I'm confused about something...

[LEDGirl]

A USA manu of ANYTHING will odds are double the cost retail wise, reason why our economy SUCKS and our dollar is dropping, china owns us.... either deal with it OR be happy to pay $1k for something produced here that costs $400 made in china.

Very true... Was going to touch on that, but glad you did for me lol.

many get caught up with the, this led is comparable to this sized hps. What if instead of that there was a benchmark like what has been set for cfl's, cmh, hps, mh lights and go for this.

126's can yield XXX grams
3XX's can yield XXX grams

As you stated, each grower will have their own results depending on their experience, nutrients, strain, CO2, temperature, etc... I've already posted results on the forum of what our lights have done, grams per watt. Two customers have reported 2grams per watt, and I've personally done 1.3+ grams per watt depending on strain, stress, etc... My current round of plants looks like it will topple the 2grams per watt achievement, but we'll have to wait and see (will be posting the thread in a few days). Your average HID grower does .5grams per watt. Good ones do .6-.85, and the BEST ones out there are pulling 1gram per watt, maybe a tiny bit higher. So I find this to be a much more accurate way to state what our lights can do, vs simply saying "our 126W will give you 8 ounces" as I can't guarantee that for everyone.

Our 126's average 8 zips a light, some get less and there MIGHT be others who can hit more. Leave it at that and let the results speak for you versus the diehard hps people jumping down leds and for that matter cfl growers throats.

I've actually posted that already on other threads... You can get up to 8 ounces with a single 126W light, it's been stated before. Just thought I'd throw that out there.

 

[LEDGirl]

China is enjoying an employment boom because all of the factories that were in the US that used to supply Americans with goods have been sent to China because china specifically has the least amount of business regulations. I can blame them. They are one part of the problem... but this isn't a political thread...

Most major companies in the US also outsource their customer service (IE the people you talk to on the phone when you have a problem) to India. It doesn't matter what company, they're getting all the jobs right now cause they work for hella cheap! So should we look down on them for being willing to work for less money, and companies in the US trying to hold onto their profit margins, or save their customers another dime? I don't. It's the cycle of life, and years ago there were sweatshops in America with poor conditions as well! So anyhow, I think the Chinese give us retailers a great option: the cost effective one for our consumers.

I would like to see these comparisons that have been with other brands. As someone who pays a lot of money for indoor grows I'm always looking at tech to lower the bills. Really it would be nice to see which companies do the best as right now I am leaning on leds from haight st.. not trying to ad or anything but so far they are in the lead for when I pull the trigger. If you got hard numbers and data to prove you are better then you will have me sold.

In about a week, a respected member on 420 Magazine (forums) will be starting a comparison using the Haight PPF-800 (186W LED), vs our 126W Penetrator. It will be side-by-side, from start to finish, to show you how much more efficient our lights are vs them. They are a fellow sponsor on 420Mag, so I can't speak down about them there, but I guarantee you we will beat them in the test, with 33% less watts, hands down. There are many reasons, but the 3 primary ones are: 1) they lack spectral output, 2) they lack intensity (140 degree lenses), 3) they lack luminous efficacy because they use 6W LED's (any knowledgeable company knows 1W LED produce more lumens per watt).

A member on this forum, and many others, by the name of IrishBoy, is currently using our 126W against the ProSource 180W Jumbo, and with 30% less watts we are currently leading the test.

We have more tests beginning soon against LumiGrow (330W Enhanced Spectrum vs 2 x 126W), and HIDHut (270W Supernova vs 2 x 126W). We plan to prove to everyone, one company at a time, that we make the best LED grow light in the world! Our goal isn't just to prove we're better, it's to beat them with less watts every time! I highly doubt that any other LED Grow Light manufacturer has anywhere near the amount of confidence in their product as I do.

 

[FreedomFGHTR]

At 2 grams per watt the 318 watt unit is not equiv to a 1000W light in terms of finished bud. Yes it might be more efficent on the bill, but a 1000W HPS at 1 gram a watt wins.

1 X 1000 = 1000grams
2 X 318 = 636grams.

Guess its a choice between more bud per space or the light bill...
Hrmm electricity isn't getting cheaper around here.

 

[LEDGirl]

At 2 grams per watt the 318 watt unit is not equiv to a 1000W light in terms of finished bud. Yes it might be more efficent on the bill, but a 1000W HPS at 1 gram a watt wins.

Considering the fact that 98% of growers will likely NEVER achieve a single 1 gram per watt HID harvest, let alone do it with consistency, why would you choose the highest possible amount to compare to what an average customer using my lights has done? That's not a fair comparison, and it seems as though your whole goal was to try and belittle my lights for what? MOST HID growers (including the good ones) do between .5 grams - .8 grams with consistency, not 1 gram. So:

.5 x 1000 = 500 grams
.8 x 1000 = 800 grams

Now, a friend of mine with just over 2 years of gardening experience, is able to pull 2 grams per watt with our lights. She is in no way a pro, and other customers have also made it to 2 grams per watt. So should I use 2 grams for the average, and higher amount for your more experienced/professional gardener?

2 x 318 = 636 grams

So when you break things down to being realistic (not imaginary consistency of 1 gram per watt with HID), our 318W most certainly compares on a yield basis to a 1000W HID, without the need for heat ventilation or A/C.

 

[sx646522]

Hey LEDgirl, will the pro models be available across your entire product line (63/126/318 W), or just the mid-range units? Thanks.

Cheers,

-SX

 

[LEDGirl]

The entire product line

We'll also begin offering supplemental lighting strips in the near future.

 

[cellardweller]

I'm a little confused about something too..

and this is directed right @ LED girl..

why do you not have any albums or pics to back up what you are trying to sell here?

edit: if you have already answered this question, then please direct me to your reply..thank you..

 

[LEDGirl]

i do

http://www.icmag.com/ic/gallery/showgallery.php?cat=500&ppuser=120194

Up until a few days ago, I simply did the attachments button. Now I'm uploading them to the gallery. There will be plenty more coming in the next few days.

 

[sallyforthDeleted member 75382]

LEDGirl seen some of the fantastic grows and flowers/harvest in the LEDGirl thread, so much so I'm converted and want to grow using only led's.

I live in the U.K and noticed that the units you have are for 110v, while over the pond we use 240v. Can you or have you got units that would run on our electricity at 240v.

I too am clueless when it comes to electricity...just wondering if you can shed some light?

Would love to run these and therefore buy a couple of units. Oh and how much would the shipping costs be to the U.K.?

 

[cellardweller]

thank you

 

[LEDGirl]

I live in the U.K and noticed that the units you have are for 110v, while over the pond we use 240v. Can you or have you got units that would run on our electricity at 240v.

Would love to run these and therefore buy a couple of units. Oh and how much would the shipping costs be to the U.K.?

We primarily sell units in the US. For international customers, we make your units to order, with the proper plug and voltage so you can simply plug it in when you get it. No converters, extra plugs, etc... We've sent lots of units to Europe, and Australia, so we do these kinds of units all the time

Shipping varies depending on the amount of units. If you get 6 or more, the shipping is free.

 

[dirtyshawa]

thanx for the reply, ledgirl. i'll be watching the conclusions of the journals linked to your lights and hopefully i'll hop off the fence very shortly.

 

[FreedomFGHTR]

Considering the fact that 98% of growers will likely NEVER achieve a single 1 gram per watt HID harvest, let alone do it with consistency, why would you choose the highest possible amount to compare to what an average customer using my lights has done? That's not a fair comparison, and it seems as though your whole goal was to try

If you look around these forums you can find plenty of grows that have exceeded 1 gram per watt and growers that do it on a regular basis.

6000 Watt Room
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=108395
http://www.icmag.com/ic/album.php?albumid=76&pictureid=66042

Look in some parts of the world people are grow lots of top shelf product w/o wasting much money. The real waste is the electricity. I am sure that d69 would love to get that electric bill down... but at what cost? If you lose half the yield for the space then its a waste of money imo.

I am not saying that LED is bad...

If you want to beat HPS it's going to take two 300Wish panels to equal the output of an hps. You still save on the electric bill by 40%, but yeah startup is a bitch.

Please if you can show a grow like that with LED you will have people emptying your warehouse by the end of next week.

 

[LEDGirl]

If you look around these forums you can find plenty of grows that have exceeded 1 gram per watt and growers that do it on a regular basis.

Look in some parts of the world people are grow lots of top shelf product w/o wasting much money. The real waste is the electricity. I am sure that d69 would love to get that electric bill down... but at what cost? If you lose half the yield for the space then its a waste of money imo.

I am not saying that LED is bad...

If you want to beat HPS it's going to take two 300Wish panels to equal the output of an hps. You still save on the electric bill by 40%, but yeah startup is a bitch.

And those growers you reference make up a VERY small percentage of this community. Most of the members STRIVE to be like those individuals, so please stop using them as a reference for everyone. Perhaps those individuals (since they are so good at producing with HID) would do 2.5-3grams per watt with our LED, did you ever think of that? Just because the highest a decent grower has done thus far is 2 grams per watt with our units, doesn't mean that's where they cap out. So if you want to compare the 1 gram per watt growers to our LED's, have one of them do a grow with it for comparison. Then you'll likely see them yielding 800+ grams with our 318W.

If you want a real world comparison with Joe Blow growing his own meds, he'll yield .5-7 grams per watt, with favorable consistency. So for him, our 318W is certainly a replacement for his 1000W, and likewise for the Pro grower, I'm sure he could get even more yet out of LED (as stated above) making it a replacement for him as well.

 

[dirtyshawa]

I would like to see how much power these lights actually use on an amp/wattage meter and they have them at home depot for like $25 I believe. Pretty important imo so we all actually know what we are talking about here when comparing yields/power.

i will be doing that test when i get a little more guts to jump out the window and purchase the lights. boy, i tell you after doing some research i've become a bit skeptical. i have to give ledgirl some credit tho, she's really standing behind her product, but, china has sure fucked up the game with those outlandish claims and that cheap ass manufacturing quality. i was checking ebay for prices and specifications on leds and found that ledgirls lights are a bit different. the main difference was the angle(which i now understand),also, the fact that she doesn't use orange. could you explain why you said orange is bullshit? anyway, i had an epifany while on ebay. why don't i call my hydro store guy(who knows everything)? (i hadn't been in about 4 months,i'm well stocked). so, i asked did they have any leds and boy did he shoot my hopes and dreams down. but, he said he hadn't heard of hydro-grow-leds and told me to let them know how they work for me. basically, he said the technology wasn't there yet, stay clear of the ufos and chinese made ones, they lacked in the flowering phase, how the intensity diminshed, and broke down why major companies haven't adopted the technology, he sited personal and customer experience. but, i'm an optimist and the proof is in the pudding so, hopefully your leds can prove them wrong. he told me of one company that he thought probably had the best leds on the market was theoreme inovations(hydro-grow-led, not withstanding). ledgirl, i know you've stated you'll be doing some side by side tests and i was wondering have you heard of that company and are you planning a test against any of their lights?

 

[LEDGirl]

china has sure fucked up the game with those outlandish claims and that cheap ass manufacturing quality. i was checking ebay for prices and specifications on leds and found that ledgirls lights are a bit different. the main difference was the angle(which i now understand),also, the fact that she doesn't use orange. could you explain why you said orange is bullshit?

I want to clear up the first sentence, as it's not necessarily China who makes the outlandish claims, it's more the retailers of the products. Most of the Chinese companies never actually test their lights on plants, they are simply a MFR. They rely on feedback from their customers on what works/what doesn't, and how they compare. So the real people who were spreading all the BS around several years ago that a 90W Red/Blue UFO could match a 400W HID, are companies like HIDHut. As I stated before, each company is also responsible for their own research, testing, and development, over and above the simple red/blue/white, or red/blue/orange that China gives you.

So why is orange bull shit? Simple: it is not used by Chlorophyll or Carotenoids for converting light energy into plant energy, therefore making it wasted energy.

FOR ALL OF THOSE WONDERING WHY OTHER COMPANIES USE ORANGE, HERE IS THE RESEARCH THEY FOLLOW:

http://www.patentgenius.com/patent/6921182.html (Go about half way down the page to the middle of the Description section)

"Our patent searches turned up U.S. Pat. Nos. 5,278,432 and 5,012,609, both issued to Ignatius et al., who suggest LED plant radiation very broadly within bands 620-680 or 700-760 nm (red) and 400-500 nm (blue). After a year and a half ofresearch, we settled on three more specific light wavelengths that produced the best plant growth results.

660 nanometers (nm) is the wavelength that drives the engine of the photosynthetic process. The 680 nm wavelength is perhaps closer to the peak absorption wavelength of one of the two chlorophylls found in higher plants. However, at 680 nm youmiss completely the absorption curve of the second chlorophyll, and furthermore the output curve of a 680 nm LED has a fair amount of light output above 700 nm, which is known to cause unwanted morphological changes to plants. LEDs of 680 nm output arealso rare in the marketplace, making them relatively expensive. Our choice of a 660 nm first wavelength component is a compromise wavelength commonly used in plant growing research, which supplies energy to both types of chlorophyll without emittingenough light above 700 nm to adversely affect plant growth.

The 620 nm LEDs used in the aforesaid Ignatius et al. patents, are meant to provide the light energy for photosynthesis, but a look at the absorption spectrum for the two chlorophylls shows that this wavelength falls almost entirely outside theabsorption curve for chlorophyll.

Our research showed better results using LEDs of 660 nm and 612 nm rather than the wavelengths of 620 nm and 680 nm. Beneficially, LEDs of 660 nm are also readily available in the market, and are very inexpensive.

Our second 612 nm wavelength component was selected not to promote photosynthesis, but to match one of the peaks of the carotenoids. As noted in "Influence of UV-B irradiation on the carotenoid content of Vitis vinifera tissues," C. C. Steel andM. Keller (http://bst.portlandpress.com/bst/028/0883/bst028883.htm), "carotenoid synthesis . . . is dependent upon the wavelength of visible light, and is diminished under yellow and red filters."

By providing the orange 612 nm light, we not only promote creation of carotenoids, which are required for plant health, but also add a little to photosynthesis, since the carotenoids pass their absorbed energy to chlorophyll. Carotenoids arerequired for plant health due to their ability to absorb destructive free radicals, both from solar damage and from chlorophyll production, whose precursors will damage plant tissue in the absence of the carotenoids. During research we found that,beneficially, test plants turned a deeper green, i.e. produced more chlorophyll, with the addition of our 612 nm light component. This ability to increase a plant's chlorophyll content with this specific light wavelength is an important aspect of ourinvention."



What's funny is that anywhere you search for information on carotenoids, tells you that their peak absorption points are primarily in the blue spectrum! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carotenoid (second paragraph)

Theirs is the ONLY research I've EVER found that states orange with any relation to carotenoids (especially when you bring MJ into the mix). But you have to find funny how they determined orange as the cause of the increased growth! Seriously, it's funny. So first sentence of paragraph 2, they acknowledge that 660nm is the main drive engine for photosynthesis. Then they tested two different combos: 680nm + 620nm, and 660nm + 612nm. They concluded that the 660nm + 612nm performed better because the 612nm did a better job of hitting the carotenoids! They don't attribute ANYTHING to the 660nm "drive engine" from sentence 1!!!!! Also, the only thing they said about carotenoids, is that it's function is diminished under yellow and red filters (meaning it absorbs nowhere near that spectrum)! Hope you guys got a laugh!

anyway, i had an epifany while on ebay. why don't i call my hydro store guy(who knows everything)? (i hadn't been in about 4 months,i'm well stocked). so, i asked did they have any leds and boy did he shoot my hopes and dreams down. but, he said he hadn't heard of hydro-grow-leds and told me to let them know how they work for me. basically, he said the technology wasn't there yet, stay clear of the ufos and chinese made ones, they lacked in the flowering phase, how the intensity diminshed, and broke down why major companies haven't adopted the technology, he sited personal and customer experience. but, i'm an optimist and the proof is in the pudding so, hopefully your leds can prove them wrong. he told me of one company that he thought probably had the best leds on the market was theoreme inovations(hydro-grow-led, not withstanding). ledgirl, i know you've stated you'll be doing some side by side tests and i was wondering have you heard of that company and are you planning a test against any of their lights?

About 2 years ago when I began doing major research, the company who I thought had the best light on the market (in terms of spectral output) was Theoreme Innovations. A couple of their customers had literally torn the units apart on various forums, citing each individual LED that they used in the product, it's manufacturer, nm, etc... While my specs are certainly different from theirs, some of the information I learned from Theoreme Innovation's customers, did help me with the development of my light (even though their customers weren't having anywhere near the "claimed" results on TI's website). They were one of maybe 20-30 different companies I studied?

Anyhow, even when there is plenty of proof that LED grow lights work better than MH and HPS, there is going to be a lot of hesitation from Hydro Store Owners across America to make the switch. Wanna know why? MONEY. Plain and simple, their profit margins would fall if they stopped selling those expensive HID and CFL bulbs to you once or twice a year (depending on how anal you are). Instead, they make a 1 point sale, with a product that needs no maintenance, and 5 years later the customer comes back for a newer model with higher output. Some hydro stores will make the switch and capitalize on a HUGE market shift, but a lot of them are going to be hesitant.

 

[Centrum]

I think its just nerves and critics

When you basically make everyone's dreams come true and they are all kicking you in the nuts it kinda changes your tone if ya know what i mean

If this thing achieves 1 gram per watt its already won in my book.

I cant wait to get one and start playing.

 

[humboldtlocal]

Don't sweat it LED Girl,
You just need to show results. People talked tons of shit about trimming machines until I showed them the results of the Twister. Stick behind the thing you believe in. I got very excited about LED's the first time I heard about them a few years ago and I know we will see some very good things from the talented growers on here. I can't wait and I wish you the best of luck.