BhT goes toe-to-toe with tea party fanatics

dagnabit · Oct 14, 2010

Grat3fulh3ad said:
You seem unable to differentiate some things.

Like 'government' from 'the government'
or 'trusting the concept of government' from 'trusting individual politicians'

Nobody ever suggested 'believing politicians'

do politicians not make up the two ruling parties?
is "the government" somehow not "government"?

you seem to try to compartmentalize very well...
but it leaves your cognitive abilities somewhat diminished. it returns to your b&w mindset.
no room for nuance..

dagnabit · Oct 14, 2010

Grat3fulh3ad said:
aren't tea party candidates politicians?

and ive said several times they are nothing new or different..
they are the exact same..
you should try reading..

last time people try to grasp it

political parties are a tool to keep you distracted while you are being fleeced

how hard will some folks fight for that D or R

sheep

grasspass · Oct 14, 2010

Thanks Big Herb for doing something that may have got some people thinking. Though I do think that most brainwashed people are not going to change their mind when confronted by a stranger on the street. I like the idea of a tea party although I haven't been to one, because it is people voicing their opinion to the government. Governments are needed, but they need to respect the people more than they do.

dagnabit · Oct 14, 2010

That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed

they seem to have forgotten

SCF · Oct 14, 2010

dankydoodle said:
The part in red just about sums it up...

If you mean support, like with tax dollars? Then you.

we live in a 3rd world country, there is no more middle class. only poor and rich.

dagnabit · Oct 14, 2010

SCF said:
we live in a 3rd world country, there is no more middle class. only poor and rich.

almost everyone i know is nonexistant?

Grat3fulh3ad · Oct 14, 2010

dagnabit said:
and ive said several times they are nothing new or different..
they are the exact same..
you should try reading..

last time people try to grasp it

political parties are a tool to keep you distracted while you are being fleeced

how hard will some folks fight for that D or R

sheep

More mischaracterization... damn, do you ever actually address what people post when you click 'reply to post'?

Where have I posted anything which could be called "fighting for that D or R"

dagnabit · Oct 14, 2010

Grat3fulh3ad said:
More mischaracterization... damn, do you ever actually address what people post when you click 'reply to post'?

Where have I posted anything which could be called "fighting for that D or R"

how myopic..

step past ego...

maybe YOU are not the subject of the R or D line

Grat3fulh3ad · Oct 14, 2010

dagnabit said:
do politicians not make up the two ruling parties?
is "the government" somehow not "government"?

you seem to try to compartmentalize very well...
but it leaves your cognitive abilities somewhat diminished. it returns to your b&w mindset.
no room for nuance..

Yes "the government" is a government... but that has no bearing on what I said... you need to figure out that 'government' is not necessarily "the government"... Once you grasp that you'll know why ONLY government can fix government, unless you opt for anarchy.

No b&w mindset from me...
Never
That's an empty lie you try and make people believe about me.
but you can't show any examples.

Plenty of room for nuance, where nuance is possible. There is no room for nuance between government and anarchy.
You're just nitpicking mischaracterized statements looking for an argument. I've made my point.

Grat3fulh3ad · Oct 14, 2010

dagnabit said:
how myopic..

step past ego...

maybe YOU are not the subject of the R or D line

Ahhh... well, when you make a statement including a quote of my post, it is easy to think you directed it at me.
If you're not replying to me, why include my quote in your post?

No ego involved. (another failed mischaracterization on your part)

dagnabit · Oct 14, 2010

Grat3fulh3ad said:
aren't tea party candidates politicians?

dagnabit said:
and ive said several times they are nothing new or different..
they are the exact same..

Grat3fulh3ad said:
damn, do you ever actually address what people post when you click 'reply to post'?

dagnabit said:
you should try reading..

moving right along...

dagnabit said:
the only ones able to fix it are the ones who dont trust it.

a better question would be
how those who trust government can be trusted to fix it?

if they trust it then they would see no reason to fix it.

or are you in the habit of fixing things that are not broken?

maybe you just trust broken things to function?

any thoughts on how those who trust the government can be trusted to fix it?

Grat3fulh3ad · Oct 14, 2010

dagnabit said:
moving right along...

any thoughts on how those who trust the government can be trusted to fix it?

Who ever suggested that one should trust the government?
I only said one should trust in government (as opposed to anarchy), not in any specific government, and not in any politician.

sac beh · Oct 14, 2010

dagnabit said:
is "the government" somehow not "government"?

Exactly, in english adding a definite article in front of a noun changes the meaning quite a bit.

dagnabit said:
you seem to try to compartmentalize very well...
but it leaves your cognitive abilities somewhat diminished. it returns to your b&w mindset.
no room for nuance..

Compartmentalizing, dividing things into categories, separating out different things, is how reason understands things.

It sounds like the crux of this thread is still the fact that despite the things that people would like the tea party to stand for, its still a melee of emotions with general feelings of anger towards the government and/or Obama with no helpful direction. If there were less emotion and more reasonable thought behind the movement, BHT might have had a more positive experience talking to them about cannabis prohibition.

The only difference between the TP and any other political movement or party is that the TP has no direction nor agreement among the individuals about basic terms and goals. Some people think this is a virtue because it somhow makes the individual more important. On the contrary it just makes the whole movement a venture in chaos, irrationality and anarchy. All political parties and movements are made up of individuals making free decisions (this is what government is made up of also!). The TP is nothing special here. Their lack of ability to reason from general proposition (individual freedom/less government) to specific (cannabis prohibition is insane) is what's special about them. Its an anti-science, anti-reason movement.

dagnabit · Oct 14, 2010

Grat3fulh3ad said:
I've made my point.

you did?

you rambled about anarchy and then used mischaracterization a lot.

fact is in several instances you present false dichotomys in order to attempt to "gain the upper hand" (your quote

)

like saying

There are only two choices.... government or anarchy.

when there are multiple levels of governance to be discussed and the only mention of the absurdity of anarchy comes in the form of your convoluted ultimatum.
i rejected your false choice as irrelevant to this topic of conversation.

so yes you made the point that anarchy is the lack of government..
bully for you.
how is it relevant?

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