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Help with Fluorecents

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srenre

New member
Of course HID would be best but that just isn't going to happen during this grow. I was planning all cfls but the higher wattage bulbs are too pricey.

Using clamp lights gets pricey too using 26 watt bulbs. One clamp light is $7 plus 3 Y connectors for $2 each plus 4 bulbs $14 for a 2 pack. $27 for 104 total watts that are twisted in a spiral. On the positive side everything but the bulbs last forever!

I am thinking of adding T12 because I can get 48 inch shop lights (uses 2 bulbs) and 2 x 34 watt bulbs for $15 total. This is only 68 watts but not in a cluster so I can make a longer canopy.

For $3 more I get 2 of the T12 sets for 136 total watts.

Which is better? Cluster or tube?
 
pearlemae

pearlemae

May your race always be in your favor
Veteran
I use an 8 lamp T5 HO set up for both veg and bud. Proofs in the pics.
 
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lightningstrike

New member
T12's are big and clunky with not a lot of light. Cheap is very important. So use one . I still use CFL's in clones and very small veging plants even though I have now moved on to HID's for most indoor growing. When not using the original CFL's they go in a really small and easy to store box . No money was wasted in buying my CFL's. Can't do that with those clunky T12's. If you are growing you are learning. You cant start out growing in a perfect enviroment. I still change things and not just lights.. At one time I used a T12 just for clones and now its hung up high for a shop light and not for growing anymore because I liked the CFL's better but I didn't waste that money either. If I buy it I use it or save it until I change things around again. A bargain buy on a light still makes me smile. I don't buy T 12's anymore even new in the box at a garage sale for a $1. But if I had no lights and a tight budget -ABSOLUTLEY.
 
Hammerhead

Hammerhead

Disabled Farmer
ICMag Donor
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To me 140$ is cheap. I got about 5 grams of pretty decent bud with that 100w t5. I know for me it's not worth the effort to do that again.
 
S

srenre

New member
Hammerhead said:
To me 140$ is cheap. I got about 5 grams of pretty decent bud with that 100w t5. I know for me it's not worth the effort to do that again.
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Someday I want to be just like you! Unfortunately I am broke and $15 is more in line with my budget.


@lightningstrike You are right, I am still learning! Thanks for the advice! I am going to get one set to start with and see how it works. In the very worst case I can just use it in another way.

@DaPurps You mean 104 watts of cfls are better than 136 watts of t12? I would really appreciate some more info on that and thanks for bringing it up! When I tried comparing online all the "info" was mean to sell what they have.

Also...

Am I right in thinking I could get t8 bulbs to go in a cheapo shop light that says to use t12s? Is there any advantage in doing that?
 
S

srenre

New member
localboyz said:
At my local home depot you can get this fixture for 35 dollars on clearance. it comes with a 85w cfl 6500k bulb. you can also buy replacement bulbs for it.Just a few mods to the fixture and your off and running. now I know its not in the 10 to 15 dollar range but it might help ya.http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs...-D27X-_-100405567&locStoreNum=650&marketID=29
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Now the bulb itself I have to look at. $16! It says " E-39 Mogul Base" and I normally see that mentioned with HIDs. Is that the same as a regular household bulb?

85 > 68 so good idea! :jump:
 
Stress_test

Stress_test

I'm always here when I'm not someplace else
Veteran
Welllllllll..............

If you are financially handicapped then I would off this advice:

Check here ... I have seen entire grow setups for free. Not that I would fall for that but there are thousands of free lighting/electrical items super cheap and even free.

Many businesses and home owners are changing out the old ballast light fixtures for the newer clod start IC ballast sets. The old ballasts are heavier and have trouble starting in colder temps and use more electricity to operate but would work fine for somebody who NEEDS lights.

Another place to look for surplus electrical supplies is an "Electrical Contractor". They either have to pay somebody to strip the fixtures down and remove the ceramic and ballasts so they can be scrapped, or give them away.
 
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localboyz

New member
srenre said:
Now the bulb itself I have to look at. $16! It says " E-39 Mogul Base" and I normally see that mentioned with HIDs. Is that the same as a regular household bulb?

85 > 68 so good idea! :jump:
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your regular household bulb is known as a medium base. e-39 is a bigger socket, for higher wattage cfl's. and yes hids do fit this base. but you have to have the right ballast for each type of bulb if that makes since.
 
RoomRaider

RoomRaider

Member
Tilt said:
Im a big fan of flouros But.......
I'm not trying to push HID or anything but I find this to be a good value

http://highpressuresodium.net/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=62_63

150w hps $85.00 reflector bulb and ballast can't beat it plug and play baby

T12 = .22 per watt
150w hps = .56 per watt
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I agree, you might want to think about this, found one from a trusted ebay vendor, $66 dollars, twice the cost, but half the hassle.

http://cgi.ebay.com/150-WATT-HPS-GR...191?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c16576b7f
 
S

srenre

New member
qbert said:
PL-L bulbs (if you don't know, now you know): http://1000bulbs.com/category/55-watt-4-pin-2g11-plug-in-compact-fluorescents-4100k/

Ballast: http://1000bulbs.com/search/?q=workhorse+7+ballast


Word is those are some of the best CFL's for what we do. Intense - it's like a 4' HO tube folded and half and shrunk a bit.

There's some reflectors around too, but if you want cheap forget em they are the spendiest part.
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Thanks for the info on those! I had a lot of reading to do to get an understanding. After looking they are still out of my price range for now to get a good set up but DEFINITELY worth considering for an upgrade mid grow.

Is there a cheap household fixture I could crack open that uses those?

Im a big fan of flouros But.......
I'm not trying to push HID or anything but I find this to be a good value

http://highpressuresodium.net/index....ex&cPath=62_63

150w hps $85.00 reflector bulb and ballast can't beat it plug and play baby

T12 = .22 per watt
150w hps = .56 per watt
Click to expand...
I understand it would be better but I can't invest in HIDs at this point. I saw the 150 club thread and found this http://www.e-conolight.com/floods/small/small-hid.html a little cheaper. Not plug and play but $40 plus a cut up extension cord and poof!

one point to mention, shoplite...get a blue and a red spectrum bulb to provide decent light
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Just to make sure... I was going to get a fixture that uses 2 bulbs. Are you saying to use 1 red and 1 blue in the same fixture?

I was planning to get one set of blue for now (vegging some youngsters) and then get another fixture with a set of red for flowering when ready.



Thanks for all the tips guys! Even though a few suggestions were out of my budget you still gave me more to think about:jump:
 
chronisseur

chronisseur

Member
missing the point - Kelvins, PAR + canopy distances

missing the point - Kelvins, PAR + canopy distances

THE MOST important things to get right are the 1) light intensity, and 2) light spectrum/color/temperature (Kelvins).

Whether its CFL or T12 or T5 of HID, you need to give the plants the right kind of light (for each stage).. Ive seen it done (mind you small harvests), you just got to keep the lights super close..

This means that you must get your lights as close to the canopy as possible without burining the tops (esp importand for non-HID light as it diminishes very quickly).. all indoor light follows the inverse square law, meaning that when you 2x the distance between the light and plants, you 1/4 the intensity! Moving the light 3 times as far as it was makes the intensity (at canopy level) 1/9.. moving it 4 times the distance makes it 1/16th and so on... Generally indoors you are best to keep shorter plants to keep light penetration to a max.. also good to thin out bottom foliage that doesnt get much light so the tops can efficiently put all energy into the main buds...

but i digress... Back to Kelvins... The noon-day sun is (depending on season) 5000-7500 Kelvins, higher (whiter) in summer... For vegetative growth, the bulb temp should be AT LEAST 5000K, even 6400K good. Metal Halide bulbs are generally 5000K.(clones/seedlings benefit from a mixture with one 2700K and one 5000K for instance).. Flowering plants (and HPS lights) are generally 2200K-2700K.

If you are using CFL or Floros, you should be mindful that for veg the color should be above 5000K, and for flowering it should be more orange/red (like autumn sun) around 2700K.

PAY ATTENTION when u buy your lights! there is more to it than just Watts! in my opinion, Ive used $15 (complete w lights! at home depot etc) 4foot, 2 bulb fixtures for seedlings and clones that have done as good as anything else could have - you just have to keep it very close - like an inch or two above canopy, and monitor it every day - only direct bulb-contact will fry foliage with these kinds of lights.. plus you can generally find more variety in bulbs with T12 than any other similar light - from 2000K-10000K and even specialized plant/aquarium (pink/purple) bulbs that are great to mix with a higher K bulb right up to flower when you change the higher K bulb to a lower one..

CFLs are more flexible, can be put between tops etc, and do come in higher wattages (although thin t5s complete fine), so probably are "better" at first glance... though they do run hotter so you may not be able to get them as close, or end up needing as much or close to as much wattage as a 250 or 400W HID!

HOWEVER>> many magnetic/coil ballasts (the kind that have been around forever) can be bought for under $100 including everything (as one person pointed out).. You can buy a conversion bulb to allow it to use a MH bulb (or HPS if u get MH orig) for $30-40, and therefore have a full HID setup for ALL stages of growth, for under $150... even less if u go with a 400W or even a small 250W

if you are going to spend so much on CFLs, Id just get an HID.. otherwise, if you want to do it cheap, try to find some old floro fixtures, or buy the 4ft shop light for $15 at all those retail hardware stores.. either way, make sure you get bulbs w proper K.. the bargain/cheap $1 are that way for a reason - less life, shitty K/PAR, etc..

I know you can grow on the cheap and for "free" essentially, but really the results will be so much better with some carefully executed purchases/finds.. remember any light will grow plants - you just need to get it close enough and make sure the right K are present for the right stage (tho again I have a friend who clones, vegges, and flowers all under a 400W MH he got for $100 but his buds are good and yields respectable - tho a bit leafier and greener than theyd be under an HPS - potency is there tho...

so think about that for the future, lol,... i just started my first ever seeds under a MH light and they are noticeably more robust, green etc than under my t-12 (even w mixed 5000K bulb and special 2200K plant/aquarium bulb), and its only been 2 weeks or so
 
S

srenre

New member
Yep I want them as close as possible to my low n00b lighting. I also know I want as much as possible in specific kelvins to allow them .... so back to the question, lol
 
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