Yield problem with soil..

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

I just ran through my first full run with sub's super soil mixed exactly as directions say. I fed nothing all the way through flower, saw some mag def but nothing sever and that was it! Super easy and carefree. The best part is the herb tasted unreal, I mean great! I guess i shouldn't be surprised at that.

The only problem with it was the yield.. Strains that I have run many times before did not yield nearly as heavy as my plants grown in R.O. with biobizz full line minus "heaven" (That stuff is too expensive!).

I am trying to set up an auto watered (via tropf blumats) stadium grow with a no nute soil. If I could get the yield dialed in with this super soil I'd have my dream garden. Those blumats seem like they kick butt.

Disclaimer:

I did transplant two days before flower (had to for complicated reasons).

Maybe the roots didn't grow very far into the supersoil and instead the plant focused on flowering?


The directions say to create a "buffer" zone when transplanting so I packed at least 3-4 inches on all sides.

I read that the buffer is unnecessary for anything other than young clones, instead plant straight into the "hot" soil.

I've seen people get great yields out of this soil mix and am highly suspect the above details are responsible for the smaller yield.

Should I try again with the same mix (with no buffer and longer veg time)? or try something else like the moonshine mix?

Thanks for any input, I'm itching to get these blumats in the ground.

 

[milehighmedical]

.

 

[NUG-JUG]

I suggest using lc' s mix or a variation of with compost teas. Those tropf devices look cool but i'd be too nervous to trust watering to that thing.Subcools "super soil" is expensive and doesn't have an active microherd since you just add water and it's so hot. Will you be reusing it?

 

[VerdantGreen]

you havent told us how big the pots were or what the strain was. also subcools soil is not something everyone will be familiar with on this forum.
also you should trust your own judgement - if the plant needs magnesium then give it some, even if the instrictions say you dont need to

milehigh - i would disagree, if you use decent size pots i have had great yields with water only soils - but if course i will feed them a little extra if they look like they need it - often they dont.

V.

V.

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

The strain was my Royal Kush. I let these two get really big, about twice as big as normal then transplanted into 7 gallon smartpots with the 4 inch barrier. I normally get about 2.5 ounces off the smaller ones and only pulled a little more than that on the huge ones.


For those not familiar...

6 Bags Roots soil or equivalent high quality supped up grow soil
25 pounds Pure Worm Castings
½ cup Azomite trace minerals
2/3 Cup Sweet Lime IE Dolomite
1 Kilo Bone meal / IE 5 Pounds
1 Kilo Blood meal ( I use a bit more bone than Blood in this recipe)
1 Kilo Bat Guano bloom formula preferably Fruit bats
3/4 cup Epson Salts
The Perlite and Coco I happen to have and it will make a better mix but it is not necessary.


As far as it being expensive, yeah it is a little but I read somewhere that you can substitute a lot of the roots for sunshine4. The mag problem was slight and imo wasn't what killed the yield. maybe I'm wrong??

I was skeptical of the blumats too until my buddy started using the dleuxe ones, the ones made for big plants. They are seriously awesome and work great!


Is it possible that because I didn't let them "grow into" their final pots that they didn't bulk up?


Thanks for the responses, I just might try a batch of the moonshine mix.

 

[SilverSurfer_OG]

That looks like a very effective mix... 25lb's of wormcastings for just over 2.5 oz seems like short change?!

Sounds like a similar problem i had with my girls not moving into their new homes and utilising the extra space... but if they got huge then didnt yield i am bit confused?? Where they already into flower when transplanted? That was my mistake..

I wouldnt worry bout the mix, probably just needs a top up of N and topdressing wiv quality dry nutes and/or compost...maybe

Peas!!!

 

[re9volt]

For those not familiar...

6 Bags Roots soil or equivalent high quality supped up grow soil
25 pounds Pure Worm Castings
½ cup Azomite trace minerals
2/3 Cup Sweet Lime IE Dolomite
1 Kilo Bone meal / IE 5 Pounds
1 Kilo Blood meal ( I use a bit more bone than Blood in this recipe)
1 Kilo Bat Guano bloom formula preferably Fruit bats
3/4 cup Epson Salts
The Perlite and Coco I happen to have and it will make a better mix but it is not necessary.

is that 2/3 cup of dolomite lime per 7 gallon container, or for the whole mix??

 

[mad librettist]

All organic, water-only soil mixes generally yield less than any liquid nutrient feeding schedule.

I think someone forgot to tell that to my plants.

Whatever the system, you can pull the same yield if you do it right. Yield is 90% genetics, and 10% grower. Only the grower can't add beyond the potential of the plant. All she can do is take away by making mistakes.

It's also possible to fuck up any method, especially if it's your first time and you are used to a different method.

selfhemp, was the plant root-bound before you transplanted, and if so, did you loosen or trim the root ball?

 

[chef]

I purposely transplant right at flip if possible, takes a few inches off stretch & then I get a big explosion of growth thruout flowering. This is with crazy vigorous hybrids tho.
IME some shallow rooters simply don't make use of it all in time, while the hybrids can never get enough.

Teas work killer on well amended mixes too, really gets'em cookin' As well or better than a heavy bottle regimen IME.

my2

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

I should clarify that this recipe is fr a batch of soil not or just one pot. The directions are mix the above ingredients, water the soil lighty, let them "cook" for a month and you're good to go.

My plant wasn't terribly rootbound but it went straight from a 1 gallon pot to a seven gallon smartpot.

For all you organic soil experts, is this mix missing anything huge that moonshine mix does better? I'm thinking it's a pretty good mix and the yield problem was from the reasons I described above.

 

[re9volt]

I know the dolomite lime would call for 2 tbs/gallon, so your pretty low on that if you are using it for your CAL/MAG or PH.

For a 7 gallon container you would want 14 Tbs. or almost a cup of dolo lime in that one container. Since there are 16Tbs in a cup.

That won't help with your yield question, but to reduce or end your CAL/MAG worries it will, and with your PH adjusting.

 

[re9volt]

also.. It looks like you went light on the following..

5 lbs steamed bone meal
5 lbs Bloom bat guano
5 lbs blood meal

You said you used 1 kilo of each/ IE 5 pounds, but a Kilo is 2.2 lbs, not 5. Even 2 kilos of each would leave you 1.5 pounds short of what the recipe calls for in total between the 3.

IF you used 1 kilo of each you more than cut the nutrients in 1/2.

 

[bombadil.360]

1 Kilo Bone meal / IE 5 Pounds

1 kilogram is 1000 grams. that is like 2 pounds plus 100grams more or less.

peace

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

Hey sorry about that that was a cut and paste from another website. (He corrected it a couple pages later to 2.5 then a couple pages later to 5 each.) But I did only use 2.5 pounds of each. Could this be the culprit?


Thank you for the responses, I' making a new batch right now with the following changes:

8 large bags of a high-quality organic potting soil with coco fiber and mycorrhizae (i.e., your base soil)
25 to 50 lbs of organic worm castings
5 lbs steamed bone meal
5 lbs Bloom bat guano
5 lbs blood meal
¾ cup Epson salts
½ cup sweet lime (dolomite)
½ cup azomite (trace elements)
2 tbsp powdered humic acid


Still see anything that needs to be added?

 

[jaykush]

how long did you let your soil sit before using it?

also you can add more azomite than that to that much soil for sure.

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

how long did you let your soil sit before using it?

also you can add more azomite than that to that much soil for sure.

Great! Now I'm getting somewhere. I actually could not find the azomite brand trace minerals but did find about a liter size package of trace minerals.

I just read that he transplants into final pot (with super soil) 3-5 weeks before he clicks over. Maybe I was on to something with not letting them grow into their pots?


I do have to say that this mix grew the tastiest herb I've ever grown and I highly recommend it


Same strain:

With the super soil:


With my reg. biobizz

 

[jaykush]

Great! Now I'm getting somewhere. I actually could not find the azomite brand trace minerals but did find about a liter size package of trace minerals.

yea azomite can be a bitch to find locally. and actually in most places down right impossible. its best ordered online from a supplier you can find as close as possible to you. folks around here are clueless when you mention azomite. there like assmites? what? lol. when i used to buy it there was a place a few hours away that had it. even with shipping its a great deal. i got 50lbs for about 35$ and that's about a 5 gallon buckets worth, which will last a long time for most people. even longer if you recycle soil.

I just read that he transplants into final pot (with super soil) 3-5 weeks before he clicks over. Maybe I was on to something with not letting them grow into their pots?

that might have been the case, but i think it was several factors to be honest. one of the main ones might be is your not used to this type of system. coming from a system with liquid bottled ferts to a living soil with amendments is a whole different game. it takes time to dial in just like any other method. but i think your already learning and figuring out what went wrong. not letting the plants grow into the fresh soil is one but you already got that.

I do have to say that this mix grew the tastiest herb I've ever grown and I highly recommend it

now just think of how good it will be when you have this way of growing down proper. yield is always easily fixed with a little fine tuning and good notes.

 

[VerdantGreen]

well, i would say that going from 1 gallon to 7 gallon and flipping straight away - especially with an indica - probably meant that the roots stopped growing before they filled the pot. also if you let them get twice as big as normal in the 1 gallon pots could they have been a little rootbound? that wouldn't help them establish quickly in the new pots either.

i tend to repot and then flip most of the time but i like to go up to a pot 2-3 times the size so the roots can fill it a bit easier.

V.

 

[SELFHEMPLOYED]

Great thanks for the help guys I'm gonna try it with the new recipe and a way longer veg (would've last time but had some issues).


Should i add a bit more dolomite lime like someone above mentioned?

 

[a'muse]

I agree, going from a one gallon pot that wasn't root-bound, into a 7 gallon where they only had two weeks to establish before the flip, was the main contributor to the smaller yield.
The best situation for yield would be to tweak your veg period, so at the end of flowering they are becoming root-bound.
Also, two tbs a gallon with the lime is standard.

The taste that a good organic situation creates is second to none!
Try adding some molasses at the end for even more sweetness and depth in the flavor.