One brave little girls attempt to put an end to bullying

[ClosetAdvocate]

Klonopin is okay for me, but not everyone.

Holy crap. I took a Klonopin pill once recreationally (only pill I've ever taken recreationally). Absolutely no recreational value. I pretty much blacked out for several hours. I don't remember a single thing that happened during that time. Scared the shit out of me, it was like taking a date rape drug except I'm pretty sure I was awake.

 

[Smoking Gun]

Well to the first question which addresses the idea of how to avoid being sued by parents is simple, you make it clear up front how discipline is handled and if they don't like it they can go somewhere else. I'll tell you what though, say you were running a school and the school also had the reputation of kids going on to harvard and being successful you'd see parents willing to overlook the discipline in droves.

As for the question of why help defend others from bullies in a "Me" oriented world? Well simple, if you're a good person it'll make you feel good.

I wasn't really asking questions, I was giving an opinion on how I see what is going on. I know exactly why to help those being bullied, I was stating why others choose to do nothing about it. They have grown up in a ME first world, with ME first parents, and ME first friends. I am not saying it is right or a permanent situation, but it is how things are now.

As for the schools or camps applying discipline, I think you have over simplified the situation. For one discipline does not equate to success. Yes, if discipline and success are seen in the same place discipline takes the back seat for the cause of success; but this becomes yet another ME first action. The situation becomes "I can overlook the strict discipline because I (or MY kid) can be successful in the future". It is done for selfish reasons not for the right reasons. There is also the other side to that argument, if the school or camp has a policy of strict discipline then some parents will simply move past it because their kid doesn't "need" that type of discipline. If enough people pass on your school or camp, it doesn't matter if your campers or students are the most successful, there won't be enough money or students to keep the program afloat.

The problem really starts at home. Parents are afraid to, or simply too damn irresponsible to discipline their kid. I can't even count how many times I have heard parents with hyperactive and destructive kids say they just can't control their kid. Well they can't control the kid because they never disciplined their child. Then they want to dump the same kid on a counselor or teacher and have the teacher deal with the problem child; and when the teacher or counselor does impose some discipline the kid goes home crying and the parents then get back up the asses of the school or camp. If these parents simply had some accountability we would not see these situations.

I got spanked plenty as a kid. I even had a bar of Dove soap shoved into my mouth (my dad held me down and my mom shoved the bar in) after telling my mom to shut up as a 6 year old. I remember this event vividly to this day, and I think I have only told my mom to shut up one other time when I was 16 and I ended up walking out of my house and not returning til very late that night with my mom and dad waiting up for me to make sure I was ok. But I learned my lessons and always showed respect for my teachers, counselors and elders. This is what seems to be missing these days, simple respect.

 

[HempKat]

I wasn't really asking questions, I was giving an opinion on how I see what is going on. I know exactly why to help those being bullied, I was stating why others choose to do nothing about it. They have grown up in a ME first world, with ME first parents, and ME first friends. I am not saying it is right or a permanent situation, but it is how things are now.

Sorry but it's hard to tell for sure sometimes if a question is waiting for an answer or is just rhetorical. Since you didn't make that clear I figured I'd go with "the question begs an answer". As for the me thing it still applies to what I was saying. They could do it because it makes them feel good. "Like, look at me, see how good I am for stopping this bully from picking on this kid." That would be the wrong motivation, one should do it just because it's the right thing to do.

As for the schools or camps applying discipline, I think you have over simplified the situation. For one discipline does not equate to success. Yes, if discipline and success are seen in the same place discipline takes the back seat for the cause of success; but this becomes yet another ME first action. The situation becomes "I can overlook the strict discipline because I (or MY kid) can be successful in the future". It is done for selfish reasons not for the right reasons. There is also the other side to that argument, if the school or camp has a policy of strict discipline then some parents will simply move past it because their kid doesn't "need" that type of discipline. If enough people pass on your school or camp, it doesn't matter if your campers or students are the most successful, there won't be enough money or students to keep the program afloat.

Well with the shit I've seen parents do with little to no regard for their kid's desires all because they believe it'll make the kids lives better down the road. I doubt there would be all that many passing on an easy path to harvard in favor of avoiding strict discipline. Also I wasn't implying the success at harvard would be because of the discipline. I was simply making the point that people will overlook things they don't like or don't agree with, if they feel the end result makes it worth it.

The problem really starts at home. Parents are afraid to, or simply too damn irresponsible to discipline their kid. I can't even count how many times I have heard parents with hyperactive and destructive kids say they just can't control their kid. Well they can't control the kid because they never disciplined their child. Then they want to dump the same kid on a counselor or teacher and have the teacher deal with the problem child; and when the teacher or counselor does impose some discipline the kid goes home crying and the parents then get back up the asses of the school or camp. If these parents simply had some accountability we would not see these situations.

I got spanked plenty as a kid. I even had a bar of Dove soap shoved into my mouth (my dad held me down and my mom shoved the bar in) after telling my mom to shut up as a 6 year old. I remember this event vividly to this day, and I think I have only told my mom to shut up one other time when I was 16 and I ended up walking out of my house and not returning til very late that night with my mom and dad waiting up for me to make sure I was ok. But I learned my lessons and always showed respect for my teachers, counselors and elders. This is what seems to be missing these days, simple respect.

The last part I agree fully with discipline should start at home and if done right it should never be needed elsewhere. Too many parents these days though want to be their kid's friend rather then thier parent. They never understood the lesson thier parents tried to pass onto them when they were kids and the parents said "This is going to hurt me more then it does you" prior to a spanking. Like a kid they likely felt their parents were mean and they carried that childhood view to adulthood vowing to never spank or use any sort of physical punishment on thier kids. I have a number of friends like this and all of them have rotten disrespectful kids that walk all over them and that approach the rest of the world with the mindset of "how can I get over on..."

 

[MrCopyZ]

Ok, this is easy to say, but so far from reality. It is often the people we are closest to we keep secrets from. Now given that this girl does seem to have a history of mental issues, that should have been a good enough reason for her parents to give a bit of extra attention. But I cannot blame anyone but this girl for the fact she took her own life. Even if people have serious mental issues or are severely depressed they often will put on a happy face and get through their days seemingly fine, at least while in public. It is when these type of people get some place private and alone that the issues really come to a head. Think of how often you hear people saying they had no idea that the person who committed suicide was having problems; well that is the way the suicidal person wanted it. They tried to hide their problems from everyone, and this can often be exactly why they commit suicide, they try to deal with their issues alone when what they really need is someone to simply listen to them and offer some empathy. So while it is easy to say that those around here should have known, it is just a naive to believe it is as simple as that.

She was in therapy, had a long medical history of psychosis and suicide attempts. She was only 19.

Hell she had a BLOG ON THE INTERNET about her suicidal life since she was 17! And her first suicide attempt was in 2008. When she was 14-15.

She might not of had the nerve to tell them to her face but she blabbed it across the internet. That is a "cry for help".

 

[HempKat]

She was in therapy, had a long medical history of psychosis and suicide attempts. She was only 19.

Hell she had a BLOG ON THE INTERNET about her suicidal life since she was 17! And her first suicide attempt was in 2008. When she was 14-15.

She might not of had the nerve to tell them to her face but she blabbed it across the internet. That is a "cry for help".

That's what I don't get. She can tell complete strangers how miserable she is but she puts on a fake smile for friends and family and says she's fine? Friends and family should be the first and most reliable people to go to for something like this. Makes me wonder how they came across to her? Sounds like they instilled a fear of ever disappointing them.

 

[ijim]

When I was young. Before the media told everybody they had to be like everybody else. And before political correctness. A pipe upside the first bully's head would have solved the problem. I feel sorry for this girl and her family. But she is a victim of modern media as she is from those kids.

 

[Smoking Gun]

She was in therapy, had a long medical history of psychosis and suicide attempts. She was only 19.

Hell she had a BLOG ON THE INTERNET about her suicidal life since she was 17! And her first suicide attempt was in 2008. When she was 14-15.

She might not of had the nerve to tell them to her face but she blabbed it across the internet. That is a "cry for help".

That's what I don't get. She can tell complete strangers how miserable she is but she puts on a fake smile for friends and family and says she's fine? Friends and family should be the first and most reliable people to go to for something like this. Makes me wonder how they came across to her? Sounds like they instilled a fear of ever disappointing them.

It is not easy to approach your friends and family with that magnitude of problem. It is however very easy to anonymously post things on the internet, everyone on here should know this. Think of all the large grows on here that we see yet the friends of the grower probably will never know about. So while to us she was putting out "obvious" cries for help, it is quite likely this was not nearly as obvious to her friends and family. She also might not have shared any of this with her parents as she might have felt they were one reason she wanted to commit suicide.

Then there is the thought that suicide will "teach them all a lesson". This is a very real mentality held by some people. In many ways it is the martyr mentality, 'if I kill myself all those other people will see how wrong they are'. But these are also not the type of ideas one would tend to share with their friends and family.

And we get to look at this all in hindsight, which is always 20/20.

Now with that said, if I were her parents I would have certainly tried to pay more attention to her after the first trip to the hospital. But if she were still hiding things from me, I would never know until it was too late. We get to sit here and discuss her specific case as though we know all about what was going on in her head, what her relationship with friends and family was like, and generally what her life was like; but we don't. I was not ever trying to make my arguments about this girl specifically but an overall statement about bullies and their "victims"

I got some very good advice toward the end my time in college. I was told "don't be the victim". The simple meaning is that we are only victimized when we allow ourselves to be victimized. There are solutions to every problem, we may just have to work extra hard to find the solutions to some problems.

 

[MrCopyZ]

I was trying to point out that her parents had to know. How does a 15 year old play off multiple suicide trips to the hospital so the parents don't even know? I am not from Australia but they would have found out who her parents were in this country and notified them. I just can't believe they didn't know their daughter was trying to kill herself a couple times a year for almost half a decade.

Its not like she was 35 or something and lived in a different state.

I have talked to people experiencing hallucinations that didn't understand they weren't real. This person was scared beyond belief of people that she knew no one else could see. It is sad, but I don't think that bullying is what caused the suicide.

 

[Storm Shadow]

Bad Parents... Enviroment is what dictates is all ... Most parents are idiots and have no idea how to raise kids....install confidence and support into your child and you will not see these issues pop up... Hey if I grow OG kush in a fucked up room...you every see how shitty she looks? You'd never know that she can shine like no other ...when the enviroment is right

 

[headband 707]

Wow talk about hypocrisy... you post in a thread about the horrors of bullying and then you belittle someone's deeply held beliefs. If you don't believe fine that's your problem, but don't call (at the very least) my opinion a bunch of bullshit.

Like I said call it what you want, psychosis; mental illness; demonic activity... but her suicide had more to do with that than the bullying.

I wasn't asking for you to agree with me. One of society's biggest ills is to completely ignore the spiritual nature of human beings. Society and medicine in general want to equate everything to a physical ailment. Why? Because physical is easy to deal with and can largely be fixed by us... It also doesn't require us acknowledging a God to be accountable to.

Enough said.

LOL yeah okay..I see we are going to see eye to eye so enough said headband 707

 

[headband 707]

I was trying to point out that her parents had to know. How does a 15 year old play off multiple suicide trips to the hospital so the parents don't even know? I am not from Australia but they would have found out who her parents were in this country and notified them. I just can't believe they didn't know their daughter was trying to kill herself a couple times a year for almost half a decade.

Its not like she was 35 or something and lived in a different state.

I have talked to people experiencing hallucinations that didn't understand they weren't real. This person was scared beyond belief of people that she knew no one else could see. It is sad, but I don't think that bullying is what caused the suicide.

No if you look closely you will see that for a young girl see looks sick. Might be the lighting but I did think she had an eating disorder which might have been giving her the hallucinations.(Self esteem) Headband 707

 

[TLoft13]

It's not uncommon for the bully to be bigger and tougher etc than the person they're bullying ... violence is not a solution, especially with kids, and will often simply exacerbate the situation.

Peacenik bullshit like this is part of the problem.
Violence is an essential part of any human, denying that only leads to bigger problems.

 

[Hash Zeppelin]

girls dont have it as easy as guys, plus the internet makes it much worse. I got bullied a few times cause I'm a runt, but I hit those people in the head with something heavy and it stopped real quick. How could I have done that online though?

 

[HempKat]

It is not easy to approach your friends and family with that magnitude of problem. It is however very easy to anonymously post things on the internet, everyone on here should know this. Think of all the large grows on here that we see yet the friends of the grower probably will never know about. So while to us she was putting out "obvious" cries for help, it is quite likely this was not nearly as obvious to her friends and family. She also might not have shared any of this with her parents as she might have felt they were one reason she wanted to commit suicide.

Then there is the thought that suicide will "teach them all a lesson". This is a very real mentality held by some people. In many ways it is the martyr mentality, 'if I kill myself all those other people will see how wrong they are'. But these are also not the type of ideas one would tend to share with their friends and family.

And we get to look at this all in hindsight, which is always 20/20.

Now with that said, if I were her parents I would have certainly tried to pay more attention to her after the first trip to the hospital. But if she were still hiding things from me, I would never know until it was too late. We get to sit here and discuss her specific case as though we know all about what was going on in her head, what her relationship with friends and family was like, and generally what her life was like; but we don't. I was not ever trying to make my arguments about this girl specifically but an overall statement about bullies and their "victims"

I got some very good advice toward the end my time in college. I was told "don't be the victim". The simple meaning is that we are only victimized when we allow ourselves to be victimized. There are solutions to every problem, we may just have to work extra hard to find the solutions to some problems.

Yeah you're right, none of us really knows what was going on in this girl's head so anything we come up with here is pure conjecture. My comment wasn't so much about her specifically though but just people in general who hide things from the ones who care most about them. In a healthy family a child should want to willingly come to it's parents with problems and walk away comforted and when needed given good advice and/or help with the problem. People have thoughtless ways of reacting sometimes though, usually when they're pre-occupied and someone coming to them for help or advice or comfort might be... not so welcome at that moment. They don't necessarily mean to be thoughtless, they just react to the moment. Sometimes it's not even what they say but thier tone or their body language that expresses the thoughtless gesture or comment, an exagerated sigh, groan, etc. Enough of this kind of reaction over time can then perhaps lead someone to try not to be a nuisance, to not ever bring problems. I mean the fact that she did go to the hospital and was recieving treatment and the parents were checking on her enough for her to put on a fake smile and say she's fine, all suggest the parents were trying to do whatever they could. That's why I said they must have somehow made her fear disappointing them.

It reminds me of an old story that goes something like this. A man got caught in a flood while at home such that he ended up on his roof. The rains causing the flood were continuing and the waters were rising. If something didn't happen soon he would be swept away and killed. So being a faithful religious man he prayed to God to save him. Soon after that a neighbor with a boat pulls up and asks the man if he wants to get in the boat and go to higher ground. To which the other man says, no thanks, you go on, I prayed to God, he'll save me. So the neighbor reluctantly goes on. Some time goes by and the waters have risen to where the man had to move higher up the roof. He prays once again and again not long after he finishes another person from his neighborhood passing by in a boat offers him a ride. Again the man waves the person on saying God will save him and again the person reluctantly goes on. Not long after that the waters have now risen such that the man is sitting on top of the chimney which is a bit higher then the roof and his whole roof is covered by water. He prays a third time for God to save him and a third time, shortly after he finishes the prayer a neighbor with a boat shows up and again he refuses the ride. After the third person has gone one the waters continue to rise and the man has no where to go and is swept away and eventually drowns. When he ends up in Heaven and first meets God he asks God, I prayed to you to save me three times and yet you just let me down, why would you do that? To which God replied, I sent you help in the form of a neighbor with a boat three times to save you but you refused each time, why would you do that?

Also the grower thing isn't a fair analogy, because we share anonymously due to the way laws are. In this girl's case I doubt laws had anything to do with it.