SneekyFarmer
Active member
Lol... I think he better keep his day job!
-
Happy Birthday ICMag! Been 20 years since Gypsy Nirvana created the forum! We are celebrating with a 4/20 Giveaway and by launching a new Patreon tier called "420club". You can read more here.
-
Important notice: ICMag's T.O.U. has been updated. Please review it here. For your convenience, it is also available in the main forum menu, under 'Quick Links"!
Everybody a breeder ?
- Thread starter silverhazefiend
- Start date
- Status
Lol... I think he better keep his day job!
B
blue green
B
blue green
Stdane
Active member
Dont quit yer daytime job lol!
Dont quit yer daytime job lol!
ROTLMAO......thanks Tom,this guy reminds me of some selfproclaimed breeders...
Dont quit yer daytime job lol!
ROTLMAO......thanks Tom,this guy reminds me of some selfproclaimed breeders...
N
new3
so am I, taste and art are the secondary argument of value.
The thread is about breeder value, what determines if someone is a breeder and you put the total on the science. FINE so you put the value of the breeder on your Mendelian trait
selection techniques.
I never contested the validity I simply asked how to calculate it.
I simply asked you to put a value on the application of science
honest how can you claim you use science effectively if you don't have the scientific data to show the difference in success?
if you don't have comprehensive records of the results of your Mendelian technique then you did not apply scientific method, you used a technique and gauged the results anecdotally
thats now how GW pharma does it (cited: The Medicinal Uses of Cannabis and Cannabinoids)
the value of scientific method can be measured quantitatively
it would be the difference between the results of natural techniques (or poor artificial ones) versus scientific ones so we can see how much value it adds
Now since you put primary importance on this and offer not proof of the exact benefit it made me question whether you were accurate about your numbers and ratios
so I did some further research and it seems your not only selective with your breeding methods but your selective with your use of genetic science
Measuring heritability
Evolutionary biologists, breeders, and statisticians have developed techniques to quantify the sources of phenotypic variation among individuals.This field is known as quantitative genetics, since most of the traits of interest vary continuously --rather than discretely -- and may thus be measured on a quantitative scale.
here is a chart from a quantitative genetics course
the norm of reaction, that is the environmental influence on phenotype variation is not only relevant but it can also be measured
the variation of phenotype distribution related to environmental influence is a recognized phenomenon and is refereed to phenotype plasticity
now lets take it one step further and introduce this (i posted experts but i invite everyone to read)
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2745.2006.01176.x/full
Quantitative estimation of phenotypic plasticity: bridging the gap between the evolutionary concept and its ecological applications
Phenotypic plasticity (PP), or the capacity of a given genotype to render different phenotypic values for a given trait under different environmental conditions, is a basic concept in genetics and evolutionary biology that has attracted the attention of ecologists for many years (Bradshaw 1965; Bradshaw 2006).
this is why GW pharma uses environment controls
to regulate environmental plasticity that is guarantee an environment that their genes require for proper expression
so tell me Tom if a controlled environment effects phenotype variation how does it not effect the ratio in regards to a selection pool?
once again it was never a question of your expertise but a qualification of how we scale the ratios between and outdoor and indoor environments
and this is where i start to get bothered especially when you bad mouth those that don't use science yet you don't want to give any absolute value to what you says matters absolutely
Tom if you cant put an absolute value on the science of selection how can you sat it is more or less valuable than the "art" of selection?
its only when you put a real value on it that it becomes more or less conceptually valuable
and come on man if you are the consummate scientist where are the records to quantify your efforts?
what scientist uses a scientific procedure but not scientific measures?
Last edited:
N
new3
dude, if you paint on a pumpkin thats art. if you claim a piece of nature as something yourself created within your limited lifespan on earth then your retarded and shouldnt be considered a breeder.
N
new3
we can appreciate nature but cannot create the marijuana plant itself, because its already been done, thats when intensive selection processes backed by scientific proof come into play and the further your understanding the more and more you deserve the right to be callled and call yourself a breeder
what specifics would you like to know
why not clarify the question before you call me out
i have no secrets nor an agenda
i never bought genetics i never sold genetics i never would or will
i have no capitalistic bias here
personal decision but it does not negate the results i achieved the observations i made or the fact i owned my own company were breeding was part of my income stream
hopefully the mods leave all the troll posts aimed at me ill answer em all at least be man enough to ask question before you act like a dick because you don't agree with what i have to say
N
new3
tell me a cross you made, what you selected for and why you selected for those traits, also tell me what leads you to think those genetics showed up on that specific plant in the first place. Then tell me how you think its an art.
uote=new3;5699512]tell me a cross you made, what you selected for and why you selected for those traits, also tell me what leads you to think those genetics showed up on that specific plant in the first place. Then tell me how you think its an art.[/quote]
you got it bro
let me tell you about my "MAGIC CROSS" because the story supports my view phenotype variation indoors but its a long story and im along winded dude so keep that in mind
the female was found in a bag of "kind" bud, this is were most of my stock came from, it was an "unknown" kush i scored sometime in the mid 90s
the weeds i had been getting were fucking epic, northern lights, afghanis, super skunks, crippies had been showing their face so i wasnt too impressed when i saw the bag
it looked flat, didnt jump out at me but it was sensi and the dude i was dealing with always treated me right. long story short, the weed was OK. it got me high, not crazy high but there was something special about the high
it eliminated my anxiety. no weed did that for me this erased it. you could kill someone put hte body in teh trunk get pulled over and talk to the cop without being nervous
it was zen weed . for me at least
i kept the seed like i did with every seed i ever found (i used to clean this dudes mids just to get the seed) i had a noahs arc complex and was so afraid that weed would be unavailable do to prohibition
now back then most indoor dudes in my region were gassing their weed and growing hydroponically and heat and co2 causes some strains to throw male flowers so there was a fair occurrence of a seed or two in bags of really good pot
fast forward some time
I decide to bring my "heirlooms" outdoors, see the one or two seeds I had gotten in those bags of "kind" bud, like those afghani and northern lights seeds, I had bred them out and they were fucking epic absolutely epic
this was summer of 99 iirc so i had about 8 strains i had bred so i popped some seed and put them out there
i was also given (3) seeds from a friend a gift for teaching him how to grow (seen here in 99 with a bunch of sensi and serious seed growing in the back and foreground)
a single seed from a serious seed breeder pack of ak47 i formally thanked Simon for his contribution on the serious board . this was the only one of 3 breeder pack seeds i was ever given before 2008. everything before and after until 08 was from bagseed
so i was going through all my seeds and i had this one "kush" and i had put notes about the anti anxiety so i put it in the ground
teh ak47 was a male the unknown kush a female so i dusted it figured the only way to see how that breeder pack seed would be
i crossed it to NL Afgahni a strain named after a friend and a few others
the kush plant was one of the single nicest plants i had ever possessed it was blood red maroon and ever facet of it was amazing
it was better than the parent
I pop some seeds and the first test of the progeny is excellent, the pot has a soaring high in some of the phenos and the kush anxiety elimination helped keep it from turning into paranoia
THen I had to shut down abruptly due to being ratted on
my stable all my seeds and all my genes went to my freind
what I got back was about a 10th of my seed which had been stored in an attic in brooklyn during the summer and some seeds when he self-ed it in an attempt to preserve it
so i was shit out of luck unless i worked with what i had
having bred out many "bagseed" i suspect to be the product of bad breeding technique and the ratio they express themselves favorably in my garden
the odds i experience and the odds people express are not the same. i havent upped pictures in aged so i have to go wiht some old ones i already got up, next time i frie up the other pc ill up more these dont really show of the resin as well as they could
you got it bro
let me tell you about my "MAGIC CROSS" because the story supports my view phenotype variation indoors but its a long story and im along winded dude so keep that in mind
the female was found in a bag of "kind" bud, this is were most of my stock came from, it was an "unknown" kush i scored sometime in the mid 90s
the weeds i had been getting were fucking epic, northern lights, afghanis, super skunks, crippies had been showing their face so i wasnt too impressed when i saw the bag
it looked flat, didnt jump out at me but it was sensi and the dude i was dealing with always treated me right. long story short, the weed was OK. it got me high, not crazy high but there was something special about the high
it eliminated my anxiety. no weed did that for me this erased it. you could kill someone put hte body in teh trunk get pulled over and talk to the cop without being nervous
it was zen weed . for me at least
i kept the seed like i did with every seed i ever found (i used to clean this dudes mids just to get the seed) i had a noahs arc complex and was so afraid that weed would be unavailable do to prohibition
now back then most indoor dudes in my region were gassing their weed and growing hydroponically and heat and co2 causes some strains to throw male flowers so there was a fair occurrence of a seed or two in bags of really good pot
fast forward some time
I decide to bring my "heirlooms" outdoors, see the one or two seeds I had gotten in those bags of "kind" bud, like those afghani and northern lights seeds, I had bred them out and they were fucking epic absolutely epic
this was summer of 99 iirc so i had about 8 strains i had bred so i popped some seed and put them out there
i was also given (3) seeds from a friend a gift for teaching him how to grow (seen here in 99 with a bunch of sensi and serious seed growing in the back and foreground)
a single seed from a serious seed breeder pack of ak47 i formally thanked Simon for his contribution on the serious board . this was the only one of 3 breeder pack seeds i was ever given before 2008. everything before and after until 08 was from bagseed
so i was going through all my seeds and i had this one "kush" and i had put notes about the anti anxiety so i put it in the ground
teh ak47 was a male the unknown kush a female so i dusted it figured the only way to see how that breeder pack seed would be
i crossed it to NL Afgahni a strain named after a friend and a few others
the kush plant was one of the single nicest plants i had ever possessed it was blood red maroon and ever facet of it was amazing
it was better than the parent
I pop some seeds and the first test of the progeny is excellent, the pot has a soaring high in some of the phenos and the kush anxiety elimination helped keep it from turning into paranoia
THen I had to shut down abruptly due to being ratted on
my stable all my seeds and all my genes went to my freind
what I got back was about a 10th of my seed which had been stored in an attic in brooklyn during the summer and some seeds when he self-ed it in an attempt to preserve it
so i was shit out of luck unless i worked with what i had
having bred out many "bagseed" i suspect to be the product of bad breeding technique and the ratio they express themselves favorably in my garden
the odds i experience and the odds people express are not the same. i havent upped pictures in aged so i have to go wiht some old ones i already got up, next time i frie up the other pc ill up more these dont really show of the resin as well as they could
Last edited:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDW_Hj2K0wo
"This is your world isn't it?"
You're prob ganna want to crack that book open to page 325, Chapter 13 Genotype x Environment Interaction
Marketing is the process of communicating the value of a product or service to customers. It is a critical business function for attracting customers.
link it up and show us what you know. I dont know which book your referencing so share the exact reference if you dont want to post it and well have at it
the process is a science, whether the breeder knows it or not.. and the result is always art in my opinion.
Kill yourself
It's Bos and Caligari's Selection Methods in Plant Breeding. Someone had a pdf pages back. Get it. I'm sure you'll love the thing. They wrote the preface just for you it ends with:
In this book, concepts from plant breeding, population genetics, quantitative genetics, probability theory and statistics are integrated. The reason for this is to help provide a basis on which to make selection more professional, in such a way that the chance of being successful is increased. Success can, of course, never be guaranteed because the best theoretical decision will always be made on the basis of incomplete and simplifying assumptions. Nevertheless, the authors believe that a breeder familiar with the contents of this book is in a better position to be successful than a breeder who is not!
i guess you won that arugement
btw marketing is done by maslow not mendel
tyvm i downloaded it and can post it and we can analysis it I promise you that
and thank you very much for saying that you cant quantify science any better with that reference than you could before you attacked my person once again
sorry you are have deluded yourself into believing science applied in your back yard will make you GW pharma
now I showed what I can do without science why not show me what you can do with it and how much better it is because of it
at least Tom can talk shit because he can throw fucking down
have you even tried dusting a pistil? or is all of your argument based on what you read on the web?
there is a reason you buy fucking seed son cause i know I dont
custy is as custy do
The genotypic value of some candidate was defined to be equal to the expected phenotypic value at given macro-environmental conditions. This means that
the genotypic value of a given candidate depends on the macro-environmental
growing conditions. It also means that differences between candidates depend
on the macro-environmental conditions. This phenomenon is called genotype
by environment interaction (g × e interaction). It may even mean that ranking
of candidates according to their genotypic value depends on the macroenvironmental
growing conditions. The latter is a disturbance to breeders, who
generally want to select candidates performing, under diverse conditions, in a
superior way. The phenomenon is also disturbing when testing varieties developed
for hopefully a wide range of conditions. This chapter elaborates some
relevant aspects of g × e interaction.
13.1 Introduction
Until now it was consistently assumed that all plants of all generations are
exposed to the same macro-environmental growing conditions. This is, of
course, only appropriate if one is interested in the performance of genotypes in
a specific macro-environment, say macro-environment k. The partitioning of
the phenotypic value of some candidate in this macro-environment was given
by Equation (8.1), i.e.
p = G + e,
The genotypic value of the candidate was defined as
G = E(p|gt,Ek)
were the genotype of the candidate (gt) and the macro-environmental conditions
(Ek) of the evaluation are specified. A particular macro-environment is
characterized by the growing conditions of a particular location, a particular
growing season (or year) or the combination of a particular location and a
particular year. Additionally it may be characterized by the growing conditions
due to some temperature regime, e.g. in a glasshouse, some amount of
fertilizer, some plant density, etc.
The quality of the macro-environmental growing conditions is thus reflected
by the genotypic value. Indeed, the genotypic value of the considered genotype
depends not only on the macro-environmental conditions, but possibly also
on the effect of interaction of the considered genotype and the considered
the genotypic value of a given candidate depends on the macro-environmental
growing conditions. It also means that differences between candidates depend
on the macro-environmental conditions. This phenomenon is called genotype
by environment interaction (g × e interaction). It may even mean that ranking
of candidates according to their genotypic value depends on the macroenvironmental
growing conditions. The latter is a disturbance to breeders, who
generally want to select candidates performing, under diverse conditions, in a
superior way. The phenomenon is also disturbing when testing varieties developed
for hopefully a wide range of conditions. This chapter elaborates some
relevant aspects of g × e interaction.
13.1 Introduction
Until now it was consistently assumed that all plants of all generations are
exposed to the same macro-environmental growing conditions. This is, of
course, only appropriate if one is interested in the performance of genotypes in
a specific macro-environment, say macro-environment k. The partitioning of
the phenotypic value of some candidate in this macro-environment was given
by Equation (8.1), i.e.
p = G + e,
The genotypic value of the candidate was defined as
G = E(p|gt,Ek)
were the genotype of the candidate (gt) and the macro-environmental conditions
(Ek) of the evaluation are specified. A particular macro-environment is
characterized by the growing conditions of a particular location, a particular
growing season (or year) or the combination of a particular location and a
particular year. Additionally it may be characterized by the growing conditions
due to some temperature regime, e.g. in a glasshouse, some amount of
fertilizer, some plant density, etc.
The quality of the macro-environmental growing conditions is thus reflected
by the genotypic value. Indeed, the genotypic value of the considered genotype
depends not only on the macro-environmental conditions, but possibly also
on the effect of interaction of the considered genotype and the considered
- Status
