LED Light DIY

[Voidling]

Are you getting those xm-l on stars or are they easy to solder on their own?

I want to try growing a mini rose under whites as a display piece. Have you seen the myindoorgarden light? It's advertised as full spectrum and it puts off white light. Saw a video on YouTube where it was used to flower a rose.

How many white lights do you think would be needed for a single plant vs how many reds and blues. Curious as to if price would make one worth going with one over the other.

Where is the best place to get the golden dragons right now? I'm looking to build a 40watt lamp. Use aboult 30watts for veg then flip another 10 Watts or so of red and maybe far red for bloom

 

[Voidling]

Here's a video of that lamp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPAPHk33VWQ

 

[rives]

I bought my GD+'s from Mouser - they were the best supplier that I found in the states. The price isn't too bad if you get over a 100 of them, but it's pretty steep until then. They also have the MCPCB stars to mount them on.


http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail...-W5AM-1T3T-1-L-Z/?qs=dzkBnbp7AzQjkL7H45NWtQ==

http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail...GAEpiMZZMunP6xGBs1h9LwglsmJQmknZG%2bxRYVhUjQ=

 

[alkalien]

The XM-L, seems to me, can not be soldered without star, or at least, I can't do it

It's the same with those drivers. There are plenty of ICs which will do the job fine but I just can't do the layout for a board, I can't do the calculations and stuff. I did study electronics for a few semesters but I figured I just can't stand it, really hate electronics I want them to work and really can't be bothered...

But seriously, if you can, I'll take my hat and clap my hands! I wish I could!

 

[blimblom]

the new Crees are borderline impossible to solder without a reflow oven. So buying them on stars is the easiest way for people with just a solder gun IMO.

@Voidling If they guy in the video uses LEDs then it is not a full spectrum lamp White LED are deficient in green and cyan and dont produce a uniform lighting as the sun.

Until now the consensus is using b/r/w LEDs and personally I find it a waste to use only white but maybe someone has done it and can share the results in growing MJ.

I have 2x30Watt LED for the trial but I dont have another cabinet for one only-white Run, so maybe if there are other willing to try

Moreover your

 

[Voidling]

They are selling the light and calling it full spectrum is all I know. I think they have one of the color charts with it. The only reason I'd want all white is for a display. For a cab r/w/b is fine with me. Though if I had the money I'd be happy to try. I got room and wood for cabs, but lack money for the lights.

I'm trying to get started with my 20"x18" cab for now

 

[*mr.mike*]

which 20watt LEDs do you mean? I have one from deal-extreme, but in reality it is more of 9x3watt LED running not so hard.

...

I dont know, maybe someone can make a setup with only white LEDs , but I think one of the advantages of having LEDs is choosing the spectrum.

Luminosity of white LEDs is not better than HPS .
warm white XM-L running @2000mA is giving around 80-85lm/w (500lm per LED)
Cool white XM-L "" " " 100lm/w but cool white I think wouldnt be so good for flowering.

I meant 20, 50 or 100 Watt behemoth ones like on this page:
http://www.elmo.lt/lang-en/33-more-than-10w-diods
Cool and warm whites only, no colors. I've seen multi-diode 100 Watt outdoor/security lights... BRIGHT comes to mind. I can't imagine the output (light or heat) in terms of some on that page

I'll agree on the lack of spectrum for white LEDs. They aren't complete. The few white ones I use have big peaks in blue, low in red, but actually release plenty on the blue-green to orange spectrum. I don't know if this really helps or not, I threw in the whites mainly just for "looks" when I'm observing the setup.

 

[T_B_M]

I bought my GD+'s from Mouser - they were the best supplier that I found in the states. The price isn't too bad if you get over a 100 of them, but it's pretty steep until then. They also have the MCPCB stars to mount them on.


http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Osram-Opto-Semiconductor/LH-W5AM-1T3T-1-L-Z/?qs=dzkBnbp7AzQjkL7H45NWtQ%3d%3d

http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail...GAEpiMZZMunP6xGBs1h9LwglsmJQmknZG%2bxRYVhUjQ=

About time they got the Bergquist MCPCBs. I had to order mine from Digikey back a few months ago.

I would go for this 36-UP version though. Its cheaper if you need a lot, they are break-away:
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Bergquist-Company/803268/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMuF/7MFYlJyBld/sTQxJxBa

Arrow also sells random GD+s. They are decently priced when they have stock.

 

[T_B_M]

I meant 20, 50 or 100 Watt behemoth ones like on this page:
http://www.elmo.lt/lang-en/33-more-than-10w-diods
Cool and warm whites only, no colors. I've seen multi-diode 100 Watt outdoor/security lights... BRIGHT comes to mind. I can't imagine the output (light or heat) in terms of some on that page

I'll agree on the lack of spectrum for white LEDs. They aren't complete. The few white ones I use have big peaks in blue, low in red, but actually release plenty on the blue-green to orange spectrum. I don't know if this really helps or not, I threw in the whites mainly just for "looks" when I'm observing the setup.

Anything more than 3W emitters kind of defeat the purpose of LED in my opinion. More power and more heat gained for less light per watt input power. All while reducing your sources of light. I'm a fan of an evenly spaced LED coverage across the whole grow space.

Light dispersion and canopy coverage are priority #1. Lenses at 90 degrees work well if you want penetration.

Best bang for your buck.

 

[T_B_M]

Are you getting those xm-l on stars or are they easy to solder on their own?

I want to try growing a mini rose under whites as a display piece. Have you seen the myindoorgarden light? It's advertised as full spectrum and it puts off white light. Saw a video on YouTube where it was used to flower a rose.

How many white lights do you think would be needed for a single plant vs how many reds and blues. Curious as to if price would make one worth going with one over the other.

Where is the best place to get the golden dragons right now? I'm looking to build a 40watt lamp. Use aboult 30watts for veg then flip another 10 Watts or so of red and maybe far red for bloom

Get your Crees from Cutter. They sell them on MCPCBs. They also have the new Cree XTE royal blues.

I would use Cree XPE reds from Cutter, Cree XPG Cool or Neutral whites from Cutter, Cree XTE royal blues from Cutter, and 660nm GD+ from Mouser or Arrow (if they have stock).

This is the next order I will likely place. I don't need them for a while, so hopefully price drops a bit more or new ones come out by next spring.

50W would be fine for one plant with good emitters. About a 1.5 square foot coverage.

Heres my newest addition to the garden, a White Widow at 46 days flower. It gets 250W HPS hung vertically in the center of the cab with a 35W LED panel just overhead at 2-4"from the tops. It stayed short, not much of a stretcher. I have another 35W panel on the other side also. Soon to be building more so I don't have to use the 250W in the summer months.

 

[blimblom]

I use a litttle shy than 60watt for 2 plants SCROG 60x30cm cabinet, but I let them develop and fill the whole cabinet (thats why i get good g/w values I think)

and I also found this seller on ebay which has quite good prices in 1W units if you dont mind the soldering work

but while I havent tried, I think a person with a bigger cabinet can go with 10w units. If you want to build 200watt unit (for lets say 1,20x60cm cabinet), life will be a lot easier with just 20big 10watt LED elements and still reach a satisfactory dispertion throughout the cabinet.

a 250HPS unit will be one source of light, while a 200watt led unit will have 20 sources.

 

[Shafto]

Transformers are voltage controllers, what LED drivers are is currant limiting devices.

Transformers transform voltage, up or down.

An LED driver that plugs into the wall will use a transformer to transform the 120V AC to a lower voltage, which it will then rectify into DC. A perfect LED driver would have an infinite impedance, meaning no change to current, while allowing voltage to float.

A perfect voltage driver would have no impedance to current, keeping voltage constant while allowing current to change without resistance.

They are both very similar in design. The only difference is in how you setup the feedback reference to the output of the controller. You could convert an LED (current) driver into a voltage driver with a few components, and visa versa.

A transformer is only present if the driver runs on high voltage AC. If not the circuit will be DC-DC.

Seemed like there was a bit of confusion about this top earlier on in the thread.

 

[blimblom]

1st plant (of the 2) got her haircut today, a bit late in bloom,

240gr wet and with branches, I hope it will be down to around 40gr when dried and the branches are removed (I keep them as I think they help the plan cure more slower and they provide a nice way to hang them from

the second plan wont be as big a producer, as I didnt take care of it that much during early flowering and buds are more scarce and smaller, so well if I reach the 1g/w figure will be extra happy. (this run my leds are tuned to around 60watt total consumption 57-59)

Powerplant seems to be a big yielder by the way

 

[GP73LPC]

very cool, please keep me informed on the final dry weight and i will add another entry to my GPW chart...

 

[purplepig3]

Hi i have a mean well CLG-100-24 4A power supply and hope to
run 8 strings of LEDs red ,white ,deep red. Can i use LM317s to reduce current on different strings

 

[blimblom]

@purplepig3 , well 8 strings in one meanwell thats quite I thing to do

i think lm317 wont be a good choice. They consume much energy to begin with, and im not sure if they will mess with the constant current on your meanwell...

As i think of it, you really have 2 different currents to use. One for RED, deep RED and one for Blue/Whites. Reds are usually working well at around 500mA, b/w @ 1000mA.

So a solution could be having to lines of parallel strings

from your meanwell will start 4 different cables in parallel. So each one theoreticaly will have 1000mA.
On the first and second cables you put b/w in series.
on the third you connect 2 cables again and run each string in series of REDs. That way you will have 1000mA /2 = 500mA.
the same thing goes for the forth....

but thats only in theory. People have reported having problems with not identical strings, as they heat differently and draw more power. So if you gonna do it please put the appropriate fuses before each string in order not to kill your LEDs.

I dont know it seems a little bit risky

 

[stratmandu]

Danger! New LED DIY'er here. Grain of salt, anyone?

Hmmm, why "think analog", you know, using LM317s and other linear devices for power control, things that sit there and generate heat while they are working? Not too green, but good for a one-off DIY or three for the house I guess... maybe I'm off my rocker but my approach is 100% digital not using any pre-made modules other than bulk DC supply. I hate loud fans.

As we know: Using switching techniques generates almost no heat in the controlling device, its in one of 2 states: either all the way on, full current but almost negligible voltage drop (hence low I*V = power dissipation as V -> 0), or it is off (I = 0), so no power dissipated there either. Very little heat sinking or device cost to PWM regulate 1 or 2 amp strings with logic FETs or whatever IMO. We have enough heat from the LEDs to deal with so why make more? This is how power LEDs are dimmed anyway BTW (read device app notes). You can do a lot on an appropriate uController... just sayin'.

Back to reading CREE and OSRAM app notes, reference designs, etc ... while waiting for spring.

 

[blimblom]

@stratmandu, Of course I prefer switching devices too, but the meanwell CLG-100-24 4A is already a current limiting device, so putting more switching boards Im not sure it will work well.

the approach of using many small switching DC/DC current limiters is assuming you are using a "regular" AC/DC voltage limiting supply I think.

The beast purplepig3 has maybe is more suitable for bigger LEDs, meaning those new LEDs that in reality are a group of 6-9 smaller ones. These big things draw around 2000mA so he could run his settings in only 2 strings which is way more safe.

again from what I ve read all those years, unequal parallel strings with a current limiter supply tend to produce uneven results.

thats why the most succesfull parallel setting iv'read about talks about voltage limiting supply, with small swiching dc/dc converters at the start of each string. Its more secure also, as the failure of one string will not result to the failure of others

 

[knna]

If you use a constant current driver with high output with some strings in parallel, the best way to avoid current unbalancing is by placing a current mirror on each string (a transistor, connected to the transistor of first string, mirroring its current).

Another interesting way is using not a constant current driver, but a constant voltage one, which are cheaper, especially on high power, and use a linear system to control current. Instead of the LM317 or LM517, its best to use an IC already designed for this task, as the Infineon BCR. Control system is a BCR, a current sensing resistor (which value set the current of the string, so you can use a different current on each string) and a transistor. A little over 1$ for each string. In this case, for higher efficiency and lower cost, using an higher voltage CV PS worth (say, 36V or higher, preferably 48-54V). Using this scheme, you need to use strings of Vf close to the CV output so linear losses are reduced.

 

[purplepig3]

Thanks for advice about the meanwell CLG 100 24 i was using it to power a class D
100W amplifier and was impressed buy its build quality and safety features also only
cost me £10 . I had looked into 10w 20w 50w led but only have 1.5 sqft and its
3ft high .

I also have 20 lux stars and 10 GD + led . Because Osram are about £1.50 per watt
now and HQ will stick with them .