope that is an option. The federal rescheduling of cannabis will change the game, and bring us closer to our goal of decrim, while allowing dying people a little relief. Rescheduling would affect the nation, not just CA or WA or CO.

Marijuana has medicinal value, and this rescheduling is obviously over due. To see folks coming out against it, while claiming to be for "legalization" is as laughable as it is disappointing.

 

[Hash Zeppelin]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO

 

[Hydrosun]

neither of those substances are sch II medicines.
apples=oranges?



doctors DO NOT WRITE RECOMMENDATIONS FOR SCH II MEDICINES they write prescriptions.
i think you really dont grasp the federal scheduling system and how it relates to the FDA.
if your doctor wrote you a "recommendation" for any SCH II narcotic...
well ask him about it next visit cuz you wont take my word for it.
this is more for the persons who feel our focus should be federal rescheduling based on medical not the free for all types.
you and i seem to agree federal rescheduling would be a bad thing.
i just dont think you realize exactly what it means.
can you tell me one SCH II that is not strictly regulated by the FDA?
why would cannabis be any different?

I am sorry but you are incorrect. Dr's may certainly say straight to your face. "I think Cannabis or any other substance on earth would be beneficial to you. I recommend A, B, C; but I do not prescribe anything to you." "Now it is up to you to obtain A, B, or C if you so choose."

That is the Dr's freedom of speech rights. Some states offer protections against or defenses to criminal charges associated with A, B, C some do not; but all Dr's are free to recommend in all 50 states.

Cannabis as a schedule I is not regulated by the FDA and the D part of FDA is not defined to include plants in their naturally occurring state. The FDA does not have the authority to regulate plants, supplements, herbs, and spices. Cannabis falls into this group; just as K2 / spice does. The FDA could do nothing the DEA outlawed the substance.

We should really discuss how DEA handles a rescheduling because the D in FDA deals with drugs that companies patient and seek to hold exclusive right to. Not too many home growers will go about seeking to patent Genetically Modified Cannabis.

 

[dagnabit]

I am sorry but you are incorrect. Dr's may certainly say straight to your face. "I think Cannabis or any other substance on earth would be beneficial to you. I recommend A, B, C; but I do not prescribe anything to you." "Now it is up to you to obtain A, B, or C if you so choose."

That is the Dr's freedom of speech rights. Some states offer protections against or defenses to criminal charges associated with A, B, C some do not; but all Dr's are free to recommend in all 50 states.

Cannabis as a schedule I is not regulated by the FDA and the D part of FDA is not defined to include plants in their naturally occurring state. The FDA does not have the authority to regulate plants, supplements, herbs, and spices. Cannabis falls into this group; just as K2 / spice does. The FDA could do nothing the DEA outlawed the substance.

We should really discuss how DEA handles a rescheduling because the D in FDA deals with drugs that companies patient and seek to hold exclusive right to. Not too many home growers will go about seeking to patent Genetically Modified Cannabis.

trying to understand..
are you saying cannabis will never be sch II becuse it is a plant?
as far as oral recommendations you are correct..
is it common for your doctor to recommend a sch II medication and tell you to go find it without a script?
id look for another doctor.
im trying to figure out what you think federal rescheduling means?
how do you think it will go down?

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

]Cannabis as a schedule I is not regulated by the FDA and the D part of FDA is not defined to include plants in their naturally occurring state. The FDA does not have the authority to regulate plants, supplements, herbs, and spices. Cannabis falls into this group; just as K2 / spice does. The FDA could do nothing the DEA outlawed the substance.

We should really discuss how DEA handles a rescheduling because the D in FDA deals with drugs that companies patient and seek to hold exclusive right to. Not too many home growers will go about seeking to patent Genetically Modified Cannabis.

Another great post. The rescheduling of cannabis would be for sativex and marinol, not for the buds or hash. Really people? lol. You can grow poppy plants and smoke that goo in private for yourself, but don't try selling it or cooking it.

Let's look at opium poppy plant, part of schedule II under opium. Looks like it gets grown still.

"Opium poppies are specifically scheduled under U.S. Law. The Controlled Substances Act, Schedule II, lists "Opium poppy and poppy straw" as well as .The law Poppies are specifically scheduled (under 'Mescaline' in the Federal Listing) as "Concentrate of poppy straw (the crude extract of poppy straw in either liquid, solid or powder form which contains the phenanthrene alkaloids of the opium poppy)".

There is some confusion in the law, however, because opium-producing poppies are widely grown around the US and Canada and the opium poppy seeds are omnipresent in cooking, breads, and deserts. The grey-blue poppy seeds sold in virtually every grocery store in the US contain low levels of opiates (not psychoactive levels). Poppy pods are widely used in dry flower arrangements.

Law enforcement in the US is somewhat schizophrenic about these plants, although there are continual attempts to try to stop them from being sold or grown. If poppies are grown as sources for opiates, there is no question that it violates the CSA. If poppies are purely grown for ornamental purposes, their legal position is somewhat less clear cut, since they are so widely grown and available.

Opium for legal commercial pharmaceutical use is grown with special government licenses around the world, although very little of it is grown inside the US. Large scale underground opium poppy growing is reported to take place in Mexico, Afghanistan, and many other countries in Asia. Much of the produced opium is converted into heroin because it is easier to ship and commands a higher price than raw opium."

http://www.erowid.org/plants/poppy/poppy_law.shtml]

 

[dagnabit]

Wouldn't it be good for the cancer patients of America to have access to pharma cannabiniods? Or is that fucking up your "free the weed" agenda? GTFO with all that. Terminally ill come before stoners. This isn't about passing a single law to change everything today, only fools hope that is an option. The federal rescheduling of cannabis will change the game, and bring us closer to our goal of decrim, while allowing dying people a little relief. Rescheduling would affect the nation, not just CA or WA or CO.

Marijuana has medicinal value, and this rescheduling is obviously over due. To see folks coming out against it, while claiming to be for "legalization" is as laughable as it is disappointing.

what do you think will happen in a post sch II world?
you think state mmj laws will go unaffected?
all animosity and bullshit aside..
do you honestly believe that sch II under fda control will put MMJ in the hands of more patients?
i believe it will put adulterated cannabis"pills" in the hands of a very few and halt all progress toward decriminalization.
the fed does not relinquish control. if cannabis hits the same sch as oxy/xanax it will be 50 years before it gets off tht sch if it ever does.
how can anyone lay that much faith in the federal government?!?!!?
you actually think they would do what is right once the FDA has cannabis?

 

[mean mr.mustard]

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=201196

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=201196

Thanks MMM, this is the Sativex thread fyi.

 

[kmk420kali]

Cannabis as a schedule I is not regulated by the FDA and the D part of FDA is not defined to include plants in their naturally occurring state. The FDA does not have the authority to regulate plants, supplements, herbs, and spices. Cannabis falls into this group; just as K2 / spice does. The FDA could do nothing the DEA outlawed the substance.

Tho this is somewhat true...there are loopholes for them to use--

Specifically, the FDA's guidance statement elaborates on current regulations that state that any product, food, or supplement making health claims must be carefully policed by the FDA. This has been a longtime FDA rule. Notably, the document suggests that foods such as vegetable juices making health claims must undergo federal monitoring.

http://www.organicconsumers.org/articles/article_4803.cfm