The Official MMA Discussion

[NateDizz]

Just caught the Jon Jones fight and I have to say he's continuing to impress me. His unorthodox striking is very entertaining and he has very good movement. Coupled with his huge reach and length and the fact that he's only 21, it's undeniable he has a very bright future in the UFC. I love his spinning back elbow combinations. I don't even know how he comes up with some of this stuff. Before sinking in what looked to be a brabo choke and finishing O'Brien, he stunned him with an amazing fake takedown attempt followed by the spinning elbow. And the one he dropped Bonnar with in his last fight he executed after catching a leg kick. Extremely original combinations. I can't wait for his next fight.

 

[Backwoods Bud]

It was a good card overall. GSP's dominance surprised me. Glad to see Bisping get KTFO'D! He should yap less and train more. Also was impressed with Lesnar's smashing of Mir. His conduct after the bout was a little over the top though. Nice to see a true heavyweight hold the belt. Look for Fedor to come to the UFC after the last fight of his contract with Affliction which is in August. The UFC will get him. That will be a real test for Lesnar.

 

[EvilRaven1031]

you know, as much as people hate on brock, he isnt that bad. i knew that he was in deep shit the moment he said "Coors". I watched the interview that he did after he got a talking to from dana and had the chance to calm down. dontcha know it, there was an ice cold bottle of bud light sitting next to him. ...when i saw that i might have peed a little.

For those that are giving hendo shit over that shot he gave bisping on the ground. grab a fuckin kleenex. these guys are trained to go until the ref stops them.

if you arent familiar with mario yamasaki's nickname (or how he handles this exact situation in the fights he refs) let me enlighten you. The mma boards have dubbed him mario "finish him" yamasaki. ive seen fights that hes worked where one fighter is on the ground - obviously on his way to a nice nap - and the fighter in top position actually looks at him as if to say "you gonna stop this? or should i hit him again?". yamasaki gives the fighter in top position a nod, and said fighter unloads with one more big shot....thats when the ref steps in.

What you need to realize is that if you start complaining about stuff like this, all we can possibly see is more early stoppages. those are no good for anyone. we all know this. i mean you've seen someone get dropped then gather themselves and get back in the fight in a matter of seconds. now, im not saying that this would have been the case in the bisping/hendo fight....but it very well could have.

im sure ive said this before, but heres my opinion pertaining to Fedor. its NEVER gonna happen. its as simple as that. im pretty sure that the UFC will not make any exceptions when it comes to what they put into fighter contracts. (especially after the clusterfuck that was the last cro-cop fight) Having said that, i dont see fedor making any concessions either. so that leaves us at the same impass we were at a year ago.

its just like the old saying "the unstoppable force meets the immovable object".

 

[ureapwhatusow]

what sucked about the brock lesnar fight is that weight class has a big weight disparity

you dont get that type of mismatch in other weight classes

 

[EvilRaven1031]

i hear ya ureap. (hows it goin btw) Can you really make a case for a super-heavy division in the ufc? there would be like 3 guys in it that i can think of off the top of my head. Carwin, Lesnar and MAYBE Cain Velazquez. you could add one more if the ufc was desperate enough to bring in Bob Sapp.

this reminds me of something i was hearing waaay too much before the Mir/Lesnar fight..."technique > strength" Obviously it didnt work out that way in this particular fight, but think back to the early days of the ufc when it played out that way almost every time.

What im saying here is that splitting the HW division is pretty pointless. Unless you like seeing the same 3 guys fight each other constantly. Hell, if some of the HW's dont like the size difference, they are more than welcome to cut to 205. Then they will be the bigger guy.

 

[dbuzz]

im sure ive said this before, but heres my opinion pertaining to Fedor. its NEVER gonna happen. its as simple as that. im pretty sure that the UFC will not make any exceptions when it comes to what they put into fighter contracts. (especially after the clusterfuck that was the last cro-cop fight) Having said that, i dont see fedor making any concessions either. so that leaves us at the same impass we were at a year ago.

its just like the old saying "the unstoppable force meets the immovable object".

dana said this at the press conference last night...

"This whole Fedor thing has been going on and on and on. I keep saying this and that about him and he keeps waiting. Eventually, Fedor's going to be here. I want Fedor. I want him to come to the UFC and everything else.

This guy just became the heavyweight champion. We'll end up getting that deal done. And then we'll do Brock vs. Fedor, and it'll be a huge fight."

all depends on if he's talking ufc contract, or co promotion single fight. i think dana knows the potential of just having that one match, could possibly be the most anticipated fight ever. but you know damn well fedor ain't signin' no ufc contract.

brock needs to stop having wwe flashbacks or pretty much everyone will hate him soon.

 

[EvilRaven1031]

you think that after what happened with cro-cop DW will let any fight go on without contractual obligations??

cro-cop nearly had the ufc bent over all because DW literally phoned in that deal.

i read all the post fight Fedor talk, im not buying it. when ufc.com officially announces Fedor v ANYONE.... then ill buy it.

 

[dbuzz]

probably right, but hey ufc went and offered cro cop another deal recently, after he stiffed them. surprising move by the ufc, so who knows what will happen.

 

[Possum]

brock plays his part well. in time they all get beat down - that have to make friends with that idea. brock seems a little slow on the up take.

 

[LiLWaynE]

Great show last night!!
god damn Bisping got rocked!! Hes prolly still wondering where the hell he is! That second hit was brutal!!

bisping looked like he has been on a huge coke bender... dude looks skinny as can be...

 

[Vegan]

Perhaps Im really naive about MMA but I want sure why Brock was getting booed by the fans after the win..I think that what set him off..

Mir is a great fighter theres no doubt about that but the size thing is just too much,
Lesnar is a national wrestling champion . anyone with those type of skills will do quite well in the UFC add to that his strenght and size ,,how about a unbeatable heavyweight(for now).
are there really that many Mir fans,, how bout the fact that when Mir had Lesnar in the leglock in the first bout even after the tap by Lesnar, then the ref tell Frank its over , Mir still cranks on the leg for a second, WTF and people still like him..He got what he deserved a beating..

the budliught thing I dont understand ??

OH and bispin got what he deserved..he was outclassed..he obviously thinks he is better than he really is

Yea Dana is pissed aoubt the ufc 100 as a whole , I think it stems from a huge problem that the UFC is in,,

any HW fight is not going to draw fans
who is gonna pay to see Brock beat up nobodys
Machida makes everyone look bad
Silva makes everyone cower ( if he makes weight )
GSP well enough said
the only belt that has my attention is the one BJ penn should just give up , he is no champion is my book..( word on the back channels of VEgas is that he was out at a local club drinking the night before GSP/Penn 2..)


rant on
Dana and he entourage make me steam..they dont make enough cash on this cow ..hey.. instead of airing fights on spike after some time has passed ..like we used to ..lets make it so if the fans want to see what going on with fighter styles (be it two or three months behind actuall bouts)
they have to pay for EVERY fight that EVER goes on by putting them ON DEMAND pay per view..

Yes i underatnd that its all about the money but the money comes from fans and Dana with the high price of your fights I am rapidly losing my intrest in your fights

rant off

 

[Weedman Herb]

Vegan - They booed him coming in too ... it wasn't just after the win ... what is this about Silva making weight? Which Silva? If it's Anderson I think it has been his Opponents who haven't made weight (Lutter) or they've been fighting him against 205ers at what's called a Catch weight in between 195 and 200 ...

 

[NateDizz]

Whether Fedor ever signs with the UFC really has nothing to do with the UFC. It all comes down to other outside organizations who have looser contracts and pay out truckloads of money to him and his management for every appearance. Fedor is controlled by Vadim Finklestein and M-1 and they only way they play is through co-promotion and millions of dollars. The UFC does not co-promote and never will and they won't pay out the kind of money to him that other organizations have been for a multiple fight contract.

Yeah, the UFC could do a one fight deal but it really wouldn't sell the way you might think. Dana has spent way too much time yapping about how Fedor is a nobody and alot of UFC fans think that if you're not in the UFC than you're non-existant. The majority of UFC fans know nothing other than the UFC and the only way Dana and the Fertitta's will bank on Fedor is through a multiple fight deal so that they will have ample time to take back everything negative they've said and use the UFC machine to hype Fedor up. This has happened with them time and time again. Us fans who enjoy MMA as a whole and follow dozens of different organizations are basically just part of a cult compared the army of fans who only know or follow the UFC.

Also, if the UFC were to get their hype machine going and predict that they could actually get their money's worth out of a single fight between say Fedor and Lesnar what would happen if Fedor won? Fedor comes in and beats the UFC's best heavyweight then leaves? That would completely crush the UFC's claim that all the best fighters in the world fight for them and it would do it infront of all their fans. People would realize that there is more going on out there than just the UFC and they would lose alot of money in the long run. If Brock won on the other hand they would make alot of money in the long run and it would further strengthen their claim. But it's a huge gamble and one that they can't afford to make.

Also, outside of Fedor's management, he personally will refuse fighting for an organization if he can't compete in the Russian and World Sambo Championships which the UFC will not accomodate. If you fight for the UFC than you have to sign your life away to them basically.

As long as there are promotions out there that will co-promote with M-1, allow Fedor to compete in Sambo, and pay them truckloads of money the UFC will never sign him. And if you think these options for him will eventually run out and he'll have nowhere left to go but the UFC, you're mistaken. The UFC is basically a monopoly (or that's their intentions anyways) and Fedor is a huge tool that other organizations can use to try to gain legitimacy. Even if Affliction's next card is their last like alot of people think there will still always be someone else out there willing to try and combat the UFC by signing Fedor.

Fedor and his management will never need the UFC and the UFC will never change their whole operation to get this one guy because they really don't need him either. They know their organization is by far the largest and most relevent in the world and they have the power to fool all but the serious MMA fans into believing that they have all the top talent in the world and anyone outside of the UFC is a nobody such as Fedor. Both sides really don't care if they wind up being business partners because both sides will continue to get exactly what they want as it is.

Personally, I would love to see Fedor fight in the octagon but anyone who actually thinks this will happen will more than likely be let down in the end. It's always possible, crazier things have happened, but it's highly unlikely we'll ever see Fedor fight in the UFC unless they change their entire business model, which they won't do for one guy, or unless the UFC becomes the one and only MMA organization in the world, which will also never happen. Or that one fight deal, which once again probably will never happen. As far as MMA on this side of the ocean, I'd expect to see Fedor sign to Strikeforce before he'd sign for the UFC.

 

[NateDizz]

Yea Dana is pissed aoubt the ufc 100 as a whole , I think it stems from a huge problem that the UFC is in,,

any HW fight is not going to draw fans
who is gonna pay to see Brock beat up nobodys
Machida makes everyone look bad
Silva makes everyone cower ( if he makes weight )
GSP well enough said
the only belt that has my attention is the one BJ penn should just give up , he is no champion is my book..( word on the back channels of VEgas is that he was out at a local club drinking the night before GSP/Penn 2..)

People boo Lesnar because of his WWE background. Alot of people don't want to support the guy because they think he's not a legitimate fighter, which is absurd. He's proven that he's definitely legit. Yes he has his size going for him which gives him an advantage from the beginning but he also has the agility and athletic ability to use that size effectively, that highly decorated amateur wrestling background, and he has an amazing ability to learn very quickly. Just being big isn't enough to be successful. I'm not a big fan myself, but there's no denying that he's for real.

As for Dana and co. being pissed about 100 and the UFC having a huge problem on their hands, you couldn't be more wrong. UFC 100 was a huge success. If there is any drawback to UFC 100 it's to their UK market with the knockout of Bisping, their biggest star, but I really don't see it having that much effect. The UFC and MMA is getting more popular there by the day.

You may think that people won't pay to see Brock fight "nobodys" but Brock is in fact the UFC's biggest draw right now. He can sell a fight better than anyone they have on their roster. The UFC's heavyweight division is one of their weakest for sure but it's getting much better and there's a nice handful of prospects on their way up right now. There's alot of cats who are hardly nobodys. Brock can fight anyone and it's gonna sell though.

And GSP and Machida making people look bad, that's exactly what the UFC wants and needs. Superstars. That's what Brock is already (due to his WWE background) and that's what GSP and Machida are on the brink of becoming due to their dominance and the rise in the UFC's popularity. Superstars = more money for the UFC and it all comes down to profit. In MMA titles switch hands very often because there are so many variables and it's only happened a few times where someone gets the strap and can defend it for an extended period of time. Everytime someone wins a fight, or defends a title especially, they get more fans and the more that guys like GSP and Machida can continuing winning, the more popular the UFC will become and once again - more money. Just think of any other sport really, guys like LeBron James, Tiger Woods, and Sidney Crosby draw alot of people and new fans to their respective sports and it's guys like that the UFC wants to develop. And when someone finally beats these superstars it'll be easy to market them too. Anderson is the same. As for him not making weight - it's never happened. He has fought at two different weight classes though (185 and 205) but that was on purpose.



The UFC is at the peak of their popularity right now and UFC 100 just propelled them even higher. There was alot of room for failure with their 100th show but it actually turned out to be a really entertaining card. Most of the points you made about things wrong with the UFC right now are actually things that are perfect for the company right now. The pricetag is a big downside it seems but they wouldn't be charging that much if they wern't making maximum profit. Bad for some us, great for them - they're not losing any money. The UFC is a very smart business and they have alot of great guys in the company and things are going better than they ever could have imagined right now.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I'm old enough to remember the golden days of boxing. Back then, boxing could compete with MMA for entertainment IMO. Boxing was my life long favorite sport.

These days, pro boxing can't hold a candle to MMA and UFC.

 

[Vegan]

Nate , mayby im representing my point badly, perhaps problem is the wrong word for my point,, as always i enjoy reading your posts about UFC whether i agree with what you say or not..

the problem as I refer to means to ME ..who the hell is gonna give the guys holding the belts a close fight ?? help me out here Nate.

can ya post up by wieght division who YOU think could give each belt holder a good run..

also I would like your opinion on Anthony Johnson as a UFC fighter if ya dont mind..

thanx

 

[Vegan]

People boo Lesnar because of his WWE background. Alot of people don't want to support the guy because they think he's not a legitimate fighter, which is absurd. He's proven that he's definitely legit. Yes he has his size going for him which gives him an advantage from the beginning but he also has the agility and athletic ability to use that size effectively, that highly decorated amateur wrestling background, and he has an amazing ability to learn very quickly. Just being big isn't enough to be successful. I'm not a big fan myself, but there's no denying that he's for real.

As for Dana and co. being pissed about 100 and the UFC having a huge problem on their hands, you couldn't be more wrong. UFC 100 was a huge success. If there is any drawback to UFC 100 it's to their UK market with the knockout of Bisping, their biggest star, but I really don't see it having that much effect. The UFC and MMA is getting more popular there by the day.

You may think that people won't pay to see Brock fight "nobodys" but Brock is in fact the UFC's biggest draw right now. He can sell a fight better than anyone they have on their roster. The UFC's heavyweight division is one of their weakest for sure but it's getting much better and there's a nice handful of prospects on their way up right now. There's alot of cats who are hardly nobodys. Brock can fight anyone and it's gonna sell though.

And GSP and Machida making people look bad, that's exactly what the UFC wants and needs. Superstars. That's what Brock is already (due to his WWE background) and that's what GSP and Machida are on the brink of becoming due to their dominance and the rise in the UFC's popularity. Superstars = more money for the UFC and it all comes down to profit. In MMA titles switch hands very often because there are so many variables and it's only happened a few times where someone gets the strap and can defend it for an extended period of time. Everytime someone wins a fight, or defends a title especially, they get more fans and the more that guys like GSP and Machida can continuing winning, the more popular the UFC will become and once again - more money. Just think of any other sport really, guys like LeBron James, Tiger Woods, and Sidney Crosby draw alot of people and new fans to their respective sports and it's guys like that the UFC wants to develop. And when someone finally beats these superstars it'll be easy to market them too. Anderson is the same. As for him not making weight - it's never happened. He has fought at two different weight classes though (185 and 205) but that was on purpose.



The UFC is at the peak of their popularity right now and UFC 100 just propelled them even higher. There was alot of room for failure with their 100th show but it actually turned out to be a really entertaining card. Most of the points you made about things wrong with the UFC right now are actually things that are perfect for the company right now. The pricetag is a big downside it seems but they wouldn't be charging that much if they wern't making maximum profit. Bad for some us, great for them - they're not losing any money. The UFC is a very smart business and they have alot of great guys in the company and things are going better than they ever could have imagined right now.

thanx for taking the time to write this out,,
Im impressed to read that kind of perspective,
I guess Im just spoiled and want to see good 5 round fights, while a lot of folks are content to see 1st round domination and knockouts

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Lesnar is an ass hat. He laughs at his own jokes and thinks he's funny. I watched him in a split video interview. Whoever edited the tape made Lesnar look like a dick. The camera cuts to Lesnar repeatedly with a big stupid grin on his face but doesn't reveal what he's laughing at. He's laughing at his own stupid jokes that didn't make the cut.

If he isn't blessed with the gift of gab he should answer questions and give insight but leave the bullshit at home. He doesn't need to act like a funny guy to get fans. And if he thinks foaming at the mouth is exciting, I'd rather watch paint dry.

 

[Greyskull]

Lesnar may be an asshat, but that dude can kick some people's asses.
I don't mind the shit talking... its all about the backing it up, and dude can do that.

6'3", 285, GREAT wrestler (note how he had Mir packed up pretty nicely with only one arm... allowing him to beat on dudes face with the other), great strength, agility and athleticism, and a hardcore fucking killer mean streak, to boot. I like fighters that get angry when they fight. Especially when they are monsters.

some folks i saw the fight with were not too thrilled with his after fight unsportsman like celebration... as i was yelling for Lesnar to hit Mir again for good measure. hahaha... wonder why i was always flagged for 'late hits' in college lol.

That shot Hendo gave the skinny brit made me want to go out and hit someone like that...

 

[catmanrob]

go check frank mirs myspace page, youll see me as a top friend..we grew up toghether and wrestled for the state title.....sucks to see that roid freek, classless POS brock lesnar beat him...yup