Who is not happy with LED the grow experiments?

[hydrorascal]

tenfeet..... your soo dead on its nuts !!! There is no current mfg in the world who makes leds of the proper spectrums to grow with. Be kinda like hanging 500w of incandescent lamps around plants and then wondering why the plants dont do well....

PROPER spectrum choice leds do very nicely. Yes, with their current output for them to be effective ... a form of scrog must be used. Honestly, as long as yield is there...who reeeally cares what grow style is used??

Lumens are a focus point for HPS ect. Those bulbs typically waste between 80 and 85% of their output on wrong spectrums and heat. With led arrays that are properly designed there is no wasted light... the plants use and love it all. Again, with a proper design.. heat isnt an issue either. Ive had many plants growing into the led array with zero leaf or stem or plant damage.

Its all about picking and choosing the proper tool for the job. Its really hard to unscrew a screw with a hammer.

 

[pandapuffin]

mugicnal engineer. nice to see another audio engineer here...
I think your views are a little misled on LED's. Is there a reason you have such disdain? Have you tried them yourself?? Im positive you havent. Anyway, just as Hydrorascal said, much of HPS lumens are completely wasted, not to mention the heat issues, ballast fires, heat identification by police, and so on... We're just trying to find a better way of doing things, and you dont see us going on the HPS threads, bashing THEIR lights do you? Me, Im THANKFUL that people are trying new things, especially when its something that can make it safer to do this. My buddies house burned to the ground after having a fire started by his grow, and no, it wasnt bad wiring.

 

[molly]

LEDs are the wave of the future. I can't wait until they become more practical.

 

[tenfeetofganja]

mugicnal engineer. nice to see another audio engineer here...
I think your views are a little misled on LED's. Is there a reason you have such disdain? Have you tried them yourself?? Im positive you havent. Anyway, just as Hydrorascal said, much of HPS lumens are completely wasted, not to mention the heat issues, ballast fires, heat identification by police, and so on... We're just trying to find a better way of doing things, and you dont see us going on the HPS threads, bashing THEIR lights do you? Me, Im THANKFUL that people are trying new things, especially when its something that can make it safer to do this. My buddies house burned to the ground after having a fire started by his grow, and no, it wasnt bad wiring.

Your right, I have no attempts at LED's under my belt. However, I think your taken quite an offense awful quickly.

Personally, my only goal is to create fine quality cannabis and improve the methods of which I currently am practicing. Arent we all?

I apologize if my statement seems....rather harsh. But I am only telling you my experiences. I have YET to see an LED grow that has led me to believe that they are the future of indoor cultivation.

But then again this industy is always changing and improving, and it is people like the users on IC who make those changes happen.

PLEASE prove me wrong. I would love to drop those energy bills and kick all my huge blowers to the rubbish can.



irie meditations...

10ft ganja


p.s.

out of the four indoor fires i have seen in my time were either through under-rated power strips, wrong gauge wiring, poor/faulty wiring, and tapping power.

p.s.s

my neighbors house burnt to the ground. but we later found out he was tappin power from the grid. the grow was SO large that he blew out transformers for the grid A COUPLE TIMES. fortunatly for me, all his power consumption was on the night cycle, while all mine was on the day cycle. so basically the only thing his blackouts caused us was minor trouble with out mother room which ran 24/7 ...but with a couple cans of gas and our handy-dandy generators...it was not problem..

***for all you greedy growers, karma is a bitch, and she will turn your ass in. PAY YOUR BILLS!!

 

[irconfused]

Well having personally used the Hid Hut Led Ufo (with 80w of supplemental 2700k fluros and another 80 of uvb intensive reptile lights to help trichome production) as recommended by hid hut was supposed to bump the output to equal to a 600whps.

For all intents and purposes it just does not work, I did it side by side with a 600whps and it was an absolute joke to compare the two, and having done fluro grows before I can say the ufo only helped a bit with the vegitative growth (super stretchy small leaves and thin stems) but the plants just did not want to flower even when the ufo was used covering less than 2'x2' area with all that supplemental light. For reference when identical size clones were put in both areas with everything identical aside from the lighting I would say the bud weight was roughly 8x better on the hps side per plant, and I was able to light 3x as many plants with the hps.

As for the Procyon 100 I do not have first hand experience using this unit however after speaking with the owner of homegrownlights.com (the manufacturer and I would assume developer as well) it is obvious that he knows little if at all about growing anything let alone marijuana (for instance he did not know what full spectrum light was!)

Suffice to say spend the extra money on cfls for the rest of your house and turn the thermostat down as right now the only thing led "grow lights" are good for is wasting money. But if anyone doesn't believe me I would sure as hell love to get rid of this $600 piece of junk led ufo haha.

As the old saying goes, if it sounds too good to be true it probably is!


Edit: I forgot to mention the grow method was scrog, as the yeild would have been even worse if they were grown in a normal configuration. This is another issue with leds, some see it as a plus that leds give light in very narrow feild (no need for reflectors) however this means the only part of the plants getting light are what have a clear shot straight up.

 

[Garden Knowm]

I see a lot of people saying LED's are useless, I have one 13w (225 light) panel on one skunk44 plant. It is my first, and I have not had one single problem since the get go. The plant is very healthy, but yeah, in comparison to a 600w light, it hasnt grown as big or as 'thick', but is a really substantial plant nonetheless. Of course you cant gro some superduper world class nugs with this 13w light, but I do believe you can get decent sized rewards nonetheless. I think its perfect for microgrows. And personally, I wouldnt consider a 600w operation a 'micro grow', nor a fair comparison, but what do I know.. 3weeks into flowering, and everything looks great, and not any different than any other plants I see on here as far as progress.

picture please

thank you

congrats on your success!

 

[pandapuffin]

Garden Knowm - if you or someone else can direct me how to put up pictures anonymously, I will gladly do so. I'd love to put up pics.

10ft Ganja. - Sorry if it seemed like I was taking offence too quickly, didnt really mean to. It's always hard to discern tone over written messages. sorry dude. The main reason why I wanted to use the LED was for heat reasons/safety issue. I just dont have the pignuts to run some hi-watt light that produces more heat than anything else - especially if I wouldnt be at home while the light was on... Im not biased towards LED's and I dont think that they can produce like a 6oow or anything, I've never said that, and I wont! But I do believe that this technology is coming around. What I dont get is how people are having such mixed results with them. (i.e. IRConfused's post) The plant I have (skunk44 from Nirvana) has been under nothing but this small 13w LED. It hasnt had one problem, and in comparison to the other micro grow plants(on IC), it doesnt look any different. I dont use any nutes, prof.fertilizer. All I use is a bag of miracle grow, and water. (I had three other plants that looked identical, but were, unfortunately, Male) I read other posts about LEDs and there are such mixed results, which leads me to believe that bad, dying, sickly plants are completely at fault of the grower, not the light source. I read and read on here, and all these people get excited about using all these special nutrients, fertilizers, that they go WAY overboard and jack up their plants. (im NOT referring to you IRConfused, Im talking about other LED threads) ANd you're right, the best method for this is scrog - THOUGH, I was a first time idiot and let mine grow naturally (no lst, scrog). Its about 14'' high, but yes, the lowest branches are quite a bit smaller, but producing nonetheless. Pistils are about 2''-3'' now (this is the end of week 3). I did 1 week of veg, then 12/12.

 

[tenfeetofganja]

It's all right panda, as they say.....no harm, no foul.

I just want to see ONE garden that efficently utilizes LED as an only source of light.

So far the record is 0-6....

If any IC users would like to donate an unwated LED, so I can run side-by-side tests. Contact Me.


10ft ganja


p.s.

www.photobucket.com

Photobucket is a great way to categorize all of your images on an online album, which are easily converted into format to use on forums.

Enjoy!

 

[bloodshot red]

Vu Jah Day?

Vu Jah Day?

This discussion resembles attitudes towards HIDs whence upon a time flourescents (not cfl) ruled indoor mj cultivation. Early 1970's...?
Typical florcn't grown buds were often lame, airy & of sativa bag seed origin, while the HID grow revolution was slow to take hold. And, HID's superiority was obvious, (unlike LED's current long on promises & very short on deliveries), few people jumped on HID's when knowledge & availability regarding their potential had become widely known.
There WILL be a point when LED type technology will replace HID, IMO. Obviously, this will not be happening very soon. The penetration depth of LED cannot deliver vs. HID, YET. Specific wavelength type cultivation that LED has promised may just be premature.
Greed once again has been the motivation behind hurrying a product out the door in beta. Greedy people are usually worried about "missing out" or someone else beating them to the profit margin.
Until selfish motive is toned down, "it is what it is." (Or w/led, isn't...) I wait.

 

[tenfeetofganja]

This discussion resembles attitudes towards HIDs whence upon a time flourescents (not cfl) ruled indoor mj cultivation. Early 1970's...?

I don't remeber any time in which flourescents "ruled" indoor cultivation.

Shit back then none of us even DREAMED of growing a forest indoors.

LED "may" be the future, but even if it does revolutionize how plants are cultivated indoors, I honestly dont want to deal with 100,000 little f***ing bulbs to grow a plant. The god damned christmas lights are pain in the ass enough to change out, I cant even imagine LED.

ON a side note... the store had a set of LED christmas lights (produces only 3watts of energy for an entire strand of 300 lights). Paid extra $10 per strand, and they went out after a week on the house...

 

[chosen]

Christmas tree LEDs are cheaply made. Most of the guys who make these LED growlight setups do a much better job. Yet, they still get blown away by the light output of simple fluorescent lights.
KNNA is dead on. I've tried LEDs by a couple of different companies. They stink and they lie. I used 2 10 watt setups and my 150 hps that only cost a $100 blew them away. It's a lot of dealers filling people with rubbish about the efficiency on LEDs that just don't put out enough light yet.

 

[hydrorascal]

and the claims many out there make of... "hang the led array 4 feet over your plants..."
are just absurd. How far away do you keep your 400w HPS ???

 

[pandapuffin]

I didnt start using this light because of false promises fom a vendor. I chose it simply for safety of usage, and stealth purposes. Like i said before, too much risk of fire when using HID/HPS lighting. I see so many people on here with extremely amateur wiring jobs, I tremble just looking at them. I cant believe some are so willing to endanger their families, themselves, just for growing pot. Though, in respect, I have seen SOME nice setups on here, that certainly have safety in mind...
I dunno, I've had a great experience with this LED panel I have. I paid less than $50. SO even if it doesnt work, Im not out a bunch of money. I spent over $85 trying to get my CFL setup going - which I have abandoned because the LED was showing more positive results.

 

[pandapuffin]

sorry to double post, but forgot something - tenfeetganja: i already use photobucket, but that doesnt solve the anonymity problem. Im talking about not being able to trace IP's and the like... Is TOR the way to go?? Anyone? Posting pictures just isnt worth it, unless I can do so anonymously.

 

[green_thumb]

those 168 led bulbs are not the way to go

those 168 led bulbs are not the way to go

posted on another forum:
I have 14 of those 168 led red/blue mixed bulbs. They are bright, but at the cost of no lateral dispersion; a 5" round array expands to only 24" @ 10' (probably the 15° viewing angle version).
My first attempt was to make a flat grid with a 2.5" gap between staggered rows of bulbs; this was a failure as even 4' away only the area directly under the bulb/array was illuminated.
So I then remounted them so each bulb was touching the 6 adjacent ones; better but only the bulbs directly over the plant were contributing.
Next was an arcade so that the arrays on the sides could be directed at the plant itself; better but the end bulbs were wasted.



My final configuration was/is a cupola affair with 10 bulbs (1680 low power leds) focused on a single plant 5" away from the face of the arrays. There are 2 arrays pointed straight down and the other 8 are individually aimed at a specific spot on the plant and physically placed as close to the top 2 as possible. The entire plant is now well illuminated and flowering strongly, how dense the buds will be is anyone's guess.

If the leds are too close the result is that the leaf will have bright spots 5mm in dia. and most of the leaf will be in shadow.It takes ~4" for the 168 5mm sources to meld into a uniform field w/o gaps (lighter/darker patterns), so I would not consider going any closer than 4".

To say that this low power led application is cost effective would be a sorry joke, but clearly it is possible even if it cannot be recommended.
Understand that I have the highest possible density of low power leds in 4 sq ft that are illuminating 1 sq ft, so it is also NOT space efficient.
Anyone wanting to use leds should look at the high power ones and bear in mind that commercial panels are far too weak for effective plant growth.

But there is a general problem with the so-called testing, mixing types of light sources precludes any meaningful conclusion.
bah

 

[green_thumb]

leaf orientation under leds

leaf orientation under leds

To those who have grown with only leds, did you notice a change in leaf orientation ?

All the fan leaves are almost vertical, what gives ?
(bear in mind it is under a 10 bulb/1680 led cupola so when vertical the leaf is lit both sides)

 

[stinkfinger]

Here is a great idea. Spend months if not years of your life planning a cannabis grow.Then go out and purchase some "new-age" LEDs for your grow.(instead of buying HIDs) Get your set-up put together and running. Now spend the next couple months risking your personal freedom for something your extremely passionate about. Next harvest your pathetic crop that did not recieve proper lumens or wavelengths. LED lights are a marketing SCAM, shame on Hightimes magazine for writing those bullshi t articles on LEDS. And fuc k everyone else here trying to mislead newb growers for a personal gain. There is a side by side grow on these forums that shows that stupid ass UFO LED(that suppoisvly puts out the same lumens as a 600w hps)compared to a actual 400wHPS. Uh yeah the 400wHPS blew that piece of junk out of the water! The UFO LED(equal to 600wHPS as advertised) produces less than a 400wHPS in reality.(thats where i live!) Lets make this easy... LED = POS

 

[fulltimehuman]

anyone ever heard of this TI smart lamp LED? it is a canadian company Theoreme
Inovations but I only find info no price or selling info. It is an LED that actually looks
like it may be finally worth using, price depending.

 

[socioecologist]

UFO LED vs. 600w HPS

UFO LED vs. 600w HPS

I just finished up a side-by-side comparison between the UFO LED and a 600w HPS (sorry no pictures). I really wanted the UFO LED light to compete, but it just wasn't in the cards. A couple Kali Mist clones of identical size were flowered immediately after rooting, SOG style. The UFO was kept within a half inch of its clone's top throughout the experiment (and it was the only plant under the light), while the HPS clone was packed in with 8 others. Both were in 2.5 gallon containers. After 72 days of flowering (and receiving identical nutrients), both were trimmed and dried for two weeks.

Final weight --
UFO LED: 6.5g
HPS: 16.7g

So about 2.5x more yield under the HPS at the individual plant level, but obviously a lot more potential yield if you ran multiple plants at the same time. From a purely subjective visual and smoke test of a plant I'm pretty familiar with, there was no discernible difference in the finished product.

My opinion on this light is that (1) it only uses 80 watts!, and (2) I've obtained similar results using 80 watts of CFL. I really hope the technology improves and goes down in price in the near future, but I'll be sticking with my HIDs for my medical needs.

 

[Boo2112]

Leds

Leds

Guys
I Also have been looking into LEDS not as a grow at this time but as a way of building a new type of Led grow light. I worked for Honeywell Aerospace in lights for 27 years before my neck and back problems put me on the side lines 2 years ago. Almost all lights on airplanes are LEDs even the airforce planes are all going to leds. My best friend only worked in leds And trust me Uncle sam only buys the best that is out there Nasa is working with Leds now to grow with and in time there will be a led light that stand up to the 600s and the 1000s watters.........Anyone want to try form a team to make one or two. I am sure I can get a line on many types of leds from Honeywell. I no how to manufacture all the Alum. And the power rings to tie in the leds. I also think a small curve in the light hood will take care of the angle problems most leds have. SO as you can see I have been thinking about this for sometime now. SO it you want talk about it PM me. I no there are many smart stoners sitting out there with nothing to do......

Boo

Ps I share my bud....

I hope this list helps you out.

O by the way look at the intensity
angle (deg)


this is a Nasa thing
http://www.techbriefs.com/content/view/499/36/

Luminous and a few other ranking for leds
http://www.luckylight.cn/product_list.asp?catalogid=11&type_id=50

More LEDs
http://www.hebeiltd.com.cn/?p=led.auto.piranha