Pharmgold VaporHawg

[Breakover]

Hey Breakover, what size collection pot are you using with your VH? Does it just pull right into negative gauge pressure?

I'm getting set to put my VH into service, but I only have a 12" pot to use with it for now. I'm currently using a couple TR21's and have debated just adding another one until I can get Ironfist to fab me up one of their 22" collection vessels to take full advantage of the Hawg. Given GW saying that surface area is usually the limiting factor, I'm wondering if adding another TR21 would give me similar performance to the VH on a 12" pot. I would need to have some electrical and construction work done to use the Hawg so another TR21 is easier to implement ATM.

I have 4 X 800Watt sous vide heaters in the water bath which I'm hoping would keep positivie pressure up with the VH w/ 12" pot.

We run a single 12" as well. We have an internally refrigerated tank that allows us to run passive for 90% of each run. We only run the pump to start and end the extraction process. Our heat source is a small water heater fitted with a PID, recirculation pump, and loaded with PG. I believe that the element is around 1000 watts.The VH will outrun it, for sure, but we have no problem running 3-4 lbs of material (approx 12-15 lbs of isobutane) in under an hour. This hot (80F max) water is plumbed in (and out) of the extraction area to a jacketed collection platter.

The VH could easily handle two MK V's, IMO.

Oh, and we don't have a separate passive bypass loop, we just let the gas flow right through the VH, adding such a bypass may increase recovery times, but we've yet to have a need for even faster recovery. Seems we have reached the outer limits of what a 12" jacketed platter can effectively evaporate anyway, pump or no pump, regardless of heat source power. Eliminate one bottleneck and you will find another...

I'd run that VH and never look back. Go 1/2" all the way and you're good!

 

[thcnology]

Yes, Pharmgold closed their doors. I've sent out feelers to see if another manufacturer wants to buy their intellectual property, but in the interim the BRP-1 Welch pump it is built around is still available.

If no one picks up the VaporHawg line, I'll publish a design.

GW do you have a part number or link to this Welch BRP-1?

 

[Gray Wolf]

GW do you have a part number or link to this Welch BRP-1?

I would suggest contacting Welch's area sales manager John Brock, and asking him where your closest smiley distributor lives.

John was a joy to work with and when I last checked with him, the factory had a dozen in stock and he said that they could be purchased individually. john.brock@garnerdenver.com

 

[thcnology]

Damn email kicked back said bad domain invalid? You got a phone number for him maybe? I'm thinking I may just have build one of these built...it prob be worth it to me as I have a "noise ordinance" the compressors too much noise Only question were these tested running 100% propane without issues?

 

[Gray Wolf]

858-663-1641

 

[JacobsLadder]

I would suggest contacting Welch's area sales manager John Brock, and asking him where your closest smiley distributor lives.

John was a joy to work with and when I last checked with him, the factory had a dozen in stock and he said that they could be purchased individually. john.brock@garnerdenver.com

I reached out to John and unfortunately he said that given the nature of the pump head they would only work with qualified oem's. He referenced that since it was used for butane and lpg they restricted private sales. Which is understandable, but disappointing for me. I'm about done with the cmeps and the constant issues. So, it looks like a no go for any diy extraction pumps based on the welch brp-1. He did give me a contact for all brp-1 sales inquires. I'll reach out to said person, but im not going to hold my breath.

 

[Gray Wolf]

I reached out to John and unfortunately he said that given the nature of the pump head they would only work with qualified oem's. He referenced that since it was used for butane and lpg they restricted private sales. Which is understandable, but disappointing for me. I'm about done with the cmeps and the constant issues. So, it looks like a no go for any diy extraction pumps based on the welch brp-1. He did give me a contact for all brp-1 sales inquires. I'll reach out to said person, but im not going to hold my breath.

Oooops! Sounds like John talked to their legal department after he and I talked.

I'll give him a call and see if there are any other build plans by others. Last I talked that was a possibility.

 

[Breakover]

I know this is a kind of old thread, but there are replacement pumps and rebuild kits now available for the VH for those lucky enough to already have one. I'm saddened by the way this whole PharmGold thing went down, but at least we can get parts now. We haven't needed any as of yet, with hundreds of hours of runtime, but even the best equipment wears out eventually.

 

[Gray Wolf]

I know this is a kind of old thread, but there are replacement pumps and rebuild kits now available for the VH for those lucky enough to already have one. I'm saddened by the way this whole PharmGold thing went down, but at least we can get parts now. We haven't needed any as of yet, with hundreds of hours of runtime, but even the best equipment wears out eventually.

Good job!! Can you share a source brother B?

 

[Breakover]

Good job!! Can you share a source brother B?

James at PDX gold sent this:

We finally got word that Welch will allow us to resell you a replacement pumps or kits if that becomes an issue. Ideally, they would like us to service the pump but said that if we trust the customer that we can talk you though process. Attached are the various replacement parts and kits. They will be up on the new website soon, but here you go.



BRP-1 Replacement pump price is $1995.00 and the various kit pricing are below:

….....…

 

[Breakover]

This is all on their website, in fact.

 

[lawya]

James at PDX gold sent this:

We finally got word that Welch will allow us to resell you a replacement pumps or kits if that becomes an issue. Ideally, they would like us to service the pump but said that if we trust the customer that we can talk you though process. Attached are the various replacement parts and kits. They will be up on the new website soon, but here you go.



BRP-1 Replacement pump price is $1995.00 and the various kit pricing are below:

….....…

Is that the same James Davies from Pharmgold and Timbercon?

 

[Breakover]

Is that the same James Davies from Pharmgold and Timbercon?

Yeah I believe so.

 

[lawya]

Who would trust him after everyone he conned?

 

[Breakover]

Who would trust him after everyone he conned?

Unfortunately, one has no choice for parts.

 

[lawya]

It surprises me that Welch is down with their name and reputation associated with Davies. They must not have ears in the cannabis community.

I wonder if they have a different dealer here on the east coast?

 

[lawya]

@graywolf. You started it all. What do you say?

 

[Gray Wolf]

@graywolf. You started it all. What do you say?

As little as possible. Sorry, no comment on PDX Gold or a universal catholic solution.

I will say that the Welch BMP-1 is a hoss and except for the prototype that Joe and I ran to destruction on the test sled, I'm not aware of anyone breaking one or wearing anything out yet, despite hundreds of running hours.

Of course the time to lay in the rebuild parts, is before you need them.

I've never abandoned a customer, so I will help those VaporHawg owners who do need parts, but are wary of further business with the new provider.

Please don't ask if you don't have an original VaporHawg and issues with Welch's new vendor.

If ya'll contact me at graywolfslair1@gmail.com, I'll share an alternate source for the parts you need.

 

[HG23]

Kaf, kaf, kaf, big boy toys are getting spendy.

From the free air specs, it looks like it should kick ass and take names.

The VaporHawg was about 6 cfm free air at 1725 rpm. Pharmgold charged $12k for the last ones out the door.

One thing I found with the VaporHawg, was much of the extra pump capacity is wasted if you don't have the vaporization surface area to take advantage of it.

Hey GW,

I'm in the process of trying to size a recovery pump for a project and I'm a little confused about how to tie together the vessel size (evaporative surface area) and necessary pump capacity to achieve the fastest recovery rate possible without over doing it on pump size (CFM).

I'm making live resin so I can only add so much heat to the collection pot in order to avoid thermal degradation. It makes sense to me that the evaporative surface area will be the next limiting factor. I will have my fabricator make the widest vessels possible, but I'm still working on the designs and don't have an exact figure for that yet.

Are there some equations or something you use to tie these ideas together to figure out the needed pump size?

 

[Gray Wolf]

Hey GW,

I'm in the process of trying to size a recovery pump for a project and I'm a little confused about how to tie together the vessel size (evaporative surface area) and necessary pump capacity to achieve the fastest recovery rate possible without over doing it on pump size (CFM).
I'm making live resin so I can only add so much heat to the collection pot in order to avoid thermal degradation. It makes sense to me that the evaporative surface area will be the next limiting factor. I will have my fabricator make the widest vessels possible, but I'm still working on the designs and don't have an exact figure for that yet.
Are there some equations or something you use to tie these ideas together to figure out the needed pump size?

Sorry I don't have a magic formula, but I can tell you that you limitations on surface area are closely related to the vessels pressure rating. ASME Section VIII requires that it be rated at 3X the systems maximum pressure.


12" is the largest ASME clamp and is rated at 7 barr, or about 101 psi. Larger than 12" would require an alternate means of closure.


Recovery rate on a 12" pot was about a pound every three minutes, holding heat to 70F, with both the Haskel and the VaporHawg.


Actual CFM is closely related to pot pressure, as one piston stroke at 15 psi intake pressure, delivers about half as much volume as one at 30 psi.