The growing large plants, outdoors, thread...

[TheSilverMullet]

On another note... Mullet, that foliar recipe is looking pretty concentrated. Have you tried it at other dilution rates?

Yeah, I started with less of each ingredient and slowly upped the concentration. I've hit freshly potted clones with it and they seem all the better for it. That said, I'm a big fan of starting at half strength or less of any recipe or feeding program and getting a feel for things before dosing anything too heavily.

Perhaps less is more with foliar? I've only been really delving into the foliar feeding program the last few years so as I said I'm open to suggestions.

 

[Veg N Out]

Hey Veg, in my neck of the woods quite a few of the landscape companies have plugged into the medicinal marijuana growing "craze" and developed their own special MJ soil mixes. Prop 215 is our state medical marijuana guidelines so most folks just call a MJ designed soil mix a "215' mix. I understand this except all these mixes were blended based on what people think growers want to buy instead of using field trial and lab analysis to build a soil that actually grow the plant...I checked out every bulk soil place in the North State..All the way down to Santa Rosa area when deciding where I was going to spend my money...Most landscape yards/nurseries dont have a clue the soil requirements for MJ but it doesnt stop them from tryin to cut their slice from the big green hog. LOL The Worm Farm, a small company who started out years back raising & selling worms, have been sellin one of the best mixes around. 'Bout $90.00 a yard. Bastards! LOL Their "215" mix is pretty much the standard in MJ grow soil and good shit but the price per yard is hiway robbery, IMO.
This place puts out garbage...Earthworm Soil Factory is the place to go!

Their description- An ideal soil mix for rapid root developement and growth. This highly aeriated mix contains worm castings from The Worm Farm, coconut coir, compost, perlite, calphos powder, azomite rock powder, glacial rock dust, and green sand. CC

I would shy away from any mix with coir fiber. Bless.

 

[CanniDo Cowboy]

Hey Veg...Some say tomatoe some say tamah-to...LOL I should back up a bit and mention my IC Disclaimer: I dont recommend one business, one product ie; soil, soil amendments, nutrients, pest/disease control products etc over another of the same. Everyone has their preferences based on personal experience, preference and the always neutral "IMO". LOL That said, last year I did go with 3 yard bag totes of Sunshine #4 from a hydroponic store here locally and had no problems. No fancy mix, no wonder additives, no green sand or the coveted but illusive glacial rock dust. Glacial rock dust? It was just a Pro-Mix like standard issue growing soil. Of course, being imported from Canada, a 3 yard tote runs about $270.00 which figures to around $70.00 per yard.

The soil thing can drive a fella crazy if he over thinks it. Just like the soil amendment game, the nutrient game, the pest and disease prevention game etc. This time of year, it seems like everywhere I go, someone has their hand out wanting money for something they carry that will "help" me grow the best product on the planet..."IMO", most of them are just "capitalistic parasites" (there, I said it) and sometimes it makes me just want to beat the shit out of a few of them...Just sayin...CC

 

[Yes4Prop215]

im still debating what soil to go with....i really prefer to use something that already has all the amendments in it, so that i only need to top dress later in flower. really not trying to mix up 10k worth of soil...rather just pot it up and let it go.

everyones mostly on fox farms but their latest batch quality has been questionable...inconsistent and hot as hell burned all my indoor plants.

leaning towards roots organics...would love to hear suggestions before i buy soil later this week..

 

[Veg N Out]

Go to the Earthworm Soil Factory and have em drop off the Nor Cal growers blend. It's 200 a yard(1 yard is 200 gallons), you wont need any fertilizer the whole year just hit them with biology... I had their different products checked out by an independent laboratory and the results came in very close to perfect on the NC Growers Blend...

 

[Yes4Prop215]

il check them out isnt 200 a bit pricy? my property is just aligned in a way thats its extremely hard to have soil dumped by the yard...i gotta get it by the pallet and bring them down to the hill 20 bags at a time on the ATV...pretty steep narrow incline.

kind of a pain in the ass lol....so yea i gotta go with a bagged blend by the pallet..

 

[MummyCat]

im still debating what soil to go with....i really prefer to use something that already has all the amendments in it, so that i only need to top dress later in flower. really not trying to mix up 10k worth of soil...rather just pot it up and let it go.

everyones mostly on fox farms but their latest batch quality has been questionable...inconsistent and hot as hell burned all my indoor plants.

leaning towards roots organics...would love to hear suggestions before i buy soil later this week..

I tried roots last year and it seemed like just peatmoss and pearlite, like sunshine mix4. I went back to fox farm this year and I haven't had any problems. Vital Earth is my favorite soil though and I think that if it was easy to get I would use it instead

 

[Yes4Prop215]

last year my plants in FF definately outperformed the Roots organics....but im just wondering about FF quality now because i heard they switched owners and lots of people have been complaining about hot patches and such....

but i can get a pallet for around 580-600 bucks, enough to fill 4 smartpots so around 150 a yard or so i think..

 

[MummyCat]

....seems like the same stuff to me... so far

I'v had plants in it since Feb.

 

[Veg N Out]

Is it pricey to spend 200 dollars to grow 1 plant that will grow you 4 lbs of bud? You tell me...I think it's a good deal.

 

[hydro-phonics]

smokin deal plus its fun

 

[YosemiteSam]

Go to the Earthworm Soil Factory and have em drop off the Nor Cal growers blend. It's 200 a yard(1 yard is 200 gallons), you wont need any fertilizer the whole year just hit them with biology... I had their different products checked out by an independent laboratory and the results came in very close to perfect on the NC Growers Blend...

Can I ask what "perfect" is? Not a formula but just a general description. I am sure we don't have the same water or access to the exact same amendments...just curious in general what you guys are looking for.

 

[Yes4Prop215]

i would love to use luxury gardens soil but i dont think they sell it in bags yet? i cant buy soil by the yard the dump truck will flip over or get stuck on my property and need to be towed out..

im pretty much forced to buy pallets....i might do roots organics but mix 50lbs of ewc and some other things into it...i just hate mixing soil who doesnt..

 

[Cartel530]

have them dump it at accesible spot and run a bobcat. One of my spots you have to cross like a swamp or a marsh which is easy on foot or atv but a loaded dump truck no way, already had to go thru that one two years ago. needless to say that was one bad ass tow truck haha. the bobcat will go over it and down the ravine. otherwise id probably say roots too. kinda sucks when a company makes tons of money and there quality goes down, you would figure it would go up

 

[CanniDo Cowboy]

Is it pricey to spend 200 dollars to grow 1 plant that will grow you 4 lbs of bud? You tell me...I think it's a good deal.

Gee Veg...And there in lies our inflationary med products problem, issue or just plain rediculous over-pricing. Most growers wont come close to 4lbs per plant but retailers sure think they do based on their med product pricing and not just soil. And lets get real here, a 4lbs yield off one plant isnt guaranteed simply by buying $200.00 a yard soil. Craigslist is littered with near new products bein sold by folks who thought large $$ investments automatically guaranteed large yields. If a fella cant get it done with 100.00 or less per yard soil, I doubt whether $200.00 per yard soil is going to transform him into a grow guru...My thinkin...

Ya know, while I'm thinkin about it, why is it that the med grow game is the only industry where product pricing seems to be based on the value of the plant or crop and not what it took to actually create the product...A direct result of grower mentality? Maybe...CC

 

[CanniDo Cowboy]

last year my plants in FF definately outperformed the Roots organics....but im just wondering about FF quality now because i heard they switched owners and lots of people have been complaining about hot patches and such....

but i can get a pallet for around 580-600 bucks, enough to fill 4 smartpots so around 150 a yard or so i think..

Hey yes...bagged FF, IMO, is middle of the road potting soil these days. Nothing special like it used to be years back. Ocean Blend or Happy Frog. Ya know, Earth Juice, whos headquarters are in Chico, makes a bagged soil now. I used it several years ago indoors and was pleased but cant justify the price per bag for the outdoor volume.

Personally I think bagged soil is just too expensive, even when purchased by the pallet when doin big outdoors. A fella can go thru a pallet of bagged soil pretty quick and not fill too many holes/pots. LOL A few places sell the 3 yard tote bag for around $260.00 and up here, they will deliver the bags, you return em empty. A little better break than pallet price. CC

 

[Veg N Out]

Gee Veg...And there in lies our inflationary med products problem, issue or just plain rediculous over-pricing. Have you looked at the input cost of what goes in to developing the Nor Cal Grower's Blend @ the Worm Soil Factory? The infrastructure there has to be in the millions of dollars in equipment, the equipment needs people to run it, this is the only soil place that actually does research and has their soil tested and adjusts their mix based on the test results of their compost as well as the blended mix..Then there's the input costs...They are redirecting tons of greenwaste, making castings, purchasing perlite, blending it, they make compost tea and spray the mix with it while blending it, purchasing peat moss, the labor to do all the blending of the mix itself...Yes $200 a yard...or 1 dollar a gallon..Is that a lot? It'd be about $15.00 a bag...How much is 1 bag of Fox Farm Ocean Forest nowadays? $13 retail? Most growers wont come close to 4lbs per plant Why not? 4lbs per plant is a very easy thing to do if you have 1 yard of soil and even 9 hours of direct light if you've got an average strain...not even talking on blue dream here. but retailers sure think they do based on their med product pricing and not just soil. There we go again...Why the need for "med products" you wont find any at my farm...And lets get real here, a 4lbs yield off one plant isnt guaranteed simply by buying $200.00 a yard soil. No it isn't but if you use the Nor Cal Grower's Blend and use enough water get good light and plant a decently healthy clone in to that 1 yard, you'd have to really try hard to not yield those kinds of #s...The soil report doesn't lie. Craigslist is littered with near new products bein sold by folks who thought large $$ investments automatically guaranteed large yields. Large $$ investments guarantee the POTENTIAL for large yields.. If a fella cant get it done with 100.00 or less per yard soil, I doubt whether $200.00 per yard soil is going to transform him into a grow guru...My thinkin...I think that I could give some one who has no idea about growing a 1 yard mound of Grower's Blend, a Green Crack clone, full sun, and a 33' piece of inline drip tube hooked up to gravity spring water and they could yield 5 lbs...Do I think they would be a grow guru that know's why it happened..No..but they don't need to be..That's part of why the soil cost $200 a yard..All the guess work was done for you and it was done correctly. It wasn't made by some one who thought it up as they went along and amended according to their feelings , or by a company that doesn't even start with the same base material they did that gave them their good name OR honor long standing bulk order accounts.......

Ya know, while I'm thinkin about it, why is it that the med grow game is the only industry where product pricing seems to be based on the value of the plant or crop Have you looked @ the cost of commercial fertilizers, fungicides, etc.,? They are EXTREMELY expensive, the application rates are EXTREMELY low and as a result the price per application is low. That is what I am talking about in my post which you completely took the wrong way. All you would need to do is spend $200 to do 1 200 gallon smart pot or mound, no more money spent on that plant all year..To me that is a good price to spend to grow at least 4 lb of bud...If the plant is in from June to Oct that's $50 a month...and not what it took to actually create the product..This statement shows me you have no idea what it takes to actually make a quality soil mix on a large scale keep it consistent and produce it on that scale over a long period of time. I agree 99% of the shit that is out there shouldn't cost as much as it does, but attacking the ONE outfit and product that does do it right really just sucks on your part in my opinion...Please take a ride out to the EarthWorm Soil Factory and just check it out...Bless.A direct result of grower mentality? Maybe...CC

 

[Veg N Out]

Yes4Prop215 - Your ATV doesn't have a tow hitch that you can hook a little trailer up to and haul a yard or two down at a time? You'd need a 3'x3'x3' or 3'x6'x3 box ...Seems like it wouldn't be that big of a deal at all...

 

[YosemiteSam]

I only wish we had that option in CO. Do you know how many yrs of tinkering around it would take to dial something like that? And you could do it the first time you grow...hell yea.

 

[guest8905]

vital earth pallets look nice....