heath inspired test prototype (aero)

[farmhouse cat]

You're right, it does slow the plants down... See, this is one of those things that I have been talking about with the pros "sweeping things under the rug"... B/c how they veg makes a difference, and that's seldom brought to attention.

Roots are what we're cultivating, you know this... So you want the biggest root-mass possible going into flower, while not having the plants choking each other out. Even when you're not seeing anything grow up top, the roots are growing. If you start whacking the plant in veg, it goes through hormonal changes to adapt... and then when you whack it some more in flower, it'll adapt faster... After you do it a few times and see the results, you'll have no trouble keeping it up. It makes harvest a lot easier when you don't have bullshit popcorn buds to clean up or simply send to the hash pile...

That brings up something that ive been thinking alot about.

My system is aeroponics, but its not true aeroponics (TAG). When i first started building this system my intention was to go (TAG) but it really wasnt feasible with such a high number of plants and misters it would require, and the high pressures needed to power the misters to get the droplet size needed for a true TAG grow.

Not that my low pressure system cant produce amazing results, its more like a hybrid aero/nft. The roots get sprayed and the water drains, but the droplet size is not ideal like in true aeroponics where you are getting like 50 micron droplets. (Have you ever seen roots in TAG?) POM POMS!

So this brings me to my next possible scenario.

Why not turn my veg units into (TAG). and grow those pom pom roots while in veg? Then take them to flower with those huge root masses. Its much easier to build veg units horizontal with TAG. Actually super easy.

Sound interesting doesnt it?

heres a pic of my roots now and a pic of what tag roots look like.

 

[bobblehead]

wow... My only thought with that is your veg is already super healthy... So is going TAG going to increase the chance of failure? I know you said it was easy, so I assume you know what you're getting yourself into... Cause I'd hate to see you change a good thing, but those TAG roots are sick. I bet you'd be taking fresh clones like every other day just to keep the plants a reasonable height. Will your organic nutes go through the smaller mister?

 

[farmhouse cat]

wow... My only thought with that is your veg is already super healthy... So is going TAG going to increase the chance of failure? I know you said it was easy, so I assume you know what you're getting yourself into... Cause I'd hate to see you change a good thing, but those TAG roots are sick. I bet you'd be taking fresh clones like every other day just to keep the plants a reasonable height. Will your organic nutes go through the smaller mister?

Its actually not much different then what im doing now with the aero vegger other then a different pump and misters instead of your typical eco pump and red ez clone sprayers. A 200 micron mesh filter in line for nutes will keep it free of clogs.

My question is what affect will the roots have (and the plants themself) going from a High pressure mist 50 micron droplet size environment in veg to my low pressure spray flower system.

 

[DHF]

I tell yas what.....My boy Bobbles is on this shit like a duck on a june bug....Yas make an old man proud the way yas explain shit that as yas say I guess get`s swept under the rug ?.......and yeah FHC.....

I`ve ALWAYS` given full disclosure on how I ran my shit , from takin fully rooted cuts and pre-veggin em under T-5`s for couple 3 weeks depending on the rotations , and trimmed , pruned , and shaped my bitches before they ever got put into the bloom rooms ta blast off when they hit the HID lights......

Single cola plants are "shaped and made" by rapin and pillagin them bitches into mini X-mas trees so they`ll stay like that till end of cycle....

All laterals are/were cut back and every sucker branch growin off the main laterals to be kept for production are done away with as well....granted....

There are strains/varieties that are single cola dominant plants , but creatin EVERY monocropped plant that goes into the bloom rooms makes for identical growth and perfect canopy once stretch is over ftw....

Not sure what results you`d get from takin plants from TAG and goin to a low pressure setup where they don`t get as much mist as they`re used to and could possibly kill roots , but....

We`ll never know till you run that shit and find out , cuz if it worked and yas had that much of a kickstart from all those extra roots when yas headed into stretch and doubled that amount ?......

There`d be some serious swellage from all the availability of juice at the plant`s beckon call cuz as Bobbles stressed.......

You`re only as good as your rootmass yas`re buildin for bottomline yields.....Never a truer word spoken....

If all growers would grow their roots , shape and prune the plants before the flip till end of stretch instead of lookin at all the purdy leaves and preflowers , yields would increase exponentially guaranteed.....

Good luck...DHF........

 

[farmhouse cat]

I tell yas what.....My boy Bobbles is on this shit like a duck on a june bug....Yas make an old man proud the way yas explain shit that as yas say I guess get`s swept under the rug ?.......and yeah FHC.....

I`ve ALWAYS` given full disclosure on how I ran my shit , from takin fully rooted cuts and pre-veggin em under T-5`s for couple 3 weeks depending on the rotations , and trimmed , pruned , and shaped my bitches before they ever got put into the bloom rooms ta blast off when they hit the HID lights......

Single cola plants are "shaped and made" by rapin and pillagin them bitches into mini X-mas trees so they`ll stay like that till end of cycle....

All laterals are/were cut back and every sucker branch growin off the main laterals to be kept for production are done away with as well....granted....

There are strains/varieties that are single cola dominant plants , but creatin EVERY monocropped plant that goes into the bloom rooms makes for identical growth and perfect canopy once stretch is over ftw....

Not sure what results you`d get from takin plants from TAG and goin to a low pressure setup where they don`t get as much mist as they`re used to and could possibly kill roots , but....

We`ll never know till you run that shit and find out , cuz if it worked and yas had that much of a kickstart from all those extra roots when yas headed into stretch and doubled that amount ?......

There`d be some serious swellage from all the availability of juice at the plant`s beckon call cuz as Bobbles stressed.......

You`re only as good as your rootmass yas`re buildin for bottomline yields.....Never a truer word spoken....

If all growers would grow their roots , shape and prune the plants before the flip till end of stretch instead of lookin at all the purdy leaves and preflowers , yields would increase exponentially guaranteed.....

Good luck...DHF........

Right on Fred!

It takes a few runs i guess to build that confidence and to see what and how these plants need to be shaped. Im on it this run like flies on poop! well as much as i can after the flip anyway.

As far as the tag goes, its an interesting idea, and one that i want to experiment with soon. I dont see how it wouldnt have positive results.
Its too bad there not alot of TAG growers out there to bounce ideas off of. I guess the only way is to try it.

 

[DHF]

I`ll tell yas why there`s very few folks doin it , cuz since I dialed krusty buckets 17 yrs ago there were just as many back then tryin ta kill it with TAG and a few did........

But mostly they killed plants left and right due to not knowin bout keepin rootzone temps below 70 degrees ta keep roots from turnin to mush....

Hell....back in the day we`d have 100`s askin us howta do hydro and we`d lay it out , they`d come back after killin em and say they were goin back ta dirt....

You can lead a horse to water and even teach his ass HOWTA drink , but yas can`t MAKE em do a damn thing if they can`t follow direction and learn from their mistakes....

I agree that TAG roots would be great for goin into your racks , but I`ve seen fine angelhair roots turn brown and die from gettin too much juice sprayed on em and too much time between feeds/sprays that dried em out/killed em....

Make us proud....Handle it.....

Peace.....Freds....

 

[farmhouse cat]

I`ll tell yas why there`s very few folks doin TAD , cuz since I dialed krusty buckets 17 yrs ago there were just as many back then tryin ta kill it with TAG and a few did........

But mostly they killed plants left and right due to not knowin bout keepin rootzone temps below 70 degrees ta keep roots from turnin to mush....

Hell....back in the day we`d have 100`s askin us howta do hydro and we`d lay it out , they`d come back after killin em and say they were goin back ta dirt....

You can lead a horse to water and even teach his ass HOWTA drink , but yas can`t MAKE em do a damn thing if they can`t follow direction and learn from their mistakes....

I agree that TAG roots would be great for goin into your racks , but I`ve seen fine angelhair roots turn brown and die from gettin too much juice sprayed on em and too much time between feeds/sprays that dried em out/killed em....

Make us proud....Handle it.....

Peace.....Freds....

Absolutely. Not much room for error in TAG thats for sure.

Thats one thing i need to address, will the TAG roots adjust to a different larger droplet spray positively?? or will they trip out and die? Ive made some inquiries. lol

 

[Grizz]

I`ll tell yas why there`s very few folks doin it , cuz since I dialed krusty buckets 17 yrs ago there were just as many back then tryin ta kill it with TAG and a few did........

But mostly they killed plants left and right due to not knowin bout keepin rootzone temps below 70 degrees ta keep roots from turnin to mush....

Hell....back in the day we`d have 100`s askin us howta do hydro and we`d lay it out , they`d come back after killin em and say they were goin back ta dirt....

You can lead a horse to water and even teach his ass HOWTA drink , but yas can`t MAKE em do a damn thing if they can`t follow direction and learn from their mistakes....

I agree that TAG roots would be great for goin into your racks , but I`ve seen fine angelhair roots turn brown and die from gettin too much juice sprayed on em and too much time between feeds/sprays that dried em out/killed em....

Make us proud....Handle it.....

Peace.....Freds....

thats why i can buy so much good grow equipment off craigslist DHF. they give up so easy.

 

[Hundred Gram Oz]

Yup get your root mass exploding, chop your girls good and of course have good genetics! Great advise, bobble and DHF!

Joesy lol I like your style!

HGO

 

[bobblehead]

I tell yas what.....My boy Bobbles is on this shit like a duck on a june bug....Yas make an old man proud the way yas explain shit that as yas say I guess get`s swept under the rug ?.......and yeah FHC.....

I`ve ALWAYS` given full disclosure on how I ran my shit , from takin fully rooted cuts and pre-veggin em under T-5`s for couple 3 weeks depending on the rotations , and trimmed , pruned , and shaped my bitches before they ever got put into the bloom rooms ta blast off when they hit the HID lights......

Yeah bro, you've never swept anything under the rug... You've always been there to help me beat the dust out of the rug if anything... But you know as well as I do that most of the "epic" threads don't focus on how the plants were vegged... Maybe it has something to do with most people growing larger plants, and the vert SOG guys trying to keep their grows as low-key as possible for fear of federal prosecution... But I can tell you that I had never read about building root mass while pruning/shaping the plants until you spelled it out to me. Shortly after, Heath gave me a bit of advice in PM that was also focused on root cultivation. Most people are just focused on the green stuff... "flower the plants when they reach x height"... Not "flower the plants when they've filled x size pot with roots, and whack it down to size so that it fits in the allotted space."

 

[Hama-Kavula]

hi bobble DHF HGO FC and all other pros and semi pros - been outta the game for quite some time and rethinking a lot since I started educating myself about verts - all ya threads and posts are a superb literature doing that - so first of all thx to yall.

And now a lil question since topic is roots atm - what do u think about pruning roots while veg to a common size/volume before planting in other pots like adviced in the bonsai-mom thread to achieve similar speed and hight in growth before flip? thx in advance

 

[farmhouse cat]

hi bobble DHF HGO FC and all other pros and semi pros - been outta the game for quite some time and rethinking a lot since I started educating myself about verts - all ya threads and posts are a superb literature doing that - so first of all thx to yall.

And now a lil question since topic is roots atm - what do u think about pruning roots while veg to a common size/volume before planting in other pots like adviced in the bonsai-mom thread to achieve similar speed and hight in growth before flip? thx in advance

HM, I think the professor can answer your question better then i could so i will leave it for him.

But i do have an interesting observation that i might need to address.

Tonight i noticed that all my new plants in flower have a much lighter green color. (almost scary) but nothing to get alarmed about.

Ive used the exact same feed etc, as i always have. I wonder if it has something to do with the change from hydroton to the bio balls.
Maybe the hydroton was holding nutes in the rootzone, and the bio balls allow full drainage without excess left behind.

HMMM?

 

[bobblehead]

HM, I think the professor can answer your question better then i could so i will leave it for him.

But i do have an interesting observation that i might need to address.

Tonight i noticed that all my new plants in flower have a much lighter green color. (almost scary) but nothing to get alarmed about.

Ive used the exact same feed etc, as i always have. I wonder if it has something to do with the change from hydroton to the bio balls.
Maybe the hydroton was holding nutes in the rootzone, and the bio balls allow full drainage without excess left behind.

HMMM?

Lol... If u mean like the Professor on Gilligan's Island... He gets all these great ideas, and then something goes wrong and they're still stuck on that island... Really with Ginger and MaryAnn both being single attractive young ladies, and the island providing everything they need to survive... I think the professor had his goals twisted.

Ah... Back to Earth... As far as the root pruning goes... I've heard ppl suggest it, but I say leave those roots alone. They're fragile, and I think having contact with them is more likely to cause them to die, rot, and lead to more probs down the road. Trimming bonsai moms is different, cause you want their growth to be stunted. Why would you want to put your plants going into flower through the extra stress?

Hydroton is porous, so it actually has more surface area than your bioballs... If the goal is cultivation of microbes, I would go back to the hydroton. If you have old hydroton, that should already be colonized. I would mix it with any new stuff to increase the speed of colonization. The hydroton does also hold some nutes like you said.

 

[Hama-Kavula]

Alrighty - makes a lotta sense - thx for the answers it´s much appreciated - and g-luck both ya with ur ongoing grows

 

[BldSwtTrs]

Very very nice thread man. My partner and I debated for a very long time whether or not to build a system similar to yours, but eventually decided not to. Its nice to see you workin it so well. Cheers...

 

[Anti]

thats why i can buy so much good grow equipment off craigslist DHF. they give up so easy.

They thought they were gonna take a few seeds out of a bag of shwag and throw them in some dirt under a single 4' shop light and supply their neighborhood.

Then they found out it was gonna take some effort and experience to get it right.

 

[Grizz]

They thought they were gonna take a few seeds out of a bag of shwag and throw them in some dirt under a single 4' shop light and supply their neighborhood.

Then they found out it was gonna take some effort and experience to get it right.

you would be surprised at how many of them spend 1000's of dollors for lights, fans filters ac's and such and have never even tried growing, as you said they think its easy and are doomed before they even start. sorry about high jacking the thread,

 

[farmhouse cat]

Dont forget all the new Vert converts that end up selling hoods. Like me! LOL

I sold 3 magnums on craigs last year.

 

[Mr Celsius]

Dont forget all the new Vert converts that end up selling hoods. Like me! LOL

I sold 3 magnums on craigs last year.

Yup 12 hoods on craigslist last year... now I'm investing in 8" cooltubes for vert

 

[Grizz]

Yup 12 hoods on craigslist last year... now I'm investing in 8" cooltubes for vert

the cool tubes take a beating around here but i have found out i can get the plants alot closer with them and it seems to make up for what you lose lumen wise.