Official Seed Harvest, Storing, Curing, ect. Thread

[mean mr.mustard]

Those are some nice lookin beanz!

 

[Mrs.Babba]

Thread Stickied
good info, thanks!

 

[UnknownProphet]

I'm really glad this got stickied thanks Mrs. Babba
I hope anyone with some extra seeds to spare can hopefully run some experiments and document their results. Even if for just germ rates. Getting an actual germination rate; in ratio to time and temperature will hopefully help those wanting to conserve genetics over an elongated time period. I for one have some great genes that I currently can not grow out I want to preserve them and by knowing the best storage method I can at least have a fighting chance over the years.

I'll have pictures soon enough but for now the majority of my plants are cut and curing, with the deseeded branches kept separate. I deseeded most of branches and kept a couple branches with seeds drying. I put the seeds, minus all leaf material in to labeled coffee filters and stacked them. I give them a little shake every day and they sit in a dark closet that gets no light. I still want to get some desiccants for the final bag up before going into the fridge, but think it may be a little over kill. Whatever though better safe than sorry.


For now this little mutant my friends plant made will have to hold you over...

ʇǝɥdoɹPuʍouʞuU

 

[cheesey]

heres a little update about my AUTO seeds .

seeds were dryed in the bud for 10 days then picked and placed into enverlopes and put someware dark and dry for 14 days . then i got 10 seeds from each strain (10 NYLD AND 10 NYCD ) placed them on tisue in a takeway box then sprayed wet and covered with more tisue and put the lid on . then placed the tub in to a airing cubboad . heat in there is no more that 22c.
36 hours later 5 out of 10 of each strain has popped .

heres a cpl of pics .

NYCD



NYLD

 

[nobull56]

One of the things we have not talked about is:
Each seed has a little sack like water resistant clear covering. This protects the seed from some moisture & early in the seeds life it is more permeable to water. As the protective covering gets older it becomes more ‘water proof’ & needs to be ‘scuffed’ so moisture can get inside & trigger the sprouting. Some fresh seeds have a super quick protector to assure that some seeds will survive those extra wet years.

This birthed the idea of placing sandpaper inside a match box, placing seeds inside & shaking the whole thing. You can find this process in some of the grow books. Some of the early Seed Banks used to package their seeds in match boxes for this purpose.

It works, if you run germination tests with un-scuffed & scuffed seeds, you will find one or two (sometimes more) additional seeds will pop in the scuffed seeds.
Keep it green

 

[Hydrobud33]

Perfect timing

Perfect timing

This thread is great! I am about to harvest Joey's C-99 x Blueberry which I crossed with one of her brothers and was wondering if all ripe seeds pop out of their shells or will they be done when the plant is done? I have a few seeds popping out but most of the pods are not open or they are but seeds are still green. Thanks for a reply and great info so far guys!

 

[nobull56]

I've found that over half of seeds of the breeds I’m seeing, have tight ‘calyxes’ & need help getting out of the bracts. I’ll try to up load some pics of how I do it.
Let your seeds dry (on/ in) the plant longer if you are getting a lot of green color & they will darken. Though I have a ‘Ice’ cross that stayed a light green, with 90%+ germination rate.

 

[Centrum]

I think drying them out in anything cardboard or paper like an envelope for about 2 weeks after the initial drying process is the best way to absorb the maximum amount of moisture. If you have ever worked with cardboard the evidence is on your dry cracked hands.
So about 3 or 4 weeks all together is a good method for initial drying.

If i don't freeze them first.
My germ rates aren't as good.

At least a 2 week freeze, a month or two would be better i think.

 

[UnknownProphet]

Finally got around to some pictures of the crosses I made. All turned out very dark-to-tan with next to no immature seeds. I think the Red Dragon cross was the only one where I culled more than a handful of seeds.

All seeds were taken down on the last day of the sixth week, after the original pollination. I don't have any space to run these at the moment, but I have gifted some out already so I might have some pictures of those relatively soon. If I know you and you are interested in doing a test run (a thread too) PM me and we'll see what I can do. Cali patients ONLY. Prop 215 and SB420 compliant.

Anyways with out further ado...
The whole lot...

All kept separate and tagged with plant #...

I let these dry for over a month compared to others and I will let you know if there's a difference in germ rates.

Red Dragon X NYCD

Blue Dream X NYCD

Gob9 X NYCD

NYCD#1 X NYCD

NYCD#2 X NYCD

NYCD#3 X NYCD

NYCD#4 X NYCD

NYCD#5 X NYCD

And some randoms...

Not trying to toot my own horn here, but I noticed with an elongated 6 almost 7 weeks created very uniform, hard, and dark seeds. Now I have an arsenal of seeds, from reputable breeders, and often not even every one in a while, I find immature, light, or even cracked seeds in "official packs". I realize now that a lot of these seed companies pump out seeds and probably don't let them go the full time they should. Anyways that being said...be patient, if you think it's ready.....wait another week.

ʇǝɥdoɹPuʍouʞuU

 

[wotamess]

wow 744 seeds in that group pic!! awesome work, UP!

my collection and storage procedure is also pretty simple...

firstly the seed plants are my last harvest, to fulfill the ripening time... then they hang for as long as is possible/practical by which stage they are (hopefully!) bone dry...

i use newspaper as my main sorting implement. i cut the branches into manageable sections if necessary then gently crush them with my hands onto the newspaper until the seeds are free and then tilt the paper at and angle and sift the seeds out, which roll down into your hand... i'm south african, so it's pretty much second nature sifting seeds from weed like this !! note - tabloid is the perfect size, emptied of about half it's contents.

once the seeds have been harvested, the are checked for bits/dead seeds and then in the bag, labelled and into the fridge. i don't dry them any extra as i dry the plants thoroughly. it's probably a wise move giving them some extra drying, but i've never worried about it and always had a good germ rate up to a year later (thus far!) still got heaps of f2's that will be heading for there second year as seeds by next years season...

as a note i breed/chuck with the goal of UK outdoor success... all projects done indoors using natural light from a big folding skylight...

last season it was lebanese cheese (leb'n'cheese - uk cheese cut x leb27) pollen used on leb'n'cheese females x 3 to create f2's and on danish passion/cheese x 1, sensi star (unselected cutting) x 1, and biddy's sister x 2...

this season decided to go with an auto seed run... all fully AF inbred lines...
auto mtf pollen (ch@ppers) used on auto mtf, auto biddy, auto indi (zed), and a range of 'mixed auto' ladies...

it's a dingy little mould prone spot, and the final product is usually scraggly mould stricken bushes, full of big, ripe beautiful seeds... lol... the seeds have been a great success, though, starring in some gardens last season... including my own... i'm rambling, thanks to lebanese cheese right now, actually!!

currently recovering from back surgery in bed, so IC is really doing me a favour!!

grow on

-wam-

 

[fastnick1oo]

From my experience:
I took seeds out of buds when they started to easly fall off - after poking them with toothpick - they weren't whole-brown by that time. I left them for week, to dry. After that I put them in fridge (with fair ammount of rice, as dehydrant) for next two weeks and tested germ ratio. 8 out of 10 sprouted and were very vigorous.

...so I don't think it's always "wait till bud is ready and collect seeds after it's dry". ; P

Don't bother reading this. I'm making germ tests (month after month), and... they don't seems to pop at all. Few of them'll show white tip, but that's all.
I was very wrong with this, so... I'm very sorry.

 

[UnknownProphet]

hmmm...sorry to hear your currently having some germ problems, but as NOBULL56 stated very fresh nubile seeds are a lot harder to germ than let's say a year or two old seeds. The barrier over time become fragile letting the seed crack, try the scuffing method and that should help the germ rate of those new seeds a lot. Actually if you do try get back with your results, we all want to know first hand experience.

Thanks regardless for sharing your information in here, it's something that many don't know of and any information helps.

That goes for all of you, CONTRIBUTE!!

~UP

 

[UnknownProphet]

As a test I threw some of my newly harvested beans in a cup of RO water, (RedDragon X Gob9) not even 24 hours later they all had about 1/4 centimeter tails. Only used 5 and was going to do the match book scuffing method as well if regular germination didn't work. I don't feel like that's necessary now though, especially considering I just toss them because I have no room at the moment. I know it's for experimenting purpose, but I still feel as though I could be throwing away that 1 in 100 outstanding pheno, so I'm not sure how much experimenting I'll continue to do. At least fir the time being with no room for added strains.

Oh here's the red dragon indoor, a much better representaion than the outdoor, visually at least...

The fan leaves cure to a blue hue, can't wait to see the NYCD influence added.



~ʇǝɥdoɹPuʍouʞuU

 

[mean mr.mustard]

I have been meaning to update my contribution to this thread and will do so as health and time allow.

That red dragon looks gorgeous!!

 

[[Bad_Karma]]

pretty cool thread !

i'll post pics on my futur second homemade cross
(probably - kerala x [the pure x sweet skunk] and - kerala x [bubblicious x kc33])

 

[closettoker]

I personaly would like to thank all of you that have contributed to this thread.


This is something that I have interest in and was a hard subject to find. I have been a numerous forums and rarely contribute to the conversations.


I have been growing for about 6 years now. In a Small Micro Stealth box. I get about 2 plants in 1 gallon pots. My vertical growth can only be under 17 inches. I have grown Northern Light, Speed Queen and some Mdanzigs Masterlow. I have been trying to go for a seed run for some time now. I Germ 3 seeds at a time to get two plants to grow. If all three pop and become seedlings I go with the best two looking plants. The last three grows I have had nothing but females. Before some of my Northern lights and Speed queen grows I had some pollen from a Masterlow male. I didn't know at the time that the pollen wouldn't keep that long, unless in the freezer. Well I dug the old pollen out of the box that has been in the dark in a cool dry place for about 13 months. I pollinated the lower branches of one of the Masterlows that I have going right now. I'm almost at the end of this grow and I was looking at the plants closely today and looks like I have some seed pods, I'm not absolutely sure of this I'll have to wait and see.


I did want to say that I have these Masterlow seeds from a seed run that I did about 4 years ago. I keep them in a Dark, Cool, Dry place and I have about a 90% germination rate. I'm down to about 28 seeds, so its time to make another run.


I was always told to keep them in the freezer. I know of people that do that and have used seeds that they planted that were almost 20 years old. I know it sounds crazy!. My uncle got seeds from when he was in Vietnam from the 70's. He said he wanted to keep some seed that were pretty close to the real genetics that he had over 40+ years ago,the seeds that he has now are from that same generation.


Sorry for the long write. Again thanks IC PEEPS.


I had to add something here....Can we see some seed pod pictures...please!

 

[mean mr.mustard]

I'll have pictures soon enough.

I was going to wait till I found out how long pollen was good for in the freezer, but that's going to take a while longer... besides this isn't the pollen sticky

I stuck to my old habits and dried the seeds on paper towels for about three weeks and then seperated them into four groups:

The seeds popped immediately were by far the worst: 12-15%

The seeds popped after being in the fridge for a month: 65-75%

The seeds popped after being kept in a dark place at room temperature: 90%+

I believe the second group will increase over time. I've also frozen a few but won't check up on their germ rate for quite a few months.

My theory is that the seeds, once dried, need to go dormant for a time (weeks). They seem to benefit from aging to improve the germ rate for up to two or three months where they plateau at 90% for about a year. The more they get shuffled around between temps and humidity, the worse off they'll be.

I do advocate freezing your seed if you want to store them for years on end.

I'll update with pics whenever I get the time... thanks for your patience!

:friends:

 

[closettoker]

My theory is that the seeds, once dried, need to go dormant for a time (weeks). They seem to benefit from aging to improve the germ rate for up to two or three months where they plateau at 90% for about a year. The more they get shuffled around between temps and humidity, the worse off they'll be.

I agree with you 100% on this. I would like to keep mine in the freezer if I could. I'm married with children and nobody knows of my Gardening Adventures.

 

[UnknownProphet]

Closettoker-Glad you found it and even happier to see you contribute your info. It's definitely a hard subject matter to find extensive info on so I thank Ms. Bubba for making this a sticky nice and easy for everyone to find. Overtime this thread will only get more precise and scientific. For now it's tests, but in years we'll really be able to tell what some germ rates and storage techniques are that hopefully benefit more than just those who read this.


Mean Mr. Mustard-Always great to see yo contribute to the thread. I wanted to ask though, what are the percentages for? I understand it's probably germ rates, but figured it could also be keeper plants, or possibly female to male percent. I'm next to positive it's germination percentage, but just to be sure I thought I'd ask. Anyways I think it's been long enough and I'll be throwing some of my fully dried out packs of personal stash seeds into the freezer. Probably about 100-200 of my hand picked seeds because they won't be popped for years likely. Although over that time I plan on gifting some so the tests can be consistent.


Anyways since my last post I've run some test and have a couple pictures to share aswell. First and foremost I must say I have been researching this for a while now and I'm coming up with pretty consistent answers....just a few to share, this obviously isn't the end all be all of seed storage, germination, harvesting , ect.

1. Fresh seeds (harvested-6months-1year) are least viable. I found this to be because of genetics. In nature a seed that is mature falls and it's protective coating shell is next to impermeable. The reason being is cannabis is an annual plant, not year round, so it needs that dormant time and is ready to pop around the next spring time. This is my theory though and not scientific evidence, so take it as that.
2. Seeds that are kept in a stable environment, preferable cool to cold and in a dark place, have a much better viability and germination rate. This is somewhat common knowledge, but you'd be surprised. Seeing it in words hopefully will help at least one person.
3. Scuffing is good! This is something that doesn't get nearly as much attention as I think it should. the outer shell of a seed has nothing to do with the ability of the plant inside of it. I think when you scuff seeds it's beneficial in many ways. It makes it easier for water to penetrate, the microscopic slashes hold water and if using a soaking method, make it easier for seeds to sink. The list goes on, if your having troubles germing seeds give this a try and see if anything changes.

I'm highly medicated and rambling so I'll stop before I fill the page with to much jaw jabbering. Pictures always seem to say it just as good as I can explain it if not better so with out further ado...

Scuffing
All you need is: seeds, matchbox, (fine) sandpaper, shotglass, water

Place sandpaper into matchbox with sandpaper side facing seeds, then place seeds inside of matchbox and shake vigorously.

After the seeds are "scuffed" up put them into a container of water. *And if you want a little extra kick put them on top of a warm source, like I put them on my old PS2 and it keeps them warmer than room temp.

These were the ugly duckling seeds I sifted though, one at the bottom was even being eaten by a caterpillar somewhat. Although 24 hours after scuffing I have 6 of 7 with small tails.

Oh and somewhat on subject, a buddy is germing some seeds I gave him and the biggest seed he got was a single Bog Bubble. It germed in 8 hours with no scuffing, props to BOG for that one. I wish he would come here and spread some of his extensive knowledge on seed prep and storage.

Good luck to all.


ʇǝɥdoɹPuʍouʞuU

 

[mean mr.mustard]

Oops I was pretty stoned and edited a pretty important sentence out... the one that stated those were my results of germ rate tests.

I agree this thread is in the testing phase... I have some more research to attend and attest.

Scuffing is very useful and brings me to further finds on my part (and many others I'm sure )

I have found that fresh seeds have a much more leathery coat to them and need to dry over long periods of time to crack properly. Though many of the tough helmeted seeds might have been genetically disposed to a thick coat, I believe that most were simply too fresh.

Scuffing appears to assist that "crackability" by reducing that coat and/or exposing the secondary layer of the shell which seems to be more absorbent than the outside layer... but with strains like Sour Bubble only curing time seems to help the beans crack well. I'd really like BOG's input on this theory... he would be a very welcome addition.

I would like to add that I somewhat hydrate my beans before scuffing though I do it the exact same way UP does :friends:

PS I used the professional scientific term "crackability"... freshly coined by yours truly right here on ICMag!!!