Basic genetics explained

[Tom Hill]

,, in 1994 i got camped on,, in that fall i took up a collection and went to Eu to check out the scene in your hood,, i was taken in by the pics and descriptions,, what a bunch of optimists to put it mildly lol.. when i got home and planted my y and z,, all that shit hermed on me it almost had me working at 7-11... It would be easy for me to say fuck all hermies this is what i want bla bla bla like these idiotic seed growers,, mo betta we stick to reality.. Drug strain cannabis growers don't get to grow from seed any more than strawberry farmers do.. if some fucking hippy came to me as a project manager and told me he intended to grow drug cannabis from seed i would fire his ass on the spot end of story no further questions asked etc..

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

Ks,, select as many as you can always this is the only correct answer to that question,, and at the end of the day? we will grow only a handful of select clones like any good strawberry or pineapple or fruit tree or sugar cane farmer,, why? because we can,, and there can be only one so to speak.. this is the true way of things,,, and if it gives 2 seeds an ounce? who the fuck cares if its the best,, that is reality.. I have no idea what these other guys are saying,,, its chinese/greek to me..

I guess the real question is not if a plant with an intersex habit is your best, because a few seeds an ounce is not really a problem if you are an herb producer I will agree. The real question is should that intersex plant be used as is for breeding?
I can see your point that you want to use the best of the best in quality terms, they are so hard to find in the first place that you do not want to waste them. But using them for herbal production is one thing, that will make a few unwanted seeds, using them for breeding is another.
I say try and clean it up or at the least reduce the intersex incidence then breed a zillion and try and find the best of the best quality in an individual with no intersex if you can. Then use it for breeding with others.
I know growers that want plants with no intersex, they grow on a big scale and from seeds not clones, they are tired of all the problems they get from just a few male flowers.....
I do not think quality is linked to intersex, in no way.
One thing is for sure, the more intersex individuals used in breeding the more intersex progeny will be around. Don't you agree?
I don't have as much problem in finding plants with lots of THC and the right terpenes as well as good traits in the quantity department, it is finding plants or varieties that are also intersex free that I see as the real work to be done.
-SamS

 

[Tom Hill]

this is a stick-up,, send me some decent Thai seed,, u derelicts still owe me from 1995.. all i have to show for it is this 6figure bicycle? it's a pretty sweet ride though..

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

let me smoke some of that hash that has u answering me in edit mode only hashaha?

I do it a lot, I am a space case....

I know u get me Sam,, as i have always got u,, yes i agree like begets like,, but no i dont agree that folks we know know what they want hehehe.. using them for herbal production may produce a few seeds,, using them in breeding may produce even less, got a coin to flip?, this is the reality of the matter.. just like when u told folk to look at progeny,, it works both ways,, we just never know so i take maybe not offense,, but a raised eyebrow let's say at such lines in the sand.. i know u can dig where i am coming from..

Time will tell, that is for sure.

i do not believe quality is linked to intersex either,, i am a firm believer in traits inherited separately,, but i can count too,, and its a shitload of things we are putting together to make us smile,, after-all,, we are doing more than making rope here,,, if we were just making rope? then let's not take our eye off how strong the fiber,, however if we are making resin? well, u know...-T

I do agree on what is the ultimate goal, I guess I think we can get there without having intersex be part of the picture. Or at least we should try.
I will try and answer all your other posts, I have to run for a few hours....
All the best,
-SamS

 

[Tom Hill]

the answers are that there are very serious mathematical consequences to each and every decision we make.. and this one we are speaking of amounts to rock solid females (phenotypically speaking) are just as likely to be masking nightmares as not,, regarding all quantitative traits. This is fact. to breed for yield or away from intersex this takes time and realization of over-all line worth over generations not to be simplified into mendelian genetics etc.. It's not something we can put in stone as a rule,, that thought is again,, optimistic to put it mildly..

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

,, in 1994 i got camped on,, in that fall i took up a collection and went to Eu to check out the scene in your hood,, i was taken in by the pics and descriptions,, what a bunch of optimists to put it mildly lol.. when i got home and planted my y and z,, all that shit hermed on me it almost had me working at 7-11... It would be easy for me to say fuck all hermies this is what i want bla bla bla like these idiotic seed growers,, mo betta we stick to reality.. Drug strain cannabis growers don't get to grow from seed any more than strawberry farmers do.. if some fucking hippy came to me as a project manager and told me he intended to grow drug cannabis from seed i would fire his ass on the spot end of story no further questions asked etc..

I might agree in many cases with many Cannabis varieties, but I have grown crops from my seeds that were all the fricking same, anyone would of sworn they were all clones unless they dug up and looked at the roots, well over 20,000 all from broadcast seeds, all identical. Nothing wrong with using seeds, there is maybe something wrong with most seeds people are trying to use/grow?
I find growing clones boring, all the same, I like diversity and growing seeds to find something new. Not like the almost homogenous variety from seeds I mentioned above, it is almost like clones. I understand the difference between growing for production and breeding, in most cases I would use clones to achieve a uniform crop also. We pioneered the use of clones to produce identical Cannabis materials over and over for pharmaceutical uses, as the powers that be said it could not be done with Cannabis. They were proved wrong about this and a lot more, over the last few decades.
-SamS

 

[Tom Hill]

i know u have seen it Sam and i have seen it too,, sincerely... But we are like 2 gambling addicts that only remember the times we won ha? i haven't seen in it a long time,, a true homogeneous crop (mostly F1's).. U grow clones,, I grow clones,, we all who kinow wtf they are doing we all grow clones do we not?

 

[Tom Hill]

and ahem,, u produced macro cannabinoid stable varieties ha? u and me both know that is a very small part of the picture,, likie selling fighter planes without the dirrections?

 

[Tom Hill]

,,,,and they grow clones too..!

 

[Tom Hill]

aw i just saw that u pioneered the use of clones etc i read different,,, i never expected u to say that,, not with a straight face hehehe.. really was the powers that be so clueless? they didn't previously believe that clones replicated?

 

[Tom Hill]

u sought showed and shared with folk that limonene5Thc7=the sky,, that's way more deep holmes..

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

the answers are that there are very serious mathematical consequences to each and every decision we make.. and this one we are speaking of amounts to rock solid females (phenotypically speaking) are just as likely to be masking nightmares as not,, regarding all quantitative traits. This is fact. to breed for yield or away from intersex this takes time and realization of over-all line worth over generations not to be simplified into mendelian genetics etc.. It's not something we can put in stone as a rule,, that thought is again,, optimistic to put it mildly..

I am a pretty optimistic kinda guy or I would have never have lived the life I have. Trying to bring Cannabis back into mainstream medicine. Several decades ago everyone told me my goals were not achievable, Cannabis was a drug of abuse and single Cannabinoid varieties for THC or CBD or CBC, or CBG or CBGV THCV, CBDV, CBCV, etc were not possiable.
Now with no intersex, I am told it is not practical or possible again.
Also now I am wanting single terpene varieties and am being again told the same, it is not possible, maybe they are right, I see the problems are much more involved then with the Cannabinoids, but it needs to be tried, even if it is only possible with some of the 130+ terpenes or terpene family groups, while others exist that can not be separated individually. I do know that terpene profiles are inherited pretty straight forward, I can easily spot the progeny of two different varieties if I have the parents terpene analysis profiles and the progenies. It is right between the two, you see it clear as day....
I could easily double blind pick the progeny, maybe that implies I can do single terpene varieties? Time will tell.
Tom, do you smoke herbal Cannabis or resin mostly?
Shame you did not drop by in 94-95 when you were in Amsterdam or the EU. I was not selling seeds, maybe that was why? But I did have a few extra tons around, and still was making thousands of hybrids to trial, most I never even got around to trialing...
-SamS

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

i know u have seen it Sam and i have seen it too,, sincerely... But we are like 2 gambling addicts that only remember the times we won ha? i haven't seen in it a long time,, a true homogeneous crop (mostly F1's).. U grow clones,, I grow clones,, we all who kinow wtf they are doing we all grow clones do we not?

I grow many more seeds then clones always have, year after year.
-SamS

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

aw i just saw that u pioneered the use of clones etc i read different,,, i never expected u to say that,, not with a straight face hehehe.. really was the powers that be so clueless? they didn't previously believe that clones replicated?

The official thought back in the 60's-80's was that Cannabis produced hundreds of different chemicals and that there was no way to produce single batches of identical materials from Cannabis, absurd but it was the rule of the day.
We showed that to be untrue with HPLC & GC-MS and GC-FID analysis of clones that were identical to each other, we did the work in the late 80's at Rijksuniversiteit Groningen, that and showed how much cheaper it is to produce pure THC with a plant then in a chemical factory. We produced and could of sold pure THC for less then the cost of Olivitol that Unimed used as a starting raw material to then synthesize THC.

-SamS

 

[Tom Hill]

but u smoke clones, year after year and rarely add a new one to your stable am i wrong? what's that last clone u took in,, sleestack?

I got a couple that stood out in 95,, sk1 bred for early (hand pollinated by the skunkman) and Original Haze,, via positronic,, one made my friend rich and the other got me high.. So as Rob says one love.. but u still owe me for the hermies man..

and will? it's not your fault,, no seriously,,, its not your fault..

 

[Infinitesimal]

if we breed for plants that produce exceptional hash, and not for herbal cannabis, then what concern is intersex or a crop full of seeds?

 

[Tom Hill]

so the very same guy that pulled the cover on the need for clones,, the guy who seemingly understood the why and whatfors the need,, is now after treating cannabis exactly like strawberries,, arguing that it can or maybe even should be bred like corn? I dont understand..

 

[Tom Hill]

inf,, weight,, seeded cannabis produces less material in which to fill with resin glands.,.

 

[Infinitesimal]

so if breeding quality hash is the goal, then wouldn't that be an example of when we would be willing to use a partially intersex individual in order to breed the superior traits we find in any given specimen? especially if final yield isn't the number one concern

 

[Tom Hill]

yes,, absolutely,, these guys are freaking out over nothing.. the end goal is all that matters.. and cannabis sexuality is no less complicating than breeding for yield,, it's not just something u throw on top of the pile of traits to breed for,, unless u have completely lost sight of your target.. in the end u can devote your life to those traits,, and come no further away from owing guys money for herming out their crop in 95... heheheheh,, dig?