2012 Legalization Effort Starts

[dagnabit]

Objection, leading the witness your honor. Your questions are about as fair and balanced as faux newz. lol

Prohibition here is fading. You are aware that possession in CA is a minor infraction? And anyone can get a medical rec. to grow a 10x10. It's not my fault you live elsewhere. Move.

We should not blindly vote for any tax/regulate/control legislation just because it is there. The devil is the details, you seem happy ignoring the details. I believe there is no answer to GMO cannabis. All we can do is rally against it. And considering that I moved 4,000 miles away from my family, friends, and career to remove the threat of 'real ass-pounding prison', I suggest you do the same. Blame and guilt will not change opinions.

assumptive garbage..
when in doubt revert to ad hominem..
its perfectly legal for me to grow,possess,use,transport,sell and/or give away marijuana right where i am.
i do not have a day job.

all of which is completely irrelevant and a simplistic attempt at discreditation and obfuscation. (weak at best)
now do you care to answer the question or revert even farther?

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

its perfectly legal for me to grow,possess,use,transport,sell and/or give away marijuana right where i am.
i do not have a day job.

You make no points in your posts. calling names, placing blame, and using big words to sound smart is divisive, and is much closer to garbage than anything. I doubt it is legal for you to sell, although I do not know where you live. That aside, you still make no points, just ask slanted one sided questions. I don't even know what your question was because you post like a troll and it is hard to read. Please rethink your question to be little less biased or you will be ignored.

 

[dagnabit]

do you believe continued prohibition is the answer to the gmo cannabis problem?
should we outlaw corn so monsanto will stop producing roundup ready seed?

^^^^
there it is.
2 simple questions.

the topic at hand being legalization.
the subject having turned to GMO as a feared consequence of legalization.
the question is quite relevant.
but hey ignore away i understand why

 

[dagnabit]

I doubt it is legal for you to sell, although I do not know where you live.

lmao
accept donations?
be compensated for?

play semantics all you like.
its cute.

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

accept donations? be compensated for? play semantics all you like. its cute.

you sure are a fan of the "enter" button. vertical space doesn't add meaning to your words, lol. But I'll give it a try so you can better understand. And thanks, semantics is half the conversation.

do you believe continued prohibition is the answer to the gmo cannabis problem?

This question makes no sense.
To start, GMO cannabis is an international issue and we are talking about CA Tax/Control/Regulation of recreation adult use/grow in CA.
Preventing GMO cannabis in CA will not stop anything.
But with that said, google NIMBY.
I also need to point out that you need to ask a more specific question, instead of trolling garbage.
Would you be asking about the continued prohibition of adult recreational cannabis use in CA?
Or true legalization in CA?
Or adult recreation and limited grow? CA or nation?
Or adult recreation and unlimited grow? CA or nation?
What about hemp?
What about age limits, grow limits, and possession limits?
Is selling/buying legal in your scenario?
You see what I mean now?
As I have pointed out repeatedly, it's hard to answer open ended questions such as the ones you have asked. That's why legislation is complex and your attitude doesn't apply to politics.
We do not all agree that GMO cannabis is a possibility (it is), or if it is bad (it may be).
There are so many assumptions in your question that it is unanswerable.
Rephrase please.

should we outlaw corn so monsanto will stop producing roundup ready seed?

lol. can we just outlaw monsanto and round up?

The simple truth is: for Californians things are going well in terms of cannabis. Anyone who wants to grow can easily get a rec. If you have a humble attitude you can get free flowers/hash from (some) dispensaries. Donations whatever are still a borderline issue in all honesty. If anyone needs to be pressured it is the folks in non-MMj states. MMj is credible, science based, and specifically about compassion for sick and dying people. Recreational use, and the commercial production, of cannabis on the other hand... is about people getting high and corporations getting rich(er). This is not going to be an easy win. I choose to fight for MMj protection and expansion, because I'm realistic.

I'll tell you right now. America already has plenty of cannabis. We don't need commercial cannabis, we need a chain of MMj states going across the country that acknowledged out of state recs To help spread quality MMj bud over the nation. Cali isn't the only place with good enough climate to make mountains of bud, we just have the best (arguably) terroir.

 

[MadBuddhaAbuser]

I'm not sure who told you that growers don't vote....

If this site alone were any indication, not only did many growers vote no, but they also did their best to encourage others to vote no....

The people I know in Cali all told me the growers were pushing the no vote. They even started sites encouraguing the no vote..... So you're information regarding growers not voting is incorrect.....

i have to agree that the most outspoken people against the vote, were funny enough, here and other sites like this. I found out about it from a friend, came online all excited and all I see is "PROTECT THE STATUS QUO VOTE NO!" and i was like :jawdrop:

Thank you for the comments bro--
I apologize for wording that wrong-- I know you guys can grow weed out there...but it isn't the long Season that we have-- It is no problem getting 2 outdoor (Greenhouse) crops a year here-- Can even throw in a winter crop, with a li'l supplemental lighting and a small heater--

no doubt man, I am jealous of the easy 2 seasons. We just have to be more resourceful out this way.

I live for the day that we, as a Country...no, I mean World, can enjoy growing without Fear--

you and me both brother *passes the diesel*

Prohibition here is fading. You are aware that possession in CA is a minor infraction? And anyone can get a medical rec. to grow a 10x10. It's not my fault you live elsewhere. Move.

A whole hell of a lot easier said then done. Not to mention some people like living where they are. Not to mention a million mediocore growers have already done this, which is why all your(cali) p's go for shit now. Legalization will bump out the mediocore growers. Monsanto wouldnt be growing my fucking bud, i would be if it was legal. Plus it would stil be illegal on a federal level, and as you already know, fed laws trump state laws. So it wouldnt even be legal for monsanto to be growing it.

This is the problematic thinking "oh we're good who cares about you guys". Prohibition=Bullshit.

Maybe it's time some of you guys and gals start writing your own initiative that actually addresses the concerns us, as potheads, smokers, medical patients, growers, and just general good people, have with 19. or the other upcoming initiatives. Maybe draft a section to outlaw corporations from getting involved or something? I dunno it's worth a shot. That would help a lot more than waiting till 2012 comes along and saying "yeah this bill sucks too". We gotta mobilize this thing.

 

[MadBuddhaAbuser]

The simple truth is: for Californians things are going well in terms of cannabis. Anyone who wants to grow can easily get a rec. If you have a humble attitude you can get free flowers/hash from (some) dispensaries. Donations whatever are still a borderline issue in all honesty. If anyone needs to be pressured it is the folks in non-MMj states. MMj is credible, science based, and specifically about compassion for sick and dying people. Recreational use, and the commercial production, of cannabis on the other hand... is about people getting high and corporations getting rich(er). This is not going to be an easy win. I choose to fight for MMj protection and expansion, because I'm realistic.

I'll tell you right now. America already has plenty of cannabis. We don't need commercial cannabis, we need a chain of MMj states going across the country that acknowledged out of state recs To help spread quality MMj bud over the nation. Cali isn't the only place with good enough climate to make mountains of bud, we just have the best terroir.

Unfortunately, California's "HaHa its medical but everybody can get it" system has managed to permanently fuck up any other states chances of getting a similar thing happening. Laws which are being passed are far more restrictive than Cali, in some cases (NJ, you fucking idiots) Not allowing personal growing at all, and far smaller amounts allowed, and (are you ready? this is from the HOLY CONTROLLING THE POTHEADS BATMAN files) actually LIMITING THE AMOUNT OF THC THAT CAN BE CONTAINED IN YOUR BUD. Wow. direct from the "Let's make OXY80s and get EVERYONE hooked" state. seriously?!?!. nad only 10%?!?! stuck with boogie!

*edit-Bolding

 

[Rednick]

I'll tell you right now. America already has plenty of cannabis. We don't need commercial cannabis, we need a chain of MMj states going across the country that acknowledged out of state recs To help spread quality MMj bud over the nation. Cali isn't the only place with good enough climate to make mountains of bud, we just have the best (arguably) terroir.

Careful now, them bees fighting words.
You may have a spook at your door any day now.

Edit: Dagnabit, you win! Nagdabit!
The ignorant have brought me down to their level and beaten me based on experience.
Thank you, I shall now stop wasting my time trying to explain logic to you work on the battles that really matter.

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

Maybe it's time some of you guys and gals start writing your own initiative that actually addresses the concerns us, as potheads, smokers, medical patients, growers, and just general good people, have with 19. or the other upcoming initiatives. Maybe draft a section to outlaw corporations from getting involved or something? I dunno it's worth a shot. That would help a lot more than waiting till 2012 comes along and saying "yeah this bill sucks too".

To cut out big biz will kill any chance of funding or support for a state proposition. Any further de-legislation will be for commercial cannabis production. That is the number one goal of Lee/Soros, the drafters/funders.

We gotta mobilize this thing.

Movement in the wrong direction is not progress. As a grower: patience, even in bad times, is something we should all have. I am attempting to mobilize this thing right now.

I am for national decrim, but not at the expense of tens of thousands of "small farms" here in CA. This is the RARE occasion when conflicting state and federal law favors the little guy. IMO the focus needs to be on non-MMj states. The only way federal rescheduling will happen is a combination of:
1) many more MMj states
2) good political timing
3) massive money infusion for the campaign
4) more stuff will post later, I'm crazy high on some jack "resin".
Until we have a rescheduling federally, statewide tax/regulate/control isn't a good idea, the fed backed that up with Obama in the blackhouse. With the cyclic nature of american politics, you can bet your ass that a republican president would go after "legal" recreational and commercial cannabis ventures. Pushing for recreational use and commercial production via a state wide proposition is approaching this task wrong imo.

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

Careful now, them bees fighting words.
You may have a spook at your door any day now.

Hey, you live in cali don't you... the greatest state.
wait... did you just call me ignant?

 

[igrowone]

when i see the Cali grower's dissing us non Cali residents about their state law, they do have a point
it's painful to see, but it is how it is, we're not 1 team anymore, money has been the big wedge
but when you see the wild speculations what will happen with Federal law, genetic modification, Monsanto, etc.
well, enough, those aren't facts, that's a long chain of speculative assumptions
Federal change of this magnitude is simply not possible at this time, probably never will be
if you think it is, show me the votes in the Senate on the key subcommittees, love to see that count
Federal rescheduling, now that is plausible, though likely to be modest, as in schedule II
but some mass market Federally regulated Cannabiz, not for a long, long time(if ever)

 

[Rednick]

Hey, you live in cali don't you...

Might as well, you all moved here.
I don't think people in other states see what is going on. I live here and it took me a long time to get the picture. Only two states are really working a dispensary model (sorry MT, MI you just don't compare on the scale/magnitude of things).

Oh and New Jersey? If you live there and don't know who got that one passed through, then you should just be happy going through life with blinders on, or be on their team.

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

when i see the Cali grower's dissing us non Cali residents about their state law, they do have a point
it's painful to see, but it is how it is, we're not 1 team anymore, money has been the big wedge
but when you see the wild speculations what will happen with Federal law, genetic modification, Monsanto, etc.
well, enough, those aren't facts, that's a long chain of speculative assumptions
Federal change of this magnitude is simply not possible at this time, probably never will be
if you think it is, show me the votes in the Senate on the key subcommittees, love to see that count
Federal rescheduling, now that is plausible, though likely to be modest, as in schedule II
but some mass market Federally regulated Cannabiz, not for a long, long time(if ever)

Thanks. I agree 100% with your post. You are sane, I needed that. Three cheers for federal rescheduling.

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

Might as well, you all moved here.
I don't think people in other states see what is going on. I live here and it took me a long time to get the picture. Only two states are really working a dispensary model (sorry MT, MI you just don't compare on the scale/magnitude of things).

Oh and New Jersey? If you live there and don't know who got that one passed through, then you should just be happy going through life with blinders on, or be on their team.

Yup, CA or CO or lame. Life is about priorities, dirty joke removed.

 

[MadBuddhaAbuser]

Any further de-legislation will be for commercial cannabis production. That is the number one goal of Lee/Soros, the drafters/funders.

Movement in the wrong direction is not progress.

Exactly why I say, "we" the people should be drafting this stuff. Not leaving it up to others with mere money as their goal from setting the rules which the rest of us must abide.

I am for national decrim, but not at the expense of tens of thousands of "small farms" here in CA.

It will not come at the expense of good growers. Only mediocore growers will be pushed out. and they wont even be fully pushed out, just have to get less for their medicine.

 

[JJScorpio]

This is the entire problem. And I don't know about other States, but what's happening in Cali affected NY the last 2 years.....

The main concern in NY was "how will we prevent what's happening in California from happening here?

So I'm glad you guys are doing so good. Anyone can get a cert. Anyone can do a fairly good sized grow. They're shipping their excess out, lowering the costs for growers in other States that face prison if caught. And preventing at least one, if not more States passing a med program because they fear what's happening there could happen in their State....

Again, I'm glad it's working out so good for you. But let me tell you this. There's a lot of people in a lot of other States really starting to get upset with what's going on. The growers in Cali were against legalization because they had families to feed, etc. And I think people respect that stance. But then all this "med weed" is making it's way everywhere else and hurting those peoples income and families. In some areas it's tough to fight, hide, sneak and grow 10 pounds. It's impossible for these people to compete with the 3 and 4 hundred pound outdoor med grows. And you're going to start seeing this animosity get larger.....

But I'm glad things are going good for you....

The simple truth is: for Californians things are going well in terms of cannabis. Anyone who wants to grow can easily get a rec. If you have a humble attitude you can get free flowers/hash from (some) dispensaries. Donations whatever are still a borderline issue in all honesty. If anyone needs to be pressured it is the folks in non-MMj states. .

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

But I'm glad things are going good for you....

isn't that just the way things go... free black market whatever. These so called "100+ pound medical gardens" are not legit in court, they risk as well. These larger outdoor producers might think they are covered with stacked recs, but that's not how it goes down in court. CAMP is out there pulling what they can, we've overgrown.com'd enforcement to the point that the nation is seasonally affected.

 

[David762]

Got an emailed link to a "YES on 19" survey today.

Got an emailed link to a "YES on 19" survey today.

I am not quite so sure that they would take my comments to heart:

=========================================

/snip
HOW WERE YOU INVOLVED WITH THE CAMPAIGN?
(X) On email list
Facebook supporter
Twitter follower
(X) Took action online
Volunteered offline
(X) Spoke with friends about Prop 19
(X) Made a donation

OVERALL, WHAT DO YOU FEEL WAS THE IMPACT OF OUR CAMPAIGN?
(X) Prop 19 moved the debate forward
( ) Prop 19 moved the debate backward
( ) Prop 19 neither moved the debate forward or backward

WHAT DO YOU FEEL THE CAMPAIGN DID WELL?
The campaign certainly brought the issue of re-legalization of cannabis to the forefront, not just in CA but world-wide. Kudos for that, at least.

WHAT COULD THE CAMPAIGN HAVE DONE BETTER?
Unfortunately the Prop 19 bill itself was well-intended but, IMHO, fatally flawed. And it's failure to pass at the voting booth has re-invigorated the repressive backlash to Prop 215 and SB 420 besides Prop 19, both at the State and Federal level. We are seeing the results with a dramatically increased number of raids by local, state, and Federal LEOs, as well as increasingly restrictive local regulations in every MMJ state.

The Prop 19 legislation needs to be completely overhauled. Some of it's major failures include: (1) a higher threshold of MMJ rights State-wide to fix gaping holes in Prop 215 and SB 420; (2) better protections for in-state MMJ growers, collectives, and dispensaries which represent the small Mom&Pop operations (who largely voted NO); (3) less restrictive area|canopy growing specifications than the 25 square foot in Prop 19; and (4) better public education regarding the long history of the Federal government's known fraudulent propaganda in spite of considerable scientific evidence to the contrary (La Guardia & Shafer Commission Reports, US Patent 6630507, the VA acceptance of MMJ, etcetera).

WHAT KINDS OF ISSUES SHOULD WE FOCUS ON OVER THE NEXT 12 MONTHS?
You need to focus on re-writing Prop 19, as well as widening those public education points, both noted above. The Feds (DEA etcetera) are vulnerable, because they ignore|disparage the truth while they continue to spew falsehoods.

DO YOU HAVE A PERSONAL STORY ABOUT HOW MARIJUANA PROHIBITION HAS SIGNIFICANTLY NEGATIVELY AFFECTED YOU AND YOUR FAMILY?
None, except that two family members by marriage have been denied the beneficial aspects of Medical Marijuana in the treatment of their medical ailments (cancers), all due to this insane prohibition of cannabis.


WOULD YOU SUPPORT A MOVEMENT TO CONTROL & TAX CANNABIS IN CALIFORNIA IN 2012?
( ) Yes!
( ) No
(X) We’ll see

ANY OTHER FEEDBACK?
That previous question regarding support of a movement to control & tax cannabis in California in 2012 is conditional upon those changes being made that I have expounded upon above.

Any future mobilization on legislation to legalize cannabis needs to fill in more of the gaps and grey areas that I have mentioned, instead of re-hashing legislation that could be seen by many as focused primarily upon the commercial interests of one person, Richard Lee, hero that he may be.

=========================================

 

[rick shaw]

It is better to be a grower in California then anywhere else,but it isn't a free easy ride. You still have landlord issues and rippers to worry about. If your over county limits you may wind up in court. Regulations are overdue and coming, I hope we don't end up like Colorado where home growers can't be vendors to dispensaries.

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

I said for a year and a half that 2012 was the year, and that Dick Lee was told to wait. He didn't, and looked what happened. Told you so! Told you so! Told you so! This will be a better initiative, and it will pass. To bad Dick didn't listen.

....and watch, we will see the same people come out against it for whatever lame ass excuse they can think of...its not about the details, its about growers/dealers not wanting to compete in a free market.

The ONLY reason 19 failed is because of the huge turnout in republican/teabag voters. When the dems get a huge turnout to re-elect obama you can bet your ass that legalization will pass.

...and you fucking youth voters: get the fuck out and vote. Put down your bong and your xbox contoller for 20 minutes to make a difference. Jesus christ yal dissapoint me...