v2 'dream system' DIY and diary

[GMax]

Gmax - I'm not here to tell anyone how to grow their garden. I only offer advice based on what I see. Take it or leave it makes no difference to me . Might just be the lighting, or camera, or the things you mentioned, maybe even an imbalance from adding kool bloom, but those plants look on the verge of overfed to me. However nobody knows what's going on in your garden better than you, so go with your gut.

no problem bro... i got a chance to pick up a few more wyes and i have most of the parts to the new WW.. but i changed plans and i am not going to get a chance to get back there tonight..so there have been no changes to the rez yet it still just the watered down nutes...when i get a chance to make it back to the grow i will take a better look..that second pic got me worried now

Yeah, GMax, you definitely want your ppm's between 450-600 with Aero-steez. if you need a refresher on aeroponics, you should check out one of Aerokrafter's many threads, all are extremely TIGHT, he yielded 3lb+ with a 1K on a mover, 18 plants. His PPM's are never above 700 if I remember correctly, and after stretch stay right below 500ppms. He gets amazing results.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=237140
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=243325
hope this helps.

RBDF

only got a chance to skim through the first one, but i am gonna try to dedicate some time to reading them..looks like it stocked full of info... thanks


i dont have a ppm pen yet but i gonna get a ppm pen ASAP.. i try to keep my nutes light, using a diluted REZ recipe with a just a little additives..i used to go even lighter when i was growing Sensi... she was more finicky though

it would be really nice to take readings and keep track of the results...i really like how this guy ^^ keeps a detailed record of his numbers...and then after harvest he goes over them to make changes etc....shows me i need to step up my organization game

when i get my pen i gonna change the nutes up, and i am gonna get the bluelab

 

[redbudduckfoot]

yeah dude, you absolutely must have a PPM or EC meter if you want to dial in your Aero grow to the degree Aerokrafter does. Shit, my sunleaves ppm pen cost less than 25$ at my local hydro-whore.

Rbdf

 

[farmhouse cat]

Glad yas caught shit in time to prevent probs Bro......The path to Nirvana takes many fuckups before finding redundant setups that guarantee production with backup equipment insurance in case pumps and such shit as solenoids take a shit........

When I ran Krusty buckets at different locations , there were 2 pumps inline tied together to provide feed as well as 2 more to provide drainage in a fast flow situation in case 1 died in the feed/drain process.........

Bet there`s a way ta daisy chain those solenoids inline so if 1 takes a shit , the other 1 kicks in.......or maybe having both inline goin on and off at the same time for X amounts of spray times and only workin 1/2 as hard for equipment life extension......

Just tryin ta help Bro.....things ta ponder......

Good luck....DHF..........

What about no solenoid? I just had my 12$ rainbird solenoid take a shit. (its been runnin with no problems for almost exactly a year) My pump was cycling on and off continually and i traced it to the solenoid not holding pressure and the pump kept trying to prime itself. Im glad i caught it quick, and no harm done..it was during lights off.

Being its thanksgiving and the stores are closed, i just removed the solenoid all together and plugged the pump straight to the timer. Its been working perfectly. The pressure when the pump is fired on is 15psi. With the solenoid the pump held a pressure of 35psi but would drop immeaditly and level out at 15. So... other then maybe the pump is not designed to turn on and off like this i dont see a need anymore for a solenoid??

 

[GMax]

yeah dude, you absolutely must have a PPM or EC meter if you want to dial in your Aero grow to the degree Aerokrafter does. Shit, my sunleaves ppm pen cost less than 25$ at my local hydro-whore.

Rbdf

yeah i used to have one of those..they are actually pretty decent..I have bought 2 of them in the past, but they are not waterproof and i always have an accident that breaks them...i gonna decent pen soon...

What about no solenoid? I just had my 12$ rainbird solenoid take a shit. (its been runnin with no problems for almost exactly a year) My pump was cycling on and off continually and i traced it to the solenoid not holding pressure and the pump kept trying to prime itself. Im glad i caught it quick, and no harm done..it was during lights off.

Being its thanksgiving and the stores are closed, i just removed the solenoid all together and plugged the pump straight to the timer. Its been working perfectly. The pressure when the pump is fired on is 15psi. With the solenoid the pump held a pressure of 35psi but would drop immeaditly and level out at 15. So... other then maybe the pump is not designed to turn on and off like this i dont see a need anymore for a solenoid??

damn sounds like the same shit that happened to me but mine hadnt even gone a year yet...

I am glad you got that shit caught in time bro.. i know how that can be, and a definate plus that it happened during lights off... way to pull through in the clutch with all the stores closed for the holidays

my pump is the same way..holding pressure at 35, and dropping to 15psi when it sprays...i dont really know the answer to whether or not it will work without a soleniod, but i couldnt personally do it because, with all my systems, i have my timers almost maxed out on amp space and the soleniod uses way less electricity than the actual pump...if i wanted to run it without a soleniod i would need another timer (which could be nice)

i would be interested to see if it keeps working....keep an eye on it and maybe buy a backup soleniod just in case since they are only $12




got some pics...postin an update here in a min

 

[GMax]

Hope everyone had a great thanksgiving.. I had the greatest thanksgiving EVER!!!

I had a chance to make it to my grow tonight…I didn’t really have any work I just wanted to check on everything…one thing that I am thankful for, is since I have updated the drainage, the system has been running smooth since…

The plants are looking good though.... the leaves are starting to turn paler though in some places, but that is about it… I still don’t have a ppm pen, but I plan on buying everything else I need for the next WW and building it tom and if i do, I am gonna change the nutes with a little more bloom boosters.. I have had my better yeilds in my old room with 2 rez changes with KB but no flush in the middle… the KB has seemed to raise my yeilds, its just easy to burn with it..I definitely have a ppm pen for the next round and be using its reading to help make these decisions…but for now i dont want to detour too far from whats been working...also i want to test this system to the old and if i make a bunch of changes, even if they are good, it will make it hard to have a fair comparison...if that makes sense

Anyways here the plants…







And here one right when the lights are on, but it makes it look like it got yellow leaves…I also gonna have a better camera after Christmas…



I got plants in veg ready to be transplanted to the next WW, I just need to get building the next system… I have been procrastinating long enough, it time to get it done for real..if everything goes as planned, I am gonna have it finished tom night and then let the glue dry and transplant the next day


one thing i am worried about, is my lease is gonna be up in a few months and it would cut that crop kinda close ^^... if you have been following my grows, my landlord did a walkthrough when i resigned my last lease..i am pretty sure he wont want another,at least i am hoping, and if he doesnt then i am just gonna resign.. but i am also gonna go back on the house market after the WW harvest.. might be safe to move since i have been here for 2 years and i would much rather own my grow so i can take the whole landlord thing out of the equation...

but i am familiar with the neighborhood etc here and i like that... if i cant get anything figured out and he wants a walkthrough then i may make a pass to try and land contract this place and take it "as is" to avoid any inspections etc ...and if all else fails i will be forced have to shutdown again..it wouldnt be a big deal really, but i trying to avoid it at all costs...i cant predict the future, just something i need to start planning for

 

[Bud buster]

Good to hear you got your drainage flowing well again and the possibility of a new home.

 

[DHF]

Not just the greenness, which is only a partial indicator. As you mentioned some strains are naturally a dark green color. What I was mainly refering to is the slight claw that is starting as well as the burnt leaf tips. You said you were 14 days from harvest correct? That is not a time where the plant is using alot of nute, so pushing them higher is especially counterproductive. It's true that some plants are just hogs and need a higher EC in general to keep them happy, less is more is subjective to the plant being grown. The basic idea is that just because a plant can take more nutes without burning to death, doesn't mean that it will yield more as a result. I have found my best yields/quality by using the proper ratio of nutes in the lowest concentration that the plant remains deficiency free. In terms of EC that is usually between .8-1.5, or 400-750 ppm @.5 conversion. Ideal concentration varies based on the plant and nute delivery system.

Not sure folks understand nutrient requirements per each and every different hybrid D Bro.........but.....

Shit get`s real and becomes evident when things slide sideways with imbalances and improper monitoring......and.....that said........

Indica hybrids accept and deal with higher ppm`s /ec without showing tip burn or toxicity , but in no way has higher ppm`s EVER made said indica hybrids yield more, but rather shows how they hold onto excess nitrogen during late flower with little to no benefit from it.......50/50 hybrids do well with less ppm`s across the board and yield accordingly IME , but I`m prejudiced............

My 2 centavos from all them yrs........

Peace.....Freds..........

 

[GMax]

Good to hear you got your drainage flowing well again and the possibility of a new home.

Not sure folks understand nutrient requirements per each and every different hybrid D Bro.........but.....

Shit get`s real and becomes evident when things slide sideways with imbalances and improper monitoring......and.....that said........

Indica hybrids accept and deal with higher ppm`s /ec without showing tip burn or toxicity , but in no way has higher ppm`s EVER made said indica hybrids yield more, but rather shows how they hold onto excess nitrogen during late flower with little to no benefit from it.......50/50 hybrids do well with less ppm`s across the board and yield accordingly IME , but I`m prejudiced............

My 2 centavos from all them yrs........

Peace.....Freds..........

good info freds

one thing is i am really not feeding the sb that heavily....full strength REZ's formula in my system would be 300ml Micro/450ml Bloom....

i am only going 150ml Micro/250ml Bloom (3/5 compared to 6/9)with a little boosters (<1ml per 10gal) when i am not using boosters i still never go full strengtth (225/375 bout as high as i go) i also only add 30ml calmag which is <1ml gal ( highest i go on the calmg is 1ml/gal)

i used to go way lighter when i was growing Sensi... but once i switched to bubble, it was telling me to fuck off with the same nute regimen that worked with SS... but that was like a day and night difference, from a finicky sativa to a nute hungry indica...i have only grown a few strains, but i have noticed that most of the difference between nutes requirements for each plant is the levels/strength of the nutes and the amount of calmag...some like less some like more....but NEVER full strength for me

 

[Mister_D]

good info freds

one thing is i am really not feeding the sb that heavily....full strength REZ's formula in my system would be 300ml Micro/450ml Bloom....

i am only going 150ml Micro/250ml Bloom (3/5 compared to 6/9)with a little boosters (<1ml per 10gal) when i am not using boosters i still never go full strengtth (225/375 bout as high as i go) i also only add 30ml calmag which is <1ml gal ( highest i go on the calmg is 1ml/gal)

i used to go way lighter when i was growing Sensi... but once i switched to bubble, it was telling me to fuck off with the same nute regimen that worked with SS... but that was like a day and night difference, from a finicky sativa to a nute hungry indica...i have only grown a few strains, but i have noticed that most of the difference between nutes requirements for each plant is the levels/strength of the nutes and the amount of calmag...some like less some like more....but NEVER full strength for me

Gmax this is exactly what I was talking about when I refered to nute delivery system. Aero is very efficent at getting nutrients into your plants, thus requiring lower concentrations to achieve the same effect. Ratio becomes even more important as the concentration lowers, but that's all a part of dialage .

 

[GMax]

Gmax this is exactly what I was talking about when I refered to nute delivery system. Aero is very efficent at getting nutrients into your plants, thus requiring lower concentrations to achieve the same effect. Ratio becomes even more important as the concentration lowers, but that's all a part of dialage .

i absolutely understand and agree with you..with aero the plants are sprayed every couple min and almost forced fed...compared to soil/flood & drain/etc...look through my round 2 and you will see how low i use to go with nutes.. and back then people were telling me to up them...and even though the nutes regimen that i am using isnt really that high, it is higher than even i would like it to be..but the SB likes it..trust me i would be burning my plants the fuck up with other strains ..


but like i said i am just trying to mimic what has given me my best numbers in the old room so i can have a fair comparison of system vs system..and i have already cheated enough by giving it a midflower flush...i know the WW gonna win, i just wanna know by how much

i am getting a ppm pen, even though i kinda dont like them..they are handy but they wont give me the readings i want.. i tried everything i could to have a DTW system but it was impossible.. i dont really like recirculating rez..i think it a flawed design (which should mean a lot considering i have a recirculating rez) because you take your ppm reading..say its 1000ppm.. and then you check it the next day and it has dropped to say 600..with the ppm pen you can tell that the plant ate that is where it handy, but you cannot tell what it ate..it could have taken out all 400ppm in straight calcium or phosporous..then you add more nutes back and could be making toxic levels of nitrogen etc..that is why i dont like recirculating and i dont like or own a ppm pen.. i would much rather own like a water analysis pen..

but so far this system has accomplished my main goal... a hydro system that i can leave (for the most part) unnattended and still have great harvests..

i have been super busy with holidays, family in town for the weekend, homework etc ..that i havent been able to get the next WW system built.. but i have been spending any spare time at the grow...i have had to make time to see family from out of state (that makes it sound like a chore, but i am glad to make time) but anytime that i have "went home" it has been back to the grow.. i spent a little time there after Thanksgiving and got there last night at 3am and worked on the next WW til 5..then woke up and got a little more work done, then back to family time..yada yada

in that time i got another rez change into the WW (same as last week) and when i have been going back i can tell that they are still eating by the color of the nutes.... and i am gonna give them a final flush in few days...still havent decided whether i am gonna run plain water, or just gradually bring down the ppm

i have been spending some time sawing up the 4'' connector pvc peices (hacksaw) ...i have got 70/80 peices cut....that is the hardest part of building this .. once that is done it just simply connecting the wyes/elbows/tees like Legos...i am gonna have this thing built sunday night, let the glue dry and transplant monday...if you want specific pics of the build, let me know now...my family leaves after the weekend and things may go back to normal... til xmas

the plants that i have in veg that go into the WW once built are almost beyond overvegged.. seeing how this last one turned out stretch-wise they are definately over vegged actually...this is what happens when you procrastinate...on top of that my veg system isnt designed for a rez change with plants...they have been in the same nutes for about 12 days straight.. so i need to get them transplanted quick before they start showing deficiencies or something

anyways i am thinkin about super cropping all of them mainly to reduce height...also be a good test to see how it stretches when croppped...plan on removing the growing shoot and the next 1-2 nodes..is that too much..?? i havent done that much cropping since switching to vert and not that much either when i was flat (mostly FIM0...think it be ok to take a 7-8'' clone and crop it down to about 5" maybe less ???

 

[GMax]

Well mr. D, you may be right

I have plans tonight, and may not be able to stop at the grow after hours.. So I decided to stop by before…when I go down into my basement, the first thing I see is the giant WW rez… it wasn’t looking low, but I decided to check the RO rez.. Last time I checked it, it was yesterday after the WW rez change around 5..and it had 90gal….today almost exactly 24hrs later I check it and it only has 60gal!!!!!! 30 gal less than 24hrs ago with a 200gpd RO...Wtf??

So I know the drill….I had nice clothes on so I stripped to my underwear again.. Starting to become regular attire at the grow lol…and then I start checking for leaks etc…

I go in the WW room and I notice that not that much water is making it back to the return rez….so I grab a couple towels and put it under the rubber cap that I added a drain to last week…expecting the worse, but there was barely any water that came out…so that’s good…it seems the plants are drinking most of it before it even makes it to the return rez….

So I go in the old flowering room and check for leaks or runaway floats and there are none ..but one of my bulbs is burned out …time for a replacement… checked on the veg and the same thing…

I have triple checked for leaks and there are none

So I check the actual RO machine and it seems to be working..I cant really tell what rate the water is coming out at, but there is water coming out the clean and waste ends… the only problem I can see with it is there are yellow/green/red areas in my RO’s pressure gauge.. The green area (good) is between 60-80psi…the house water pressure keeps it between 85-90psi (red)..there seems to be nothing I can do about it.. I cant seem to get it in between..it either too high or too low…how bad is this ??? Seems like it would make it run faster if anything

So I know that bobble said that the water isn’t just disappearing, the plants are drinking it…but I have AT LEAST 230gal of unaccounted for water in the last 24hrs!!!!

This has happened twice now…but there has been one coincidence that I think I need to take a harder look at…both times this has happened right after a bloom booster rez change…

I did the midflush…fixed the built up water problem… did a bloom booster rez change..next day 100gpd RO cant keep up…switched to 200gpd RO.. Let the nutes continue with “watered down nutes” for few days and RO stayed caught up… did another bloom booster rez change and next day the 200gpd cant keep up anymore…

So here is where I am confused… if your plants are drinking an excessive amount under proper conditions, not because heat or whatever…this would seem like a good thing…but is it actually a sign of overfert???? Like the plants are drinking excessively to balance it out ???

Or is it actually a good thing ??

and 230gal in 24hrs really ??!!!!



Idk my humidity has spiked up (77% max), so for the first time this grow I am about to bust out the dehuey …temps still in check though

running a little late...got to go

 

[GMax]

well i have confirmed that the plants are definately drinking all that water... rez down to 50gal today so that another 210gal gone ...looks like i have no choice but to find another water source and have that 100gpd hooked up to the main rez also, for a total of 300gpd

i want to transplant the next WW tomorrow, but i wont be able to if there not enough water, and i cannot do any rez changes of anything else at the moment

i never imagined that this would be the bottleneck of the system lol


FHC are you using a RO? how big etc...

 

[farmhouse cat]

Mine drink a ton too. but not anywhere near what you are saying. Mine at this stage drink about 20 gallons a day. I use a 3 stage RO filter. Every morning i drop the RO feed into the reservoir and check it later in the day. When it hits the level i want i remove and shut it off.

I used to have a float valve hooked to my res, but i didnt like not knowing exactly how much they were drinking. I try and change the res when they drink the volume of the res.

Also..i always start a new res with half tap and half RO...but i always wondered if topping off with straight RO until next changeout could be unbeneficial?

 

[Bud buster]

Ever think about mixing tap water 50/50 it can't be that bad and the need for cal/mag would be diminished.

 

[GMax]

Mine drink a ton too. but not anywhere near what you are saying. Mine at this stage drink about 20 gallons a day. I use a 3 stage RO filter. Every morning i drop the RO feed into the reservoir and check it later in the day. When it hits the level i want i remove and shut it off.

I used to have a float valve hooked to my res, but i didnt like not knowing exactly how much they were drinking. I try and change the res when they drink the volume of the res.

Also..i always start a new res with half tap and half RO...but i always wondered if topping off with straight RO until next changeout could be unbeneficial?

yeah i feel ya, i used to do the same thing with the topoffs and rez changes...try to keep track of water drank and replace rez when they drink volume of the rez.... i dont like not knowing how much they are drinking either, but it eventually got to a point where it wasnt practical anymore...and i cant be there everyday

yours are still around stretch part of flowering still right ?? i dont know exactly how much they were drinking before...but up until a week and a half ago, a 100gpd is all i need...now a 200gpd cant keep up

under that logic, i should have already done another rez change...the plants have drank 4x the volume of the rez, 2 days in a row!!! yesterday you can tell there where still some nutes left, but the ppm had to be pretty low... but today, it just looks like plain water...so they drank a shit ton (400+ gal) and ate all those nutes in 2 days

i was gonna harvest this crop on day 50, but it has been such a good crop that i am gonna give it an extra 2 days...so that puts it at exactly 14 days from harvest (but you gotta understand that such a short flowering strain, the stage of flowering its at is different than a 9wk strain for example...a 9wk strain is accomplishing something different on day 38, compared to SB on day 38...hope that makes sense)

my basement has a utility sink that my RO is currently hooked up to and a W/D hookup..these are my only 2 sources of water in the basement.. i was gonna use my W/D to run my other RO off of..would it be possible to buy a wye peice for the sink, and run 2 ROs off one faucet??? it might be possible.. my 100gpd has 1/4'' intake and my 200gpd has 1/2'' and i got good city pressure

but my other option, is to buy a wye peice for the sink and have an RO hooked to one end and then a hose to the WW soleniod..then i can run it DTW with tap for flsuh and not need any topoffs..then the RO can be dedicated to filling the rez and i may not need a second RO, but if i did i could hook it up to the W/D....the only problem is the RO would lose pressure for 10 sec every 7 min...but that sort of the same as operating with a automatic shutoff valve

 

[GMax]

Ever think about mixing tap water 50/50 it can't be that bad and the need for cal/mag would be diminished.

i have but i really dont like the idea of it... RO gives me full control and with my nutes are always ph perfect...i dont own a ph pen either, but i do own a ph dropper set for making cloning solution..i rarely ever check my ph and when i do it always gives the color of right around 6.0...no matter if it fresh nutes or nutes right before changed..the only thing i ever need is a couple drops of PH down in my rooting solution...that just something i dont feel like messing up, know what i mean

i could do the 50/50 rez change, but it really wouldnt help because my plants are gonna get topped off with 4x that and it would have to be RO, cause i cant rig a main rez to get topped off with a 50/50 ratio

i really dont like the dtw idea i just mentioned ^^ because out the tap my ph is 7-8...if they werent drinking so much i wasnt planning on doing anything with the rez... i was just gonna let the nutes continue to get watered down and let it ride out the rest of the two weeks, which would have meant no more work with the WW except a final defoliation in few days and harvest

 

[Anti]

Sticky this fucking thread already. Jesus.

 

[GMax]

Sticky this fucking thread already. Jesus.

wow anti.. i really dont know what to say... :respect

 

[GMax]

well a quick update...

i have been talking to a girl who lives in a different city...she lives farther away from where i live, but closer to where i grow... i have been staying out late at her house and when i leave, for the past few days i have just been going back to the grow and passing out, which has been convienent because i can wake up in the morning to get some work done on next WW.... point is, i have been spending more time at my grow then my house lately

so anyways, my rez is still drinking like bastards !! when i woke up this morning, the rez was only half full, the float was still working, and only 60gal in the main rez, compared to 50 the day before...my logic is that if my RO is 200 gpd (and brand new at that, literally a week old) and there is only 10 gal more the next day, then there is 190+ gal drank... so i shutoff water supply to the WW rez, filled it back up manually and let the main rez try to catch up...

the WW rez is definately the culprit, after i shutoff water supply to it, i left for a few hours for home depot etc...and came back and the rez was only 1/4 full!!! my WW seems to be averaging around +/-10 gal an hour

well i cant just sit back and hope it will fix itself...it actually seems to be getting worse the longer i wait, so i went to home depot to buy the parts to hook up my old RO to the wd hookup...after a few failed attempts, i just attached a wye to the 200gpd faucet and tried running both ROs off one facuet and it worked!!!

my pressure gauge only works on the 200gpd and when i turned on both ROs from the one faucet, the pressure dropped from 90psi (which was already a little high) to 70psi (recommended range) with both running

i scavenged a unused float from my WW rez and sealed the hole with a rubber cork....so now my rez has 2 floats...one with a 100gpd and one with a 200gpd, all from one faucet...and the 200gpd does still flow faster

hopefully this helps...


it is great that my plants are drinking so much, but i worry about water usage....there are countless threads asking about being busted for power usage, and it would seem that it is just a wives tale and to pay your bills on time....but you use too much water and they will send someone to your house to check for leaks...trust me i know from experience (happened while i was growing...crazy story which i have referenced twice in this thread but havent told, i will get to it eventually)

couple that with a high electric bill also, and it seems like a no brainer figuring out whats going on



anyways, when i am not fucking with the rez, i got the next WW bout 50% built, but the hardest parts are out the way

gonna try to get some pics up tonight and do a real update

thanks everybody

 

[bobblehead]

Jesus fucking christ Gmax! I second the sticky nomination. This thread is epic.

Don't worry about the high pressure on your RO... You might have more impurities pass through the filter, but so what? My water starts out at .9 EC and comes out the RO at 0-.1 EC, and I use a pressure booster. I don't recall the pressure level... Point being you'll be fine, and you'll create more water than the filter is rated for with the extra pressure.

Keep the detailed updates coming dude... This is so awesome!