question on clone only strains,why cant we seed them

[Rudedewd]

One misconception is that a clone only is a strain, it is a phenotype of a strain. Selfed seeds may or may not have a phenotype that is as good or better than the original clone but it will not be identical to the original (even though it could be damn close). One thing to remember for people who lust after the original clones is that all of these phenotypes were started from seed by someone and the cut just got passed around. If you grow out seeds you can choose which plants that you can keep in perpituity, and if you plant enough seeds you will find some gems that are as good if not better than many clone onlys. Remember, just because you can't exactly replicate the clone only in seed form doesn't mean that the seed doesn't have potentual to come very close to the "original"

 

[Rgd]

Please show us photos of true Cheese S1's if you have them,, quids on the are BigBuddha's Cheese or Kachina.

>not sure if you meant me and my deleted post.
i realized it might end up in controversy so i nuked it.

the gist of it was:

bubba, og, cheese clones reverse well and throw out
non hermi, clone similar s1's

Would not touch anything from a seed company to reverse.
It has to be a grown out several times clone only to bother reversing.
Life is too short to mess around with Big budda or GH .
The clone has to come from a verifiable source first to even bother growing it, AND after that it has to be grown out ar least several times.

The s1 cheeses going now are a little on the short side.
They look like skunk#1 all the way, none of this indi leaning varied pheno bs
Its best to wait until they have flowered.


Good "homogenous" comment.
bubba,cheese, og sure are.
Would not reverse escd due to hermi in genes.

 

[englishrick]

check this out.....

..[F]..................[M]
ChemD.... x .....ChemD[reverced polen] = S1

S1 is basicly an incross "imo"........the food industry would call it an F....i think S1 will show parent phenos in a similar way to F2

if you want simple S1`s......Rez did some OGKA S1 seeds......its been done !!!

Hazeseeker
I believe but could be wrong here that selfing is basically opening up the door to the family/pool the original cut came from,
so selfing say Chem D could give you a pheno close to the cut but it'll also give different phenos depending on the matching of the chromosomes held already within the genes

ID SAY YOUR SPOT ON......WELL SAID BRO......YOU SOUND LIKE A HUMBLE GENIUS

 

[gramsci.antonio]

being used in cross is one thing... reproduce the same exact plant is impossibile just by using the f1s..

Supposing that a plant is Elite because it has very rare gene, and those genes are recessive (otherwise they wouldn't be special, would they) then the mendelian law says that if you take a couple of genes 0% of the f1 will show them, and 1.5625% of the f2 will show them, therefore you'll need a LOT of plants and a LOT of generations to stabilize them.

Consider also that many special feature of our beloved clone, like taste or potency, are regulated by more than one gene, and you are playing with many genes at the same time, like speed, potency, taste, pest resistance, ....


That's why GHS elite seeds or from other companies aren't as the real thing, because it would require a LOT of money to make a stable line, thus they prefer to release something that isn't the real thing, but it's much cheaper to breed...

Like the chineese version of your preferred food....

 

[Rgd]

I can ONLY speak from experience.Not quotes from elsewhere.

Bubba clone reversed make plants that look taste smell and act like bubba

Og clone reversed make plants that look taste smell and act like bubba plants.

Cheese s1's have have not been grown to maturity yet [by me] so can only comment that they look like each other and resemble skunk#1 in growth pattern.

and this is all from personal experience

Thats it for me ,good thread, carry on.

 

[englishrick]

so there is no Landrace lookalikes in the Cheese S1,,,????????

 

[phan]

I know I am taking a risk posting on this thread as a novice, but, I think this could be an important part of the discussion. In Michael Pollan's great book the Botony of Sex (I think that is the title) he discusses a variety of plants and the way the "reproduce" and how they have been manipulated by man. In the chapter about apples, he says that most apple varieties are the same plant "grafted" or cloned. If you planted the apple seeds from a Macintosh apple tree, each seed would produce a different type of apple and many of them would not be edible. I would guess the same argument would hold true for this discussion. Just my newb .02$

 

[Rgd]

so there is no Landrace lookalikes in the Cheese S1,,,????????

Excellent question!

So far it looks like skunk#1 phenos all the way and no throwback to
skinny sativas or wide leaf indicas.

I will only be able to answer that as they finish.

Then there will be photos.

Only want to know the truth like you do.

Interested whether the cheese smell comes through.

I do know that this is an s1 of the cheese cut so I am not wasting my time in hybrid land because again life is too short.



I can say there are no throwbacks in
Og ghost s1`or bubba s1
Due to having grown them more than once.

also very interesting info Phan

 

[Scoobs]

IT is all about the SEX.

Clones are produced asexually. (They are identical)
Seeds are produced sexually.

Sexual reproduction produces a great deal of genetic variation through the shuffling of both beneficial and deleterious mutations.

IT is this variation that guarantees genetic differences between seeds.

This is the main reason I enjoy growing from seed, you never know what you will get.

 

[englishrick]

I know I am taking a risk posting on this thread as a novice, but, I think this could be an important part of the discussion. In Michael Pollan's great book the Botony of Sex (I think that is the title) he discusses a variety of plants and the way the "reproduce" and how they have been manipulated by man. In the chapter about apples, he says that most apple varieties are the same plant "grafted" or cloned. If you planted the apple seeds from a Macintosh apple tree, each seed would produce a different type of apple and many of them would not be edible. I would guess the same argument would hold true for this discussion. Just my newb .02$

yeh man....the pink grapefruit came from the 1 clone...if that clone was not dicovered and mothered our fruit and veg shops would never be the same...


id say in F1... ie, "true ibl x true ibl",...eg, sk1 ibl x whitewidow ibl....you get a 50/50 mix of genes,,,,certain parent traits will be dom at f1,,,but this is due to one particular parent plant having resessive genes....and as we know all plants are indervidual...SamS seached for a long time to find the perfect recessive sk1 male..

i read F2/F3 is where the magic is....what do you guys think??

i love the idea of S1 and feminised outcrosses...eg C99 x OGKA

Excellent question!

So far it looks like skunk#1 phenos all the way and no throwback to
skinny sativas or wide leaf indicas.

I will only be able to answer that as they finish.

Then there will be photos.

Only want to know the truth like you do.

Interested whether the cheese smell comes through.

I do know that this is an s1 of the cheese cut so I am not wasting my time in hybrid land because again life is too short.

I can say there are no throwbacks in
Og ghost s1`or bubba s1
Due to having grown them more than once.

also very interesting info Phan

i heard Cheese S1 was throwin out Landrace Lookalikes....but when they were feminised onto each other eg...S1cheese#3 x S1cheese#12 ,,the results was extreemly close to the clone....

 

[thinman]

for what its worth....not trying to piss in anyone's corn flakes....but a foaf has had most of what are considered clone only "elites" through the years. he was among the first to exchange cuttings with people holding the hyped up elites. guess what, he has not kept a single one of them through the years. he shared everything with me, and i don't hold any of them at this time either. i'm growing jack the ripper and shiva skunk at the moment and would put either of these strains up against most of the elites i've run. i paid $1000 for a cut of pacific's g-13 and gave it away after just a couple of runs of it. same with og-kush, bubba kush, genius, trainwreck, chocolate diesel, just on and on. they have all been passed on to others. if they were so wonderful, surely i would have kept at least one of them.

take my advice and remember the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence. little clicks of people who shared clones years ago went to great lengths to pimp their clones, as if to wave them in the faces of those who could not obtain them. its all a bunch of bullshit. you're just as likely to find a terrific plant from a pack of nirvana seeds. it reminds me of the wizzard of oz, when you find out that its just a man behind the curtain---not a true wizzard. sort of a disappointment. the same goes for the elite clones. always a disappointment in some way or other. it is just pot after all.

 

[DocLeaf]

take my advice and remember the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence. little clicks of people who shared clones years ago went to great lengths to pimp their clones, as if to wave them in the faces of those who could not obtain them. its all a bunch of bullshit. you're just as likely to find a terrific plant from a pack of nirvana seeds. it reminds me of the wizzard of oz, when you find out that its just a man behind the curtain---not a true wizzard. sort of a disappointment. the same goes for the elite clones. always a disappointment in some way or other. it is just pot after all.

good post ^^^

 

[CCfromTCC]

good post ^^^

what he said^

 

[Chrome]

thats lil ot ... but selection is resulting in finding the special phenos. if its male or female or even seeds after all. it makes sense and its a hard work. selecting from Nirvana is the same as somebuddy selected the elite cuts and shared them with friends.

everyone should select his own green. but some ppl cant do it and are more than happy to get a selected cut from a friend. some of those cuts are amaizing. others less.

 

[englishrick]

cheese is easyer to get than good sk1 seeds

 

[floydfanx6]

not eveyone can get clones like me,,,i live on the east coast,,so i pretty much have to grow from seeds everytime,unless once in a while il get a clone from someone but that is very rare out here

 

[bassickly]

What does living on the east coast have to do with getting clones???? Just wondering

 

[floydfanx6]

clones are readily available like baseball trading cards in california,,people are more secretiv on the east coast,and no one grows medically where i live,,so clone only strains lik gdp,urkle,og,ect,,,i cant get

 

[floydfanx6]

i want some og kush clones,or gdp cheers

 

[Verdi99]

for what its worth....not trying to piss in anyone's corn flakes....but a foaf has had most of what are considered clone only "elites" through the years. he was among the first to exchange cuttings with people holding the hyped up elites. guess what, he has not kept a single one of them through the years. he shared everything with me, and i don't hold any of them at this time either. i'm growing jack the ripper and shiva skunk at the moment and would put either of these strains up against most of the elites i've run. i paid $1000 for a cut of pacific's g-13 and gave it away after just a couple of runs of it. same with og-kush, bubba kush, genius, trainwreck, chocolate diesel, just on and on. they have all been passed on to others. if they were so wonderful, surely i would have kept at least one of them.

take my advice and remember the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence. little clicks of people who shared clones years ago went to great lengths to pimp their clones, as if to wave them in the faces of those who could not obtain them. its all a bunch of bullshit. you're just as likely to find a terrific plant from a pack of nirvana seeds. it reminds me of the wizzard of oz, when you find out that its just a man behind the curtain---not a true wizzard. sort of a disappointment. the same goes for the elite clones. always a disappointment in some way or other. it is just pot after all.

I am 100% positive that shivaskunk will get you where you want to be and if it dont you seriously ought to consider changing drugs.....Verdi99