A Basic Compost Tea Guide

[Cool Moe]

Vonforne and CT Guy, thanks for your knowledge. When my buds come up with nicknames for me it's not usually Aristotle or Bob Villa it's more like rockhead or dumbass. If I get the largest aerator at the pet store that pumps 4 tubes 4 airstones do you think that should be enough to mulitiply microbial life in a 5 gallon bucket? Thanks again.

 

[Microbeman]

Vonforne and CT Guy, thanks for your knowledge. When my buds come up with nicknames for me it's not usually Aristotle or Bob Villa it's more like rockhead or dumbass. If I get the largest aerator at the pet store that pumps 4 tubes 4 airstones do you think that should be enough to mulitiply microbial life in a 5 gallon bucket? Thanks again.

No. It will likely be enough for 1 to 3 gallons.
http://www.microbeorganics.com/#So_You_Wanna_Build_A_Compost_Tea_Brewer

 

[ColBatGuano]

So I know "un-sulfured" Blackstrap Molasses is the preferred molasses. Hard to find without ordering on the internet. So I've been using just "Grandma's" Molasses for my teas.

Is there a big difference between the "Blackstrap" and the regular kind? Also, the bit of sulfer, from what I read above will kill the beneficials. Is that also true? There is not that much sulfer in the product but I just wanted to ask since elemental sulfer is everywhere on earth.

Here's a side-by-side per-tablespoon comparison of the Nutrition Facts labels for Grandma's Unsulphured Molasses and the bottle of Wholesome Sweeteners' Unsulphured Organic Blackstrap Molasses I've been using:

Grandma's:
Sodium: 20mg
Potassium: 110mg
Sugars: 14g
amounts of the following are not specified, only percentages of daily value:
Calcium: 4%
Iron: 4%
Magnesium: 2%

Wholesome Sweeteners:
Potassium: 730mg
Calcium: 115mg (10%)
Sugars: 10g
amounts of the following are not specified, only percentages of daily value:
Iron: 15%
Sodium: 0%
Vitamin B6: 10%
Magnesium: 8%

Quite a difference in the overall mineral potency, but I think the lack of notable amounts of sodium in blackstrap molasses alone makes it the clear choice.

Just look a little harder to find it. If they sell it in this rinky-dink town I'm in, they've got to have it in yours. Look in health food stores, organic food stores, nutritional supplement supply stores, etc. Always check the ingredients, and make sure it says "Blackstrap Molasses" and nothing else. I found mine at a small health food store in a tiny strip mall.

 

[Cool Moe]

Thanks Microbeman that is a great link

 

[grapeman]

TY - I've been waiting for the reason. I'm sure it was out there but I never ran across it, so I just been using Grandma's. I'll have to order the blackstrap on the internet now.

Thanks a bunch.

 

[ColBatGuano]

TY - I've been waiting for the reason. I'm sure it was out there but I never ran across it, so I just been using Grandma's. I'll have to order the blackstrap on the internet now.

Thanks a bunch.

You're welcome. FWIW, the bottle of blackstrap molasses I use doesn't say "Blackstrap" on the front of the bottle, only "Organic Molasses." I had to turn to bottle around and read the ingredients to know it was blackstrap molasses.

This is the brand I use: http://www.organicsyrups.biz They make lots of other products useful in making teas, like Sucanat, unrefined sugars, and honeys.

 

[CT Guy]

TY - I've been waiting for the reason. I'm sure it was out there but I never ran across it, so I just been using Grandma's. I'll have to order the blackstrap on the internet now.

Thanks a bunch.

In the US, i've found it at most grocery chain stores like PCC, Whole Foods or even QFC.

 

[grapeman]

Another question (found blackstrap btw). When I make my ewc tea for the last several months, I always get decent foaming within an hour or so of starting the air pumps.

Seems that when I add hi P guano and/or kelp meal to the ewc tea, the foaming is very minimal. without investing time and money in a microscope, is this common or is something wrong?

thanks

 

[Trichgnomes]

Another question (found blackstrap btw). When I make my ewc tea for the last several months, I always get decent foaming within an hour or so of starting the air pumps.

Seems that when I add hi P guano and/or kelp meal to the ewc tea, the foaming is very minimal. without investing time and money in a microscope, is this common or is something wrong?

thanks

I'm not exactly an expert on the subject, but I've definitely watched them step in and give constructive criticism more than once, so I think I'll take a stab at it.
Foam, says little to nothing about microbial life. Unless you use a microscope, there are few ways to discern biologically active, aerated compost tea from say, dirty water. I have read someone say there are things to add to keep the foam to a minimal , if it becomes problematic (yucca extract maybe?). Without a scope (I don't have one either, but have been eyeing the ones on MM's site for a while now), this is what I try to aim for in a tea brewing:
(At the advice of many knowledgeable folks here at IC, thank you all for sharing )

-Keep the temperature consistent/ brew time consistent ( Of course one can get into brewing for different biological makeup, but without a scope I do not think it is worth guessing)
-Use fresh compost/EWC
Do not overfeed! A lot of recipes call for WAY too much molasses. I think Dr. Ingham calls for 5ml/5gallons of water. I've seen some that call for 15ml/ 1 gallon. Too much food-stock usually leads to an anaerobic tea which should be discarded. Less is more!



Also, my research as well as the advice of CT Guy and Mm state that it is unwise to add guano to a tea. It becomes not just a compost tea, but a manure tea, which increases the risk of pathogens. If the guano were to be composted first however, then that is a different story. Compost, thermophilic or EWC, will ensure that the pathogens are a minimum, thus extracting microbes which in this context are considered beneficial.

 

[jaykush]

I have read someone say there are things to add to keep the foam to a minimal , if it becomes problematic (yucca extract maybe?)

watch out yucca will make it foam MORE, a lot more lol. i think CT was saying a small amount of quality veggie oil keeps foam down and doesnt hurt the biology.

and just to say, i dont think adding guanos to teas is bad. adding too much yes, but a little bit, definitely not as it does contain life. and my microscope proved that to me. and so has years of using bat guano.

PS: bat guano is composted, your mostly using bug guano ( depending on the guanos source) because they ate the bat crap and processed it( almost like worms and cow manure). the original source was just bats. if you composted the guano in a traditional sense it would be far less nutrient rich than before you did and would then be pointless to buy and use.

 

[Microbeman]

I think I may disagree with you here Jay but I am a little unsure. [If I have read correctly {please correct me if incorrect}] You seem to be saying that manure (at least guano) has more nutrients prior to being composted. I really do not think this is the case. When maure is included in a composting process, it is my understanding that the nutrients are actually compounded but in sequestered form, to be released to plants by microbial interaction. You seem to also be saying that there are nutrients in guano (manure) which are directly available (without microbial processing) to plants. Although, I think there are some minimal ionic form nutrients available in guano (manures) I understand that around 95%+ require microbial processing, the reason why it may be better to topdress guano (manures). There are some who make the claim that worm castings are directly available to plants but similarly, I believe this to be incorrect, otherwise these nutrients would rapidly dissappear into the water table, which they don't.

It is true that all manures will display a multitude of microbial life under the microscope but whether it is primarily anaerobic life may be another story. Now, I happen to belong to the school which believes a few anaerobes in the mix can be beneficial so can perhaps see the benefit in adding a minor amount of guano to compost tea, bearing in mind that I have no experience with guano and bearing in mind that the qualty of guano may vary wildly [some may be not much different than rat shit; hmmmm] However, if one is attempting to make the most aerobic compost tea possible, then I venture that adding guano will likely reduce the dissolved oxygen level and add anaerobes [& perhaps pathogenic microbes]

 

[Trichgnomes]

Thanks for the correction jk. I knew there was connection with Yucca and foam--but my conception was completely opposite!. Good thing you didn't listen to me grape!

So is there certain beneficials in the guano, or would you do it just for the soluble P contained in it? I have had better luck topdressing personally, but plan on moving away from guano all together once I run out.

 

[mad librettist]

Microbe, it's hard to generalize, but guano can have a very high NO3 content. Enough, actually, to be an ingredient in certain gunpowders. That explains why many guano users "see a difference the next day".

quick wiki quote:

Guano consists of ammonia, along with uric, phosphoric, oxalic, and carbonic acids, as well as some earth salts and impurities. Guano also has a high concentration of nitrates.

 

[jaykush]

no where did i say bat guano doesn't need microbial processing. and its not like the guano is sterile, far from it. it can process itself if need be.

put it this way..... add a few handfuls of guano to your soil, your going to burn the shit out of your plants and watch them fry to death there's no doubt about it.....compost that same guano with something carbon rich, then add a few handfuls of that compost to your soil it will not give you the same result. its not really that is has more, just more available in a shorter period of time. the compost will last longer yea, but sometimes plants are hungry and soils are not that great to meet the plants needs. and a little help is needed.

i think adding a small amount of guano just adds to the diversity of ACT. but like i said obviously too much is not good, and 90% of the time people add too much simple as that. just like too much of anything can be bad. but a little can be beneficial from what i have observed and learned over time.

that being said, you dont NEED guano. i dont use it anymore, but used it for years and years in the past. its just another way to meet the same needs of the plant.

 

[mad librettist]

well if it's between using guano and losing the crop, sure. but given what I just posted, when you see a difference right away it's because you added nitrate in high enough quantities to feed the plant (as opposed to the soil).

 

[CT Guy]

well if it's between using guano and losing the crop, sure. but given what I just posted, when you see a difference right away it's because you added nitrate in high enough quantities to feed the plant (as opposed to the soil).

Why are you losing your crop in the first place?

 

[mad librettist]

well, I figure that since I'm after quick results, I add guano to the point of giving enough nitrate to change the plant's appearance overnight. Then I'm probably overfeeding bacteria, which gobble up all the O2. Anaerobic conditions and wild swings of nitrate availability ensue. Then I see the plant is sick and I can either change everything or give it more nitrate. Then I just flush the soil before harvest. Simple.

 

[Microbeman]

Jay, My misunderstanding probably brought about by "it would be far less nutrient rich than before you did and would then be pointless to buy and use." Thanks for the clarification. As far as what you call burning the plants with guano, does this include placing guano on the surface of the soil? I have seen plants show supposed signs of burning by mixing horse manure into the soil but the same thing does not occur with the horse manure topdressed. I have also seen supposed burning by planting directly in mushroom compost, probably caused by fumagants. I believe that sometimes 'burning' is confused with other problems, like nutrient lock up or an electrical or microbial off-balance.

Mad-lib; Welcome. Be cautious with standardizing how long you think it may take microbial delivery of nutrients to plants from compost or other organic matter. There is evidence of these processes switching nutrient delivery several times in a day. Anyway it is not necessarily slow. A case in point; I received a plant recently in a little transplant pot. It appeared planted in some commercial peat mix. I noticed it yellowing so I took some totally dried out vermicompost sitting on my lab bench for about 3 months, mixed up about three tablespoons with water and poured it on the soil surface in the evening. The next morning the plant had greened up and was reaching up to its 24 hr desk light saying 'Oh Ya.'

All; Bear in mind the usual reason for brewing aerated compost tea is to extract and multiply microbes and not to supply direct nutrients. In growing practices no one way is right or wrong. Experiment.

 

[mad librettist]

ah, good point microbe. right you are. let's say then that there is a tendency for things not to be so fast most of the time. Particularly when trying to transform a mass of soil already colonized by roots. mad lib's mad lib:

and let's say that guanos are adjective in nitrates. and let's say I verb lots and lots. The immediate noun can verb gradual noun, no?

 

[Clackamas Coot]

Microbeman and/or CT Guy

I had a couple of questions of 2 specific products that could be added to an AACT and specifically the Dyna-Gro Pro-TeKt which is a liquid and according to their web site contains 3.7% Potassium (K2O) and 7.8% Silicon (SiO2) and the other one would be EM.

I called EMAmerica and asked on of the customer service folks and she said that if you wanted to add EM to an aerobic tea you would want to add it when you're ready to apply the tea to the soil or as a foliar spray.

Any thoughts?

Thanks.

CC