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LIQUID KARMA is just KELP?

B

baet

Member
I bought a bottle of Liquid Karma because everyone seems to absolutely love the stuff on here. Geez it was expensive.. After checking the ingredients I felt a little cheated..

Why don't people just use a cheaper source of liquid kelp hydrolysate?

Kelp is awesome, and wouldn't grow without it, outdoors I've always used peaceful valleys liquid kelp hydrolysate or maxicrop dry kelp.



I can purchase a gallon of liquid cold processed kelp for $20+tax that has a recommended dose of 1-2 tbsp per gallon.

A quart or 1/4 gallon of liquid karma is $28+tax and has a recommended dose of 2 tsp per gallon. much more expensive kelp product.



can anyone convince me to pay the extra price for LK? is there something i'm missing or don't know about?
 
B

baet

Member
The only difference I know of between the two kelp products above is that the gallon of liquid cold processed kelp is a variety of kelp known as California Bull Kelp. And I'm assuming the LK is the Norwegian kind of kelp Ascophyllum, only because every other kelp product I've ever seen has been this variety..
 
HUGE

HUGE

Active member
Veteran
LK also has humics and fulvics but don't know if that justifies the price. Also it seems to fall out of solution in like 2 days. My res strys out all dark with lk then 2 days and it's all settled to the bottom. And don't know I'd it's still effective.
 
Randybobandy

Randybobandy

Member
It used to kick ass-then they took away all the humics. Not good karma for them. How you gonna skimp on your product when it says the word karma on it? LOL Botanicare is slipping.
 
B

baet

Member
hmmm. yeah. i like to keep things as simple as possible and mix the least amount of nutes possible.
botanicare seems to be very solid and i've been very happy so far.
but after learning about the EDTA in their calmag+ and the removal of humics and fulvics from LK i might have to find an alternative to calmag supplement and a kelp.
i use RO water so calmag supplement is a must..

i think i'll pick up dry maxicrop in the future like old times and start searching for another calmag..

any thoughts?
 
B

baet

Member
wise-yeah i've always used dry maxicrop outdoors, i don't know what's happened to me, ever since starting indoor i've been played and marketed by the shiny graphic designed labels and bottles.
i'll continue to use pure blend pro grow and bloom though, love the stuff.
 
T

tester

Member
From here

NPK
  • Total Nitrogen (N) 0.1%
  • Water Soluble Nitrogen 0.1 %
  • Available Phosphate (P205) 0.1%
  • Soluble Potash (K20) 0.5%

Non-plant Food Ingredients:
  • Humic Acid derived from Leonardite 0.01%
  • Aloe Vera extract 0.01%
  • Yucca extract 0.01%

Description:
Liquid Karma chelates micronutrients through amino and fulvic
acids, and shuttles them into plant cells, increasing metabolic
rates and conserves plant energy. Full of B-vitamins and other
stress relieving components with I large amount of cytokinin
derived from ascophylum nodosum North Atlantic sea kelp.
Liquid Karma represents a significant breakthrough in plant
nutrition. This is because it contains a full complement of
metobolically active oragnic compunds (0.1-0.1-0.5) not found
in regular plant foods or supplements. These unique
compounds are absorbed immediately and act as regulatory
signals, activators or catalysts to produce synchronized and
accelerated growth under all conditions.
Liquid Karma functions as a growth engine because its high
metabolic activity produces a large amount of energy, which is
immediately transformed to growth.
It contains fermented compost, amino acids, vitamins, plant
extracts, humic acid, seaweed extracts and carbohydrates.


According to this MSDS:
INGREDIENTS:
  • dolomite
  • potassium carbonate
  • fish meal
  • sea weed extract
  • magnesium sulfate
  • humic acid (derived fro leonardite shale)
  • water soluble vitamins


If these are true, it's more than just kelp although not much more.
A little bit of this, a little bit of that...
 
Last edited:
B

baet

Member
tester-interesting. i hate when bottles don't disclose everything they put in their nutrient. LK says derived from: kelp ,or something like that, but just kelp..

what's the point of adding humic if your only going to add .01% honestly?
 
B

baet

Member
tester- from the first link you provided, igrowhydro.com says LK contains, fermented compost, amino acids, vitamins, plant extracts, humic acid, seaweed and carbohydrates. different than what the MSDS link provides, a lot is the same, but there is some differences.. i dont think i'll ever know exactly what's in LK. there is seaweed, maybe there's some humics, yet randy says they'v pulled the humics. maybe theres some fermented compost but the two links contradict that. maybe there is some carbohydrates.
 
M

maryanne3087

Active member
I think part of what makes Liquid Karma successful other than it works is people don't know why it works or what's in it. This seems to make just about any nutrient successful. The recipe for making a successful nutrient is to proven some sort of results, be very vague about what the product contains, and spend a bunch of money on marketing.
 
T

tester

Member
Anything works.
I gave a small eyedropper to a fellow grower and told him to give 3 drops with every other watering, it will make his buds more dense, bigger, filled with glands. I said it was the newest stuff going for 100 bucks but I give it away for free because I got it as a present and I wasn't growing anyway.
Needless to say he was very happy because of his newest treasure, so he went bragging to his friends about it.
He was owning something nobody else had before, something new and very expensive that works in such ways nobody can even imagine.

After a few weeks when we had meet again he told me how wonderfully it was working, he got much bigger and denser buds, even the taste become better etc....

It was tapwater in his own eyedropper flask he gave me a while ago.


First, I'd like to see side-by-sides made by a 3rd company, double blind tests, the research behind it, OR/AND the exact contents of the product, then I can decide if it's worth the money.

"Growshop products" can't supply any of these, there's only marketing behind a product without any research or valuable compound.
 
PoopyTeaBags

PoopyTeaBags

State Liscensed Care Giver/Patient, Assistant Trai
Veteran
if you think that is expensive look up nitrozyme.... only 200 a gallon and is a kelp extract.... 30% leonard extract... or what ever it may be....
 
DiscoBiscuit

DiscoBiscuit

weed fiend
Veteran
Using your pricing,

gal of kelp - ~8 cents per tablespoon

qt of LK - ~15 cents per teaspoon

LK qt. = 2x price per application compared to the gal of kelp
 
EddieShoestring

EddieShoestring

Florist
Veteran
PoopyTeaBags if you think that is expensive look up nitrozyme.... only 200 a gallon and is a kelp extract
Click to expand...

that's right about nitrozyme. It is great stuff-but unfeasably expensive for what it is. Nowdays I use this
 
H

highvolt

nice one eddieshoestring
so do you use that seaweed (kelp) throughout the entire grow right up to flush ?
 
B

baet

Member
maryanne-yeah your completely right

cocktail frank-believe it.


jhbiotech's humax, 12% humic acid, $15.99 a gallon.
advanced nutrient's grandma enggy's H2, 2.62% humic acid, $71.95 a gallon.
I always smile when i see locals buying advanced nutrients at the hydroponics store feeling like big dogs. that company is almost a scam. i could rant for ever about the subject..

tester-ha, placebo, nice story. that would be nice..

poopy-yeah i've seen that stuff, even heard people rave about it online. think i'll stick to cheaper alternative
 
B

baet

Member
discobiscuit-thanks for taking the extra step and work to figure that out.

~also LK recommends 2 tsp. a gallon. so actually 30 cents a gallon OR 4x more expensive than alternative liquid kelp per gallon of nutrient solution.


eddie-nice
 
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