ICMAG Administration endorses The Regulate, Control and Tax Cannabis Act of 2010

[rives]

j its wording was also intended to be so inclusive as to theoretically act as an interim solution until we fully legalized.

I can guaranty you that for the overwhelming majority of voters who got 215 in, this was not the case. That is what I see as being the problem with everybody running under 215 - it is simply rubbing all of those constituents noses in a decision that they thought was giving sick people access to something helpful. That is why there is a backlash from other states, and why there will eventually be a backlash in California. Certainly cannabis should be legal, that is why we should all vote yes on 19.

 

[dagnabit]

how can you compare Oxycontin, alcohol etc with cannabis?

so according to you those that use the medical loophole to be able to enjoy cannabis are evil?

hm interesting and here was me thinking that forbidding the use of cannabis in the first place was the evil part. anything we do to be able to enjoy our cannabis legally is there for totally fair. with out the evil prohibition you wouldn't have to use medical to stop the government from locking you up like an animal.

i get that 19 needs passing, but really you are coming off more like some kind of jack ass dea agent swearing about the medical users getting away with using cannabis, omg how evil? roflmao. even comparing cannabis to basically heroin for fucks sake? wow never thought i'd hear that comparison on ic mag. comparing the most benign substance on the planet with the deadliest when it comes to mind altering stuff.

i think your missing the point..

those who abuse the med system "because it makes me feel high" are the example pointed to by anti med people in other states..
so in a way they are in part responsible for legitimate patients being denied meds..

as for the "comparison" why would you not compare your pain medications?
or do you not believe cannabis is medication?

 

[localhero]

i think this whole abusing the system thing stems from many people feeling guilty for using medicinal cannabis for recreational smoking. well relax you have no reason to feel bad. 215 was written that way, for all people, dire and not to have access to cannabis. otherwise cali would have written a much more narrow version of 215 much like other states have.

dont feel bad that other states didnt have the balls to write their own medical laws with such all encompassing terminology. remember, cali leads the way, they can be led to the water. they dont have to drink.

would these other states have had medical laws at all without cali writing 215?

dont worry about them. let them legitimize cannabis in the way they see fit, and i hope they all eventually create a full legalization prop.

it upsets people here who feel that guilt and then see some kid flaunting 215 like its a rap video. by hating that person, you justify the opposition. you hurt your cause.

i would say to a naysayer who was anti marijuana and feels that med is just a smokescreen for legalization:

well, whats so bad about legalization? id rather those kids in the rap video smoke a j then drink a 40, wouldnt you? lets legalize it so those kids dont have to get a drs rec.

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

how can you compare Oxycontin, alcohol etc with cannabis?

so according to you those that use the medical loophole to be able to enjoy cannabis are evil?

hm interesting and here was me thinking that forbidding the use of cannabis in the first place was the evil part. anything we do to be able to enjoy our cannabis legally is there for totally fair. with out the evil prohibition you wouldn't have to use medical to stop the government from locking you up like an animal.

i get that 19 needs passing, but really you are coming off more like some kind of jack ass dea agent swearing about the medical users getting away with using cannabis, omg how evil? roflmao. even comparing cannabis to basically heroin for fucks sake? wow never thought i'd hear that comparison on ic mag. comparing the most benign substance on the planet with the deadliest when it comes to mind altering stuff.

You completely missed the point I was trying to make, which is we need to pass 19 so that rec users don't need to hide under 215 to enjoy a smoke, thus helping to legitify the mmj scene in California, as well as across the nation.

 

[vta]

I'm voting no.

And after reading this thread over a few more times than I should have, I'm going to do more than just vote.

I just made a donation of our hard earned $$$$ to,

http://www.noonproposition19.com/

That's where we stand.

bb57
madds

ftp

Good for you man! You just joined this "list"....


http://www.noonproposition19.com/endorsements/display
Opponents of Prop 19

Gary Haskin ( Councilmember , City of Escalon )
City of Covina
City of Escalon
Kerry Condon ( President , Anaheim Police Association )
Anaheim Police Association
Diane Hargis ( Fraud Investigator , Vacaville Police Department )
Carmelita Garcia ( Mayor , CIty of Pacific Grove )
Bill Gore ( Sheriff , San Diego County )
Dean Flippo ( District Attorney , Monterey County )
Orange County Coalition of Police and Sheriffs
Association of California School Administrators
City of Fontana
William Bowen ( Police Chief , Rio Vista Police Department )
Das Williams ( Councilmember , City of Santa Barbara )
Joseph McKeown ( Retired Police Chief )
City of Half Moon Bay
Stanley Henry ( Police Chief , Cathedral City Police Department )
Virginia Black ( Retired Sheriff , Yuba County )
Clay Parker ( Sheriff , Tehama County )
Bill Cogbill ( Sheriff , Sonoma County )
Gary Stanton ( Sheriff , Solano County )
Rick Riggins ( Sheriff , Siskiyou County )
John Evans ( Sheriff , Sierra County )
Tom Bosenko ( Sheriff , Shasta County )
Steve Moore ( Sheriff , San Joaquin County )
Curtis Hill ( Sheriff , San Benito County )
Edward Bonner ( Sheriff , Placer County )
Sandra Hutchens ( Sheriff , Orange County )
Doug Koford ( Sheriff , Napa County )
Mike Kanalakis ( Sheriff , Monterey County )
Rick Scholl ( Sheriff , Mono County )
Tom Sawyer ( Retired Sheriff , Merced County )
Tom Allman ( Sheriff , Mendocino County )
John Anderson ( Sheriff , Madera County )
Steven Warren ( Sheriff , Lassen County )
Bill Lutze ( Sheriff , Inyo County )
Warren Rupf ( Sheriff , Contra Costa County )
Martin Ryan ( Sheriff , Amador County )
John Crombach ( Police Chief , Oxnard Police Department )
James Anderson ( Police Chief , Placentia Police Department )
Tom Chapman ( Police Chief , Arcata Police Department )
Lisa Solomon ( Police Chief , Paso Robles Police Department )
Jacqueline Seabrooks ( Police Chief , Inglewood Police Department )
Mario Krstic ( Police Chief , Farmersville Police Department )
Patrick McGrath ( District Attorney , Yuba County )
Louis Fetherolf ( Police Chief , Salinas Police Department )
Michael Ramsey ( District Attorney , Butte County )
Jim Copsey ( Police Chief , Grover Beach Police Department )
William Olson ( Commander , Placer Special Investigation Unit )
John Schaefer ( Police Chief , San Marino Police Department )
David Lawton ( Police Chief , San Gabriel Police Department )
Thomas Sonoff ( Police Chief , Signal Hill Police Department )
Brian Bowles ( Police Chief , Yreka Police Department )
Paul Cooper ( Police Chief , Claremont Police Department )
Robert Sanderson ( Police Chief , Arcadia Police Department )
Michael McCrary ( Police Chief , Wheatland Police Department )
Steve Smith ( Police Chief , Blythe Police Department )
Joel Bryden ( Police Chief , Walnut Creek Police Department )
James Shaw ( Police Chief , Escalon Police Department )
Stephen Lodge ( Police Chief , Santa Clara Police Department )
Brian Klier ( Interim Police Chief , Sutter Creek Police Department )
Ronald DePompa ( Police Chief , Glendale Police Department )
Mark Siemens ( Police Chief , Rocklin Police Department )
Carlos Mestas ( Police Chief , Hanford Police Department )
Phil Green ( Police Chief , Twin Cities Police Authority )
Peter Hansen ( Police Chief , Redding Police Department )
Kim Raney ( Police Chief , Covina Police Department )
Charlie Parsons ( President/CEO, D.A.R.E. America )
D.A.R.E. America
Los Angeles County Police Chiefs Association
U.S. Senator Dianne Feinstein
Atwater Village Chamber of Commerce
Steve Cooley ( District Attorney , Los Angeles County )
California College, Career and Technical Education Charter School
California Chamber of Commerce
Paul Chabot ( Founder, Coalition for a Drug Free California )
Inland Valley Drug Free Community Coalition
CIA Investigation Academy
Coalition for a Drug-Free California
Jacqueline Jackson ( Deputy District Attorney , Riverside County )
Californians for Drug Free Youth
Dana Stevens ( Public Health Advocate )
Dolores Carr ( District Attorney , Santa Clara County )
Loretta Adarne ( Program Coordinator )
Linda Ledesma ( Juvenile Justice Coordinator )
Ken Strang ( Pharmacist , San Diego )
San Dieguito Alliance
Protect Our Society
Jim Provenza ( Commissioner, Oceanside Police and Fire Commission )
Gary Philp ( Sheriff , Humboldt County )
Peace Officers Association of Los Angeles County
Erica Leary ( Oceanside, CA )
David Paulson ( District Attorney , Solano County )
J. Kirk Andrus ( District Attorney , Siskiyou County )
Lorrac Craig ( Sheriff , Trinity County )
Debbie Obregon ( Oceanside, CA )
Maria Russell ( Oceanside, CA )
North Coastal Prevention Coalition
California District Attorneys Association
Rod Hoops ( Sheriff , San Bernardino County )
Gary Lieberstein ( District Attorney , Napa County )
Phillip Cline ( District Attorney , Tulare County )
Manfred Kollar ( Sheriff , El Dorado County )
CALM
California Association of Code Enforcement Officers
California Narcotic Officers' Association
Bradford Fenocchio ( District Attorney , Placer County )
Margaret Mims ( Sheriff , Fresno County )
Bill Brown ( Sheriff , Santa Barbara County )
California State Sheriffs' Association
Michael Harper ( District Attorney , Trinity County )
Birgit Fladager ( District Attorney , Stanislaus County )
Adam Christianson ( Sheriff , Stanislaus County )
E. G. Prieto ( Sheriff , Yolo County )
Scott Marshall ( Sheriff , Colusa County )
Jim & Carol Long ( Retired Special Investigator , Madera County )
Jan Scully ( District Attorney , Sacramento County )
Elizabeth Egan ( District Attorney , Fresno County )
Bishop, Dr. Ron Allen
Robert Brown ( District Attorney , Mariposa County )
Robert Holzapfel ( District Attorney , Glenn County )
Dwayne Stewart ( Assistant District Attorney , Glenn County )
Dennis Downum ( Sheriff , Calaveras County )
Donny Youngblood ( Sheriff , Kern County )
Arthur Maillet ( District Attorney , Inyo County )
James Fox ( District Attorney , San Mateo County )
Robert Kochly ( District Attorney , Contra Costa County )
Gilbert Otero ( District Attorney , Imperial County )
Todd Riebe ( District Attorney , Amador County )
Gregory Totten ( District Attorney , Ventura County )
Michael Ramos ( District Attorney , San Bernardino County )
George Booth ( District Attorney , Mono County )
PRIDE-Omaha, Inc.
Cliff Newell ( District Attorney , Nevada County )
J. Paul Parker ( Sheriff , Sutter County )
California District Attorney Investigators' Association
Keith Royal ( Sheriff , Nevada County )
John Poyner ( District Attorney , Colusa County )
Gregory Ahern ( Sheriff , Alameda County )
Gerald Benito ( District Attorney , Shasta County )
Steven Durfor ( Sheriff , Yuba County )
Brian Muller ( Sheriff , Mariposa County )
Barbara Gordon
Shaun Keating ( Author )
Jeff Reisig ( District Attorney , Yolo County )
Save Our Society from Drugs
Mothers Against Drunk Driving
International Faith Based Coalition
CoachAmerica
California Police Chiefs Association
California Peace Officer’s Association ( John Standish, President )
California Correctional Supervisors Organization
California Bus Association
Nate Holden ( California State Senate, retired; Los Angeles City ouncil, retired )
Alexandra Datig
Bonnie Dumanis ( District Attorney, San Diego County )

 

[MoldyFrogToe]

Well that's awkward.

 

[vta]

So...lets check out http://www.noonproposition19.com/about

Here is what they are saying...I'll add my in Green

Proposition 19 is a chaotic initiative filled with major flaws that will have severe, unintended consequences for California. Prop. 19 poses a major threat to public safety in California and will make our roads, workplaces and communities less safe. Proposition 19:

*Fantastic intro from LE meant to entice fear

Expressly omits any definition of what constitutes being “under the influence” of marijuana. Proponents did not include a standard for “driving under the influence,” and there are no correlative tests between marijuana and driving skills as there are for alcohol. Therefore, a driver may legally drive even if a blood test shows they have marijuana in their system.

*I sure can see how LE would hate this...but for us Not only that but they just gave us are argument to beat dui's

States that you cannot use marijuana while driving, but makes it completely permissible to use marijuana just prior to getting behind the wheel. No driver over 21, including bus, taxi, light rail train operators, or everyday commuters can be required to be drug-free while operating a vehicle under Proposition 19.

*Nice! Finally some Freedom

Prevents employers who operate transportation companies or have company vehicles from requiring employees operating these vehicles be drug free. Companies won’t be able to take action against a “stoned” driver until after he or she has a wreck, not before, opening up a tremendous liability question for employers.

*As the way it should be. Stay out of my personal life...MAN

Does not regulate marijuana like alcohol or tobacco. Rather, Proposition 19 leaves to cities and counties the task of individually regulating marijuana within their own borders. This approach will limit, not enhance, California’s ability to control marijuana.

*Allows us to get away with the FED/STATE conflict and sets up some places to be cannabis meccas!!

Would not eliminate the need for illicit marijuana dealers as a large segment of marijuana users are under the age of 21 and therefore will still not be able to legally purchase marijuana.

*Our closet growers need someone to sell to.

Would place hundreds of employers, including public schools, at risk of violating the Federal Workplace Act of 1988 which mandates the necessity of a drug-free workplace. This is why public school superintendent John Snavely, Ed.D. warns that Proposition 19 could cost our K-12 schools as much as $9.4 billion in lost federal funding as well as the loss of millions of dollars in federal grants for our state colleges and universities.

*Same shit they said about 215 and the money never stopped. Just another fear tactic.

If passed, licensed marijuana dealers would be able to advertise without restriction, near schools, libraries and parks, just like cigarette companies. This is made possible by a U.S. Supreme Court decision in 2001 entitled Lorillard Tobacco Co. v. Reilly (US Sup. Ct., Opinion per O’Connor) which struck down as unconstitutional a Massachusetts statute which banned tobacco ads within 1000 feet of a school or playground.

*Well gezz...how else am I suppose to know who's got the dank?

Would forbid school bus drivers from smoking marijuana on schools grounds or while actually behind the wheel, but a bus driver could arrive for work with marijuana in his or her system, thereby placing hundreds of school children at risk on a daily basis.

*Stupid people do stupid things...We shall not stand for a nanny state. I would like to see the stats on stoned bus drivers and all the accidents they cause.



Its Impact on Business

Proposition 19 presents a grave threat to California businesses and workplace safety.

Oh no!!!! Save us from ourselves LE!!

The CalChamber Board voted to oppose Proposition 19, the “Regulate, Control and Tax Cannabis Act,” because it could result in employers losing public contracts and grants because they could no longer effectively enforce the drug-free workplace requirements outlined by the federal government.

Also, current law allows employers to discipline employees who are “under the influence” of drugs or alcohol. This proposal would create a separate and higher standard for marijuana use to a level that requires the employer to prove that the employee is “actually impaired” from performing his or her job duties as a result of drug use.

That's great because I would rather my coworker have pot in his system versus ...oh say Whiskey.

According to an analysis released by the Los Angeles County District Attorney’s office, a California employer will no longer be able to: “screen job applicants for marijuana use; regulate any employee conduct related to the use, transportation or cultivation of marijuana unless the employer can prove job impairment; or choose to maintain a drug-free workplace consistent with federal law.”

If an employer allows employees cigarette smoking breaks and/or certain areas in which cigarette smoking is allowed, they would have to allow marijuana smoking as well.

This initiative would also prohibit bus, trucking and transit companies from requiring employees to be drug-free. If passed, Proposition 19 promises to be a legal quagmire for California businesses, raising significant liability issues.

Proposition 19 is strongly opposed by Mothers Against Drunk Driving (MADD) and virtually the entire law enforcement community.

Wow...so you mean 19 gives us back some of the rights you assholes took from us in the 90's. Does this mean that I can piss on your leg now instead of your fukin cup?


So...MaddsVonF...you gave these guys money?

 

[subrob]

Good for you man! You just joined this "list"....


http://www.noonproposition19.com/endorsements/display
Opponents of Prop 19

thats called slammin the lid!

 

[rives]

Ummmm..... cutting your nose off to spite your face much?

 

[localhero]

yeah im not sure if it would be a wise choice to put your no on 19 money to that site. you might end up promoting the very weird anti cannabis mentality that we are trying to oppose.

unless madvon was trying to make a point? like hey, this is the anti site, is this what the no votes are about? lol.

 

[Hammerhead]

as we all know trying to teach old dogs new tricks is very difficult if not impossible. These naysayers are in it to the end and I commend you guys for trying to shed the truth on the matter but no matter how hard we try I can tell they don't want any part of whats right. They are going by what they think is right even when they know there wrong.

 

[dagnabit]

if you believe that loser donated so much as his time to even read the noon19 website ive got a bridge for sale...

the uneducated are usually universally so imho.

 

[MaddsVonF]

Is there one page here among one hundred and twenty six that contains no name calling, slams, bully tactics, scare tactics?

Kind of an indicator,,,,,,,,,,

 

[Shcrews]

what happens to california's borders if this passes?

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

Is there one page here among one hundred and twenty six that contains no name calling, slams, bully tactics, scare tactics?

Kind of an indicator,,,,,,,,,,

Awww you wittle fweeings get hurt?

The fact that you would come to a pro legalization site and profess how ignorant we are to vote for 19 and to even further spit in our faces by saying you donated to the police to help shoot this prop down entitles you to any and all critcism, and justly so.

Amazing that people who dedicate their lifes to this plant would get upset with people like you.

Like others have said, I find it hard to believe I'm debating legalization with what I thought were fellow smokers on our side.

Personally, I know we are all allowed our own opinions, but I believe people who openly oppose legalization for whatever asinine reason should be permenantly banned from this site.

You want to tell everyone what a piece of shit prop this is, then go hang out with your cop buddies on a LEO forum. I'm sick of hearing the same bogus rhetoric repeated over and over.

You antis all have the same path.

1) Make any claim to sway votes.
2) Realize your false claims hold no weight.
3) Realize nobody is fooled by your lies.
4) Play the victim.
5) Dissapear from the conversation.

Your on step 4. And soon you will have been just another anti that we will be happy to forget...

 

[MaddsVonF]

Same thing that's been going on for DECADES. Wide open flowage.

 

[MaddsVonF]

Wowzers,

so if i don't see it "your" way,,

 

[rives]

Madds - I agree, some of the discourse has gotten a little heated but I think that is mainly due to some folks unrelenting denial of facts garnishing an inability to do research. Of course that's just my view, but when people state outright lies and refuse to check sources that are on almost every page, it gets a bit frustrating. I've read this thing since the beginning, and it has been a loooong time since a new argument came up. It seems that no one wants to go back a few pages and actually see what has already been discussed. And then we have you making a spectacular gesture in the wrong direction, climbing snugly into bed with all the wrong people. Yep, it's a little irritating. I thought that voters with that level of competence all lived in Florida.

 

[JJScorpio]

I really found this post to be an eye opener.

When the hell did this seperation occur amongst growers? Why the hell would anyone turn down whats being offered? It gets the door open. After that people can work to get it expanded.

And now people are using this site to brag they donated money to a site that posts reports that cops are against this Bill?

Is greed really that powerful? Is jealousy that powerful? I guess we've seen it all now.

I would just like an answer. When did this happen? Twenty years ago everyone would have been partying in the streets and waiting in line for days hoping to be the first to vote yes. Now it's going to be a fight to get it passed. I can't even stomach seeing cops, DA's and smokers all on the same side fighting legalization. It isn't right.............

Awww you wittle fweeings get hurt?

The fact that you would come to a pro legalization site and profess how ignorant we are to vote for 19 and to even further spit in our faces by saying you donated to the police to help shoot this prop down entitles you to any and all critcism, and justly so.

Amazing that people who dedicate their lifes to this plant would get upset with people like you.

Like others have said, I find it hard to believe I'm debating legalization with what I thought were fellow smokers on our side.

Personally, I know we are all allowed our own opinions, but I believe people who openly oppose legalization for whatever asinine reason should be permenantly banned from this site.

You want to tell everyone what a piece of shit prop this is, then go hang out with your cop buddies on a LEO forum. I'm sick of hearing the same bogus rhetoric repeated over and over.

You antis all have the same path.

1) Make any claim to sway votes.
2) Realize your false claims hold no weight.
3) Realize nobody is fooled by your lies.
4) Play the victim.
5) Dissapear from the conversation.

Your on step 4. And soon you will have been just another anti that we will be happy to forget...

 

[MaddsVonF]

Actually, we're kinda getting settled in here.

Got us some fresh popped, a fresh cuppa, and a damn near endless curiosity.

Think we'll hang around and see how this plays out.

Been a darn fine show so far, human nature being what it is and all that,,,,