End of flower...leaves color changing question

[greentrich]

Ok so I'm still fairly new at this. While I have the majority of the process down...the end of flower seems to be my question of the day.

I am in my second to last week and my leaves are not lightening up in color. Still the same nice lush green. But when I see flower pics of other grows, I see really light colorful leaves, some droopy and look like they're about to fall off. I have also read here in ICmag that if they if there is still lushy greeness at the end..."you did it wrong".

So my questions: Is this a natural phenomenon per the life cycle of the plant/strain, or is this lack of color and leaves dropping induced by the grower? If it is induced, how so? Also, how soon before the "chop" is this lightening process supposed to happen?

For clarity...I am in Botanicare's moisture formula coco with all BT nutes as well. This is my best cycle so far and just trying to make it the best I can (and clean as possible).

Thanks in advance.

 

[ThePizzaMan]

What you are seeing is probably what we refer to as the "flush".

Many growers flush their plants with plain water 7-10 days prior to chop. This is why you see yellow dying leaves and heavy brown buds. If plants are in mid flower, and you are seeing a change in color...this is due to some form of deficiency.

 

[gaiusmarius]

yes normally people like to stop feeding plants near the end and giving only water for a certain time. if your flowering plants big fan leaves are still dark green and healthy it only means you have fed them well so far.

when you get to the point where you think they are just about ready, in coco coir 1 week before harvest day is great. then do a big watering with plain ph corrected water. put enough water through the coco that the nutrient level is as low as possible, then just continue giving plain water at normal watering times till harvest day.

when the buds are properly dried, you should get a nice white ash when you smoke bud from well flushed plants.

 

[greentrich]

What you are seeing is probably what we refer to as the "flush".

Right on, that's what I thought. Just wasn't sure. I've never flushed for a week, maybe a day or two. So I've never had the leaves lighten up on me. I will do a flush 10 days prior, and plain water for the rest of their life. Just wasn't sure if this was a inherent plant thing, or if it was induced. This will also be a good experiment for me to see if it really makes a difference to flush or not to.

if your flowering plants big fan leaves are still dark green and healthy it only means you have fed them well so far.

Yup...that's the state they're in. I even noticed a couple 12 fingered leaves. Is that normal too?? They're not too green to show and N toxicity, but still pretty green and lush. I look forward to them turning Autumn colors.

I'm really interested to see if this makes a difference.

Thanks all!

 

[gaiusmarius]

well those autumn colors you some times see on pics can have different causes. they can develop those colors due to cold temps, also through genetic tendencies. the flush and just water regime in the last week of your coco grow will not cause your leaves to go totally autumn color, that also takes the plant to be over ripe a bit, or at least very very ripe. most people tend to harvest before that point. a lightening of the leaves shows that they have not been getting new N, which is the main thing for the best taste, if you want the leaves to get all yellow and brown red etc, you will need to feed with just water for longer then just 1 week after the big flush. depending how ripe, strong, lush and well fed the plant is when you start the flush, it can take longer. also make it as cold as you can at the end phase for those colors to really show up.

yes plants will some times make massive fan leaves with a bunch of fingers, my cats just love those fan leaves.

 

[greentrich]

Awesome, thanks for the explanation GM. I don't know 2 of my strains....dank bagseed. But one is a bubbakush, not even sure what version of BK it is. Yes I will be harvesting before the very very ripe stage. I don't like being too sedated. I typically like more milky than amber trichs.

I figured the majority of the colors were due to strain, but wanted to make sure I was doing things properly this time. So I'll just give 'em a weeks flush and be done. The only problem I have now is keeping the temps down. I'm in a very warm region and running the A/C is getting too expensive. So I'll just shoot for the normal yellowing.

One more question GM, you stated

a lightening of the leaves shows that they have not been getting new N, which is the main thing for the best taste...

, does this mean N is better for taste, or LESS N is better for taste.

Sorry for being such a pest.
Thank you!

 

[buddin_904]

more

lol

 

[Calimed]

Is 7-10 days all you need in coco? I thought it was supposed to be more like 14?

 

[Dirtfinger]

I'm new to coco and in organic dirt I didn't really flush as it was always running out of everything by that point anyway.

14 days seems like a long time to flush something that doesn't have any nutrient content of its own.

I would think 4-5 days (watering 1-2 times per day) would flush not only the medium but also any mobile elements out of the plant. Non-mobile elements are in there for good and can't be flushed anyway.

Any longer than that and you're just forcing the plant to finish whether it would have naturally or not - death by starvation. If you have your stuff dialed in perfectly then I suppose you could synchronize this with the end of the natural life cycle of your strain.

I also think too much flushing promotes mold and rot in buds that are susceptible to it, especially if you like to harvest a little over-ripe.

If you're not grossly overfeeding a flush shouldn't make that much of a difference anyway, but like I said, I'm new to coco.

 

[dunkybones]

If you're near harvest and your plants are still nice and green, it sounds to me like whatever it is you are doing, is getting done right. Feeding straight water for the last week is all the plants will need, they'll lighten up a bit, maybe get a little crispy, but probably not turn all crazy autumn colors. The only time my plants have turned crazy autumn colors is when they got overfed at some point.

My plants don't seem to take up much nutes once they hit the ripening phase, so I'll back the nute strength down for the week before they get flushed. That way the flush is more productive, and I'm not feeding the plants more than they want. My avg. yeild is 32 oz. off 12 plants under 1200w for 8 weeks.

 

[gingerale]

well the fan leaves should yellow up and drop off for sure

 

[greentrich]

If you're near harvest and your plants are still nice and green, it sounds to me like whatever it is you are doing, is getting done right. Feeding straight water for the last week is all the plants will need, they'll lighten up a bit, maybe get a little crispy, but probably not turn all crazy autumn colors. The only time my plants have turned crazy autumn colors is when they got overfed at some point.

My plants don't seem to take up much nutes once they hit the ripening phase, so I'll back the nute strength down for the week before they get flushed. That way the flush is more productive, and I'm not feeding the plants more than they want. My avg. yeild is 32 oz. off 12 plants under 1200w for 8 weeks.

Thanks Dunky, very informative. That seems to be exactly where I'm at right now. I'm in my second to last week and the plants have slowed down their uptake, meanwhile I've been backing the nutes off gradually over the course of this week in prep for next weeks flush. I wasn't really looking for the crazy colors I see in some pics as I've found out that is mainly related to strain, cold temps, and now as you've stated....little too much food. And like I said, out my three strains I only know of one that is specific...so I don't even know what they're supposed to look like at the end. But I was really looking for the lightening of the foliage and wanted to make sure I was doing things correctly.

This is my third time around the block (ya I'm still a noob), but the first two I did not flush and harvested very green plants. This time I will flush once and then plain PH'd water for a week and see if that makes a difference in taste and smoothness. It's a great grow so far and I want the end to be as perfect as possible.

Thanks for everyone's replies...very helpful!!!

Edit: Ok, another quick question. Is a leaching agent like Clearex or something else really necessary?? If it is, is there something else I could use at home that I don't have to go to the hydro store to by? I ran out of Clearex and don't really wanna go by a bottle of this stuff just to use once.

 

[3dDream]

Is this a natural phenomenon per the life cycle of the plant/strain, or is this lack of color and leaves dropping induced by the grower? If it is induced, how so? Also, how soon before the "chop" is this lightening process supposed to happen?

I think I am inducing a natural phenomenon


I have done tests with coco and pureblend pro you need at least 7 days to get the poop out. BTW I grow in cups so my flush is a bit more effective than a large pot. I flush to get the green out of my plants. I start flushing when the first set of flowers are done swelling up and the pistils go brown. Also some plants can take a month+ of plain water to wrap up. It all depends on when you cut out the food and how you like your smoke. I monitor the smell, the bract size, the leaf color, and the trics color to determine when to chop. Experiment w/ clones to find out the best time to chop. I have an f13 that is better 50% purple/green than 100% green or 100% purple.

some long flushed plants 3+ weeks:

 

[xmobotx]

i for 1 prefer to see "fall colors" moreso than yellowing and drying up

some strains do not have such a striking senescence as others - maybe check what other growers flower pix look like of your strain

BTW, in an organic grow plants enter senescence and get fall colors even in the presence of nutes. the purpose for flushing your coco nutes is more about getting the nutes out of the medium in hopes they will not be present in excess in your final product

the plant will show 'fall colors' or not all on it's own

 

[dunkybones]

Edit: Ok, another quick question. Is a leaching agent like Clearex or something else really necessary?? If it is, is there something else I could use at home that I don't have to go to the hydro store to by? I ran out of Clearex and don't really wanna go by a bottle of this stuff just to use once.

Clearex isn't necessary, water is fine.

 

[gaiusmarius]

I'm new to coco and in organic dirt I didn't really flush as it was always running out of everything by that point anyway.

14 days seems like a long time to flush something that doesn't have any nutrient content of its own.

I would think 4-5 days (watering 1-2 times per day) would flush not only the medium but also any mobile elements out of the plant. Non-mobile elements are in there for good and can't be flushed anyway.

Any longer than that and you're just forcing the plant to finish whether it would have naturally or not - death by starvation. If you have your stuff dialed in perfectly then I suppose you could synchronize this with the end of the natural life cycle of your strain.

I also think too much flushing promotes mold and rot in buds that are susceptible to it, especially if you like to harvest a little over-ripe.

If you're not grossly overfeeding a flush shouldn't make that much of a difference anyway, but like I said, I'm new to coco.

this is a very good post, the mold can really hit those fat colas if you flush too long, that's why i never do more then a week sometimes only 5 days. it really goes rather fast in coco. that is why i always tell folks to wait with the flush till they see the first 5 or 10% trichome heads turning amber. also because as you said it can cause plants to start finishing flowering early if you begin the flush too early.

someone made a rather good point about bio grown plants finishing up colorful, this is totally correct, bio farmers get beautiful fan leaves at harvest

puff puff pass

 

[greentrich]

Clearex isn't necessary, water is fine.

Perfect...thanx Dunky

I also think too much flushing promotes mold and rot in buds that are susceptible to it, especially if you like to harvest a little over-ripe.

the mold can really hit those fat colas if you flush too long

Can someone explain this for me. I'm not understanding how this is possible, not that I am doubting anyone....I would just like to know how watering with plain water vs. a nute mix can promote mold/rot. As a preventative measure I guess.

Thanks again!!

 

[Dirtfinger]

Perfect...thanx Dunky

Can someone explain this for me. I'm not understanding how this is possible, not that I am doubting anyone....I would just like to know how watering with plain water vs. a nute mix can promote mold/rot. As a preventative measure I guess.

Thanks again!!

This is just my observations and interpretation of what's going but here goes.

If you give the plant only water at a critical time when it wants nutes to finish up (remember its life goal is to produce seed and it will keep trying until it naturally dies) it will take up more water in an effort to get the nutes you took away. This makes the entire plant including the buds hold more moisture which is never good if there is any susceptibility to rot or mold. The denser the buds, the more likely they are to get rot.

Plants do run low on nutrients by harvest time when grown naturally, but they don't go from super-mega-bloom-blasting with metallic salts to absolutely nothing in a few days.

This is just my opinion, but I think not over nuting and tapering off gradually the last week or two down to a weak solution would be better than overfeeding and then trying to flush it all out at the end.

*If you really want to use Clearex you can make your own with a little corn syrup and water, but imo it's kind of a gimmicky waste of time and money.

 

[greentrich]

Thanks Dirtfinger. I was pondering this while lying in bed last night and that was the only logical solution I could come up with....glad to know my logic is backed up by someone with experience. Sometimes MY logic is illogical.

So with that philosophy in mind...with a couple others...I started tapering the nutes off about two days ago in prep for Sunday's flush, and Friday's chop.

With yours and Dunkey's input I've decided to forgo the Clearex. They got a good dose of it about three weeks ago (that's when I ran out), so I'm assuming just a good 'ol flush will do the trick.

Corn syrup and water huh?? Good to know! I would have never thought corn syrup as a cheleting agent.

Very informative thread everyone. Thanks for all the help!

 

[Dirtfinger]

Thanks Dirtfinger. I was pondering this while lying in bed last night and that was the only logical solution I could come up with....glad to know my logic is backed up by someone with experience. Sometimes MY logic is illogical.

So with that philosophy in mind...with a couple others...I started tapering the nutes off about two days ago in prep for Sunday's flush, and Friday's chop.

With yours and Dunkey's input I've decided to forgo the Clearex. They got a good dose of it about three weeks ago (that's when I ran out), so I'm assuming just a good 'ol flush will do the trick.

Corn syrup and water huh?? Good to know! I would have never thought corn syrup as a cheleting agent.

Very informative thread everyone. Thanks for all the help!

If I remember right, the ingredients listed on the Clearex label are glucose, sucrose, and water. I'm guessing it's corn syrup since that's the cheapest way to make what is essentially sugar water.

I was told in a thread not too long ago that the idea was to give the plant something to eat in place of the nutes while flushing. I'm not so sure that isn't a lot of bullshit based on a little research for marketing purposes.

Everyone has their own tastes, but personally I like to harvest from a healthy mature plant just like the veggies in my garden. I want the plants happy to the end and going out in a blaze of glory, not all depressed and limping out on crutches. Doesn't always work out that way, but that's what I aim for.