can pH fluctuations be caused by the air pump?

[D's]

Sry double post. I was reading more, if they are cuts and not a large rootball. I have learned I will hand water til they get developed. But I am in flood and drain with grows tones, I veg in a aero cl

 

[D's]

Damn. I am in grow stones and use an aero cloner setup for a after clone preveg station to help me save space and time. I use tea in both, cause the rezes are in the warm rooms currently.

 

[FRIENDinDEED]

Growing is fun and challenging, indoors your right of passage (hazing) is bugs (mites) then, when you switch to water culture more so than hydro (peat is hydro) another lesson must be learned.
Dead rez or living Rez?
Hurry up, I don't think you have much time before you smell death. When leaves die roots are dying is what I have learned. I don't know much as I just learned how to control the water where I live. Like I said earlier bacteria competes for food. Feed the better bacteria. Or use pool shock, I don't know that recipe. Household unscented bleach works too. I believe your plants are slowly drowning without the right tools to help them breath underwater. Dissolved oxygen I believe is a myth, dig a hole outside and it's wet, but indoors it must dry out. No worms indoors....no worm poop ever touched your water (well water probably). Brew the ewc tea, take a smell of it should smell like dirt and water 48hrs after brewing. People from another forum elaborated on the tea quite a bit, I read over 300 pages, spent some coin, and earned my rights. Good luck. And if your early enough it will work, last run I rushed my setup added plants too soon and even with tea, problems erupted and I resorted to handwatering to save my losses, no casualties lucky me. If I misunderstood your ph problem then this won't help, my ph would go to 7-8 within a week. I also use ro water and have never had my ph go below 5.2 without nutes or ph adjusters.
And those bio filters work well, I think I got mine for $12. Good bacteria needs a home before the rootzone is large enough. Use plastic chain to hang it in your rez. Again good luck.

honestly with whats involved with hydro and recent events going back to organic soil seems to be constantly calling me back.

don't get me wrong, im going to stick it out for a couple of grows and get it dialed in. I know and read about the beneficials and already have the supplies for it; my plan has always been to get some lava rocks over the airstones after I let them sit in the EWC tea.

I posted the link earlier in the thread about the aquarium pumps. since its the beginning stages of the grow im not too worried and actually have some wiggle room to do some testing figured id try out the tea and get two pumps to see how well they work but after I get a good 3-4 grows out of the buckets think im either going with a RDWC setup or go straight back to organic soil.

hydro is nice but goddman man! I got into it for the ease of it all but its far from . . . so far

 

[TheCleanGame]

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[FRIENDinDEED]

What water are you using?

I recommend R/O water because it's always the same and your grow style will never change. Talk to people who've grown for decades and then moved to a different area and water supply. Ouch!

Stuck with the pumps you have? Grab a timer and turn the pump off a few times a day...

Once you get dialed in with hydro... you'll not want to change.

Keep it Clean!

I know what you mean man an d I know your right, hydro is the best thing once its dialed in.

R/O water is not in the budget right now, maybe down the line though.

for right now it seems that those aquarium filters would/could be my best bet. ive done so much research with the down time that I had that I started to setup an aquaponics system in my driveway because I was truly determined.

from hydro to reading/learning about the relationship that the hydroponic plant environment can have in existence/conjunction with an aquarium environment is just genius to me but setting that shit up is the real beast.

I can and know how to grow but my as of recent my downs have far outweighed my ups so yeah im really skeptical about shit these days and just expect the fucking worst all the time when it comes to my grows.

just don't understand why this shit can be so simple/easy for some and not me. im thinking im too honest about growing? nah man this shit is not easy at all and the biggest problem is that people love to talk about their successes more than they do their failures.

being totally honest though, no worries, im gonna get those filters soon and am gonna setup an EWC tea on the side and let my lava rocks get inoculated before I put them in the buckets.

the GH series has pH buffers but I guess no one told my nasty ass water that! the first week it went from a nice level 6 to damn near a 9 cause that shade of blue wasn't even on the fucking chart I have.

I pH'ed the water on 10/27 and have been watching it the entire week and its been raising but a lot more slowly this time I would say it went from 5.8 or 6 up to 6.5 or even lower, very very small color difference when I tested it so maybe it was the initial startup that had things go wacky.

so could it be the pumps? could it be the first round fluctuations that could be normal? who knows huh? anyway

im gonna setup the EWC tea tomorrow and the pumps can be bought on payday, now I gotta go dig out my molasses so I can feed the BB's

don't worry guys, hang with me, I haven't given up yet and realistically dont plan too. doesn't seem to be the pumps cause the fluctuations though but I do think they contribute a lil.

 

[TheCleanGame]

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[FRIENDinDEED]

That's about exactly what you want.
Keep track of what ppm and light density you had at that point... it's a good baseline to start with in your setup.

Now... to seriously increase the health of your plants... drop the pH to around 5.2 and let it drift up to 6.1 the same way.

Watch your plants get super happy over the next few days.

Keep it Clean!

I think im seeing what your talking about with the pH. just came from the area and checked the pH in one of the buckets and after the week its still holding at around 5.8 -6 with, there is a slight color variation when I tested it but for the most part its still holding

so is that the norm with hydro that a lot of ppl maybe miss or don't talk about? ive always followed the advice of adding the nutes and giving the system a couple hours, if not a day or two, to level out before you add the plants but in regard to pH.

it seems that it takes a lil longer for it to get to a point where its stable and you don't have to do too much maintanence after that.

it also puts me in the mind of ppl that I see with diaries that talk about how they either don't change their water and top up their systems or they don't esperience too many pH shifts after a while.

my plan now is to add some more nutes to the water for basic all around reasons.

the first time the pH rose I did notice the larger fan leaves and lower foliage looked kinda light. after I added the pH down they looked healthier. after I went in there today they are starting to get that light color again so because the ph is still stable iim just gonna add the nutes this time and not pH the water again until I test and find that it has drifted again.

NOTE: don't get me wrong guys, im not or don't knock the use of pH gizmos but I have two things that are preventing me from getting them and implementing them in my grow.

1) the cost is just ridiculous and I cant see those prices right now, although I am going to look into getting the $35 type like you suggested earlier and 2) ive seen a grow completed without any of those things so I know for fact that you can grow without any manner of tester outside of the liquid for pH, relying on what the plants show me and what I test in the water is enough. I don't think that hydro is as complicated or as involved as some would like to suggest.

IF IM WRONG? its cool, this is a hobby, and I love it. the trials, tribulations, successes and failures especially the DIY; the DIY part of it brings me a small sense of achievement that I get a kick out of. its relaxing and keeps my busy which I think a good hobby should do

WHATS NEXT: gonna add some pH down to the empty bucket with the nutes in it just to see if there are any swings going on; im going to add 1gl worth of nutes to the 3 plants and test the pH on wed, if its still stable and I don't see any weird shit happening with the plants ill add another gallons wroth and keep my eye on things; gonna setup the EWC tea tonight after I look up the instructions again on how/what to do

 

[TheCleanGame]

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[FRIENDinDEED]

Yeah... reservoir management seems to be a lost art. 10 years ago people understood... I think the huge waves of new growers over the years of washed the right info away with the continual influx of un-educated misinformation that comes with them.

Anyway... pH swing from bottom to top range is extremely important in hydro.


You can't afford $7 for a pH drops kit? I've only used a pH pen a few times over the years. Drops are just fine... it even helps to get that slight difference in pH each time you mix nutes.


You might want to look into the 'Simple Res Management" technique.

Example Res= 10 gallons.

Mix nutes for 10 gallon res at ppm that gave you the 'slow' pH rise.
pH to around 5.2
Top off daily with R/O water until you've used 10 gallons of R/O water.

Dump your res and start over again.

This is the most simple method you can use to maintain a healthy reservoir with nothing but a $7 pH test kit.

Once you pick up a ppm/tds meter you'll be able to use it to add nutes back to drop the pH again instead of dumping the res. Cool stuff... been running no-dump res up to 5 months for years now. Saves a lot of nutes and water.

Keep it Clean!

LOL, no man, its the $7 that I have!!! your sitting there thinking im some bum just eyeballing my pH so you read my posts like "WTF bums are growing now?" lol

 

[FRIENDinDEED]

these are what im working with at the moment . .

these are what im working with at the moment . .

figured i'd post up a couple pics of what these things look like since I haven't been able to find any thing really solid online.

let me apologize in advance for the pics being sideways, really don't know what happened they just flipped when IC was done uploading. figure I'll resize/crop them later or maybe the next batch of pics

so far they are doing pretty well, pH is still level at 5.8 - 6.0. these are what im going to be using for cuts and then moms later on. so far I can get a good 7 cuts, but I hope to give things a lil while longer and get a couple more. thinking 2wks should be good enough time to let them get bigger and take some more side cuts besides the tops.

once they are chopped up im gonna put the left over in the bottom part of my veg/mom cab to get big again. got some more cuts on the way and then after that im supposed to be getting some CHEM#4 from the same blimburn seeds.

as ive said before not too much information on these at all, don't know anything about what pheno they may be or anything like that. they may have been ordered from a seed company but im gonna treat them like bagseed until more can be found about them. just watch 'em, care for 'em properly, listen and learn.

in retrospect, because there isn't much info on them, I really do wish I had a digital tester so I could better gauge how/when/what to feed. don't know if im under doing it or over doing it and I really don't wanna take the chance of overdoing it and losing them all so im feeding per GH instructions.

once the cuts get big enough they will be flowered out with the lucas formula regimen

 

[ydijadoit]

Hey FRIENDinDEED,
I just re-read your whole thread, and I forgot to mention/ask one thing. Did you soak your clay pebbles in ph'd water for a day?
It won't matter now, as they are fine, after being in the system for awhile, but fresh hydroton always raises ph, in my experience.
I've had a few times when I didn't have the patience to presoak the hydroton in a bucket of 5.0ph water. Not doing that had me chasing the PH for a few days, or a week, until the hydroton had stabilized.
Just something to consider.
Those plants look good. After your description, I thought you had some major problems brewing, but they look pretty happy so far!
Depending entirely on your tap water, Lucas Ratio should run very well for you. Obviously, it would be good to have TDS and PH meters, but I hear you on the $ issue!
Regards

 

[TheCleanGame]

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[FRIENDinDEED]

Hey FRIENDinDEED,
I just re-read your whole thread, and I forgot to mention/ask one thing. Did you soak your clay pebbles in ph'd water for a day?
It won't matter now, as they are fine, after being in the system for awhile, but fresh hydroton always raises ph, in my experience.
I've had a few times when I didn't have the patience to presoak the hydroton in a bucket of 5.0ph water. Not doing that had me chasing the PH for a few days, or a week, until the hydroton had stabilized.
Just something to consider.
Those plants look good. After your description, I thought you had some major problems brewing, but they look pretty happy so far!
Depending entirely on your tap water, Lucas Ratio should run very well for you. Obviously, it would be good to have TDS and PH meters, but I hear you on the $ issue!
Regards

nah , didn't even think, to soak them just rinsed them off with the regular tap water which is shitty to say the least.

soaking them in pH'd water does seem like a logical step and will be done in the future.

the plants are doing fine, im just steadily watching for this pH shit since I know that, that can be the one thing that changes drastically when other things happen to the un-noticing or seeing eye.

I still have time to choose but im seriously thinking about getting those water filters for my buckets as opposed to doing the tea. my train of thought is starting to go along the lines of "the less I introduce to the system itself the better"

yeah man, this money thing is not a game. I wish this guy would have come at me with these plants once I finished school and the room was finishes, but hey like I said, I told him what the deal was and he was willing to shoot for the stars with what I have so its all good BUT you know how it is when your a grower your a "grower"

 

[FRIENDinDEED]

Looks good!

Drop that pH down to 5.2 with pH down and let it slowly drift to 6.0 or 6.1. I swear they'll love you for it.

Personally? I run Lucas only... veg through flower. Why? It makes for short, stocky plants that produce the same yield as when given veg nutes. Just one thing I've picked up over the years.

I saw a blue tds meter on Amazon for $12... I used to use the exact model. Plenty good enough for a few runs of cannabis. I paid $30 at the time? lol

Keep it Clean!

im gonna look into that tester bro, I know I need one and actually want one to be honest.

maybe come payday, but right now the scratch is a serious issue, don't have the extra to throw at anything else. my supplies I have ive had since the last grow while I was still full time but now that im part time/in school

so seriously man, thanks for that info, I can take a $12 hit right now. those things have been so fucking expensive over the years and every time I looked at them that I just stopped looking; guess im good to take my head outta the sand on that one

 

[TheCleanGame]

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[FRIENDinDEED]

totally understand the lack of $$ situation... seems to be a common thing around here too.

Drop your pH to 5.2... seriously.

Keep it Clean!

lemme ask you, in regard to the lucas formula, do you or have you ever either wanted to or had to add any manner of additives to boost strength of your strain or was running the lucas formula more than enough with the pH @ 5.2 -6

im sure @ 5.2 the plants are eating the shit outta those nutes

 

[TheCleanGame]

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[FRIENDinDEED]

SO FAR SO GOOD . . .

SO FAR SO GOOD . . .

pH is still holding steady, so this wknd im going to take the advice ive been given and drop it down another notch to 5.(?) im expecting that since the pH has been stready so far that once I add the 1cc of pH down that it should stay at that level for a good while

I have two other buckets/vacant spots that ive been pH'ing the same way that the buckets with the plants are being pH'd so that water is what I will top up with but I don't see myself doing that for some time; still around 2.5gls in there . . .

I have named her THE BEAST!!! showing the most promise pheno wise, outgrowing the other two by leaps and bounds. asked the "broker" if they came from different plants and he says that he believes so . . .

so it doesn't seem to be the pumps causing the pH fluctuations since they've been going strong ever since; I did leave them off for a couple days and tested the water and it was still at 5-6. im suspecting it could be what I always thought it was which is this nasty ass water im using.

oh by the way, if anyone knows what I need/could do to fix these pics before I upload please let me know via pm.

I think this thread has seen its end unless there is more that others can add as to what changes the airpumps can cause within a stand alone DWC system.

i'll be back to check on it every once in blue to post plant progress pics,thanks guys, later!

 

[TheCleanGame]

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[FRIENDinDEED]

Uhh... the 5.2 pH advisement is for DWC where you top off every day.

Are you topping off or are you letting the plant suck everything up mostly?? Dropping to 5.2 and not topping off will damage them.

My apologies if I missed how you tend your res.

Keep it Clean!

well honeslty haven't had the need to top off yet at all, theyre just growing up and out like I want them too.

I got you man, I wanted to get everything level first before I started topping anything off pH wise that is.

I have 3 extra sites that im not using/ no plants, well 5 unused sites now, and they all have water in them. 1 site has water with nutes in it, 2 other sites have plain water in them and they have been pH'd to level and I just added 2 more sites and just letting them bubble for 36hrs before I do anything to them but they will be pH'd to level as well

when I say level im starting to get the hang of my water, which I think was my problem to begin with when I was doing hydro and scared the shit outta myself more than a couple times chasing the pH dragon.

ive got a lil more level head about it all now and have decided to chill out, watch for the switches and make changes accordingly. but im starting to see the tds meter as a necessity considering things do move a lot faster in hydro.

all in all, lmao, yeah brother, I understood what you were talking about but it was going to be done that way whether I was told specifically or not to be honest; I had planned to top up when the water level got atleast half way down from my fill line but and when I top up its going to be with the water in the plain buckets that will be at the same level as the plnat buckets

right now the level that im at is still that high 5's low 6's area and things are still steady. im figuring 1cc per bucket, as opposed to gallon should do the trick considering where they are now. since ive seen the swings I kinda get it now. for example I added pH down to the 3 plants and let them swing back up before I added 2cc more; after the 2cc's more of pH down they've been hangin in there stable so I added 5cc's flat out to the 2 buckets with plain water and not only did it bring them to the same pH but they are holding at the same level as well

now the only thing I need to know is when and how much to feed them and for that im definitely going to need that tds meter. although im seriously easing to a state of comfort with hydro im beginning to see the ease of hydro BUT only once certain things are done/taken care of.

lol, I really did not want this thing to become any manner of diary but it seems as though it may just become that because I do want to keep track of what im doing and I find IC is the best place to do that, not only can you keep general track but you can get feedback as well

will be posting back for sure!