California's Proposition 19 will supersede or amend its medical marijuana laws

[2Lazy]

Seriously. Just look at the sources. Go check out NORML's take on it.

http://stash.norml.org/californias-prop-19-a-word-for-word-analysis

 

[GanjaAL]

Funny though... Jack and the author of 215 did and do not support prop 19.

 

[Herborizer]

ive disputed this bullshit article in several threads but in short ill do it again here



I.tc2010 states it is "intended to limit enforcement of law" this sentence is very important and succinct.

II.the "rule of three" in the strictest legal sense is complete bullshit. the bill defines city/local government as follows "(vi) “local government” means a city, county, or city and county."

III.the "error of omission" this is just not how law works. tc2010 does not specifically mention murder but P.C.187 will be unaffected.

the truth is this.

after tc2010 if i want to grow pot for me in my home i can do so without having to ask the government or pay a fucking hack "doctor" to write me a recommendation for my hangnail.

I am voting yes for prop 19.

 

[dagnabit]

Funny though... Jack and the author of 215 did and do not support prop 19.

they are men...fallible.

anyone can be wrong.

 

[binaryfission]

check the sticky. read the bill. this is nonsense.


vote yes.


https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=182592

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

Im still amazed at the level of stupidity.


weed = illegal RIGHT NOW....

prop 19 passes

weed = legal with guidelines

your breaking the law now.

what diffrence will it make if this passes ?????


why do i feel like im arguing with republicans here??? does logic not comprehend?? or are you just so fucking biased you cant see the whole picture????

just be real.

 

[Strapped]

they are men...fallible.

anyone can be wrong.

You're right bro. I like to think that people in these forums think for themselves.

I can't help but feel like opponents of Prop 19 are doing it solely to preserve wealth.

As much as I admire Mr. Herer for his good works; to hope for any product in this country to be untaxed for the general public is a far cry. I hate big govt., and I hate paying uncle sam; but if paying a tax on MJ will make it so that I don't have to worry about having my kids taken away for choosing a safer alternative to alcohol, than I will do it.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but MJ is ALREADY taxed. MJ is a product with close to a 2000% profit margin because of its illegality. Then you pay for it again in income taxes to enforce its illegality. Then you pay the sales tax on what you use to smoke it with. Even if you grow you pay tax on nutes and seeds at the very minimum.

To ask for MJ to be untaxed is kind of ridiculous. You pay tax on a gallon of milk bro. What legalization would do however, is make it so farmers of it could file for a tax free status like any other legit farmer.

 

[j242]

Im still amazed at the level of stupidity.


weed = illegal RIGHT NOW....

prop 19 passes

weed = legal with guidelines

your breaking the law now.

what diffrence will it make if this passes ?????


why do i feel like im arguing with republicans here??? does logic not comprehend?? or are you just so fucking biased you cant see the whole picture????

just be real.

Let's break it down, under FEDERAL Law it is ILLEGAL before and after and legalization vote. The feds would view it no different. After all VOTERS voted in 1996 and we are still be persecuted. Why would VOTERS voting again in 2010 be any different? MJ WOULD STILL BE ILLEGAL UNDER FEDERAL LAW. Until the FEDERAL law is changed we can all go to jail for growing legal recommendation or legal per state.

 

[j242]

d

 

[Snowberry]

Any naysayers to 19 have either stupidity or greed motivating their opposition to it.

I remember the days back when you could be drafted to war overseas and get well trained to kill other people at 18. I also remember the early days in Ann Arbor Michigan when young Americans stood up to legal voting age, and drinking age....the logic involved was pretty basic stuff, If you were old enough to kill, you were old enough to vote and have a beer if you wanted.

History proves my point a little further down the road with the fact the S.D.S. (students for democratic society) organized University of Michigan students into a local political force to be reckoned with. In the early 70s, SDS ended up with a majority of local city council and enacted a bylaw with respect to cannabis possession, rendering it a misdemeanor if you were busted by city cops with an ounce or less, it was simply a $10.00 fine....in effect decriminalizing it.

I remember those days well and fondly, walking downtown or briarwood mall or sitting in one of the many public parks that dot the community....blazing away. In only one instance in my fortunate life did I ever have a LEO intercede in my enjoyment....he took my zip with no ticket. I believe he was looking for some personal stash at the time. The first weekend in May in Ann Arbor since the early 70s has been celebrating "Freedom day" it used to be known as the Ann Arbor Hash Bash.

To bring theses memories up to the present, we 420 friendlies have come a long way....but the job is not yet done boys and girls. This is the political tipping point on the timeline of history and striking down laws based on lies. It really never is a pleasant thing losing a state supported monopoly of competing commodity markets....losing is supposed to taste like a shitt sandwich.

Reality check folks....Tomatoes are a legal commodity regulated and taxed and so is alcohol after idiotic prohibition laws were repealed. Let people grow their own buds in their backyards or patios just like tomatoes....and who really cares if somebody else makes a living doing it as long as they keep their guns at the local firing range instead of our streets protecting "Turf". With so many Americans growing tomatoes these days not even the Heinz empire would consider a tomato prohibition or a "Turf war"

Organize and register other 420 friendlies and pass 19...I am absolutely convinced this will start all the rest of the dominoes falling in our favor across the world.

Time to get off yer asses and roll up yer sleeves!

 

[dagnabit]

Let's break it down, under FEDERAL Law it is ILLEGAL before and after and legalization vote. The feds would view it no different. After all VOTERS voted in 1996 and we are still be persecuted. Why would VOTERS voting again in 2010 be any different? MJ WOULD STILL BE ILLEGAL UNDER FEDERAL LAW. Until the FEDERAL law is changed we can all go to jail for growing legal recommendation or legal per state.

REPEAL 215!!!!

the inequity is intolerable!!!!

DO NOT SUPPORT THE SYSTEM!!! BURN YOUR MED CARD!!!

 

[ReelBusy1]

Funny though... Jack and the author of 215 did and do not support prop 19.

Founding fathers are not always right about everything.
The signers of the Declaration of Independence left slavery in place.
Jack Herer was wrong about Prop 19 then.
And his family says he would support it now too.

 

[Hydrosun]

I met Jack's son Mark at a glass show in Las Vegas last month. There were nice pictures of Jack. Hawaiian shirts worn by Jack. Mark was handing out Beeline (great product to light your weed with), but there was ZERO ZERO ZERO mention of prop 19 from the gentleman or his booth. If the family believes that Jack would have supported 19 they aren't doing much to show their own support publicly, if in fact they do support 19.

 

[dagnabit]

I met Jack's son Mark at a glass show in Las Vegas last month. There were nice pictures of Jack. Hawaiian shirts worn by Jack. Mark was handing out Beeline (great product to light your weed with), but there was ZERO ZERO ZERO mention of prop 19 from the gentleman or his booth. If the family believes that Jack would have supported 19 they aren't doing much to show their own support publicly, if in fact they do support 19.

do we care what he would have thought?

 

[Hydrosun]

do we care what he would have thought?

Not really because as a society we should control our own destiny and not be guided by the "cold dead hand."

But it is refreshing and possibly opinion forming to hypothesize what great thinkers, activists, and philosophers would think about current social change.

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

 

[Hydrosun]

Sorry your family is full of incest loving hill billies, but it does help me understand you better.

Thanks,

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

Oh come on hydro, I bet even you snickered a little......

 

[Hydrosun]

a little All is fair game in a free society and having thin skin is no good.

 

[hawaiiOG]

For the people that are not for prop19 what are you thinking, well I know your thinking about your self!“Prop 19 is about prioritizing our resources so we can meet the real problems that California faces, while respecting the rights of adults to make decisions free from government intrusion.” – Former Seattle Police Chief Norm Stamper Like Chief Stamper, I support legalization of recreational marijuana and will vote yes on Proposition 19, which would allow Californians age 21 and older to possess up to one ounce of marijuana. Here’s why:
. Marijuana prohibition is an utter, abject failure. Like alcohol prohibition before it, people still use the banned substance. In a 2006 report published in Harm Reduction Journal, Ryan S. King and Marc Mauer wrote that despite 30 years of “aggressively pursuing marijuana,” usage rates remain flat at about 6 percent of the U.S. population. CNBC estimated that the U.S. marijuana market is worth between $10 and $40 billion annually.
. Marijuana prohibition creates a hugely profitable market that gangs exploit. Chief Stamper notes that “Marijuana sales in the United States are the source of 60 percent of Mexican drug cartels’ profit, and the cartels use that money to subsidize more expensive drugs, such as heroin and cocaine, which would otherwise be more expensive due to transportation and production costs.”
It’s senseless to keep failed laws that help violent gangs subsidize production, transportation and marketing of deadly drugs like heroin and cocaine.
. The cost of enforcing marijuana prohibition is exorbitant. CNBC reported on the 2010 study entitled “The Budgetary Implications of Drug Prohibition” by Harvard’s Jeffrey Miron: “… Legalizing marijuana would save $13.7 billion per year in government expenditure on enforcement of prohibition.”
Don’t forget the cost on our overburdened courts, jails and prisons. King and Mauer estimated that in 2001 the nation spent $1.36 billion “on the court processing of marijuana offenders.” They also estimated the annual cost to incarcerate the 27,900 people imprisoned for marijuana offenses at $600 million. This does not include probation and parole costs related to marijuana prohibition convictions.
. Marijuana is not a gateway drug. Numerous studies, including a University of New Hampshire study released this month, dispute the oft-repeated chestnut that marijuana is a “gateway drug” that leads to use of other drugs. Here’s the truth, put succinctly by the Drug Policy Alliance: “Most marijuana users never use any other illegal drug. Indeed, for the large majority of people, marijuana is a terminus rather than a gateway drug.”
In fact, as AlterNet’s Scott Morgan wrote, there’s no such thing as a gateway drug: “The term was invented by hysterical anti-drug zealots for the specific purpose of linking marijuana with harmful outcomes that couldn’t otherwise be established.”
. Legal marijuana can be taxed. The nonpartisan state Legislative Analyst’s Office concluded that if Prop 19 passes, “state and local governments could eventually collect hundreds of millions of dollars annually in additional revenues.”
. Europe’s experience shows that decriminalization won’t lead to increased marijuana use. Cato Institute’s Glenn Greenwald studied Portugal, which decriminalized all drug use in 2001: “Decriminalization has had no adverse effect on drug usage rates in Portugal, which, in numerous categories, are now among the lowest in the EU, particularly when compared with states with stringent criminalization regimes.”
John P. Morgan, M.D. and Lynn Zimmer, Ph.D. noted Holland’s experience: “Despite easy availability, marijuana prevalence among 12 to 18 year olds in Holland is only 13.6 percent – well below the 38 percent use-rate for American high school seniors.”
. Current laws about recreational drugs are inconsistent. If your recreational drug of choice is alcohol or tobacco, you’re in luck. You can enjoy that scotch and cigar without fear. If you prefer marijuana, which is safer than tobacco and alcohol, you risk arrest and imprisonment. This kind of inconsistency leads to widespread disregard for laws and this kind of rank unfairness is un-American.
Let’s restore sanity and fairness to California’s drug laws and pressure our federal lawmakers to follow our example. Let’s heed the lessons of alcohol prohibition: We cannot afford to enforce marijuana prohibition and it’s simply madness to subsidize violent drug cartels by banning a substance that is safer than other already legal recreational drugs like alcohol and tobacco. Let’s use our heads, not our guts, and legalize recreational marijuana use.
Yes on Prop 19.
“Even if one takes every reefer madness allegation of the prohibitionists at face value, marijuana prohibition has done far more harm to far more people than marijuana ever could.”