All ears.

[jaykush]

. I know this feeling you're talking about, of course, but this is the feeling of the smoke interacting with the lung walls, not expanding in the lungs. Even the cleanest smoke, taken in too large a volume, will cause discomfort. But generally, the great smoke of the world can fill the average smokers' lungs with a rasta-sized hit, and cause no urge to cough. This smoke is rare to find, but I tell you, fellow smokers and searchers for the very best in the world... it IS out there, and you CAN grow smoke like this.

one way i have found to describe this to others, is if they have smoked good hookah. it is practically smoking flavored air. great weed should be better than that. and as i have said before, like smoking amazingly smooth flavored stoney air.

 

[Crazy Composer]

^^^ A person with enough of a frame-of-reference to speak about what great weed should smoke like.
It's understandable, though, that if you've never experienced the highest levels of cannabis quality, the best you've ever had is the best you've ever had... how can you know there's something better, or what that's like? I feel for these people, I really do... but when some of these people try to give advice about what makes the best smoke, it's misplaced information.

 

[VerdantGreen]

thats good news - i always find that other people's weed makes me cough rather easily and it tastes and smells rubbish compared to my own.

personally i also think that guanos are one thing that takes the taste and aroma to the next level... shame that many of them are questionable when it comes to sustainability

V.

 

[Retardo Motabon]

Whaz up MP? Thought I'd give you a couple tips on your new exploration. Organic soils have available salts in them that are measurable most of the time. Dont stop your metering, folks may tell you its pointless. FFOF measures over 3000ppms out of the bag and the pH is almost always closer to 5.5 then 6. Yeah, thats a hot soil.
Roots Organics soil measured closer to 4000ppms out of the bag.
I never put a plant in soil without at least a baseline to start from.
Micrroherd or not, pH is important, keep metering so you dont end up starting with fkd soil on a grow. Go easy if you use molasses. Folks recommend a tblsp a gallon when watering which will read at 300-400ppm. Go with a teaspoon per gallon. If you use molasses at the end of the cycle, make sure you cut it off the last week at least. It may give dense frosty nugs but can leave the taste kinda nasty if you overdo it. The flowers dont burn as well in those cases either. It would be interesting to see you try the basic mix offered here with something easy cheesy like the chem4
and run it side by side with your planting mix and nute program.
See how they compare for you and go from there.
RM

 

[bombadil.360]

never mind the partisan thing, that was just playing around. I don't care to quibble about what you said, it's there to read. But I believe you meant to retract your assertion re: heavy metals. You have not quite done that.

Can you tell me why you are worried about nutrients that can't be flushed? If they aren't water soluble the plant can't take them up. They are not in play. Blood meal is chock full of urea, and is the equivalent of guano IMO. But by the time I cook my soil for 2-3 months, it's not urea anymore.

retract what assertion? that there are better ingredients to make an organic medium mix than others?

that blood and fish emulsions are not the best choices? not only because these two have traces of undesirable metals but mainly because they linger on the soil for longer than desired when trying to grow cannabis low on nutes?

I don't see what do you disagree with or what your beef is.

also, your argument about nutrients not being water soluble is not too realistic; afterall, cannabis is able to absorb things like iron, in fact, plants need a bit of it; but what happens when you overdose with iron?

why would a grower trying to grow organically choose organic ingredients that have excess of what they actually need to grow smooth smoke?

maybe you are missing the point.

 

[idoreallytry]

Whaz up MP? Thought I'd give you a couple tips on your new exploration. Organic soils have available salts in them that are measurable most of the time. Dont stop your metering, folks may tell you its pointless. FFOF measures over 3000ppms out of the bag and the pH is almost always closer to 5.5 then 6. Yeah, thats a hot soil.
Roots Organics soil measured closer to 4000ppms out of the bag.
I never put a plant in soil without at least a baseline to start from.
Micrroherd or not, pH is important, keep metering so you dont end up starting with fkd soil on a grow. Go easy if you use molasses. Folks recommend a tblsp a gallon when watering which will read at 300-400ppm. Go with a teaspoon per gallon. If you use molasses at the end of the cycle, make sure you cut it off the last week at least. It may give dense frosty nugs but can leave the taste kinda nasty if you overdo it. The flowers dont burn as well in those cases either. It would be interesting to see you try the basic mix offered here with something easy cheesy like the chem4
and run it side by side with your planting mix and nute program.
See how they compare for you and go from there.
RM

sounds like a plan,,,a side by side...peace

 

[bombadil.360]

i find my self using less and less nutrients and or soil amendments grow after grow. its fascinating that my plants still swell and fatten up..
good living soil is just a piece of the puzzle in organic great tasting buds.

remember that the main source of food for plants is light photosynthesis and all.

if the roots find a good medium, enough water, it will not grow without light; yet plants can grow with crappy soil and little water but with enough sun.

light quality is very important when considering plant nutrition.

 

[solarz]

Well, as long as your soil is still healthy and occupied by beneficial bacterium and fungi, your top-feeding of 10-10-2 is perfect. I've been in the same position as you are in now... know this... once a leaf goes yellow, it can never come all the way back to healthy green... but remember this also... you are not growing leaves, you are growing buds... so keep them barely fed, just enough to keep them from getting any worse. Then... starve the hell out of it for the last couple weeks... let the leaves fall off and everything!

Now, something to note about sativa dominant plants (which I'm not sure if your plant actually is sativa dominant)... sativa dominant plants tend to keep growing roots through their entire life cycle... right through flower... which means you can transplant them half way through flower without any problem at all. Just make sure the soil you use is very, very light in organic material so you don't end up with more nutrient by harvest time than you want. The extra root space would take some stress off the plant and probably give you a better yield than if you kept it in the 2 gallon pot. Again, this is only for sativa dominant plants. Indica plants grow roots profusely up until about 3 weeks into flower... then all growth emphasis goes to the top. So, if you transplant an indica in the middle of flower, the roots barely enter the new soil, and this leads to other issues we don't need to go into here because you aren't growing an indica dominant!

CC, don't want to be a stickler, but you still didn't advise to how much of the 10-10-2 would be a good base to start at, because like you said...the minute you over feed just once, it affects the taste from then one...right? Just trying to get it all figured out. Thanks in advance.

solarz

 

[Crazy Composer]

Oh, well, I judge the amount per case... With a yellowing haze in a 2 gallon pot I'd start with a tablespoon and see what that does. You should see the change in 2-4 days in most cases... A tablespoon usually lasts my plants about a week to two weeks.

 

[solarz]

Cool, thanks. i was just looking for an acceptable starting point, and i'll be able to tweak it from there with a little trial and error/documentation. Thanks again bro...a lot of quality info in this thread.

solarz

 

[Hank Hemp]

I use Promix BX (what's here)50%, 25% EWC, 25% perlite, 2Tbs dol. lime. For ferts I use PBP Gro and Bloom, LK with some superthrive when transplanting. Oh and blackstrap molasses of course.

 

[MeltingPOT]

Thanks Hank!

RM...appreciate it bro...I think the Chem4 is a great place to start my organic journey, thanks for the suggestion! I have used molasses in the past and still finished with a two week plain flush, I was thinking it would be good to have mid to late flower and just incase any CalMag issues showed up along the way...I know what you mean about PH being important no matter what, I think I'm going to stay away from FoxFarm bagged soil for now...Thanks man!

IDO!

I'll stick to PMing my boys next time I need answers LMAO...this thread is a fucking shitshow...a bunch of hooplah, Wine, Pine, Vagine.

 

[solarz]

Actually MP, i think that this thread did a lot of good, even will all of the other things going on. It made for good debate, and the release of goof info about organic gardening. If you wouldn't have started this thread, and rather sent a few pms, i wouldn't have learned this shit today...and that wouldn't have been good (at least not for me...lol). So thanks for starting the thread, and for those out there reading this, START THE THREAD instead of the pms...we can all learn together

solarz

 

[MeltingPOT]

Good point bro, I'm just being Mr. Poopy Pants. Your welcome for starting the thread, and Happy Holidays...

 

[maryjohn]

CC, come on, do you even know what mercury tastes like, in the form in which it is found in fatty tissue? Are you even sure that kind of ppm can be detected? Let me assure you, you lack the sensory organ capable of detecting what you claim to have detected. Explain to me how mercury is getting into menhaden. You should know, by the way, that menhaden is used for vitamins, because it is so rich in omega 3 and does not contain excess mercury. Now go ahead and take that industry down, because they are raping the ocean. I wish there was mercury. Seriously, you're brilliant, but some of this shit is insulting my intelligence, on a common sense level.

I gave some hard thought to what you say, and a step back. I don't think we understand each other well, and that's partially my fault (not taking all the blame, mr. wrench in the gears of rational discourse). Looking over the description of what you actually do, I would say you are not in control of nitrogen levels in you soil as you say, and as such not running afoul of anything I've advocated, despite what I said. Since we don't agree on terms, we aren't really talking. And I would put forward that we don't agree on terms because you aren't clear on what means what - and are confusing me. You of course, probably feel the opposite.

What you are controlling by withholding guano is the amount of nitrates, but those are a fraction of what's present. That's not the same thing. And perhaps what I haven't communicated well is that I and many others are growing without the excess nitrates from the start. Which makes me wonder if my plants don't veg slower as a result. Which I don't mind, but certainly explains why people use urea.

Now it may be your way does make better weed. That doesn't make it less important to know why. For real why, not stoner lore why. Because the real why can give you power way beyond what stoner lore can do.

 

[Crazy Composer]

MJ... whatever, man. I'm gonna decant this killer Cab Sauv I just brought home, and enjoy the evening. Why not go to one of MY threads and tell me I'm doing something wrong there? Too much evidence --in plain sight-- to the contrary, I reckon? Spend a few hours looking through my picture gallery and report back on what you think I can improve on, won't you?

 

[maryjohn]

CC, don't put words in my mouth. Stick to what I said. I never questioned the quality of your weed or your skills as a grower. There are so many growers light years beyond me growing organic, hydro, and whatever. Beyond you, I bet. So what? I am trying to set some scientific facts straight to dispel some myths - ones I hold and ones you hold.

It's not the observations or results I'm questioning, but the specific conclusions you jump to and your explanations of how you reach them. No amount of godlike growing talent and all around magnificence can make a false statement true. In any case, no amount of experience with soil can teach you about microbiology or chemistry, and I submit that it hasn't.

why not let someone qualified teach you a bit about nitrogen? Dr. Ingham spells it out so anyone can understand. And before you say it, don't tell me it doesn't apply to indoor grows.

you can watch that while I ogle your grows. I'm not drinking tonight, and I'm supposed to be wrapping presents. About to get yelled at. Long drive tomorrow. Enjoy your wine.

Happy X-mas to anyone forced or willing to observe it!

 

[montanaorganics]

Hey, you guys realize that u have hijacked the shit out of meltinpots thread? I,m sure you both grow exceptional connosuer meds. But I really dont care to see anybody bickering like old men. Nobody is learning anything from your arguments, whats the point. Wait I take that back. Though I dont necessarily believe in it out of benefit of doubt I will try starving my plants from about 5 to 6 weeks on. I do agree, chlorophyll is like smoking grass clippings.. or horseshit.

 

[Crazy Composer]

Well, this thread started like thousands of other that go a few posts and fizzle out... It was a few simple questions he wanted to discuss. Instead, he got his answers and new questions arose, answered, information was volunteered, and based on the number of comments I got in private about this... a LOT of people appreciated the nuggets of wisdom that showed themselves in this thread... an unlikely venue for this much information, but there it is anyway... And the negativity was entirely contained if you ask me... it was like a conversation that I might have in private with someone else with stern ideas and big personality. If nothing was learned from this... you already know a whole hell of a lot... or you simply didn't pay enough attention.

I'm done responding to mj for now because the positive outcomes have been pretty much exhausted... time to move on.

 

[Crazy Composer]

No more off topic provocations, please.