My intro and bona fides...

[PakaloloFromPNW]

I've been having problems with PM so the other day I bought some Serenade. The company says this about it:

SERENADE Garden is made from a unique, patented strain (QST 713) of Bacillus subtilis. Bacillus subtilis strain QST 713 penetrates and destroys the disease pathogen, but does not harm beneficial insects or wildlife.

So I thought I would give it a try. The leaves on Pitbull were looking like this with PM.



This isn't the same leaf but it had PM all over it. I sprayed on the Serenade and now it looks like this.



It seems to wash off the PM and the leaf appears reasonably clean. I don't know now long it works but I sprayed my teenagers with it. Warning: this stuff stinks.

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

My noctural seedling got attacked/nibbled on by a mouse and I wasn't sure if it would recover. I can see some growth in the middle so I'm sure it will turn out okay.

Noctural

 

[Weyenot]

Weyenot - You asked a lot of questions and provide sound advice. Thank you for that.

I read some posts on the Grass City website that got me interested in organic growing. I have experience with the herb dating back to the early 70's. I also did organic vegetable gardening most of the 80's. So in a few hours it all made sense to me. I'm never going back to any other way of growing. Organics all the way.

My watering technique is something I learned over the years. I grew underground for my personal use and I don't remember why I did it but it seemed a good way to figure out the amount of water in the pot. I go with the idea of keeping my soil between 30% and 80% where 0% is desert sand dry and 100% is peat bog wet. So I don't water all my plants at the same time. I water when they are about 30%. Another thing I do is feel the soil at the pot's drainage holes. Here is what I think of as time to water.

30% dry
https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=50417&pictureid=1196498View Image

80% wet
https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=50417&pictureid=1196499View Image

So it has been a long time since I had trouble with watering. Even the move to organic soil has been no difference. I think a lot of my bottled nutrient growing techniques transferred over to organics.

My OG Kush was attacked by spider mites and I had to take some major intervention to get her this far. She suffered some leaf damage but I'm going to get an okay harvest from her. PE was attacked by PM and I took her down on Sunday. She is hanging upside down in my drying area along with some Pitbull branches and Trainwreck 1. All had an issue with PM.

My experiment with SST cloning is a success as far as I'm concerned and I'm going to use this from now on. I am going to change up and not use ziplock bags in the future. I sprouted my barley seeds in a jar like I used to do in my hippie days, cheesecloth and a rubber band. I rinsed them regularly until they sprouted much like you described. I then placed them in the cotton material. I used CC's clone soak recipe to moisten/wet the material then put the canna seeds that soaked in CC's recipe for 36 hours on top of the t-shirt. Your suggestion sounds interesting but I'm going with the small plastic containers. I only pop a few seeds at a time so I don't need much room. I'm going to continue to sprout the old hippie way and place them in the small container, cover with cotton and place canna seeds on top. I'll take a picture when I do this.

As far as 'The Dude' I searched for the avatar because the dude and I have a lot in common. We're not totally the same but that picture sums me up. Going through life with that grin.

I may have missed some of your questions so ask away. If you have a journal I'd like to check it out. You obviously have some organic growing experience and this is my first grow organically. So I've got a lot to learn.

gl

Hey Pako, that wee baby youve got looks like it going to be just fine Itll be cool to see what it turns into; I just love seeing the change a plants goes through as it matures!!

Thank you for the kind words and for sharing your experiences; I have one friend in my area who shares this passion so its great to meet other kind folks who are on this trip too. I know some things but others know alot more, im happy to be in such good company

I havent made time to look into getting a camera so I havent been documenting my grow but its definitely on the list and sooner than later hopefully! The building im in has been a work in progress and alot of my time has gone into its completion; it should be done soon and that will free up some time that I can use for things like taking pictures.

Again, much respect for your watering skills; like anything it comes with practice and im getting there day by day Since Ive built the raised beds for my bloom rooms I have way less containers of a size that I can use that technique on but Ive still got some so its not obsolete by any means and I thank you for sharing your thoughts!

It sounds like the transition to organics wasnt hard at all for you and I bet having the organic veggie gardening helped alot with that; theyre all plants after all, so why wouldnt organics be best for canna growing too?!

I wish Id had some experience with the PM so I could recommend something; if I have some time Ill look through some of the threads in the organics section to see what might help. You should check it out because Im sure theres something there that can help.

I think Im all typed out for now, so Ill catch ya later

Keep it easy!!

 

[Weyenot]

Ok so I took a quick peek at the IPM thread in the organic section and on the first page there is info on using lavender, thyme and rosemary as antifungals, this might help. The amounts vary per plant variety I think but Id say a couple cups of plant material blended in a gallon of water would be a good place to start; you do this and let it sit in a dark cool place for a few days( just dont let it ferment) and then strain and use a cup of this per gallon of water in a spray. Thats the method for cilantro but I think itll work fine for these other herbs too

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

Ok so I took a quick peek at the IPM thread in the organic section and on the first page there is info on using lavender, thyme and rosemary as antifungals, this might help. The amounts vary per plant variety I think but Id say a couple cups of plant material blended in a gallon of water would be a good place to start; you do this and let it sit in a dark cool place for a few days( just dont let it ferment) and then strain and use a cup of this per gallon of water in a spray. Thats the method for cilantro but I think itll work fine for these other herbs too

I've been using a tea of lavender and rosemary for the spider mites. I read (can't prove as fact) that lavender will cause the eggs to burst. I know I may have burnt my leaves on OG Kush from having let the tea sit too long but it did reduce/eliminate my mites. So this works on mites. I usually use an IPM of neem oil/ProTeKt/aloe vera juice ever 3-4 days until the 3rd week of flowering. After that I'm using the tea.

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

Time for the weekly update on my ladies progress. During this past week I've harvested Trainwreck 1, Pineapple Express and most the branches off of Pitbull because of PM. PE is ready to be cleaned and placed in paper bag. I'm going to do that later today. So I've got what's left of Pitbull and OG Kush.

Pitbull


The PM on Pitbull doesn't seem to hurt bud development so far. Those are the fattest buds I've grown. Using bottled nutrients never produced buds so fat. I'm looking forward to growing without having to deal with PM or mites. I'm wondering how big of bud I'll get if the plant grows without any problems.

OG Kush


The leaf damage is really apparent from the tea that probably had turned a bit alcohol. The bud isn't a fat as Pitbull. This is more the size of bud I got from bottled nutrient grows.

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

I've got the other 2 plants a couple of weeks behind. Trainwreck 2 is coming along nicely but I've noticed some spider mites on her. Not too many and I think I'll be okay but it would be great to grow without them. Once I get these to harvest I'm going to have to clean out my flower area.

Trainwreck 2


I pollinated one branch of Trainwreck 2 and the pollination has taken. The plant is really putting on the trichomes this last week. I just need to get this lady to maturity so I can pop some babies for Eminem x Trainwreck 2.

Trainwreck 2 seeds


What can I say about Mildred. This is my favorite lady right now. I've seen some mites but not as much a Trainwreck 2. I pollinated her too but the seeds aren't showing as much as Trainwreck 2. This plant has great structure and is pushing out lots of branches without any training.

Mildred

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

gl

Hey Pako, that wee baby youve got looks like it going to be just fine Itll be cool to see what it turns into; I just love seeing the change a plants goes through as it matures!!

Thank you for the kind words and for sharing your experiences; I have one friend in my area who shares this passion so its great to meet other kind folks who are on this trip too. I know some things but others know alot more, im happy to be in such good company

I havent made time to look into getting a camera so I havent been documenting my grow but its definitely on the list and sooner than later hopefully! The building im in has been a work in progress and alot of my time has gone into its completion; it should be done soon and that will free up some time that I can use for things like taking pictures.

Again, much respect for your watering skills; like anything it comes with practice and im getting there day by day Since Ive built the raised beds for my bloom rooms I have way less containers of a size that I can use that technique on but Ive still got some so its not obsolete by any means and I thank you for sharing your thoughts!

It sounds like the transition to organics wasnt hard at all for you and I bet having the organic veggie gardening helped alot with that; theyre all plants after all, so why wouldnt organics be best for canna growing too?!

I wish Id had some experience with the PM so I could recommend something; if I have some time Ill look through some of the threads in the organics section to see what might help. You should check it out because Im sure theres something there that can help.

I think Im all typed out for now, so Ill catch ya later

Keep it easy!!

Noctural is going to recover. The leaves growing from the middle have doubled in size. I'm lucky the mouse didn't chew the top off like Goblin Queen. I haven't grown either of these before but I've seen pictures of them.

My SST sprouting experiment has produced 2 Mazar-I-Shariff x Guerrero plants. They just poke their heads out of the soil. So that's 100% for them. I'm watching for the other 4 to poke up too.

Whether you can lift the pots or not the watering is basically 30-80. I can tell by looking at the plants when it is getting around 30%. I've watered many plants over the years. I don't even think about it but it is one of the biggest mistakes growers make is to over water. I was looking at another grower who has been doing it for many years over watering his babies. The few leaves had that yellow tinge to them that comes with over watering.

Moving to organics has been easy for me. Maybe the vegetable garden experience, definitely the years with the herb all helped make the transition. I did a lot of reading posts about organic growing and mixing soils. I read 'Teaming with Microbes' so I got a quick look at how soil food web works with the plant. I probably spent 3 weeks of intense studying before I mixed my first soil. I posted what I was planning and got feedback. The mix seems to be doing fine. I'm not having to supplement the soil to get the plants to finish. I've also got 2 other variations on the soil mix going. Plus my worm bin and outdoor compost. So I've got a lot of things to experience before I understand the soil as well as I do the watering.

I'm not too worried about PM. I think I understand it enough to deal with it. It looks like I have cleared up the problem with the teenagers. So cleaning up the flower area may eradicate it. The Serenade seems to be working well so I'm going to put it into the IPM regiment.

I see you've been a member since Nov 2012 but with no journal. I'm guessing that you lurk in some other journals. Do you have any journal(s) that you follow?

 

[Weyenot]

I've been using a tea of lavender and rosemary for the spider mites. I read (can't prove as fact) that lavender will cause the eggs to burst. I know I may have burnt my leaves on OG Kush from having let the tea sit too long but it did reduce/eliminate my mites. So this works on mites. I usually use an IPM of neem oil/ProTeKt/aloe vera juice ever 3-4 days until the 3rd week of flowering. After that I'm using the tea.

gl

Spot on, that sounds like a great plan; lots of diversity in there which should confuse those little buggers and give you the upper hand!! I used to believe the word on the street that once you got mites youd have them forever but the aforementioned recipes have changed my mind and Im soooooo thankful to for the people who shared them!! The biggest thing ive learned about using the sprays so far is that they are much more effective if you follow a strict routine and spray every other day. The articles ive read also suggest changing it up and rotating the different herbs so the bugs dont get used to them. What I mean is, use the neem oil/protekt/aloe as the base and then mix in some of one of the herbs like lavender, rosemary etc. Have you tried the cilantro, thats a good one too!! Just to be clear, you say youre using a tea of the rosemary and lavender, do you mean youre watering it in and not spraying at all?

Keep it up and Im sure youll prevailgl

 

[Weyenot]

o

Noctural is going to recover. The leaves growing from the middle have doubled in size. I'm lucky the mouse didn't chew the top off like Goblin Queen. I haven't grown either of these before but I've seen pictures of them.

My SST sprouting experiment has produced 2 Mazar-I-Shariff x Guerrero plants. They just poke their heads out of the soil. So that's 100% for them. I'm watching for the other 4 to poke up too.

Whether you can lift the pots or not the watering is basically 30-80. I can tell by looking at the plants when it is getting around 30%. I've watered many plants over the years. I don't even think about it but it is one of the biggest mistakes growers make is to over water. I was looking at another grower who has been doing it for many years over watering his babies. The few leaves had that yellow tinge to them that comes with over watering.

Moving to organics has been easy for me. Maybe the vegetable garden experience, definitely the years with the herb all helped make the transition. I did a lot of reading posts about organic growing and mixing soils. I read 'Teaming with Microbes' so I got a quick look at how soil food web works with the plant. I probably spent 3 weeks of intense studying before I mixed my first soil. I posted what I was planning and got feedback. The mix seems to be doing fine. I'm not having to supplement the soil to get the plants to finish. I've also got 2 other variations on the soil mix going. Plus my worm bin and outdoor compost. So I've got a lot of things to experience before I understand the soil as well as I do the watering.

I'm not too worried about PM. I think I understand it enough to deal with it. It looks like I have cleared up the problem with the teenagers. So cleaning up the flower area may eradicate it. The Serenade seems to be working well so I'm going to put it into the IPM regiment.

I see you've been a member since Nov 2012 but with no journal. I'm guessing that you lurk in some other journals. Do you have any journal(s) that you follow?

gl

Im definitely going to have to try using the SST for popping beans; for my next run ill put them directly in the soil without soaking and then saturate the ground with the tea, or I might possibly soak the seeds for about 10hrs in the SST before putting them in the ground. Ill let you know how it goes.

True, I could see how it would be just as easy to look at the soil and the plants to tell when to water; alot of sources say when the bottom leaves begin to droop a little its time. Thanks a bunch for sharing your insight, its in my head and Ill put it to use!

You got me, Im more of a lurker at this point. Ive read alot here but havent taken the time to put a journal together; it really wouldnt be that much more to do, just take some pictures and do some writing which id enjoy. My buddy just got a new camera so I might be able to at least borrow his old one. Youve given me a nudge in that direction, thank you!!

The previously mentioned buddy has a journal I follow; type in freedom35 into the search and you should find it, its cool!!

On another note, I think I remember seeing you on the old ROLS thread a while back when I was reading through it; now that was some good information!!

Till next time, peace

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

o

gl

Im definitely going to have to try using the SST for popping beans; for my next run ill put them directly in the soil without soaking and then saturate the ground with the tea, or I might possibly soak the seeds for about 10hrs in the SST before putting them in the ground. Ill let you know how it goes.

True, I could see how it would be just as easy to look at the soil and the plants to tell when to water; alot of sources say when the bottom leaves begin to droop a little its time. Thanks a bunch for sharing your insight, its in my head and Ill put it to use!

You got me, Im more of a lurker at this point. Ive read alot here but havent taken the time to put a journal together; it really wouldnt be that much more to do, just take some pictures and do some writing which id enjoy. My buddy just got a new camera so I might be able to at least borrow his old one. Youve given me a nudge in that direction, thank you!!

The previously mentioned buddy has a journal I follow; type in freedom35 into the search and you should find it, its cool!!

On another note, I think I remember seeing you on the old ROLS thread a while back when I was reading through it; now that was some good information!!

Till next time, peace

The herbal teas I have been using are strictly foliage sprays. I make what I call nutrient teas by putting 1/4 of neem seed meal, 3/4 kelp meal into 5 gallon bucket and aerate it for 24 hours. Then I strain off the solids and water the plants. I use the nutrient tea every 2 weeks until the plants are in their last few weeks of flowering.

I'll check out freedom35's journal. I haven't look a much here. What little exploring and posting on other journals wasn't very productive for me. I was basically ignored so I didn't bother to engage when I'm ignored. I'm cool with that. I'm mainly on the 'Minions of the Dark' journal.

I'm also on 2 other forums where I'm known as Pakalolo. I wasn't on the ROLS but one of the other forums I participate in had some of the grower mention it. I've only been on these forums since October 2013.

Some people lurk and some people write journals. Getting information and sharing information is what these forums are all about.

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

I transplanted my Trainwreck 2 clone to a 1 gallon pot. I transplanted my Mildred from a 1 gallon to a 2 gallon pot. I started soaking 2 seeds each in Ful-Power water. They were Halo 2x, Ravnus and Overload.

The seeds I started last Friday, 4 have sprouted out of the soil. 2 Mazar, a Goblin Queen and a Cascadian Frost. That's 4 out of 6 in a week. I'm sticking with the seed sprouting technique I experimented with.

 

[blazesck]

If you are still having trouble with mice, I recommend baiting your traps using peanut butter. They will not be able to resist it.

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

If you are still having trouble with mice, I recommend baiting your traps using peanut butter. They will not be able to resist it.

I've tried the peanut butter but the mice are good at licking it out and not setting off the trap. What I've found works best is cheese that has dried out a bit. I then pack it into the trigger portion. The dried cheese means they have to bite at it and BANG the trap crushes their spines. I sometimes get 2-3 mice with the same cheese. My problem is they keep coming into the cellar from the outside all winter long. It's warm in my cellar and a noticeable lack of other mice make it a tempting place to set up housekeeping.

 

[Weyenot]

The herbal teas I have been using are strictly foliage sprays. I make what I call nutrient teas by putting 1/4 of neem seed meal, 3/4 kelp meal into 5 gallon bucket and aerate it for 24 hours. Then I strain off the solids and water the plants. I use the nutrient tea every 2 weeks until the plants are in their last few weeks of flowering.

I'll check out freedom35's journal. I haven't look a much here. What little exploring and posting on other journals wasn't very productive for me. I was basically ignored so I didn't bother to engage when I'm ignored. I'm cool with that. I'm mainly on the 'Minions of the Dark' journal.

I'm also on 2 other forums where I'm known as Pakalolo. I wasn't on the ROLS but one of the other forums I participate in had some of the grower mention it. I've only been on these forums since October 2013.

Some people lurk and some people write journals. Getting information and sharing information is what these forums are all about.

gl

Its so much nicer when people are friendly!! There are so many people on here so even if some ignore there will be others that dont; good people like CC, BluejayWay, xmobotics and you to name a few, im happy to talk to all of you

Ive been content lurking for the most part but I think its time for me to poke my head out into the sunshine; the more people on here that are doing the organic thing the better I think and it sure helps to have visual proof to inspire others. Its truly magical what some properly mixed soil and some teas will do and if seeing pictures proving it is what it takes than that would make it worth it for me to do a journal.

Ive never used the teas just as a foliar; Ive always brewed the materials in a vortex brewer i made from ideas on the CT thread and then applied it unstrained to the soil. Plants absorb things through their leaves pretty well the way I understand it so I should try straining some tea and using it that way too. My goal with the teas has been to provide the plants with the components the teas have to offer in addition to adding organic matter to the soil to enrich it and feed the soil life, that is why ive done my teas this way; it is good to diversify so thank you for sharing your method, I plan on trying it out soon!!
The neem and kelp is a good combo isnt it? Another good one I like is 1/4c kelp+3/4c alfalfa+5g water as per your method, nettles and comfrey are two other good plants to try. I wouldnt use the alfalfa more than a couple weeks into bloom though. O and one more thing on that note; what do you do with the solid material you strain out of the tea?

I couldve sworn that was you on the ROLS thread but I guess it was someone else you likes the dude; Im totally going to check out MOD and see whats up there, if your there it must be good.
My buddy who does Freedom 35 hasnt been updating it much lately but there is a good bit of previous stuff to read; I need to talk to him and see whats up with his absence, his pictures are good and I miss them.

Any chance of some more pics soon? Im always up for some more eye candy

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

gl

Its so much nicer when people are friendly!! There are so many people on here so even if some ignore there will be others that dont; good people like CC, BluejayWay, xmobotics and you to name a few, im happy to talk to all of you

Ive been content lurking for the most part but I think its time for me to poke my head out into the sunshine; the more people on here that are doing the organic thing the better I think and it sure helps to have visual proof to inspire others. Its truly magical what some properly mixed soil and some teas will do and if seeing pictures proving it is what it takes than that would make it worth it for me to do a journal.

Ive never used the teas just as a foliar; Ive always brewed the materials in a vortex brewer i made from ideas on the CT thread and then applied it unstrained to the soil. Plants absorb things through their leaves pretty well the way I understand it so I should try straining some tea and using it that way too. My goal with the teas has been to provide the plants with the components the teas have to offer in addition to adding organic matter to the soil to enrich it and feed the soil life, that is why ive done my teas this way; it is good to diversify so thank you for sharing your method, I plan on trying it out soon!!
The neem and kelp is a good combo isnt it? Another good one I like is 1/4c kelp+3/4c alfalfa+5g water as per your method, nettles and comfrey are two other good plants to try. I wouldnt use the alfalfa more than a couple weeks into bloom though. O and one more thing on that note; what do you do with the solid material you strain out of the tea?

I couldve sworn that was you on the ROLS thread but I guess it was someone else you likes the dude; Im totally going to check out MOD and see whats up there, if your there it must be good.
My buddy who does Freedom 35 hasnt been updating it much lately but there is a good bit of previous stuff to read; I need to talk to him and see whats up with his absence, his pictures are good and I miss them.

Any chance of some more pics soon? Im always up for some more eye candy

I ventured out on a few threads and made posts when I found something I liked. In all cases I was ignored. So I assumed this forum is bunch of little cliques. So I don't do much posting here. Maybe I already said I'm over on Grass City and LivingOrganicSoil with active journals. I'm just plain Pakalolo over in those forums. Both those forums are much nicer to new posters. So I spend more time there.

If you check out MOD you'll discover that it has some fine shoots of some nice genetics. Introduce yourself with a post.

Who doesn't like 'The Dude'. Even Jeff Bridges likes 'The Dude'. I think is a more realistic stoner character than Jeff Spicoli. Anyway the movie is one of my favorites.

This summer I will be working on my accumulator plants like comfrey. I've got nettles and dandelions growing wild around my property. I'm going to be planting herbs too. I got the seeds from Horizon Herbs. So I'll be using more of those in my nutrient teas. I don't do much foliar spraying to provide nutrients. My spraying are all for IPM. I do use the nutrient teas to feed the micro herd.

I am checking out Freedom 35 journal. I've gotten through the first harvest but that was a couple of years back.

I normally post pictures on the weekend. I probably will post some pictures of my babies during this week. I've got the Noctural but also 2 Mazar x Geurrero, a Goblin Queen and a Cascadian Frost. Not much to see but I'll get a picture of two up.

I'm taking down the Pitbull with the PM issue when I get home today. It has the fattest bud and I only have kept her around to do more learning on controlling PM. I don't want to lose the buds so down she comes.

I might get some bud shots in the next couple of days of Mildred and Trainwreck 2. They are starting to get to the stage I enjoy. I like babies and final stage buds. The in between are just my LITFA mode. It's not very exciting for me. Seen it, done it for almost 40 years. I guess I'm just jaded.

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

I've been doing a lot of woe is me posts. I've documented my problems but here are some results. I took down Pitbull today. I think I've learned some lessons about the management of PM. So I feel better prepared if/when the next bout breaks out.

Pitbull main cola


I've got a branch that is leaning on its side that is just as fat as the above. These are the big buds I've grown. I don't think I ever got bottled nutrient buds this big.

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

Okay, who doesn't like looking at bud shots? Here are a couple of my just over 5 weeks old ladies. They are already showing some potential. These are what I'm considering my keepers until I can find something better.

Trainwreck 2 bud


Mildred bud


I pollinated both of these crossing them with Eminem. Trainwreck 2 (going forward from here I'm dropping the 2 because I'm done with Trainwreck 1) was showing seed development and I took a picture back a few posts. Now Mildred is starting to show some seed development. I'll get pictures of both next weekend.

Speaking of seeds I noticed today that the last two seeds are sprouting out of the soil and should have there heads out tomorrow. So all 6 seeds from my sprouting experiment have produced plants. I'd say that was a successful experiment. Now I know how to sprout seeds. Thanks to all that contributed the information for me to apply to seed sprouting.

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

I thinned out the teenagers because of the new genetics that are coming. I got rid of Trainwreck 1, OG Kush and Pitbull. Here is a picture of the teenagers.

Teenagers


Starting on the lower left corner: Chocolope, Chemdawg, Eminem and Trainwreck (dropping the 2). I plan on moving Chocolope and Chemdawg to the ladies area in the next few weeks. I have some clones so if these turn out to be couch lock then I'll grow the clones. Otherwise they are gone.

Next Mildred


Mildred is my keeper and I've got a Trainwreck that I just moved out of the cloning cup and into a gallon pot.

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

I'm saying that things are going pretty good in Pakalolo's cellar.