Ice hash for lung cancer cannabinoid therapy without the high?

[two heads]

I'm sorry I haven't done much of a search of this forum; I'm only in the Outdoor Growing forum when I'm here at all, but my sister has lung cancer. She has undergone radiation and chemo with pretty good success and is about to enter maintenance chemo. I mentioned cannabis therapies. She's open-minded but would definitely prefer not to get high. I'd like some advice on how to convert a half pound or so of my outdoor herb to the most effective, but least psychoactive cannabis extract for her.

My understanding is that temperature is what activates THCA to form THC. If I were to make ice water hash from my cured weed and she were to take it in a way that did not heat it, would those cancer cells still get a substantial shower of cannabinoids without her getting too high? Would they still be the optimum cannabinoids, compared to heated cannabis?

Finally, are there differences in cannabinoid effectiveness and/or psychoactivity between ingestion (maybe with some olive oil) and a suppository?

It's such a new therapy but if anyone has answers to my questions, I'd appreciate it. Needless to say, I'm anxious to get started.

 

[Mad Lab]

Hey two heads,

Sorry to hear about your sister, i hope her treatments continue to be successful.

As you stated above, THCA, which is not psychoactive, needs to be decarboxylated to become THC, which is psychoactive.

Both THCA and THC have been found to be beneficial in treating many ailments.

THCA has medicinal properties that are lost when the plant is dried, and it can be metabolized in much larger doses than THC, making it potentially more effective.

THC also has been found to have it's own benefits that are extremely helpful with a long list of illness. THC has even been shown to kill cancerous tumors.

CBD, which will also be present if you decide not to decarboxylate the THCA into THC. CBD contributes aide to just as long of a list of ailments. CBD has also been shown to kill cancer cells.

So it's up to your sister whether she wants the THC in her medication. THCA/THC/CBD would be a good suggestion to possibly cover all bases but if you choose to leave out the THC your sister will still benefit from the other cannabinoids.

Using fresh frozen material to make your hash has a better chance for the material to retain more THCA. Alot of patients with chronic-immune system diseases are juicing cannabis for amazing results.

I would look into juicing. Also if she decides THC is ok, look into coconut oil infused capsules or FECO (Full Extract Cannabis Oil). The capsule is made with an indica strain but it’s formulation is such that it contains CBD, THC and THCa.

 

[Snype]

I've been wondering the same thing for a while. Can you treat cancer with THCA or do you have to decarb it to THC?

It would be nice if you could leave it in it's THCA form so that you didn't get high. Hopefully someone here has some experience.

 

[Mad Lab]

Sorry I forgot to include THCa's benefit section.

Yes, THCa has also been found to help fight cancer and other tumors. It will also do similar things to THC's effects such as stimulating the appetite, aide with sleep and is also a powerful anti-inflammatory.

But, THC is a different cannabinoid and is likely to produce its own individual benefits towards aiding in cancer treatment. So while THCa and CBD are helpful in their own ways, THC is as well in its own.

Many more studies are taking place currently on the benefits of THCa but theres a few in the past few years noting its cancer fighting abilities. Im sure i can find a few here..

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21175579

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3570006/

 

[Mad Lab]

I would try cannabis juicing and the coconut oil capsules. Have her test the capsules and see how she reacts.

Obviously the capsules would be ideally made with a high CBD low THC strain to keep the THC dosage low.

 

[hello/Banana]

hello,

i think the best non psychoactive method would probably be raw juicing of whole plant (inc the leaves)

leaves with trichomes, can have ALOT of medicinal content, also chlorophyll is supposed to be very good for you i think.

unfortunately i think the reccommended dosage amount of non psychoactive cannabinoids is VERY VERY high, sorry i don't know off the top of my head, but from what i have seen you need to be drinking ALOT and juice yield vs weight of material is low.

decarboxylated cannabis is supposed to be better / more ideal a course of treatment i think.

i don't know about THC / CBD better for cancer, anecdotally some say rick simpson oil ("highest thc possible") / others suggest cbd may be better etc (???)

there won't be a difference is psychoactivity between method, although i would imagine drinking juice may be better as presmably more chance in transit to absorb as much medicinal content as possible throughout the G.I. tract - if digestive system is O.K.

suppository obviously better if edibles not well tolerated.

--------------------------

is there no way she would consider having a decarboxylated 1:1 thc:cbd strain or something ?, less psychoative then high THC ? and then you also have both ?

think the idea is to flood your body with as many cannabinoids as you can tolerate - baring in mind here that ones tolerance builds and the effect is less debilitating after a while ?.

she could find the effect beneficial if you could convince her to try ?, also there's appetite stimulation etc etc ?

hope this was of some help,

regards,

 

[wolfhoundaddy]

I recently saw a you tube video of a woman who used cannabis to treat her lung cancer. She didn't want to get high either. She took the oil rectally and didn't get high. Search you tube ' back door lung cancer'. I know it sounds a little odd but she is a sincere '54 yr. old wanting to get the word out.
good luck to your sister.

 

[two heads]

Thanks for the thoughtful replies. I think she would like the idea of juicing fresh cannabis but, as an outdoor grower, I can't help her with that right now. She may talk to her oncologist about a medical exemption to get legal access to fresh cannabis but sadly that doesn't seem too likely under Canada's current system. It sounds like my ice water hash might produce a good THCA/THC/CBD combo and slowly increasing the dose would be a good way to find the sweet spot for her.

Thanks for the medical links Mad Lab. I've added them to the bookmarks I am working my way through.

 

[blastfrompast]

two Heads:

I would get her to get an excemption, and then purchase meds at somewhere besides the LP's out there (way way overpriced)....Oil is still illegal in canada

I'm canadian, and have my PPL (covered under injunction)...

Also you could try getting her to ingest cbd oil first before the high THC version..

Backdoor method is good also, seems to be less psychoactive effects (depending on how far you put it in )..

 

[two heads]

Thanks blastfrompast, I think she will look into an exemption - any advice you have would be appreciated.

I'm new to the med side of this so the only acronyms I understood were THC and CBD! What is LP and PPL?

 

[Mad Lab]

Thanks blastfrompast, I think she will look into an exemption - any advice you have would be appreciated.

I'm new to the med side of this so the only acronyms I understood were THC and CBD! What is LP and PPL?

LP is licensed producer.

PPL is personal production license

 

[sawney beane]

Best of luck & a wee bump

 

[two heads]

Thanks everyone. Until she has a medical exemption and we have access to high CBD, lo THC cannabis, I think I'll try making hash for ingestion through ice water extraction. I'm accustomed to baked cannabis so I'll try some first to see if there is a substantial difference using hash which has never been heated. I'll report back.

 

[hello/Banana]

hello,

you could just rehydrate the whole of your dry harvest matter and juice that if you wanted a non-psychoactive alternative as an idea ?.

- i found the test results of leaf from a CBD SnS widow sample:

http://analytical360.com/m/expired/188053

you can see it has 1% CBD - i know that doesn't seem alot, but baring in mind, ALOT can only regularly yield in the region to 5% (although i have seen upto 13% i think (?))

- THC is nice though for taking mind of illness, if compatible with the individual.

and i think an "hollistic" approach is better, although imho get more "bang for your buck" with decarboxylation (everything) although i haven't ever had a vast enough quantity of marijuana to try juicing.

good luck with whatever you decide, and best wishes.

 

[two heads]

In a way, that's what the ice hash is doing - rehydrating my cured bud.

Sometimes it's called bubble hash. It's made using ice water and various meshes of screen to separate and capture resin glands from cannabis agitated in the ice water mixture. Lovely stuff really. Because it's never heated, the cannabinoid profile should be the same as un-burned/vaped/baked bud since it won't have been decarboxylated. Relatively high in THCa (and CBDa?), though there will still be some THC because of breakdown due to drying and curing.

And wow, a leaf sample with 1% CBD. It's amazing how breeders are working the cannabinoids in plants. I've always been a big fan of the herb - I hope it makes a fan of my sister too, and she doesn't get high if she doesn't want to.

 

[hello/Banana]

hello,

sorry yes, i understand "why bother juicing" when "the trichomes can be harvested" - more potent / standardized medicine, benefits etc etc

but there's loss of terpenes, chlorophyll, cartenoids etc i think to maybe consider (all with alleged/anecdotal health benefits).

it just seems a shame to throw it away, if there is medicinal content within (?),

also considering here, that it's purpose is medicinal and not recreational, and "bad bits, commonly discarded" etc, could well form some small part in the medicinal jigsaw puzzle (???).

i like to make a paste of ground decarbed trim / flowers, dried non decarbed t,f (mostly for terpenes) and coconut butter to eat.

try to be as hollistic as possible, as of the conflicting info, people trying to make money selling snake oil etc...

i will shut up though now, because i have a tendency to "not get the message" on when to stop, sorry if it was "2 posts ago"!.

regards,

 

[dickcorn]

I thought drying and curing converted at least some thca into thc etc. i thought no thc required fresh non heated extraction? Sorry about your sister. Cancer is a terrible thing to witness someone or go through, my prayers go out.I second supository or possibly a no heat longer soak green dragon tincture. More then likely though she'll get high unless fresh material is used I think.

 

[two heads]

No, I appreciate your thoughts hello/Banana. If I was interested in the overall health benefits of cannabis I think juicing cured herb would be an option but in this case I'm only interested in its cancer-fighting properties which appear to based on cannabinoids alone so I'm going for the most concentrated form I can.

That's my understanding too dickcorn - once drying and curing occurs, some THCa is converted to THC so the only way to get "no THC" is to use fresh cannabis. Until that's an option, I'll see how much less psychoactive ingesting hash is compared to any method that applies enough heat to decaboxylate it. If it still gets you quite high, it may not be an option for my sister. We're so alike in many ways but differ on this one...

 

[trichrider]

qwet or qwiso without decarbing delivers more of both and will not get you high (to an extent) meaning you can consume up to a gram daily without disorientation/discombobulation.

I didn't have lung cancer but it disappeared my skin cancer.

best wishes to your sister/family/you in dealing with this awful menace.

more info:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=278827

scroll thru...

 

[hoss1111]

hey man,just saw this ya sorry to hear.i have dealt with this with my mother..........sad time, stay positive as you can

i have some cbd seeds i can gift you,wish i could do more
hoss