Making wax- but it's too dark.

[RegisPhilburn1]

Yup FE i get a Pull'n'snap sap at about 115, but i find that to be more preferable by patients than a full on shatter. Agreed on high amounts of residual butane causing waxing, i have got a decent wax from leaving my collection pot unpurged for a couple days and then scraping and vaccing. Sometimes it just tries to go back to a shatter and ends up budder though. Honestly a thin film shatter/sap is much easier and faster to produce than wax with a vac-oven. A small baking rolling pin helps a lot to get very thin films....

 

[nakadashi]

Subsequent heatings after initial collection result in harder shatter after each cooling.. Given you dont scorch the oil...

Anyone else have similar experiences?

O_O repeated controlled heat hardens out the shatter? This I have to try... Do you have to let it cool completely before re-applying heat?

 

[furrywall11]

Hash Man - I haven't been able to get consistent results either.... It's the temps. I haven't been able to get steady temps with the griddle, omega mat, or AI oven. It's all over the place...Called the technician and she suggested an autotune. Did it, but it's not working. If I had a way to dial in steady temps I'd have no problem making waxes or shatters. Yes, temps differ from strain to strain but you can start on 115 for shatter and then take it down to 109 and if it doesn't move then it's totally done....if that doesn't work then you adjust. but with no control over temps you can't do crap. 105 has been making good wax for me with thin film blue dream...it's a nice sparkly redish/blonde. The problem is I only get 105 on the bottom rack and only when the oven is set to 121....and even that isn't consistent....argh Trying again tomorrow..

 

[nakadashi]

Hash Man - I haven't been able to get consistent results either.... It's the temps. I haven't been able to get steady temps with the griddle, omega mat, or AI oven. It's all over the place...Called the technician and she suggested an autotune. Did it, but it's not working. If I had a way to dial in steady temps I'd have no problem making waxes or shatters. Yes, temps differ from strain to strain but you can start on 115 for shatter and then take it down to 109 and if it doesn't move then it's totally done....if that doesn't work then you adjust. but with no control over temps you can't do crap. 105 has been making good wax for me with thin film blue dream...it's a nice sparkly redish/blonde. The problem is I only get 105 on the bottom rack and only when the oven is set to 121....and even that isn't consistent....argh Trying again tomorrow..

Wow thanks for the tip. I have been wanting to upgrade from a skillet to a vac ovens because I thought they would be the end all be all of vac purging but it looks like I was wrong about that. Which oven are you running by the way?

 

[Hash Man]

Got close

Got close

I whipped some shatter up at 120 and put it in the vac oven at 100 to -29.5 hg. I repeated 3 times and let it sit overnight at 100 and -29.5. It looked like whipped wax but its a straight crumble. Did i overdry it?
Tastses good and smells good but chips off instead of feeling like a wax.

 

[nakadashi]

I whipped some shatter up at 120 and put it in the vac oven at 100 to -29.5 hg. I repeated 3 times and let it sit overnight at 100 and -29.5. It looked like whipped wax but its a straight crumble. Did i overdry it?
Tastses good and smells good but chips off instead of feeling like a wax.

Grats, you finally made it! I'm gonna have to try this 100 degree overnight vac too..

How did you whip at 120 degrees? At 120 degrees my oil is usually a bit too runny to properly whip.

Interesting that you were able to get wax/crumble with 100 degree heat overnight, when a lot of people are claiming it should long duration purge anywhere from 110 to 140. I don't know what to believe anymore!

 

[Hash Man]

I hear u about the oil being to runny at 120... I kept it between 120-130(extract temp) in a hot water bath. When it got clowse to 130 i took the dish out and whipped on my countertop until it cooled to 120 again. It looked like this.


Lol dont hate. This was a nice orange shatter in a thin film.



After the first round of heating and vacuuming the extract was still full of solvent, so reheating it and rewhipping it seemed to get alot of the extra little bubbles out. After the 3rd round of reheating and rewhippng and revaccing, leaving it overnight.... When i released the vacuum, the extract didnt lose any volume at all and had all those little honeycomb marks on it.

I am still missing something- I need to get that wax texture.

Is it over done.... Or undercooked?

 

[furrywall11]

is it like sand? possibly whipping and drying dried it out too much? different strains do different things... blue dream seems to like to be shatter while chemdawg likes to be wax... i got this result at at around 110F 8 hours at full vac in the ai - it's chemdawg... it's totally stable and wax like. not the pretties to be sure, but a pretty good step

 

[vapeman24]

Personally I have never used the terms "shatter" and "whipped" in the same sentence.

 

[Hash Man]

Personally I have never used the terms "shatter" and "whipped" in the same sentence.

Lol, i have. I thin film purged some shatter. It dried and cooled. Then i collected it and whipped it.

Furry-did u whip that at all?

 

[nakadashi]

I think an important variable might be the thickness while purging. I did my first overnight purge yesterday and this morning I noticed that the thin parts were shatter as usual, the thicker parts turned waxy (but not dry yet). Kind of like "budder" texture. I am leaving it in there longer to see if it progresses from budder -> wax -> honeycomb. It will be interesting to see also if the thin part stays shatter forever.

 

[nakadashi]

Forgot to mention, the thicker waxy parts look shiny in the picture because I took it out and applied some heat to the top to try to get it back into shatter form. It kind of worked on the surface layer, but as you can see the matte look is already coming back.

 

[furrywall11]

nakadashi - from my very small amount of experience I would say that sample may or may not turn to wax but it would definitely take a long time.

Hash Man - no whipping at all.

 

[furrywall11]

i let it sit overnight and it formed into a puff patty and then I put it into the AI and it formed a big muffin, collapsed, liquified an hour later and, then 8 hours later was wax. it was light dep trim.... no nugs. i really think it's just harder to get old stuff (last years) to wax.

 

[Hash Man]

I think an important variable might be the thickness while purging. I did my first overnight purge yesterday and this morning I noticed that the thin parts were shatter as usual, the thicker parts turned waxy (but not dry yet). Kind of like "budder" texture. I am leaving it in there longer to see if it progresses from budder -> wax -> honeycomb. It will be interesting to see also if the thin part stays shatter forever.
View Image

No offense but that looks well on its way to burned.

 

[Green Dot Labs]

So a few things...

1. Always let sit in your oven for 30 minutes prior to pulling a vacuum. This will greatly reduce the muffining effect and your oils will use gravity to make its own thin film.

2. Time > Temperature. Set that shit at 103, let run for 6-8 hours. Then release vacuum and let set for 30 minutes. Take it out and flip it. Repeat.

3. Fabricate a dry ice sleeve around your column of your closed loop. -40c will help freeze some plant fats and waxes (waxy membrane around trich head) and not allow them to pass through your screen. Too much plant fat and wax will make your shatter (autobudder) over a short period of time.

4. Do not touch your shatter with your oily ass fingers. This will cause autobuddering. Do not fold in more than once to make a patty, or you will increase your chance of autobuddering.

5. Use a buchner funnel/lab filter and passive vacuum system to completely dewax your oils. You have to either keep adding butane or bury the funnel in dry ice to keep your tane chilled -40c. If you smell the wax you get off of using dual solvent winterizing process, you will notice it smells better than your oil. If you use a single solvent for dewaxing, hte wax has no smell; therefore, full terpene retention in the oils.

6. Stop smoking wax. Seriously. You are smoking a bunch of unnecessary plant materials in your product. The stuff that makes you feel like you got kicked in the chest... thats WAX.

 

[Green Dot Labs]

Some legit info here... but ill add to it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8pIiq1t5fU

7. Never turn your vacuum pump off while in the oven. Yes AI ovens have a vac-lock mechanism but the problem is that as they hydrocarbons boil out of the oil, they release a very very very small fraction of vacuum in your oven; thus, slowing down the purge; thus requiring you to add more heat and longer times that make your oils dark. You simply get more action by leaving the pump running throughout the whole purging process. This will yield you lighter oils.

8. Never let your collection vessel exceed 80degrees F when recovering your tane. Always leave about 5% gas in your collection vessel to act as a carrier solvent for your oils. This will speed up the cleaning and scraping times, but will lose you 5% gas (a few bucks) but lets face it.. time is money.

9. Learn how to calibrate your AI oven. It came with the instruction manual and the guys at AI will gladly assist you in breaking down the PV/SV and what it means to your oils.

10. Safety first. Gas mask, lab coat, gloves? check. walk in lab hood that pulls 2700cfm? check. Proper fire suppression and explosion proof equipment? check. Do not cut corners here. Lots of people die OVER SOME WEED because they want to make money

 

[nakadashi]

No offense but that looks well on its way to burned.

Yea it is way burned now. I don't know why I decided to risk 24g following some random advice stating that a vac at -29"hg and 130F would make wax.

For my next attempt I am going to try a method recommended in this thread. Will be setting aside a bit of un-purged wax overnight and then vaccing it when it is a muffin.

 

[nakadashi]

So a few things...

1. Always let sit in your oven for 30 minutes prior to pulling a vacuum. This will greatly reduce the muffining effect and your oils will use gravity to make its own thin film.

2. Time > Temperature. Set that shit at 103, let run for 6-8 hours. Then release vacuum and let set for 30 minutes. Take it out and flip it. Repeat.

3. Fabricate a dry ice sleeve around your column of your closed loop. -40c will help freeze some plant fats and waxes (waxy membrane around trich head) and not allow them to pass through your screen. Too much plant fat and wax will make your shatter (autobudder) over a short period of time.

4. Do not touch your shatter with your oily ass fingers. This will cause autobuddering. Do not fold in more than once to make a patty, or you will increase your chance of autobuddering.

5. Use a buchner funnel/lab filter and passive vacuum system to completely dewax your oils. You have to either keep adding butane or bury the funnel in dry ice to keep your tane chilled -40c. If you smell the wax you get off of using dual solvent winterizing process, you will notice it smells better than your oil. If you use a single solvent for dewaxing, hte wax has no smell; therefore, full terpene retention in the oils.

6. Stop smoking wax. Seriously. You are smoking a bunch of unnecessary plant materials in your product. The stuff that makes you feel like you got kicked in the chest... thats WAX.

Thanks for all the useful tips Green Dot. In Cali for some reason there is still a demand for wax and budder so maybe what I need to be doing is wiping my greasy ass hands all over the stuff and using more heat on the column to pull more waxes haha.

Can you elaborate a bit more on the dry ice sleeve? This sounds very interesting to me!

Another thing I am curious about is why you are flipping your patties? I don't have a a vac oven yet, but I was under the impression that the benefit was uniform heat throughout the slab. Is flipping still necessary?

 

[Green Dot Labs]

Check out sub zero extractors. I do not use one but have modified my unit to have this on it. Its the only way you will make light colored closed loop extracts, unless its the middle of Jan and you run your closed loop outside...

https://www.facebook.com/extractors

Patty flipping is just common sense for the most part. You really don't have to go 'thin film' necessarily if you do this properly. Once your patty stops looking like the toxic avenger and those oil on water rainbow bubbles stop bliping, your shit is pretty much done. An extra 30 min for good measures.

Dry ice can be fairly expensive and can cut into your bottom line. I am having a column fabricated with a refrigerant coil inside of a sleeve that can hit about -50c. It is pretty expensive though.