Old strains VS new strains

[Blowmonkey]

Hm...for some reason I can't choke that down. In fact, I flat out don't beleive it. Even if trichs don't carry much active compound in themselved ( which im sure if you have well structured trichs with bubble tips they do ), it is most likely an indication of the concentration of active compounds inside the plant material.

Why don't you believe it? Why is it so hard to understand? Why do you doubt scientific research? Why do you put more faith in your own speculation and others' farfetched theories?

And resin is cough inducing? Hm...in a good chest expansive type of way. Plant matter is much worse to smoke IMO.

You do realize that the resin is considered plant material as well? It consist out of many more substances than cannabinoids alone. All kinds of waxes, oils and terpenes are in there as well. Some strains produce a hell of a lot of THC per trich, some don't.

That's pretty much it. A relatively easy question and a relatively easy answer. Don't make it more difficult then it is.

 

[Ogstradamus]

Jeez calm down...gettin a little defensive? This is not a simple question and answer. Lol...

I told you why I don't beleive it so why are you asking? I've smoked countless buds, and resin is nearly ALWAYS a factor in potency. I hate smoking non resinous plant material...
Look at the superstrains out there today that are associated with POTENCY. I don't see anything even slightly below average on resin.

I'm basing my "speculation" on years of smoking and observation. Scientific studies don't mean everything, hell the government is a wonderful example of that.

I know that resin is plant material, but I wasn't speaking technical now, was I? I used the term plant material in order to differentiate it from the trichs, which obviously served its function because you understood what I meant. Maybe I shoulda said calyx and leaf? That better Mr. scientist?

A relatively easy question and relatively easy answer and don't make it more difficult than it is? Gee, if we had that attitude about everything in life we would make a lot of wrong assumptions now wouldn't we?

Buddy, I'm not set on the fact that resin = potency. I merely notice a correlation and was curious as to how some of these older, less "dank" looking strains overpowered the ones of today.

And about your little article:

"Also, the active cannaboids (THC,THCV, etc.) are only necessary in amounts small enough that they may not be major components in the resin."

What the hell does that mean? First off, I thought it was spelled "Cannabinoids"...could be wrong though.
I don't really understand what this sentence is trying to say. Is it saying that cannabinoids are only needed in small amounts by the plant or by people to get high? Doesn't make any sense. If someone can't even type a coherent report on plant potency what should make me beleive them?


"Experience connoissers actually may look for a non-resinous but very potent variety - who need cough inducing resin if it doesn't add to the high?"

Again, should be "Experienced" and "needs cough inducing". Wow, they even spelled connoisseur wrong!
Did they even bother to proofread? lol.


Anyway, not saying it's not true...but those are my reasons for doubting it and I think they are reasonable.

Peace...and here's some resin for ya lol.

 

[Ogstradamus]

I'm going to do more research on this subject later, but I gotta go to class. Here's something I dug up real quick...doesn't mean much but it seems to contradict the other link.

"The major sites of cannabinoid production appear to be epidermal glands which show a variation in size, shape and population density, depending where on the plant they are. While there are no published reports of glands present on root surfaces, most of the material parts possess them, along with non-glandular trichomes. "

http://www.norml.org.nz/article422.html

Doesn't mention THCV but I'll search more later.

 

[BigClunke]

Everything in retrospect is better. The biggest player here is the power of the mind, set and setting. We live in a different world than the 70's all drugs seem different because the people taking them have changed.
A lot of good points and many are completely true; I just don’t think the primary change is in the actual amount of desireable chemical compounds in the cannabis, there is a lot more to being high.

 

[guineapig]

this thread has a good basic topic worth pursuing for sure.......

i think that new flavors and odors have been created in these new-school Cannabis strains.....
this makes sense for a few reasons.....if you add two perfumes together often a third perfume will arise which is distinct from the parental's scents.....

Cannabis is a pharmacological miracle-plant. There are rare and exotic cannabinoids. There are psychoactive chemicals which produce opposite sensations in the brain. Some Cannabis makes you hyper-aware and full of energy while another strain will make you sleepy and dulls perception. Some will give you the munchies while other have actually been found to be appetite supressants (reference can be found at RM's site).......

These new hybrids of rare cannabinoids which were previously isolated in 2 populations separated by thousands of miles have suddenly come together in an offspring......now that is exciting stuff!!!! Shantibaba and other top breeders are currently investigating these exotic cannabinoids.....

But at the same time this is happening, on the flip-side we are losing some really killer original land-race strains, varieties of Cannabis which have been selectively bred for potency for thousands of years........some of those old-school strains aren't around anymore..........so i think that we are taking the Cannabis plant in different directions now......

there's gotta be some kind of limit to the amount of cannabinoids which can be packed onto a square millimeter of flowers.........or is there??????

 

[Ogstradamus]

Some *very* good points guinea and Big...

 

[ichbingeil]

That big sucking noise?

That big sucking noise?

there's gotta be some kind of limit to the amount of cannabinoids which can be packed onto a square millimeter of flowers.........or is there??????

The limit has yet to be determined, but there is a limit. Just beyond this limit the gravitational pull of these massively compacted cannabinoids will create a black hole and instantly cause anyone smoking it to disappear (in a dying kind of way). But we all have to go sometime, and what a way to go!

I think this is a trick thread, impossible to answer but interesting to think about. Anyone who smoked the 70's weed is handicapped (but oh, to be handicapped like that forever) by time (distance away and the effects of aging. I'm one of them) and place. This comparison can only be done in a double blind taste test, 'cept how certain are we that the old strains still exist as they did then? Combine this with differences in ozone, global temperature, teenage breast size and the amount of bad fats McDonald's fries are cooked in and you can see.....what was I talking about?

The best part? We can/are still getting stoned. Think how much worse this thread would be if a weevil mutated that fed only on Cannabis and destroyed all weed in the entire world and we were talking about the old days when you could get high.

IBGeriatric

 

[Guest]

please don't say that.....

The best part? We can/are still getting stoned. Think how much worse this thread would be if a weevil mutated that fed only on Cannabis and destroyed all weed in the entire world and we were talking about the old days when you could get high.

if this did indeed happen we'd open up a forum for all brains on the site to combine forces and come up with a solution on some George Washington Carver type shit

George Washington Carver (c. Spring of 1864 – January 5, 1943) was an African American botanist who worked in agricultural extension in the Southern United States. He taught former slaves farming techniques for self-sufficiency and is known for suggesting hundreds of uses for the peanut and other plants to increase the profitability of farming.

Carver was born into slavery in Newton County, Marion Township, near Diamond Grove, now known as Diamond, Missouri. The exact date of birth is unknown due to the haphazard record keeping by slave owners but "it seems likely that he was born in the spring of 1865" [1]. His owner, Moses Carver, was a German American immigrant who had purchased George's mother, Mary, from William P. McGinnis on October 9, 1855 for seven-hundred dollars. The identity of Carver's father is unknown but he believed his father was from a neighboring farm and died "shortly after Carver's birth...in a log-hauling accident" [2]. George had three sisters and a brother, all of whom died prematurely.

When George was an infant, he, a sister, and his mother were kidnapped by Confederate night raiders and sold in Arkansas, a common practice. Moses Carver hired John Bentley to find them. Only Carver was found, orphaned and near death from whooping cough. Carver's mother and sister had already died, although some reports stated that his mother and sister had gone north with the soldiers. For returning George, Moses Carver rewarded Bentley with his best filly that would later produce winning race horses. This episode caused George a bout of respiratory disease that left him with a permanently weakened constitution. Because of this, he was unable to work as a hand and spent his time wandering the fields, drawn to the varieties of wild plants. He became so knowledgeable that he was known by Moses Carver's neighbors as "the plant doctor."

One day he was called to a neighbor's house to help with a plant in need. When he had fixed the problem, he was told to go into the kitchen to collect his reward. When he entered the kitchen, he saw no one. He did, however, see something that changed his life: beautiful paintings of flowers on the walls of the room. From that moment on, he knew that he was going to be an artist as well as a botanist.

After slavery was abolished, Moses and his wife Susan raised George and his brother Jim as their own. They encouraged Carver to continue his intellectual pursuits. Aunt Susan taught him to read some words and write his name.

Since blacks were not allowed at the school in Diamond Grove and he had received news that there was a school for blacks ten miles south in Neosho, he resolved to go there at once. To his dismay, when he reached the town, the school had been closed for the night. As he had nowhere to stay, he slept in a nearby barn. By his own account, the next morning he met a kindly woman, Mariah Watkins, from whom he wished to rent a room. When he identified himself "Carver's George," as he had done his whole life, she replied that from now on, his name was "George Carver." George liked this lady very much and her words "You must learn all you can, then go back out into the world and give your learning back to the people," had a great impression on him.

At the age of thirteen, due to his desire to attend high school, he relocated to the home of another foster family in Fort Scott, Kansas. After witnessing the beating death of a black man at the hands of a group of white men, George left Fort Scott. He subsequently attended a series of schools before earning his diploma at Minneapolis High School in Minneapolis, Kansas.

After high school, George started a laundry business in Olathe, Kansas.

Over the next few years, he sent letters to several colleges and was finally accepted at Highland College in Highland, Kansas. He travelled to the college, but was rejected when it discovered he was black. In 1887, he was accepted to Simpson College in Indianola, Iowa, as its first African-American student (some reports cite the year as 1890 and that he was, in fact, the second black student accepted at Simpson). He transferred in 1891 to Iowa State University (then Iowa State Agricultural College), where he was the first black student, and later the first black faculty member.

In order to avoid confusion with another George Carver in his classes, he began to use the name George Washington Carver.

While in college, he showed a strong aptitude for singing and art, as well as for science, and could possibly have chosen a career in any of the three fields.

He completed his bachelor's degree in 1894 and earned his master's degree in 1896.
[edit]

Later years

In 1896, he was recruited to Tuskegee Normal and Industrial Institute (today: Tuskegee University) by Booker T. Washington in Tuskegee, Alabama. He remained there for 47 years until his death in 1943.

Taking an interest in the plight of poor Southern farmers working with soil depleted by repeated crops of cotton, Carver advocated employing the nitrogen cycle by alternating cotton crops with other planting, such as legumes (peanuts), or other crops (sweet potato) to restore nitrogen and other nutrients to the soil. Thus, the cotton crop was improved and new cash crops added. He developed an agricultural extension system in Alabama to train farmers in raising these crops and an industrial research laboratory to develop uses for them.
Peanut specimen collected by Carver
Enlarge
Peanut specimen collected by Carver

In order to make these new crops profitable, Carver devised numerous uses, several of which were unique, for the new crops, including more than 300 uses for the peanut. These applications included glue, printer's ink, dyes, punches, varnishing cream, marble, rubbing oils, and Worcestershire sauce; however, contrary to popular belief, this list does not include peanut butter. He made similar investigations into uses for plants such as sweet potatoes and pecans.

Until 1915, Carver was not widely known for his agricultural research. However he became one of the best-known African-Americans of his era following the funeral of Booker T. Washington when he was praised by Theodore Roosevelt. In 1916, he was voted in as a member of the Royal Society of Arts in England, one of only a handful of Americans at that time to receive this honor. By 1920 with the growth of the peanut market in the U.S., the market was flooded with peanuts from China. That year, Southern farmers came together to plead their cause before a tariff hearing. Carver was elected, without hesitation, to speak before the hearing. On arrival Carver was mocked but was not deterred and began to show them some of uses he had found. He was initally given ten minutes to present, but the committee extended his time again and again. The committee was held spellbound and rose in applause as he finished his presentation. The following year a tariff was placed on imported peanuts.

Now Carver was famous. Business leaders came to seek his help and he always gave it to them without a price. Three American presidents - Theodore Roosevelt, Calvin Coolidge and Franklin Roosevelt met with Carver. The Crown Prince of Sweden studied with him for three weeks. Indian leader, Mahatma Gandhi too was in his company for a while. Carver's best known guest was Henry Ford who built a laboratory for Carver and conducted research with him there as well. Their most notable discovery together was regarding the fabrication of rubber. Carver also did extensive work with soy, which he and Ford considered as an alternative fuel. Carver created a soy-based plastic still used in automobiles today for its dent-proof qualities.

In 1923, Carver received the Spingarn Medal by the NAACP, awarded annually for outstanding achievement. In 1928, Simpson College bestowed Carver with an honorary doctorate. In 1940, Carver established the George Washington Carver Foundation at Tuskegee University. In 1941, the George Washington Carver Museum was dedicated at the Tuskegee Institute. In 1942, Carver received the Roosevelt Medal for Outstanding Contribution to Southern Agriculture.

Upon returning home one day, Carver took a bad fall down a flight of stairs; he was found unconscious by a maid who took him to a hospital. Carver died January 5, 1943 at the age of 79 from complications (anemia) resulting from this fall.

On his grave was written the simplest and most meaningful summary of his life. He could have added fortune to fame, but caring for neither, he found happiness and honor in being helpful to the world

On July 14, 1943 [3], President Franklin Delano Roosevelt dedicated $30,000 for the George Washington Carver National Monument west-south-west of Diamond, Missouri - an area where Carver had spent time in his childhood. This dedication marks the first national monument dedicated to an African-American. At this 210 acre national monument, there is a bust of Carver, a 3/4 mile nature trail, a museum, the 1881 Moses Carver house, and the Carver cemetery.

Carver appeared on US commemorative stamps in 1948 and 1998 and was depicted on a commemorative half-dollar from 1951 to 1954. The USS George Washington Carver (SSBN-656) is also named in his honor.

In 1977, Carver was elected to the Hall of Fame for Great Americans. In 1990, Carver was inducted into the National Inventors Hall of Fame. Iowa State University awarded Carver the Doctor of Humane Letters in 1994. On February 15, 2005, an episode of Modern Marvels included scenes from within Iowa State University's Food Sciences Building and about Carver's work.Many people honor George Washington Carver to this day.

including yours truly

The boll weevil (Anthonomus grandis) is a beetle measuring an average length of six millimeters (¼ inch). The insect crossed the Rio Grande near Brownsville, Texas to enter the United States from Mexico in 1892 and reached southeastern Alabama in 1915. It remains the most destructive cotton pest in North America. By the mid 1920s it had entered all cotton growing regions in the U.S.

On December 11, 1919, the citizens of Enterprise, Alabama erected a monument to the boll weevil, the pest that devastated their fields but forced residents to end their dependence on cotton and to pursue mixed farming and manufacturing.

The infestation led to the introduction of the peanut--an alternative crop popularized by the Tuskegee Institute's George Washington Carver. Peanut cultivation not only returned vital nutrients to soils depleted by cotton cultivation, but also proved a successful cash crop for local farmers.

be well

 

[Guest423]

good point guinea....nice pics jack!! i always wondered this too, is weed getting better or is it getting worse? what if you could go back in time and give some old hippies back in the 60's a fat doobie of ecsd or black domina, ect....would it blow their minds or just be another doob? either way you look at it the old school weed is the building blocks of all the weed out today, it's just crosses..back crosses...f1's f2's f100's, special phenos crossed ect......my personal opinion is weed breeding kicks ass because of the time,effort, charastics and special phenos that keep coming up with these kick ass strains based on smell,potency,taste,yeild,flowering time, medical.....there is basically strains out their for everyone....there is definatly more variety then ever before and IMO thats a good thing....keep up the good work guys!!

peace

 

[osoloco69]

The older sativa strains had a lot of thc...some 20%+ being grown in the mountains of foreign countries where they were acclimated. The old afgans were what started the cbd becoming the mainstay of pot. Look at wallyduck's stuff and you can see some of the new guinea style sativas....also look up the dalat. Those take forever to finish indoors and have a low yeild, but when you have hectares of spave outdoor it didn't matter. Hawaiian weed has been the best continually, but all strains don't do well in hawaii as it is humid. Look in some of the south american and asian forums and you can find these old school strains that aren't stabilized. good luck.

 

[Verite]

Everyone seems to foget from a physical/mental brain standpoint that " You can never really go home. "

Home isnt a just a place, its a memory. Much like a high isnt just the buzz, but more the buzz that went with an experience. Much like the way food tastes when you pinch your nose. Its not the same from one point in your life to the next.

As the body gets older the pharmacopia of the brain changes, certain cravings subside and can be replaced with others. What might be right for you may not be right for some, much like the little fact that no two people see the same shade of color the same way between them because they both have slightly different patterns that make up the rods and cones in their eyes.

 

[ichbingeil]

Everyone seems to foget from a physical/mental brain standpoint that " You can never really go home. "

The only way I could agree more completely with this post would be if I was Verite himself.

PS: Your avatar always reminds me of the Manhattan Transfer singing Operator

Operator
Give me information
Information
Give me long distance
Long distance
Give me heaven...

(two, three)
Operator
Information
Give me jesus on the line etc.

 

[Guest]

out with the old,in with the .....

out with the old,in with the .....

The new strains came from selectively choosing from the old strains ,right.So the more learned breeders capture the great or more vigourous,potent,smelly or now medicinal traits held in the structure that they want.Example:
I crossed a very medicinal Titan with a stratospheric,knockout Boom Shanka
The Boom Shanka clone needed some colour,taste and smell.The Titan needed some more vigour.The resulting strain held the goods!!!How long would this take outdoors in nature or in a native garden.That what the new era has done,made it easy for us all to create and re-create.Peace!!!

 

[Skunkenstein]

Go to Alcapulco...

Go to Alcapulco...

It's kinda Laughable..when 1 guy is arguing about something he has'nt yet experienced.Kinda like describing a BJ, without ever having one. I totally understand were he's coming from...all the great genetics at our dissosal,blah,blah. But here's the Dealee-O..That leafy,seeded,golden,awsome smelling weed(Alcapulco Gold) is simply the best F***ing high there is...Period.It's like the Dodge 426 HEMI..tHE stuff Legends are made of!!

 

[Guest]

I smoked some damn fine Acapolco Gold in the severties I remember to this day, same with Panama Red and some purple in the early 80's. The things that make those smokes so unforgetable was the people I was with and the good times we were having. Two of my memories with Gold and Red revolve around fun fishing trips. The pot was great but there were good times aswell.

Then in the early 80's 'Hawaian' green bud hit and that changed everything. The buzz we got from the old strains was available daily and the green bud has forever remained more popular. The old strains didn't die they were replaced with pot more popular.

Everyone that smoked the Gold related to that flavor that I could never duplicate in my closet, so why bother? It's just not the same.

Resinous buds are good smoke. I don't need no study telling me otherwise.
Smell and potency work together.

 

[Guest]

Brown Thai Buddah,White Thai Buddah,Purple Head,Cambodian Red,Columbian Gold, Acapolko Gold,Southern Indian,Lebonese Red,Panama Red,Rock Thai,PNG Gold, Sumattrian Black, Hunter Valley Sativa,African Black Majic,Bangladeshi,Red Gum,Chinese Eyes. All these sativa's a from an era gone by.But if you look into the genes of our favourite strain,they must have come from somewhere!?! I have tryed all of these and more,Burmese ,to this day is my favourite all round landrace strain!!! What made Northy,SK1#,Haze,Bubblegum,Widow and the likes.I think you will find they come from the old day strains bred into something new!!!