S
schwagg
compost ?
-
Happy Birthday ICMag! Been 20 years since Gypsy Nirvana created the forum! We are celebrating with a 4/20 Giveaway and by launching a new Patreon tier called "420club". You can read more here.
-
Important notice: ICMag's T.O.U. has been updated. Please review it here. For your convenience, it is also available in the main forum menu, under 'Quick Links"!
New to Organic Soil, using Super Soil. Why don't u come by and give some input.
- Thread starter 311
- Start date
311
Member
Not following u? Are u asking if this is compost?
S
schwagg
no, i was wondering if you got any compost to toss into that good soil you're building. are you making compost, can you get decent compost from elsewhere?
311
I had the chance to get a couple bags of this 2 years ago out of Maine. If it were available in Oregon at a reasonable price it would blow a couple of the boutique potting soils around here out of business.
It's as close to a homemade mix that you can find commercially. There's a potting soil in Oregon of the same quality - small batches, top quality ingredients, amendments, etc. Runs $9.00 per 1 c.f.
CC
I had the chance to get a couple bags of this 2 years ago out of Maine. If it were available in Oregon at a reasonable price it would blow a couple of the boutique potting soils around here out of business.
It's as close to a homemade mix that you can find commercially. There's a potting soil in Oregon of the same quality - small batches, top quality ingredients, amendments, etc. Runs $9.00 per 1 c.f.
CC
ha that's funny. i was gonna recommend the same compost CC!
one of my dearest friends is an ecology/biology nerd living on the maine/new hampshire boarder and he has highly recommended those products.
one of my dearest friends is an ecology/biology nerd living on the maine/new hampshire boarder and he has highly recommended those products.
311
Member
Thanks guys. U guys have been a great help. I mixed, and filled about 30 gallons in trash bin, and added 2 gallons of water. The other about 15+ gallons went into a storage bin and added 1gallon of water To that. Soil seems pretty wet. I did NOT cover the bins. Is that correct?
CC
Dont know if u saw my question. but instead of 5 cups of alfalfa meal, i added 7 cups. Is that ok?. I listed the recipe for u a couple of posts ago
CC
Dont know if u saw my question. but instead of 5 cups of alfalfa meal, i added 7 cups. Is that ok?. I listed the recipe for u a couple of posts ago
V
vonforne
I always lay a loose cover over my soil when it sits but you must not just leave it. Remove it daily or so and give it some fresh air.
Remember......Less is Better. You can always add to but NEVER take away in soil. Alfalfa is considered a hot material even when dry due to the C:N ratio. You can use it dry to heat up a compost bin.
1 cup = 16 TBS x 2 = 32. Make sure you total numbers do not exceed 2 TBS per gallon.
V
S
Savoir-faire
Glad to see coast of maine get a shout on here. Excellent products, and excellent blend variety. I mix the COM (also 9$/cf) with Kinney's (4$/cf) compost (also from maine coast), add a dash of COM EWC (10$/8q!
) = 25% of my main(e) mixOn another note. I may be completely wrong here. Hope someone else chimes in if they haven't.. but I think you will want to let that mix (as posted a page earlier) sit for a little longer than usual.. The blood meal looks like nearly a full dose for your amount of soil if I read correctly. In adding the alfalfa meal (higher N? + fast release?) I believe the mix may be a little toasty.
Edit: I see V chimed in about the alfalfa above. Sorry..
:
V
vonforne
I would add more soil or compost to cut that amount down. You will burn the plants with alfalfa.....quick.
So, on a plus side you learned something early with out killing your plans.
Lesson learned. We have done this before......please follow the instructions until you have figured things out a bit more.
Less=Better.
V
S
Savoir-faire
keep it simple as V said.. Less is more.. not just of EACH ingredient but less # of ingredients (especially at the begining)
Altering soil recipes.. organic or not, requires math. we are working from (hopefully) tried and true recipes. When one takes one of these recipes and adds another ammendment to "double cover" an element.. they must take in to consideration that they are altering the ratio (and amount) of elements. In this case by adding alfalfa you are simply adding more N laden matter to the already N filled (blood meal) mix. Soooooo.. if you want to keep the N:K:Mg:Ca:etc. the same as the "tried and true" recipe (which i think that we do want to.. because it works) we must account for it in the equation..
Original equation for achieving desired N in total mix:
N(blood meal) = N(total)
Your equation:
N(blood meal) + N(alfalfa meal) = N(total)
and you want N(total) to remain the same.. because pot plants likes it that way
if the recipe ur using uses only blood meal to achieve the amount of N desired (N(total)).. and you want to use both blood and alfalfa... using the given N %/lb. listed on the products you must lessen the amount of blood you use to keep consistent N(total).
I know.. we are taught to forget NPK.. but you just can't when it comes to changing recipes in regards to primary Nutes.. which is what is being done.
It seems obvious but if you don't think about it for a second... you will end up with a HOT mess.
Altering soil recipes.. organic or not, requires math. we are working from (hopefully) tried and true recipes. When one takes one of these recipes and adds another ammendment to "double cover" an element.. they must take in to consideration that they are altering the ratio (and amount) of elements. In this case by adding alfalfa you are simply adding more N laden matter to the already N filled (blood meal) mix. Soooooo.. if you want to keep the N
:K:Mg:Ca:etc. the same as the "tried and true" recipe (which i think that we do want to.. because it works) we must account for it in the equation.. Original equation for achieving desired N in total mix:
N(blood meal) = N(total)
Your equation:
N(blood meal) + N(alfalfa meal) = N(total)
and you want N(total) to remain the same.. because pot plants likes it that way
if the recipe ur using uses only blood meal to achieve the amount of N desired (N(total)).. and you want to use both blood and alfalfa... using the given N %/lb. listed on the products you must lessen the amount of blood you use to keep consistent N(total).
I know.. we are taught to forget NPK.. but you just can't when it comes to changing recipes in regards to primary Nutes.. which is what is being done.
It seems obvious but if you don't think about it for a second... you will end up with a HOT mess.
NSPB
Active member
It is really all about balance. I use 18 different fertilizers / amendments to my base soil mix. This allows me to simply water the plants through their entire life cycle.
My current mix I've listed on this site many times utilizes 16. However, it is only growing approx. 85-90% of strains without zero defficiency. This means it's still not quite "PERFECT", as the goal is to achieve 100%. It has taken me nearly 3 years to fine tune this formula.
I truly believe using multiple sources for each of the macro (N, P, K) secondary (Ca, S, M) micro (Fe, Zn, Mn, Co, Cu, Cl, Mo) nutrient requirements...you are allowing the plant to essentially pick and choose what it wants to feed on. Not only this, but you will impart a MUCH more accurate flavor which is more representative of genetics rather than a particular feeding regimen. The more complete the soil food web is, the better you end result will be .
The key to this is fully understanding what each various oranic compound is contributing to the whole. For example, using alfalfa not for its N content, but rather for its high levels of tricantanol, which is an amazing growth stimulating hormone. Now understanding, for a lack of a better term, the soluability or availability of each compound once it is actually in your soil becomes important. Many factors affect this, the largest of which is the health and concentration of the micro-organisms in the soil. If the oranisms that "break down" oranic matter into usable forms of plant nutrition are not happy and well nurtured, your entire organic experience will be less than satisfactory.
As stated it is all about balance and understanding on an itimate level the ENTIRE soil food web and how various compounds affect it....
When just starting out, it is often useful to start off with less, as suggest by VG...the man knows his organics. However, that is no longer the only option to thoose wanting the fullness of what organics can offer. SOON...very soon...THERE WILL BE A SOLUTION... for newbies and experts alike.
NSPB
My current mix I've listed on this site many times utilizes 16. However, it is only growing approx. 85-90% of strains without zero defficiency. This means it's still not quite "PERFECT", as the goal is to achieve 100%. It has taken me nearly 3 years to fine tune this formula.
I truly believe using multiple sources for each of the macro (N, P, K) secondary (Ca, S, M) micro (Fe, Zn, Mn, Co, Cu, Cl, Mo) nutrient requirements...you are allowing the plant to essentially pick and choose what it wants to feed on. Not only this, but you will impart a MUCH more accurate flavor which is more representative of genetics rather than a particular feeding regimen. The more complete the soil food web is, the better you end result will be .
The key to this is fully understanding what each various oranic compound is contributing to the whole. For example, using alfalfa not for its N content, but rather for its high levels of tricantanol, which is an amazing growth stimulating hormone. Now understanding, for a lack of a better term, the soluability or availability of each compound once it is actually in your soil becomes important. Many factors affect this, the largest of which is the health and concentration of the micro-organisms in the soil. If the oranisms that "break down" oranic matter into usable forms of plant nutrition are not happy and well nurtured, your entire organic experience will be less than satisfactory.
As stated it is all about balance and understanding on an itimate level the ENTIRE soil food web and how various compounds affect it....
When just starting out, it is often useful to start off with less, as suggest by VG...the man knows his organics. However, that is no longer the only option to thoose wanting the fullness of what organics can offer. SOON...very soon...THERE WILL BE A SOLUTION... for newbies and experts alike.
NSPB
organicterra
Member
Hi, first post over here at ICMAG.
I have been looking at the supersoil recipe and had a couple thoughts. Feel free to ridicule me and toss my ass outta here.
At 8 bags soil (assuming 1cuft ea) and 1 large bag EWC you will have around 9 cuft.
1 cuft equals approx 7.5 gallons
9 cuft probably around 67 gallons
The first thing that strikes me is the blood meal, bat guano and fish bone meal quantities.
Converting pounds to cups is difficult due to different material weight so I am figuring 3 cups per pound. (between sugar and flour)
So 5 lbs of each is somewhere around 45 cups or 1.5 cups per gallon. (edit: ok so math's not my strong point. I think it's more like 2/3 cup per gallon in this scenario)
Seems like a lot.
I have been looking at the supersoil recipe and had a couple thoughts. Feel free to ridicule me and toss my ass outta here.
At 8 bags soil (assuming 1cuft ea) and 1 large bag EWC you will have around 9 cuft.
1 cuft equals approx 7.5 gallons
9 cuft probably around 67 gallons
The first thing that strikes me is the blood meal, bat guano and fish bone meal quantities.
Converting pounds to cups is difficult due to different material weight so I am figuring 3 cups per pound. (between sugar and flour)
So 5 lbs of each is somewhere around 45 cups or 1.5 cups per gallon. (edit: ok so math's not my strong point. I think it's more like 2/3 cup per gallon in this scenario)
Seems like a lot.
organicterra
Member
The next thing is the azomite at 1/2 cup per 67 gallons.
On the box I have it says use at 1-2 Tbs per gallon for container plants. That would be more like 4 cups.
I agree with the other posters regarding using a broad range of quality sources to obtain the nutrients and minerals needed for quality plant growth.
I think the lack of K has already been covered.
On the box I have it says use at 1-2 Tbs per gallon for container plants. That would be more like 4 cups.
I agree with the other posters regarding using a broad range of quality sources to obtain the nutrients and minerals needed for quality plant growth.
I think the lack of K has already been covered.
great thread going here guys. full of good info.
Organicterra - this mix is suppose to be hot. It is designed so the supersoil goes in the bottom half of the pot, then the top half with base mix. (sorry if known)
Also, Roots Organics bags of soil have 1.5 cubic feet or 12 cubic feet per 8 bags (being liberal) Or a total of 14 cubic feet after EWC and additives. Plus I add Pumice @ 1.5 cubic feet.
Other than that, go on.......
Also, Roots Organics bags of soil have 1.5 cubic feet or 12 cubic feet per 8 bags (being liberal) Or a total of 14 cubic feet after EWC and additives. Plus I add Pumice @ 1.5 cubic feet.
Other than that, go on.......
organicterra
Member
Bullfrog44
Thanks for clarifing.
Other than my fuzzy math which I think I fixed it still seems hot. Only slightly familiar with this mix but I do recall reading that he suggests not transplanting directly into the supersoil.
I've been putting more like 2 cups per cuft of meal/mineral mix.
311
Member
DO NOT TRANSPLANT DIRECTLY INTO SS, is correct! I saw 1 grow W/PICS where someone went straight to SS, and actually had success. Even Sub himself chimed in and said he couldn't believe it, but pics didn't lie. THOUGH, I will not be trying this out myself!
I will be ONLY filling about 1/3 of the container, for starters. Once I get the hang of this, I will try for 1/2 the container. Rather have to feed, 5 weeks into flowering, than burning my ladies, 2 weeks into flowering.
