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CANNACO-OP

Farmassist
Veteran
6.5 to 7.0 ph is for soil 5.8 to 6.2 ph is more suited to hydroponic applications although that seems a bit high for hydro but I'm not certain as I've no real experience with hydro. I've noticed alot of the products marketed online are targeted towards the hydroponic grower and that's the most likely reason the product your using is suggesting that ph level.

Yeah ph can be real critical because when the ph is off even though the nutrients may be there in the soil or whatever media you're using, the improper ph causes nute lock out and so the plant is getting what it needs to make that swelling happen.


Thanks, we appreciate the info. We had also had a farmer who used the apple vinegar. We do understand that the soil differ from hydro and agree with your ratios. We had a concern of using the ph down from the local hardware store because they had algecide? in it.
 

Stoner54

New member
I am a bit perplexed and hope someone has an answer. I have a bagseed plant that I started in April. It is now about 3 ft tall, bushy like a pine tree but has now started growing just single leaves the last foot or so. They are staggered coming of the main stalk like steps. Every one of the leaves and branches have tiny buds with hairs at every node from the bottom up. It looked like any normal 3-5-7 leaf and then switched. It is outside on my deck and gets great sunshine through the day. Anyone have an explanation for me? The leaves about 2 inches down from the top are almost 4 inches long. It shows no sign of developing any main cola at this point. I have a white widow and a purple lady and they look normal with as many as 9 leaf clusters. At this point you wouldn't even recognize it as cannabis.
 
Last edited:
Drainage/Basin/

Drainage/Basin/

What kind of container are you using? Do you have adequate drainage? Are your containers in some kind of basin that would catch and hold run off?

I water using a partial submersion technique:

First I put my plants in a basin and then I fill the basin until the bottoms of my pots are about 1/2 inch underwater. (i.e. All the drainage holes in pots are submerged.)

Second, I water each plant from the top slowly until the entire pot is fully saturated with water.... that is, water fills the pot above the soil line almost all the way to the lip of the pot.

Once the pot looks like a lake with a bush in the middle I watch for bubbles. As long as I see bubbles, I continue to top off the water in the pot. When the bubbles stop, I stop watering that plant and move to the next, repeating the whole process.

At the end, I remove the plants and put them in an identical basin, but this one is dry. (empty. no water.) I let them sit there for a few minutes (smoke a bowl...:joint:) and then I set them all on a towel for another couple of minutes... and then I put them all back in the cab.

I do this every 3-4 days. When my plants were young, I could do this once every 7-9 days and be just fine.

Growing in miracle grow moisture control w/1 part perlite for every 2 parts MG.

I need to add perlitie next time. I have been using straight Black Gold organic potting soil without problem when I used my Fluorescent lights but ever since I switched to the HPS and changed my fert to Earth Juice I have been having problems. I have yet to have a successful grow since switching fert and light and those are the two things changed so I assume it has to be one of those but I don't know. My soil does seem to dry very slowly. I water my plants until I get the roughly ten percent runoff then I dump the drainage trays the pots are in. (I'm using individual 3 gallon pots sitting on drain trays) I've never heard of the way you water but I am going to start trying that once my plants dry out. This is driving me bonkers! Thanks for the good ideas!
 
New pics/overwatering/PH

New pics/overwatering/PH

Thanks Hempkat, I think I must be over watering too. Should I just leave them until they dry out? The Black Gold organic soil holds water pretty well so it could be awhile. Is there anything I can do to get oxygen to the roots in the meantime? I am in the third week of flowering in 3 gallon pots. I attached some new pics to show how the problem has progressed. The bigger plants still look the best but the small ones bigger fan leaves are toasting. Are the plants cannibalizing the bigger leaves first or something? the tiny ones look fine but growth has definitely slowed or stopped. I watered after scratching the dolomite lime in on Monday the 13th but I shouldn't have to water for another week at least I'm thinking. When can I expect to see a change in PH form the lime? If I remember correctly it was a week or so but do I just wait to test it until the next time my plants NEED water? That's one of the most confusing things for me when it comes to problems. Many of the potential ones either show similar symptoms with completely opposite treatments or in order to fix one it appears you have to make another worse. Temperamental little things, but I love them. I have been lifting the pots everyday now to gauge weight. Thanks again!
 

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HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
Thanks, we appreciate the info. We had also had a farmer who used the apple vinegar. We do understand that the soil differ from hydro and agree with your ratios. We had a concern of using the ph down from the local hardware store because they had algecide? in it.

Algecide is just something to keep algae from forming in the water reservoir found in hydro systems or from forming in pools or fish tanks. I can't say if it would be good or bad for soil but clearly that ph down is intended for things like pools and fish tanks. I'd be reluctant to use it too as it might end up being harmful to beneficial organisms in soil.
 

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
I am a bit perplexed and hope someone has an answer. I have a bagseed plant that I started in April. It is now about 3 ft tall, bushy like a pine tree but has now started growing just single leaves the last foot or so. They are staggered coming of the main stalk like steps. Every one of the leaves and branches have tiny buds with hairs at every node from the bottom up. It looked like any normal 3-5-7 leaf and then switched. It is outside on my deck and gets great sunshine through the day. Anyone have an explanation for me? The leaves about 2 inches down from the top are almost 4 inches long. It shows no sign of developing any main cola at this point. I have a white widow and a purple lady and they look normal with as many as 9 leaf clusters. At this point you wouldn't even recognize it as cannabis.

Did you move it from inside to outside, or from a more shaded spot to where it is now, just before this happened? That one blade leaf deal seems to be the result of a plant sort of revegging. I've seen it mentioned before when people move a plant from indoors to outdoors. I've experienced it myself but not from moving the plants but rather taking cuts from mother plants that aren't fully mature. While I'm not positive of what triggers it I can tell you that your plants will still flower and form nice buds, they just may not be quite as nice as if you had leafsets with 5, 7 or 9 blades.
 

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
I need to add perlitie next time. I have been using straight Black Gold organic potting soil without problem when I used my Fluorescent lights but ever since I switched to the HPS and changed my fert to Earth Juice I have been having problems. I have yet to have a successful grow since switching fert and light and those are the two things changed so I assume it has to be one of those but I don't know. My soil does seem to dry very slowly. I water my plants until I get the roughly ten percent runoff then I dump the drainage trays the pots are in. (I'm using individual 3 gallon pots sitting on drain trays) I've never heard of the way you water but I am going to start trying that once my plants dry out. This is driving me bonkers! Thanks for the good ideas!

Well I can tell you that the only problem an HPS light should cause is heat issues and it can also cause light stress (aka bleaching) if too close. Lights won't cause ph imbalances.

It could be the EarthJuice although lots of people use that product line and claim good results. My guess is this, you're feeding them the EarthJuice too soon and if I'm remembering correctly you're using the wrong one for the stage of growth you should be at.

The soil you have is already loaded with organic nutrients derived from compost. You should be able to use just that soil for a good month and need only add water when you water. If you are starting to add nutrients from the beginning than you are probably making things too rich/hot for young plants. Also I'm pretty sure you said the Earthjuice is the Bloom formula which is fine for flowering (12/12 light schedule) but judging by what I saw in your pictures those plants look like they should still be in veg (18/6 light schedule).

In future grows resist the urge to add nutrients until the plant shows signs of needing it. With most enriched soils such as Miracle Grow you shouldn't need to add nutrients for close to a month. Then you should start noticing nitrogen deficiency which shows up as a paling of the leaf color, first light green and then eventually yellowing. This is a sign the plants are running low on nitrogen in the soil and that's when you start feeding them. Black Gold is perhaps richer in nutrients then Miracle Grow so it could take longer then a month before you need to add nutrients.

If your soil is slow to dry adding perlite can help but it's one of those things you add when mixing your soil I wouldn't try adding it now. Basically it helps keep the soil loose and allows better drainage.
 

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
Thanks Hempkat, I think I must be over watering too. Should I just leave them until they dry out? The Black Gold organic soil holds water pretty well so it could be awhile. Is there anything I can do to get oxygen to the roots in the meantime? I am in the third week of flowering in 3 gallon pots. I attached some new pics to show how the problem has progressed. The bigger plants still look the best but the small ones bigger fan leaves are toasting. Are the plants cannibalizing the bigger leaves first or something? the tiny ones look fine but growth has definitely slowed or stopped. I watered after scratching the dolomite lime in on Monday the 13th but I shouldn't have to water for another week at least I'm thinking. When can I expect to see a change in PH form the lime? If I remember correctly it was a week or so but do I just wait to test it until the next time my plants NEED water? That's one of the most confusing things for me when it comes to problems. Many of the potential ones either show similar symptoms with completely opposite treatments or in order to fix one it appears you have to make another worse. Temperamental little things, but I love them. I have been lifting the pots everyday now to gauge weight. Thanks again!

Well one way to get oxygen to the roots is to add hydrogen peroxide to your water. I've not done that in a long time though and I forget what is the correct ratio. Basically if you look at it on the molecular level hydrogen peroxide is fairly unstable and when added like that one of the oxygen atoms breaks off and this is what can get oxygen to your roots. It doesn't completely turn things around though so even after adding that you will still need to let things dry out.

As for your question about the leaves yeah, generally speaking the plant will go after lower older leaves first but it also depends on what the plant is low on and which leaves have what it's looking for.

As for when you'll see the change in ph, well certainly not until your next water unless you can test the ph without watering. Now you may see the plant improve before then but I'm thinking not much since it's already been 3 days since you added the lime. So yeah test things the next time you water.

Now here's the bad news. If you're three weeks into 12/12 you're probably not going to have a good harvest no matter what you do, with maybe the exception of reverting to veg, getting the plants bigger, and then flowering again. The first 3 weeks of flower is what is known as the stretch phase. During this time the overall plant gets a final surge in growth that can double or even triple the overall plant size after this period pretty much the only things that grow are the buds. The plant doesn't get bigger, the roots don't grow longer and the only leaves produced are the ones associated with the bud sites. What this means is your soil will not start drying out quicker because the roots won't be spreading much and the plant won't be getting much bigger and therefore need more water. If you are right about needing a week between waterings then you'll only have a few opportunities to add nutrients before harvest and therefore your bud growth won't be terribly impressive.
 

hoosierdaddy

Active member
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Start with fresh water and flush. Flush about 3 times the amount of the container. Flush well. Then water w/ 30ml/gal hydrogen peroxide (3% from grocery). Then let dry until pots are light to lift. Only water when the pots are light to lift. If you happen to let it go too long and it wilts, simply water and it will regain it composure within minutes.
If it does wilt, then you know about how long you need to wait next time.

Flushing now will rid any anaerobic crap. The fresh water and h2o2 will invigorate the root zone with free radical oxygen.

(don't worry at all about the h2o2/water ratio...you could use 4 times that amount and it would not hurt the plant.)
 
Im a total newby.

Im a total newby.

Hello experts! Please help me out.

I have a 6 planter aeroponic misting kit with rockwool, hydroton, a 400w HPS light.

Now I have plans on 1 super lemon haze, 2 kings kush and 3 king kong.

Now my main concern is the nutrients. I want something that will give me good quality and high yeild.

I have never grown before, but I have been researching a lot of information on youtube and of course here.
 
I'm no expert and dont know shit about hydroponics but a lot of people swear by foxfarm nutrients completely organic supposedly increases your yield kinda pricey though. I'm currently using it and would have to agree its worth the money.
 
B

boo

general hydroponics makes a great 3 part nute mix...you change the ratio of the three dependant on the veg/flower cycle...very easy, reliable, and dependable...I've ued it both hydro and soil for years...spray with topmax foliar for huge buds and prolific trichome productionI assure you, you will be thrilled with the results
 
B

boo

I cant begin to tell you how much I like it...I realized a 25% increase in bud size, trichimomes were probably 30% more, and the buds grew much denser...the only change was the addition of the topmax foliar...I hosed them down twice a week but had fans and an air chiller to keep the temps down so the mildew was never an issue

the south will rise again brother...
 

darksith

Member
just wanted to say hi, Im new to these forums but I consider myself an old fart when it comes to this stuff and I would love to help anyone in need. See you guys around :)
 
I may have figured it out...

I may have figured it out...

Like the title says, I think I may have figured it out (As always though, emphasis is on "I may"). When I transplanted the clones I got they were already pretty big. I got them from a good friend while I was extremely busy at work, house sitting, and had family in town so my mind wasn't all there. I transplanted them into their pots and watered them and then three days later started feeding with a regular strength mixture of EJ Grow and Bloom. The EJ bottle said to use Bloom during veg as as well as flower. I think I mentioned this in one of my first posts (may have been a different forum) but I forgot to change my timer from the last grow and so I immediately went into 12/12. The browning of some of the leaves started progressed rapidly after the feedings (a total of 3 feedings of 1 tbsp. per gallon before I stopped) and so I stopped and went to water only. I saw a picture of a plant with a twisted shredded type leaf that was from pH problems on another site and so I grabbed a PH test kit and found the PH to be low in some but not all. After all the back and forth on here I'm pretty sure that my main problem is I fried the little ladies by fertilizing to soon causing them to lockup and not stretch as much which was compounded by screwing up the timer and losing the veg time. (Could the plants not sucking up the nutrients due to lockout alter my PH?) From what I gather this would explain the lack of growth in the smaller ones and certainly the lack of dry soil. Of the 7 I have two of them are roughly a foot tall and the others are 2.5 to 3 feet tall. They are showing decent size buds for all the stress I've been putting them through so I think I can save some of them but I'm having trouble deciding what the best course of action is. Should I wait it out until they dry and then water with a hydrogen peroxide mixture? Or do I need to get air to the roots ASAP since they have been sitting in a very saturated soil for a couple weeks? I've read about spraying fertilizer directly on the leaves. Would that just make things worse or allow the plant to get needed nutes? Should I flush immediately then water with hydrogen peroxide mixture or will this just drown them even more? Many thanks Hempkat and HoosierDaddy. I have to say that even though this isn't going as well as I hoped, the learning process is pretty damn fun and it will be exciting when I get it down. Thanks again!
 

hoosierdaddy

Active member
ICMag Donor
Veteran
My advise was for plants that are waterlogged. The initial flushing (they are already wet...how much more waterlogged do you think they can become?) will help to wash away any excess salts and stagnant crap, and provide fresh water than has some oxygen in it.
Hitting it with h2o2 right after than will increase the oxygen available at the roots and will normally start pulling the plant out of it's distress.
This should have been done immediately not days later.
 
B

boo

on the eother hand, flushing with hydrogen peroxide will kill all bebeficial bacteria and flora in the soil...ya gotta give this some thought
 

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
Hello experts! Please help me out.

I have a 6 planter aeroponic misting kit with rockwool, hydroton, a 400w HPS light.

Now I have plans on 1 super lemon haze, 2 kings kush and 3 king kong.

Now my main concern is the nutrients. I want something that will give me good quality and high yeild.

I have never grown before, but I have been researching a lot of information on youtube and of course here.

There are lots of good nutrient brands out there. I've never grown with any form of hydro style so unfortunately I can't name any specific products. Ask and or look around in the hydro threads and use what seems to be popular.
 

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