Help me understand nute burn?

[Wonderon]

No I did not sorry. I got them doing good and got my ro unit working so I thought I was clear. I don't understand but is it possible that by not keeping the coco wet that it holds on to the salts too well? I watered them with half strength nutes for the last few days and they were looking much better and then last night I skipped a day and today they took a turn for the worse. This is what happened last time too, then if I do a plain water flush they come back... Seems the salt builds up in this medium and if it stays wet the plants can use it but if it dries too much the plant burns.

 

[unspoken]

I would transplant into a larger pot and keep watering every day with your 3/4.5(sorry, forgot you were under fluoros when I said 6/9 earlier). Check the coco like I said (before you transplant).

 

[TribalSeeds]

I agree on not letting them dry. Water everyday WITH NUTES
I read that you said it happened after you fed with nutes... But heres what were saying...
When you use regular water youre destroying the coco's CEC. When the plant needs food its not there until youve used enough nutes to put it back in the right balance. Id asume thats jerking your plant around. Ive never had good results with plain water in coco so I just dont do it anymore.

 

[Wonderon]

Actually this last time they were loooking great after 3 waterings (1a day) of half strength nutes. I always run about twice as much water through them as it takes to fill the cups so I get a good amount of run to waste. I skipped one day watering and they went onto shock and look terrible. Yesterday I gave them a plain watering to if it helps, otherwise they were curling and dying any how so couldn't hurt. If they don't bounce back with some vigour, I'm gonna pluck them and start over. Thanks

 

[Ziggaro]

Bro you just said a week ago you used ph up when you were asking about it affecting your EC. I saw the chlorosis and curling and thought maybe you had an mg lockout from too much K.
I was only trying to help but you act like I have no clue what's going on.. I won't bother anymore!

 

[Wonderon]

Whoa I didn't mean to offend you. I said a week ago that one of the solutions I made I went a little low on ph so I added some up. I haven't made that mistake again so only using ph down now. As of now I need to start from scratch. I'm gonna pluck the two I have now as they are probably stunted and won't be any use. I need to get a better ph meter and a better ph down solution because gh ph down seems to make my solutions drift way too much.

 

[Wonderon]

I'm gonna start some more seeds in a day or two. Gonna start with 6. I plan to rinse the %&%* out of the coco and then precharge it with 1/2 strength nutes. Probably start in 16oz cups. Wish me luck. Thanks for the help. I'll update.

 

[d3cryption]

I'm gonna start some more seeds in a day or two. Gonna start with 6. I plan to rinse the %&%* out of the coco and then precharge it with 1/2 strength nutes. Probably start in 16oz cups. Wish me luck. Thanks for the help. I'll update.

good luck...

 

[Wonderon]

Sitting at work and thinking. Is it possible that I fucked my coco up from the start by hydrating it with plain tap water chlorine and all? That's the last thing I can think of that could be causing issues. Wondering of the coco is good at holding on to the chlorine. I have a bail and a half left so I can try hydrating the new stuff with ro.

Edit:
I finally get what you all mean by not rinsing with plain water. So if I see them getting crispy would I be better off to rinse the shit out of them with something like 1/4 strength nutes so not to destroy the coco. Say I'm using 16oz cups, if I drain 3 cups of 1/4 strength nutes through them they should be rinsed, correct?

 

[Wonderon]

So I know runoff isn't what I'm suppose to monitor but I decided to check it today. I flushed my step kids with half strength (maybe a bit lower .7 ec and ph 5.7).
Then I checked the initial runoff and the ec was way high around the top of the truncheon and ph was around 6.4
So I kept flushing and when I decided to stop about 400% flush I got a ph of around 7 and ec is at 1.1

Is there something that can be learned from this?

Also here is the best pic of a leaf I can get. They look green and in 1-2 days most leaves look like this.

 

[Wonderon]

This could be the last straw. I busted my ass yesterday flushing them with 1/2 strength nutes about 400% worth and them 200% full strength 6/9. They actually have perked up. But I was just about to water them this morning and I notice just the surface is dry in one spot so a pushed some coco back and saw this:

This is after I poked at it to see if it was hard.


Is that mold? Also it has a funny smell almost sweet. I thought it was the plant at first but then I realized...

Edit: After a quick search is this the beneficial fungi that comes in coco? trichoderma

 

[TribalSeeds]

Ive used trichoderma and have never noticed any white growth. A lot of people try and tell me its normal to have mycelium growing in and on it... I have never had it though... You might wanna wait for someone else to answer this one

 

[FlowerFarmer]

In previous discussion with the makers of Atami coco I was told that the white 'skim' sometimes found on coco is penicillium.


Didnt look like what you have pictured though..

 

[Wonderon]

Did I just discover some new coco bound organism LOL. I had this happen twice so its gotta be in the coco. First time was in my basement with limited air flow, but this time its new coco and in my garage which gets fresh air continually. I take it nobody else has this??? Seems my luck with coco is terrible.

I bought some physan 20, once it gets here I will remove what I can and apply it to the coco however it says to do so. Hopefully that fixes it.

 

[johnnyrotten]

Wondering,

I'm a new grower, so take this with a grain of salt...

Have you thought about using a coco hempy bucket? I have plants in smart pots with 100% coco, a couple in smart pots with a 70/30 coco perlite mixture and three in hempy buckets with two inches in the bottom of the bucket and the rest coco... The hempy buckets have been much easier to use for me... You don't have to wait very long to get runoff either compared to 100% coco...

 

[señorsloth]

looking at those guys id say they are not burning but lacking in all nutrients...i use maxibloom so im not an expert on flora nova and lucas but isn't the standard dosage 6/9ml? my moms had a similar look to them when i did something similar to what you did...if we are in theory both following the lucas formula, you are using like the equivalent to 1-2 grams of my maxibloom powder when a full dose is 7 grams...

now from what i have seen most strains are happy at the full dose, but the lowest ive ever given a plant long term was half dose...you are giving like 1/6th dose...so it's like basically plain water already...my maxibloom powder got wet last month and when it dried i broke it up, but ended up with much fluffier powder, i didnt bother to weigh the scoop to see if it was different, and after a few weeks my mother plants started to look like yours, when i finally weighed the scoop i found i was using less than 1/3 of normal strength and my plants were showing a bit of everything, mag deficiency like yours obviously have, also a slight nitrogen def with the yellowed leaves, and purple stems, and necrotic tissue at the tips of the serrations on the leaves from pk def...

even if your plants could handle a dosage of primary nutrients that low but i don't think they can handle having that little magnesium...

i don't know i could be wrong but id say just stop flushing them so much and give them the standard normal dose at 6/9...what you are doing now is definitely killing them so what could it hurt to try something drastically different? they wont end up any more dead than they will at only 1/1.5 grams of nova...i grow c99 now and have grown ssak47, both handled full strength lucas formula with my maxibloom wich is in theory exactly the same as 2 part lucas using nova nutes...i honestly am not sure i can think of a strain that could survive on 1/6th strength lucas, no offense...your best off just giving them the normal dosage per lucasformula.com, id bet my next harvest they start growing healthy again in a week...and stop flushing!

 

[Wonderon]

The plants have been up and down since starting them. At the moment they are looking to be improving. I dont think its the roots because they are lower then the whiteish layer and appear to be healthy from what I can tell. It's some kind of mold or fungi. If its not normal then I'm gonna treat it as a threat. Going to try the physan.

 

[señorsloth]

pulled this from the lucas formula website

Lucas Formula when growing in Coco Coir - Head's Formula

If you're growing in coco, you may need to adjust the Lucas formula slightly to compensate for a property of coco which may result in a calcium or magnesium deficiency. How? You may be able to get by simply by adding 1-2ml of calmag (or MagiCal+), or 1 gram of Epsom salt (any pharmacy carries this), per gallon of water, before feeding the plants.

There is a modified formula specifically for Coco that consists of using a different ratio: 6ml of Flora Micro, and 9ml of Flora Bloom, per gallon of water, along with 1 gram of Epsom salt per water.

Either works, but be sure to try Head's Formula if you're having deficiencies or other nute/pH problems.

also i think you may be over worrying about the mold...if it is mold i think they are screwed...dampoff or whatever it's called is deadly, they don't recover once they get root rot...but you very well may not have it at all, you are probably just making the mistake of worrying too much about things that ultimately don't matter...i know how it is, i get it every time i start new genetics, once i get them mother plant size i am not worried about killing them, but as sprouts...you can lose so much money in a day by letting them dry out and die or like me, let a cat in the room who bit the heads off 30 lifesaver seedlings i was supposed to test outdoors for BOG back on overgrow...lol

if they are having any mold issues it's likely from all of the flushing, there is a reason it is supposed to dry out in between watering, and that is it...personally i wouldn't worry about it, if it is root rot its too late, if it's not it will be fine most likely as long as you stop flushing them...and honestly i fail to see how re-potting them will help at all, but since you did, you should definitely start using full strength lucas, or they will likely get worse...

 

[Wonderon]

My friend, I flushed them with 1/2 strength solution yesterday at about 400% then I flushed full strength solution 6/9 through them at about 200% they look better for sure, not 100% but that will take time for them to grow new leafs. The issue at hand now is the white crap under the surface of the coco. I don't know what it is or if it is causing issues or is benificial in any way.

 

[señorsloth]

lol ok sorry i guess i was beating a dead horse then, i made it through as many pages as i could, before i skipped to the end...

i can't see anything white in those pics besides the perlite chunks...when i see white stuff in my soil it's usually calcium and stuff from hard water depositing on soil, much the same way it deposits on your glassware in the washing machine...

i don't suppose you could describe what it looks like a little? were you talking about the yellow sand looking stuff? i don't think you can see beneficial bacteria...