Organic Growing from a Microbial Perspective

[Microbeman]

I have initiated my plan to construct a cheap ($200 to $300) microscope to make available. Some of the components are supposed to be crossing the ocean right now. Once I get several bodies to work with I will build some diffraction shapes and filters to improve the images produced. The objectives are coming from several sources. It could be a while but I really wish to make this available cheaply.

 

[jaykush]

Thanks for the link. I read through it but it does not really answer the question of whether the guano purchased has been composted. At least I did not notice it in my rapid read. The author of the prose you referenced states that it is essential to compost manures before using them, yet says no such thing for guano. Because we have used manures extensively on our farm, spread on our hayfields and pasture I know and appreciate their value. There is a big difference, however, between spreading manure thinly over a field where it is rapidly decomposed and placing it in my vegetable garden or using it in a tea. I could understand mixing some guano in with your soil to gradually decompose and feed microbes but I think using it in CT opens the door to pathogen propogation. Just my opinion.

The author also mentions NPK being immediately available to the plant. This is, in my opinion, a carry over from the chemical paradigm. I believe this would imply that manure contains inorganic compounds or that plants can assimilate organic nutrients unassisted. This is something which interests me greatly. If anybody out there knows of some scientific papers showing that plants are capable of absorbing organic forms (molecules) of macro or micro nutrients without processing by microbes please point me to them.

guano has been composted in the cave, sometimes over thousands of years. microbes have done there work on it over and over again. most of the guano info is near the end. also you cant compare manure to guano. two different games. also imo guano is far better used mixed in the soil, BUT sometimes you need a quick dose of N or P and a liquid guano extract (its not really a compost tea) does the job fast and efficient. guano is true and tried over years and years in this community, this gives you far better confidence than any scientific test can give you.

i agree with you on the pathogens. ive left guano in a bottle and omfg did it reek so there is a chance. there had to have been some baddies in there. but just as much take some compost tea. cut off the air for half a day or more and your getting close to that stink and possible pathogens. hell you could possibly even use bad compost with manure that wasent aged properly and introduce pathogens. its the job of beneficials to outcompete those microbes. not ours to keep them out completely.

as for nutrient uptake i think i have a link to it ill have to search. i know for sure only some micro and macro nutes can be used by the plant without the microbes. each has there own molecular signature ( size ) if i remember and only some can pass though with ease while others need help. on the foliar surface this is even more efficient as the space between cells is larger and allows a larger number of nutrients to be used or fit through.

 

[jaykush]

I have initiated my plan to construct a cheap ($200 to $300) microscope to make available. Some of the components are supposed to be crossing the ocean right now. Once I get several bodies to work with I will build some diffraction shapes and filters to improve the images produced. The objectives are coming from several sources. It could be a while but I really wish to make this available cheaply.

make sure to have a hook up connection to connect slr cameras to the microscope. i have friends who do this but they have very expensive microscopes way out of the range of a stoners income. there images are amazing.

 

[Microbeman]

"sometimes over thousands of years"

I doubt this is true now, considering the amount being harvested and sold. I guess everything boils down to trusting your supplier.

 

[MrFista]

Good points from all. Do NOT trust anything in a bottle unless you personally know the product. I've had bad EJ before and just a smell confirmed this.

If in doubt, ask about.

Fantastic idea making microscopes affordable a lot of farmers will be grateful for this in the future.

I have never used guano or many of the other things people in this forum are 'sold' on. Hydro store crap - literally - crap.

It must be broken down though Tim - or we'd all hate the stuff from bad reports.

You are fighting established norms of hydro store dependance and wives tales ad nauseum. It is a good fight! You will meet much opposition, especially if you make sense.

 

[jaykush]

You are fighting established norms of hydro store dependance and wives tales ad nauseum. It is a good fight! You will meet much opposition, especially if you make sense.

half the people i talk to about gardening with microbes think im full of shit, but its all good sucks to be them.

 

[sophisto]

half the people i talk to about gardening with microbes think im full of shit, but its all good sucks to be them.

I feel you on this one....They never seem to complain about the smoke though do they???..... Sleepwalkers caught up by the fancy labels and "scientific breakthrough's"....

The dream is over for me...

 

[MrFista]

Awww

Smoke a bowl of this sophisto...

The dream is back!

 

[Suby]

half the people i talk to about gardening with microbes think im full of shit, but its all good sucks to be them.

I say Fuckem, my friend growing in hydro goes nuts over how little money and time I spend on my buds.
Especially since I now recycle soil and compost my job is even easier, no bales to lug and less ingredients to mix with the soil... I see bottle users and especially pushers and it's a little sad, some products work fine but I prefer a source of nutrients that allows me to grow with what's cheap, local, and organic.

 

[sophisto]

Awww

Smoke a bowl of this sophisto...

The dream is back!

Thanks Brah, thats much better........AHHHHHH!!!!

 

[Kozmo]

Subbed

 

[heady blunts]

 

[Bmac1]

SUb a dub dub.

 

[Granger2]

OK. A portion of the nutrients in guano, especially N, can be immediately available, because bats shit on the cave floor, but they also piss. Unlike in a feedlot where herbivores do both, the caves get no rain to leach the solubles.

The amount and type of microbial activity in guano is a... uh crapshoot [couldn't resist]. This largely depends on human activity. Some guano comes from totally exploitative mining, and some like the one over in Texas [Brakett Cave?] is done responsibly. -granger

 

[blackpulpit]

Hello guys!! love all the info here and have a lot of respect for you growers info on here and was wondering if you all could help me with a simple question?

I have the CC BAS nutrient w/minerals pack and Sphagnum peat moss and clay/lava rocks for aeration…I want to fill 2 15gallon soft pots I have which in order to do with equal parts of each item above as suggested, and, using a 5g bucket as the "part"….

Question: Should I only use say 10g of the PEAT MOSS because it will expand once wetted into say 15 or so gallons in actuality?? then add my EWC/nutrient Pack/Lava rocks to make it 30g needed... sorry if confusing.

 

[Coba]

Bacillis SUBtilis

that just means I'm subscribed... clever huh, thanks...

 

[Weird]

I think people miss the main point when it comes to gardening with proper microbrial populations (really the definition of true organic) and that is the plant gets to how it feeds according to its genetic preference, exudates need this and if it is not perfect your feeding the plant not the plant feeding itself.

I much prefer a plant that feeds itself, as good as I am with bottles, the best I can do is this, where in if I have the right soil, the plant do it automatically.

 

[xmobotx]

Question: Should I only use say 10g of the PEAT MOSS because it will expand once wetted into say 15 or so gallons in actuality?? then add my EWC/nutrient Pack/Lava rocks to make it 30g needed... sorry if confusing.

depends;

if you're using a bale of peat, you'll want to fluff it out & hydrate it before you mix. loose bagged stuff is already fluffed out

i hydrate it to where it's just consistently moist

 

[blackpulpit]

depends;

if you're using a bale of peat, you'll want to fluff it out & hydrate it before you mix. loose bagged stuff is already fluffed out

i hydrate it to where it's just consistently moist"


Thanks xmobotx, basically just wet it first and then add the 10g of peat?

 

[heady blunts]

bp---

using yucca or aloe as a wetting agent will help a lot in hydrating the peat. if you don't use those consider soaking the peat a day ahead of mixing your soil so it has a chance to homogenize. the raw peat is very hydrophobic right out of the bale.

the standard 3.8 cuft bale expands to roughly 6 cuft.

when I built my last batch of soil I blended the dry amendments, charged the char, and hydrated the peat first, then mixed everything together.