Legalize MJ ! Really? No I mean REALLY?

[Anti]

Ignorance on display.

Saying it is less effective than proving it. State your case plainly, sir, so that we can all read and judge for ourselves. Use facts not opinions. We all have opinions and some of them clearly smell better than others.

Amazing how the central government can set up road blocks to prevent entrepreneurs entry into this business (all businesses actually) and your comment is basically "so what"?

You could make a helluva profit if you could hire illegal immigrants for less than minimum wage to work in your factories... it's a shame that the central government sets up road blocks to prevent entrepreneurs entry into this business.

And so the central theme of this thread was more government regulations are coming and you have been quick to post your poorly thought out crap in defense of legalization at the cost of common sense.

By the time I started posting, the central theme of this thread seemed to be "Grapeman wants weed ILLEGAL because he figures ILLEGAL is better than regulated." That's what I've been arguing against, and you keep responding... so....? wtf?

Then you defend your ignorant rants with questioning the poster as to why he would ever want to make a business out of growing this product. Because in your opinion, he doesn't need more space then the permitted room size grow.

If he wants to make a business out of something BECAUSE IT IS ILLEGAL then he is no more important to me than a guy who wants to kidnap teenage girls and keep them as slaves. If he wants to get into a legal business model and find a way to make it all profitable, well, he's me.

It is folks like you that will never get it while we watch our great country slide into 3rd world status. Who the fuck are you (or the government) to decide how much room he needs or wants to grow?

How much is he CURRENTLY allowed to grow? Oh, nothing at all? Wow. You're right. 25 square feet is certainly worse than nothing at all. You sure got me there.

Aside from the fact that you don't even live here, your affinity for government control which prevents people from taking risks to enter a business makes me want to vomit.

If you'd just think for a few minutes before your brain started frothing you'd understand (because I say it over and over) that I have no affinity for government control, and I'd love for herb to grow freely all over the planet the way common grass does... unfortunately I live on a planet that is largely run by completely selfish, clueless assholes.

And now we have a possibility of scraping a little freedom from under the rug. I say we take it. Who knows.. We might develop a taste for it.

You are obviously a letter carrier or in a simular field and have no critical thinking skills. It is obvious that your parents failed you.

You are obviously making a major profit from prohibition and are scared shitless that if it becomes mainstream that you will be forced to fall back on your other skills, of which you have none, so you might find yourself being forced to be a letter carrier or some other occupation you feel is below you. Get over yourself.

The average letter carrier earns more than a good portion of our population. Why aren't you all up in arms about the people working at McDonalds? Aren't they americans too? Aren't their freedoms being trampled on in the name of corporate profits too? Where's your outrage over all of the other injustice in our system?

The poster was correct that this path towards legalization favors existing dispensaries with money that are already making cozy relationships with unions. This situation will never enable folks to enter the business in a competitive way.

So.. if I understand the above statement, being in business FIRST and having a LARGE BUDGET and cozy relationships make you naerly unbeatable, right? Then how is the very NEXT statement you made even POSSIBLE:

But like you and your job at the post office, you never saw FedEx passing you up in customer satisfaction until it was too late.

By your above explanation, there's no way FEDEX could've even gotten off the ground! The existing system was government supported and had a large budget and cozy relationships with all the right people... how did fedex manage to come from nowhere and overtake them? Something's wrong with your reasoning, homie.

Insulting my unknown position in an unknown industry is kinda baseless, eh?

You probably won't get it until your 99 weeks of unemployment runs out.

Wait.. I thought I was a letter carrier? Now I'm unemployed? Wonder why I spent 10 hours at a totally unrelated job yesterday?

Weird.

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

Dont get your panties all in a bunch woman. Its only the internet!

Vote No On Prop 19!

Honestly, if it wern't for the fact I KNOW that this little shithead and his braindead buddys will probably be sniffing glue and snorting his mom's crushed up RX when it comes time to vote id probably be a bit more worried. But he cant be older than 17 ... maybe 18? I mean listen to him. He's a complete fucking moron. This guy can't even comprehend the fact that people are all ready going to jail for weed and we have a chance to end that, but its not "good enough" because he might get in trouble for handing weed to a minor. Well guess what shit-for-brains?? That happends with alcohol, prescription drugs, tobacco, and just about ANYTHING else that has age limits on it.

So what WOULD be ideal to you? Everyone smokes weed even 6 year olds?? Thats definatly what should happend. Hey lets give little johnny six year old a bottle of jim beam and a pack of reds while hes at it.

I still cant believe this kid even tries to make an argument. He has NOTHING. Not a god damn thing to argue on that is actually legitimate.

My grandmother is 87, a die hard rush limbaugh fan and even she thinks its a good idea to legalize and she don't even smoke weed.

In fact, she has taken it upon her self to start swaying the elderly vote in her community in favor of Prop. 19 and Ill tell you what brother, they WILL be out there to vote in groves, in FUCKING GROVES.

...I even making them a bunch of pink tshirts with potleafs on them that say "ITS NEVER TOO LATE...." on the front and "VOTE YES ON PROP 19" on the back.

We WILL relegalize cannabis. Its 2010 let the legalization begin!!!!

 

[Kalicokitty]

So how did you like the article and the video by Perron?. Any comments? or just insults?

I didn't insult you, I just don't believe what you're claiming.

Read the article, and watched the Perron Vid.
I felt the article was the equivalent of people saying how wrong the no jaywalking laws are, and how many people will be in prison because of them.

You guys have had it good so long out there now that you have completely lost sight of what it's like for the rest of us in the non-med states.

It's like were starving to death, and you're at an all you can eat buffet bitching about the poor selection of dipping sauces.

 

[StoneElemental]

Anti man I have to applaude you homie, and herb tree I sincerely wish our elderly community here would even go for something like that but it's a lot of closed minds ruined by government marijuana propaganda. Seems I could easily befriend people like this but around me I stand in a field of ignorant drones and I'm looking for life in the form of friendship. Honestly sad...

-S.E.

 

[StoneElemental]

Wow, I'd hate to double post but you just hardcore preached to the choir kalicokitty. Don't it feel a shame drooling over opportunities like that? Yet none follow.

BTW love the the lil pug with foil and your caption for it I chuckled quite a bit over that.

-S.E.

You guys have had it good so long out there now that you have completely lost sight of what it's like for the rest of us in the non-med states.

It's like were starving to death, and you're at an all you can eat buffet bitching about the poor selection of dipping sauces.

 

[Frozenguy]

I've been fighting for our liberties and freedoms for several years now. I've also been fighting for the true legalization of cannabis.

I want it legalized. But I'm not about to backtrack on one fight, to further another.

The worst part of US democracy is when free speech is abused. An intelligent and knowledgeable citizen's vote means nothing when false information is spread to the easily deceived masses and left unchallenged. Free speech is meaningful and of value when only the truth is revealed. When false information is allowed to flow freely with the intent to sway votes, our laws and our constitution are worthless.

WHO ELSE THINKS AMERICA IS A DEMOCRACY?
Serious question, I want to see some people respond.

 

[StoneElemental]

What do you mean by this statement exactly?

I want it legalized. But I'm not about to backtrack on one fight, to further another.

Technically speaking the U.S.A. is a Republic not a Democracy (look up the definitions of each). My girlfriend often says that if your vote actually meant something it would be outlawed. I have to say I frequently agree with that altho there are some few circumstances where she is wrong. If you all think you voted for our presidents over the years and your vote actually counted for something I think you'd be wrong as your vote is tallied then CONSIDERED by the ellecotoral college. Corruption has festered in our government for years and has a death grip on it.

WHO ELSE THINKS AMERICA IS A DEMOCRACY?
Serious question, I want to see some people respond.

 

[Hash Zeppelin]

For those of you who think prop19 wont have an affect on our current med laws, read this and tell me what you think....

California's Proposition 19 will supersede or amend its medical marijuana laws

http://www.examiner.com/x-14883-San...supersede-or-amend-its-medical-marijuana-laws


p.s. after reading the article, watch the 2 videos in the link especially the last one. open your eyes people.

VOTE NO ON PROP 19!

this is just not true. it would have to be more specific about doing so. it would have to clearly say you cant cultivate.

also 215 will still be king in california. part of prop 420 was ruled unconstitutional at a state level by the california supreme court, 3 times already. The part they deemed unconstitutional was the plant limit set. They say only your doctor can decide that.

that will not change. it is set in stone so to speak because of the multiple cali supreme court precedents.

the article that trav linked to above is 1000% paranoid bull shit. I am glad people are at least looking for ninja shit. the problem is that it isnt there, and they say it is anyways.

Also if you have any business at all having a large whare house grow in a populated area like the bay area you damn well better have 275,000 already, or at least the ability to get it. 275k is a drop in the bucket in the cali business world. Up keep on a grow that size is crazy. Plus the electrical logistic to keep it safe need to be done by a pro electrician. That is not a cheap job to get done. you dont want your shit burrning down

truthfully the more I read this bill the more I like it. It is designed specifically to help the state and the city of san fran even more.

you know eventually that someone will have a large chain. just look at Bull Dog or green house in amsterdam. bull dog shops I found to be good, but green house shops had the shittiest product for too much money. (that was back in 03 though, they might have changed there act.) It is good for people like Mr. Lee to be the top dogs. he helped path the way, and will continue to bring quality herb to the area. I would rather go to blue sky over green house any day. Better quality. better service, and I am helping a freedom fighter. (note: I have been to green house, but only read about blue sky)

Richard Lee is not about to screw med patients. He is a patient. I am sure he knows, as well as many people here, that the feds already make busts on med patients even after Eric Holder said no. By passing this bill a flood of recreational growers will come about. The federal focus will turn to them. they only have so much resources to bust people, so this law will keep sick people out of jail by changing the focus of those limited resources. this is if the DEA even chooses to keep enforcing federal pot laws illegally. I have a feeling they are gonna lose this one though. they cant stop 99 percent of the growers already, so they have no chance in even making a small difference after this passes. they will be helpless.

Plus if this bill passes then people like Eddy Lepp will have a better chance at winning an appeal.

 

[dagnabit]

I've been fighting for our liberties and freedoms for several years now. I've also been fighting for the true legalization of cannabis.

I want it legalized. But I'm not about to backtrack on one fight, to further another.

backtrack?
you do realize this law is looser than amsterdam ffs?

what do you want? complete deregulation?
not gonna happen EVER!

WHO ELSE THINKS AMERICA IS A DEMOCRACY?
Serious question, I want to see some people respond.

only those who never sat through a civics class think that.

 

[Hash Zeppelin]

^ another good point. just look at a-dam. they have tighter laws and they function fine. why? cause they just do what they want. That is exactly what the free thinkers in cali will do too. and the DEA wont be able do shit cause no one will help them. why would they? everyone is sick of them already, they are glorified thieves. In a legalized market people wont put up with the DEA. The state it self will even go after them. They will have state trooper guard pot shops to keep DEA out, it need be. Why? Because the huge amount taxes from the the pot shops pay their salary and buy there bullet proof vests, and they know it. Plus cops never like to give up there jurisdictional control to the federal government, it is an ego/power trip thing that so much LEO has.

If the feds send in the national guard as a response they will look so bad. Sending in the national guard to enforce a law that over 50% of the US population thinks is bull shit, will be a disaster. It will be like the opposite of little rock in the 60's, when the feds forced integration in schools, which was something good that the feds did.

 

[Frozenguy]

What do you mean by this statement exactly?

In my opinion, prop19 is not in support of liberty or freedom, even though it offers a fraction of security for the general populace over 21.

By supporting this, I feel it only strengthens governments role in taxing and regulating our consumables. Which goes against my other fight. The fight to downsize state government and the central government and put it back into its place. Granted this is California government, but whatever California does with this, I'm sure the feds will eventually follow with even bigger taxes and regulations. (Unless they go against our freedoms/liberties another way and drop a Federal Lawsuit on us and completely forgetting the 10th amendment)


Dont get me wrong, I fully support degrees of taxation and regulation to certain aspects of society. What prop19 proposes is beyond what I'm willing to sacrifice.

The people who need cannabis can get their cannabis today, legally. I'm not worried about recreational smokers enough to vote for a proposition that I dont personally support. (Recreational smokers in California are not going to jail, and more often then not dont even get a ticket. And on top of that, people's bud hardly ever gets noticed so its rarely an issue.)

Technically speaking the U.S.A. is a Republic not a Democracy (look up the definitions of each). My girlfriend often says that if your vote actually meant something it would be outlawed. I have to say I frequently agree with that altho there are some few circumstances where she is wrong. If you all think you voted for our presidents over the years and your vote actually counted for something I think you'd be wrong as your vote is tallied then CONSIDERED by the ellecotoral college. Corruption has festered in our government for years and has a death grip on it.

Well, its actually a Constitutional Republic. But ya..

Who here knows who they are represented by in the electoral college? I sure as hell dont. When have we elected those who elect our president? I dont even know how they get to be on the electoral college lol. But it bothers me, a little. Its put in place because this is not a democracy, and the decision of the mob is dangerous.

 

[Frozenguy]

backtrack?
you do realize this law is looser than amsterdam ffs?

what do you want? complete deregulation?
not gonna happen EVER!

Maybe not with that attitude
But really, I do believe in some regulation.
Cannabis could and should be treated pretty lax. I tend to feel that 18 should be the legal age, but in a perfect world, I would vote for no age. Not because I think kids should be able to smoke, but because it takes another responsibility away from parents. They dont try as hard to teach good values when something is illegal. If something was legal and I dont want my kid to do it, I will educate them and put down my own rule. Its sad when the government cant trust parents to take care of their own children. The government shouldn't even be there.

only those who never sat through a civics class think that.

I know, right?! I think some people just dont care, or forget when they see their politicians talking about democracy and spreading it around the world.

 

[grapeman]

Saying it is less effective than proving it. State your case plainly, sir, so that we can all read and judge for ourselves. Use facts not opinions. We all have opinions and some of them clearly smell better than others.



You could make a helluva profit if you could hire illegal immigrants for less than minimum wage to work in your factories... it's a shame that the central government sets up road blocks to prevent entrepreneurs entry into this business.



By the time I started posting, the central theme of this thread seemed to be "Grapeman wants weed ILLEGAL because he figures ILLEGAL is better than regulated." That's what I've been arguing against, and you keep responding... so....? wtf?



If he wants to make a business out of something BECAUSE IT IS ILLEGAL then he is no more important to me than a guy who wants to kidnap teenage girls and keep them as slaves. If he wants to get into a legal business model and find a way to make it all profitable, well, he's me.



How much is he CURRENTLY allowed to grow? Oh, nothing at all? Wow. You're right. 25 square feet is certainly worse than nothing at all. You sure got me there.



If you'd just think for a few minutes before your brain started frothing you'd understand (because I say it over and over) that I have no affinity for government control, and I'd love for herb to grow freely all over the planet the way common grass does... unfortunately I live on a planet that is largely run by completely selfish, clueless assholes.

And now we have a possibility of scraping a little freedom from under the rug. I say we take it. Who knows.. We might develop a taste for it.



You are obviously making a major profit from prohibition and are scared shitless that if it becomes mainstream that you will be forced to fall back on your other skills, of which you have none, so you might find yourself being forced to be a letter carrier or some other occupation you feel is below you. Get over yourself.

The average letter carrier earns more than a good portion of our population. Why aren't you all up in arms about the people working at McDonalds? Aren't they americans too? Aren't their freedoms being trampled on in the name of corporate profits too? Where's your outrage over all of the other injustice in our system?



So.. if I understand the above statement, being in business FIRST and having a LARGE BUDGET and cozy relationships make you naerly unbeatable, right? Then how is the very NEXT statement you made even POSSIBLE:



By your above explanation, there's no way FEDEX could've even gotten off the ground! The existing system was government supported and had a large budget and cozy relationships with all the right people... how did fedex manage to come from nowhere and overtake them? Something's wrong with your reasoning, homie.

Insulting my unknown position in an unknown industry is kinda baseless, eh?



Wait.. I thought I was a letter carrier? Now I'm unemployed? Wonder why I spent 10 hours at a totally unrelated job yesterday?

Weird.

Man you're stupid. You didn't comprehend anything. Probably not your fault. I'm sure you are victim.

See son, it's laws and regulations set by the government that make entry into business more and more difficult and not the other way around. If FedEx tried to develop a business plan TODAY IT MAY NOT EVEN GET OFF THE GROUND due to burdensome government regulations. Only those of us that actually produce something in this life would understand that the government produces nothing, and in fact, inhibits our freedom to do so. If we were all like you, we would starve.

Why not start a thread that discusses legalizing mj in your state since you don't even live in ours? But you can't seem to help yourself in continuing to post pieces that prove over and over again why public education fails.

 

[StoneElemental]

grapeman, you have some decent points and i can relate, agree, and even empathize with some. However your constant hostility over a subject you posted and should've known some individuals would disccus and even combat leads me to believe you would throw stones at the mentally handicapped and abuse the elderly. Do you just set up scenarios where you can just attack? Or is there a glimmer of humanity in you? We all want the same damn thing here but we're all also entitled to our person points of view on the details. I'm not trying to be a bleeding heart here however, how are we all gonna work together to get what we want if we can't get along for a discussion first? If you want TO influence as anti said youre going about it in ALL the wrong ways. Step outside yourself for a minute damn it.

-S.E.

 

[Anti]

Man you're stupid. You didn't comprehend anything. Probably not your fault. I'm sure you are victim. .... But you can't seem to help yourself in continuing to post pieces that prove over and over again why public education fails.

Dude, you were misspelling things while you were reprimanding me for being less intelligent. I took the high road and didn't resort to rubbing it in your face.

Then I did a point for point rebuttal of your last post... and you respond with .... NOTHING.

Good job!

Don't you remember me saying THIS:

Saying it is less effective than proving it. State your case plainly, sir, so that we can all read and judge for ourselves. Use facts not opinions.

So far, your case seems to be that I'm stupid because I think you're wrong. You have no facts, only opinions. And of those opinions, most of the ones you've expressed are centered on the fact that I don't currently live in california (though i grew up there and lived there 5 years ago and am in the process of moving back) and that I'm a postal worker and ... oh yeah... I'm stupid.

So... great rebuttal! I sure do feel stupider for participating in your discussion. Must be a contact stupid.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

LOL. If you only knew. I am actually almost 40 and I am already a Breeder/Seedmaker.

I am interested in the new varieties you have developed, can you please list them? I started seed collecting and breeding 40 years ago and always want to keep up on the new breeders work...
What is your best variety?
-SamS

 

[Guest 88950]

LOL. If you only knew. I am actually almost 40 and I am already a Breeder/Seedmaker.

you sound all of 20.

just b/c you f'd up and your crop got pollinated doesnt make you a breeder/seedmaker.

what traits do you breed for? SEEDS.

if you are confident in your breeding / seed making then please let us know the name of your Seed Company.

 

[Anti]

You'll never get those answers guy, because that sock got banned and whatever real account created it is probably smart enough to duck its head back down long enough to create a new sock account. The next new joiner to the site who bounces right into this thread will be whoever was behind Travieso.

 

[Guest 88950]

very good point ANTI.

Grapeman, you sound bitter over regulations required by your chosen profession. when disputed in an educated and rational way you resort to name calling and telling people they are uneducated.

you even attacked MariaVanessa, i think, saying she was too poor to have a tv or something like that.

i dont think you have it in you to change the way you post but those kind of attacks screams inner turmoil.

let it go, you'll live longer.

 

[SilverSage]

I've been fighting for our liberties and freedoms for several years now. I've also been fighting for the true legalization of cannabis.

I want it legalized. But I'm not about to backtrack on one fight, to further another.

WHO ELSE THINKS AMERICA IS A DEMOCRACY?
Serious question, I want to see some people respond.

Nobody said the US is a democracy, but we do have "democratically" elected representatives. As I stated previously, when you do not know the true facts about issues you are more likely to base your votes on information you hear or read. When this information is distorted and not challenged, your ability to decide correctly is questionable.

The point to made here is simple. When those who stand to lose "money" when cannabis is made somewhat legal, you really need to know the truth about what the new law will entail. Trusting anyone who says vote "NO" to legalization immediately tells me they have "something" to lose if the current law is changed. Since cannabis is currently "illegal", the only thing that "something" can be is "MONEY".

Clear enough?