Too much watering. Let them dry out to nearly wilting between waterings. When you do water them, pour until it runs out the bottom some...then wait until the container feels light to water again.
Wanna Ask The Old Farts A Question?
- Thread starter HempKat
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Vinegar, watering with for plant health
Vinegar, watering with for plant health
Thanks again, 6.5 to 7 is the key i think, the well water is coming out high ph (client only has liquid tester so exact PH not known) but had "hybisscuss" that was sick and another farmer suggested the vinegar for his house plants (he just tried it with his mj water also, thinking ph was high) not that his stuff looked bad, but you could tell missin something, but last 4 weeks (he just finished a batch), but last month, let me tell ya, 180 degree turn around on his plant health.
and they really swelled, which he had not got them to do before, did not change a thing but trimmed some botton growth off (which helped ) and the vinegar trick.
side note: we using technaflore brand nutes and they say to adjust ph to 5.8 to 6.2, is this because of the nute brand and not being marketed to only mj, or just the ph their stuff works the best at.
and is the 6.5 to 7 the same for diy aero/nft type system? and in closing, sounds like higher PH better then too low PH with mj,
thanks again old farts. peace.
Vinegar, watering with for plant health
Thanks again, 6.5 to 7 is the key i think, the well water is coming out high ph (client only has liquid tester so exact PH not known) but had "hybisscuss" that was sick and another farmer suggested the vinegar for his house plants (he just tried it with his mj water also, thinking ph was high) not that his stuff looked bad, but you could tell missin something, but last 4 weeks (he just finished a batch), but last month, let me tell ya, 180 degree turn around on his plant health.
and they really swelled, which he had not got them to do before, did not change a thing but trimmed some botton growth off (which helped ) and the vinegar trick.
side note: we using technaflore brand nutes and they say to adjust ph to 5.8 to 6.2, is this because of the nute brand and not being marketed to only mj, or just the ph their stuff works the best at.
and is the 6.5 to 7 the same for diy aero/nft type system? and in closing, sounds like higher PH better then too low PH with mj,
thanks again old farts. peace.
goneforasmoke
Member
Will this bring them back or are they to far gone would you say. it does look like new leaves are forming.
can you help i dont no whats going wrong im growing in soil and they are 2-3 weeks old and as you can see the leaves look like they are dying, my room temp is 76f and RH is 50%
i have a 10 ltr resi ph 6.3 with 20ml rizo and 5ml of canna A & B
im watering every day keeping the soil moist is this where im going wrong?
Well I'm not sure if that's your only problem but of the things you said you're doing, watering every day is the only thing you mentioned that is known to be bad for MJ plants. Your temps are fine, the humidity is fine, the ph is fine, I'm not familiar with the products you're using but if you're following dosage directions that should be fine. Although at 2-3 weeks you really shouldn't be needing to do much if any feeding yet.
Watering every day is a definate no no and can potentially lead to root rot and other issues. If you are adding nutes with every watering then even though you might be mixing it up in the proper strength acoording to directions it's still way to much and could be causing nute burn. At most they should only be getting nutes once or twice a week. Typically it goes like this, potted plants that are not root bound usually only need watering once every 3 - 4 days (much bigger pots may take longer). In this situation you can add nutes almost everytime and it'll only be once or twice a week it's getting nutes. Even then most folks do water/nutes, water/nutes and then every third watering just give water. This helps prevent salt build ups that can lead to nute lock out.
6.5 to 7.0 ph is for soil 5.8 to 6.2 ph is more suited to hydroponic applications although that seems a bit high for hydro but I'm not certain as I've no real experience with hydro. I've noticed alot of the products marketed online are targeted towards the hydroponic grower and that's the most likely reason the product your using is suggesting that ph level.
Yeah ph can be real critical because when the ph is off even though the nutrients may be there in the soil or whatever media you're using, the improper ph causes nute lock out and so the plant is getting what it needs to make that swelling happen.
Leaves that have been damaged for one reason or another will not heal themselves and get better once the problem that damaged them is corrected. If you cut back on the watering the plants should recover but those damaged leaves will remain damaged looking and most likely dry up and fall off before long.
The way you tell if a problem with a plant has been fixed is to always look at the new growth to see if the same signs show up there. If the new growth is healthy looking then the problem has been corrected.
noproblempablo
Member
How do I add Dolomite Lime?
How do I add Dolomite Lime?
I beleve I have figured out the problem I am having with my plants. My runoff PH is between 5.0-6.0 due to using highly acidic Earth Juice Bloom which comes out under 4.0 when I test the water/bloom mix. I have purchased fine grade dolomite lime but I don't know what to do with it. Do I sprinkle some on top of the soil? Mix it with water? With water and fert? How much do I mix into the water? Do I need to let it set after mixing before watering with it? As you can see I really need a push in the right direction. I'm really trying to figur this out on my own so I can stop being a mooch but I have hit a wall with this one. Please help and many thanks for such a kick ass thread going hundreds of pages strong. Cheers!
How do I add Dolomite Lime?
I beleve I have figured out the problem I am having with my plants. My runoff PH is between 5.0-6.0 due to using highly acidic Earth Juice Bloom which comes out under 4.0 when I test the water/bloom mix. I have purchased fine grade dolomite lime but I don't know what to do with it. Do I sprinkle some on top of the soil? Mix it with water? With water and fert? How much do I mix into the water? Do I need to let it set after mixing before watering with it? As you can see I really need a push in the right direction. I'm really trying to figur this out on my own so I can stop being a mooch but I have hit a wall with this one. Please help and many thanks for such a kick ass thread going hundreds of pages strong. Cheers!
noproblempablo
Member
I should say "I think it's due to EJBloom".
Well first of all it sounds like you're on the right track or at least could be, I'm not sure what's been wrong with your plants so it's hard to say for sure. But yeah a ph that low will definately cause you problems. Typically dolomite lime is added when you mix up the soil before you pot the plant. Usually you mix up the soil with whatever else you might add (perlite, vermiculite, raw organics like worm castings and/or blood and bone meal, etc.) once that's done you measure out what you have with a one gallon pot and for every one gallon you measure, add 1-2 tablespoons (varies depending on how acidic things get without it) per gallon of soil mix. So say you have 15 gallons, you would add 15-30 tablespoons of dolomite lime and then mix it all up real good before using it to pot your plants.
Now in your case you're already growing which makes things trickier. It won't be quite as effective ad make take a week or so to really imporve things but you can sprinkle it around the base of the plant and "scratch" it into the soil. You might be able to speed things up a few days by crushing the lime up real fine before adding it.
When used from start to end in the soil mix dolomite lime does three things that will help you plants, one is it will buffer acidic soil to a ph of around 6.8 to 7.0. Not only that but it also provides the plant with a good source of calcium and magnesium both of which MJ needs to help maintain good health.
For what it's worth most flower ferts are on the acidic side because the strongest element usually is phospherous as that's what flowering plants need most for flowering (although they still need some nitrogen and a fair amount of potassium too). Anyway phospherous is often derived from phosphoric acid and that's part of what helps make flower ferts more acidic. Now another approach you could try is instead of adding something to the soil to bring up the ph, just adjust the ph of your water/nute mix before adding it to bring the run off up to 6.5. At least until this grow is done, then use the dolomite in the soil from the start on your next grow.
Don't worry you'll get this thing, you're already farther along then most, You came here with a problem you diagnosed and were just looking for a confirmation and some info on how to apply the solution. Many with problems have no clue what the problem is when they seek help. It's really not that hard and once you get two or three good grows under your belt you should start feeling pretty confident about what you're doing.
On another note I want to amend some advice I've given in the past. Every so often you run into folks trying to start their plants or clones in window sills or using non grow lights and usually it's because they feel they can't afford anything better. To which I usually tell them about how you can get 2 x 4' long shoplights that hold two 40W tube fluoros and the 4 tubes for a total of about $20 at places like Walmart. For 160W of effective veg/cloning power spread out over say a 4'x2' area. Usually these lights are made by a company called "Lights Of America" at least that's the brand Walmart carries.
I would now like to alter that advice to say spend a little more and get something better at say a hardware store. These cheap Walmart lights have crappy ballasts and out 0 out of 6 I bought have failed to out live a single bulb. One even started suddenly smoking one day and nearly caught fire. Fortunately I was there to catch it before it did. There's an old saying of "You get what you pay for." So if you pay a low price your likely going to get sub standard quality. In the long run you're better off spending a little more for good quality lights and saving on how often you have to replace them.
I would now like to alter that advice to say spend a little more and get something better at say a hardware store. These cheap Walmart lights have crappy ballasts and out 0 out of 6 I bought have failed to out live a single bulb. One even started suddenly smoking one day and nearly caught fire. Fortunately I was there to catch it before it did. There's an old saying of "You get what you pay for." So if you pay a low price your likely going to get sub standard quality. In the long run you're better off spending a little more for good quality lights and saving on how often you have to replace them.
noproblempablo
Member
What can I add to my water/nute mix to bring up the PH? How high should I shoot for (ballpark) to get the correct runoff? If my current runoff is 5-6 with my 4 ph nute mix does that mean I want to try and get it to 5.5 or so before adding it? Should I stop feeding for the week while I get my Ph up. I'm about two weeks into flowering. Thanks for all the help!
noproblempablo
Member
And now pics
And now pics
Here are pics of my plants. I just wanted to make sure I was on the right track with PH being my problem. It has gotten progressively worse over the last week and a half with the smallest plants and biggest fan leaves having the worst of it.
And now pics
Here are pics of my plants. I just wanted to make sure I was on the right track with PH being my problem. It has gotten progressively worse over the last week and a half with the smallest plants and biggest fan leaves having the worst of it.
Attachments
Well what I find to be the easiest way is to use the ph adjusters sold in hydro stores (either the online or the real world ones) these tend to be made from ingredients good for the plant. Also get a dropper that's measure to be 1 teaspoon when full. Use that to add the ph adjuster a little at a time. Like if it was 4.0 to start I'd add 1/2 teaspoon of ph up per gallon of water/nute mix and then remeasure the ph. If that brought it up to say 5.5 I'd add half that much again (1/4 teaspoon) and the remeasure the ph again. Keep doing this until you get the ph where you want it. If you accidentally go too high then add a little ph down to bring it back down. Be careful I find the ph down tends to be fairly strong and therefore not alot is needed.
What I would do is start out with your water/nute mix being 6.5ph after you adjust it but before giving it to the plant. You can't assume that because the soil brings the ph up to 5 or 6 when what you put in is 4, that starting with five will make it 6 to 7ph. It may but I'm doubtful. Sounds like it's only able to buffer the ph up to 5 or 6 so it's only going to impact things more acidic. Therefore a 6.5 in should yield around a 6.5 out. Now if by chance it raises it higher then next time try starting at 6.0 ph
Yes typically when you have a ph imbalence that causes nute lock out the first step is to flush the soil with just ph adjusted water and no nutes. This is a process refered to as flushing because you want to give more water then the plant needs so that you get alot of run off. When you have nute lock out the nutes just sit there in the soil and when you feed again you're adding more and the nutes can build up to a toxic level. If you correct the ph with the nute levels toxic then the plant will likely get nute burned all of a sudden if you don't flush that excess build up out. Then you start feeding again the next watering but usually at half strength the first time or two.
Could be more then just ph issues, kind of looks like some overwatering going on there too. How often are you watering?
noproblempablo
Member
I alternate watering/feeding every three days or so to about 10% run off. Can I wait until the soil is dry on top before watering again? My first few grows where with CFL's (standard 150 watt curly bulbs and work clamp lights for reflectors) and I watered roughly the same and didn't have any problems but I figured that the smaller light source made my margin for error bigger too. (Would over watering account for the fact that the smaller plants are doing worse than the bigger plants?) The only things that I have changed are my lights (from CFL to 600 watt HPS) and the fertilizer. I scratched the dolomite lime (1/2 tbsp. in each pot) into the surface dirt and mixed it around a little then watered. How long should I wait before watering again to check my runoff? Thanks a million guys, really. Lifesavers!
noproblempablo
Member
My PH tester recommends I use PH UP to raise PH so I will head to my local store and see if I can find some of that. Thank you thank you thank you!
What kind of container are you using? Do you have adequate drainage? Are your containers in some kind of basin that would catch and hold run off?
I water using a partial submersion technique:
First I put my plants in a basin and then I fill the basin until the bottoms of my pots are about 1/2 inch underwater. (i.e. All the drainage holes in pots are submerged.)
Second, I water each plant from the top slowly until the entire pot is fully saturated with water.... that is, water fills the pot above the soil line almost all the way to the lip of the pot.
Once the pot looks like a lake with a bush in the middle I watch for bubbles. As long as I see bubbles, I continue to top off the water in the pot. When the bubbles stop, I stop watering that plant and move to the next, repeating the whole process.
At the end, I remove the plants and put them in an identical basin, but this one is dry. (empty. no water.) I let them sit there for a few minutes (smoke a bowl...
) and then I set them all on a towel for another couple of minutes... and then I put them all back in the cab.I do this every 3-4 days. When my plants were young, I could do this once every 7-9 days and be just fine.
Growing in miracle grow moisture control w/1 part perlite for every 2 parts MG.
What kind of container are you using? Do you have adequate drainage? Are your containers in some kind of basin that would catch and hold run off?
I water using a partial submersion technique:
First I put my plants in a basin and then I fill the basin until the bottoms of my pots are about 1/2 inch underwater. (i.e. All the drainage holes in pots are submerged.)
Second, I water each plant from the top slowly until the entire pot is fully saturated with water.... that is, water fills the pot above the soil line almost all the way to the lip of the pot.
Once the pot looks like a lake with a bush in the middle I watch for bubbles. As long as I see bubbles, I continue to top off the water in the pot. When the bubbles stop, I stop watering that plant and move to the next, repeating the whole process.
At the end, I remove the plants and put them in an identical basin, but this one is dry. (empty. no water.) I let them sit there for a few minutes (smoke a bowl...
I do this every 3-4 days. When my plants were young, I could do this once every 7-9 days and be just fine.
Growing in miracle grow moisture control w/1 part perlite for every 2 parts MG.
I'm surprised the moisture control soil can dry up in 3-4 days. I can go 3-4 days on a pot of soil as saturated as you describe using just regular miracle grow organic soil with added perlite.
Well if you're watering because a calander says it's time to and not because the plants need it then yes, you're overwatering even if it is every 3 days or so. Also if you are giving as much water as often to a smaller plant as you are to a bigger plant then you're probably overwatering the smaller plants. A simple yet effective way to monitor your plants for when to water is the "lift" method. Basically what you do is when you pot the plant, after you've added the soil but before you water, lift the pot and remember how it feels (don't worry you don't have to be dead on accurate). Then water it as you normally do 10% run off is okay as long as that run-off gets dumped and doesn't just sit in the drainage pan for your pot. When you're done watering, and it's stopped draining, lift the pot again. Notice how much heavier it feels. From that point lift each pot everyday and don't water until the pot feels as light as it did when before you first watered it. Now how long this will take will depend on alot of factors. If temps are on the warm side ( above 80 degrees F) then it'll likely dry out faster. If temps are low it'll dry slower. If humidity is high it'll dry slower, if it's low it'll dry quicker. If it's a new plant with not much of a root system developed it'll take longer, if it's a well developed rootball that's become rootbound it'll dry out faster. If it's in a new pot just a little bigger then the rootball it'll dry out quicker, if it's in a pot way bigger then the rootball it'll take longer until that rootball fills the new space. Generally speaking when all factors are right a new plant or a newly transplanted plant in a proper sized pot will start out needing water every 4-5 days. As time passes and the roots fill the pot and the plant up top gets bigger, it'll take less and less time between waterings. When you get to where it's needed every other day you are rootbound or close to it. Oh and another factor I forgot to mention is the light. If you have fairly weak light then you aren't going to generate as much growth as stronger growth. It's when all the growth is happening that water is most needed.
In case you're wondering why it's so important to let a pot dry out here are some of the main reasons. If you allow a pot to dry out then it encourages the roots to spread out in search of more water. The more roots you have the more a plant will be able to drink the next time you water. The more it can drink, the bigger and denser your buds will usually be. Another important reason is that while every one knows plants like carbon dioxide many fail to realize roots need oxygen, as well as the other gases in our atmosphere. The way plants get this is that as the water in soil dries it creates pockets and since nature abhors a vacuum air from above is pulled into those pockets from above. If you keep topping it off by watering too soon then the roots in the area that never dried out can literally smother and this usually leads to root rot which can really harm or even kill a plant if not corrected.
One final thing when I talk about letting a plant dry out I mean to the point it was when you first potted it, there's usually some moisture in a soil mix unless it's been sitting around a long time, so it's not totally dry. If you're not checking regularly a pot can become totally dry where the soil is really pulling away from the sides of the pot and the plant is wilting as it feeds of itself. This severely damages the roots even though once you do water usually the plant will perk up and look almost as good as new in about 30 minutes or less. If after 30 minutes it still looks sickly it probably won't make it. Also if you do get that dried out it's probably a good idea to water from the top and bottom similar to what Anti is describing. If a plant is that dried out often when you water just from the top the water will run right thru and not as much, will get soaked up into the soil for the roots to work on. In that sense soil can be like a spunge where it'll soak moisture up until it's saturated.
