H3ad formula problems, week 1 flower

[MynameStitch]

No problem black and XIII! Keep it green

OOO, the ole drop the pen in the water, arrrg! I hate that; cause I have done that a few times,I am very clumsy sometimes.

Phatty, it looks very similar, yes you do have a magnesium issue, but not sure if it's from lockout..... not enough; do not have enough details.....

do you know the pH of your tap? Are you using more pH adjuster now than when you were using RO?

were you using cal mag this time around with tap?

That first picture you took with the HPS light on, can you get a picture of that without the hps light on?

 

[XIII]

Hey phattybudz!

Gotta say the problems do look very similar and Cal-Mag helped mine immensely.

For a day or two we actually did try mixing half RO and half tap and it didn't help ours. Maybe our water isn't hard enough, we didn't use enough tap, our tap lacks the magnesium, or something like that. We aren't sure, but the cal-mag showed more immediate results than the tap/RO mix. So IF your problem indeed is a magnesium deficiency... then you may have to add Cal-Mag or epsom salts. I'm sure Stitch can help ya out tho! What is the PPM of your tap water by the way?

-XIII

 

[phattybudz]

[/url][/IMG]

[/url][/IMG]

Here are some more pics for you out of the HPS stitch... so my tap water is 180ppm at .5 conversion (320 ppm at .7, which should I use..?), and 7.5 ph. I don't have R/O, although I'm leaning towards buying one now (just BROKE at the moment.) I was watering at normal rates with H&G no cal-mag this time... and my ph was around 6. I will finish out this round with H&G at normal rates and 5.8 ph (got a hanna meter finally, stoked!) Then next run I will be doing H&G with some H3ad formula testers... Really want to figure this out for next run though, can't take another beating like this!

 

[MynameStitch]

Which pH meter are you using? Do you live in europe, us or somewhere else?
Most people use the .5 it all depends on your pH meter too which conversion if I remember correctly.

I would add some magnesium, that is what you have and you should use it with ever water your water source does not have enough in it..... start at about 1 1/2 teaspoon first time and use 1 tsp per gallon from then on.

Damage leaves will stay that way, so just look for semi newer to semi older growth to make sure it's not spreading.

 

[phattybudz]

Its a hanna meter 98219 waterproof combo, US. Cool, do you mean calmag or Epsom ? I will probably finish out this flowering run without it but start the vegges with it....most of them look alright. thanks !!!!!

 

[dr-dank]

epson is mag + sulpher, so if you have a mag def, yes, add epson. If you need calcium then I would go for a comercial cal-mag solution. I have heard that tomatoe end blossem rot stopper (or such) has a lot of C, and is at hemp depot, but not sure. Read the label.

Regards

 

[Vash]

I'd find out the ph and ppm's of my water. Then I would ph and ppm my runoff. That would give me an idea of how acidic my medium is. You just may need to flush first with ph'd water before adding any more nutes.

 

[guineapig]

Stitch, do you think the problem is due to excess salts in the B'Cuzz brand coco fibers? This is one of the more expensive coco products out there, and looks great because it is pre-broken-up and pre-moistened......do you think the coco should be flushed with pure water before using by the customer, even though the label says it has been pre-rinsed?

Here is what the manufacturer says about the product:

"Atami ships compressed coir to the Netherlands where it undergoes rigid batch testing and treatment. Because Atami owns its own facility in Sri Lanka they are able to guarantee the quality of the original untreated/raw product (age and origin). Atami coir is sourced from coir that is grown 50km's (or more) inland from the coast meaning the original coir source is low in sodium chloride. Furthermore, the coir is under two years old which means the coirs composition is ideal for use as a hydroponic media. Atami utilizes a unique steaming and buffering process for the coir at its facilities in the Netherlands and then ships it around the world. Atami is the only company in the world that uses this steaming process to flush impurities from the media. In this process, the coir is initially saturated with calcium and magnesium solutions. After this, the coir is steamed to 900 C and then flushed with large amounts of water; the combination of these two processes ensures that impurities are efficiently and effectively flushed from the media. After this B'Ccuzz coir is lightly fertilized to achieve optimized nutritional balance within the media. Because of Atami's rigid standards, B'Cuzz coir is the largest selling coir in the European retail hydroponics market."

Hopefully i can understand more about the specific diagnosis and treatment here....

kind regards from guineapig

 

[MynameStitch]

Stitch, do you think the problem is due to excess salts in the B'Cuzz brand coco fibers? This is one of the more expensive coco products out there, and looks great because it is pre-broken-up and pre-moistened......do you think the coco should be flushed with pure water before using by the customer, even though the label says it has been pre-rinsed?

Here is what the manufacturer says about the product:

"Atami ships compressed coir to the Netherlands where it undergoes rigid batch testing and treatment. Because Atami owns its own facility in Sri Lanka they are able to guarantee the quality of the original untreated/raw product (age and origin). Atami coir is sourced from coir that is grown 50km's (or more) inland from the coast meaning the original coir source is low in sodium chloride. Furthermore, the coir is under two years old which means the coirs composition is ideal for use as a hydroponic media. Atami utilizes a unique steaming and buffering process for the coir at its facilities in the Netherlands and then ships it around the world. Atami is the only company in the world that uses this steaming process to flush impurities from the media. In this process, the coir is initially saturated with calcium and magnesium solutions. After this, the coir is steamed to 900 C and then flushed with large amounts of water; the combination of these two processes ensures that impurities are efficiently and effectively flushed from the media. After this B'Ccuzz coir is lightly fertilized to achieve optimized nutritional balance within the media. Because of Atami's rigid standards, B'Cuzz coir is the largest selling coir in the European retail hydroponics market."

Hopefully i can understand more about the specific diagnosis and treatment here....

kind regards from guineapig

Which grow are you talking about gp? Phatty or XIII grow? I assume you are talking about XII's, because phatty said he re-used his...

Yes, salt build up had some to do with his problem, salts/sodium is taken in by the plant before any other nutrient and it blocks the uptake of other nutrients. The other part is, with hardly no cal mag.... The sodium breaks down the vascular system in the plant in high amounts, the plant won't absorb water or nutrient correctly and they end up looking weird and droopy and sick.
That is in high amounts though, small salt buildup can be seen in different ways depending on how the "salts" got there, weather from buildup from nutrients or left over from not using plain water every now and then.

Hydro companies try to save money as much as possible, so because they say it's rinsed, does not mean it's "rinsed" enough for your plants; so to avoid possible stress on them and stunted growth, it's good to rinse now than to worry about it later after you got your plants in the medium.

Either way, yes even if it says rinsed well I would still rinse it at least once or twice before using it. Ya, it's very good coco, makes it very convent with it all broke up and washed.

I have seen many situations where they did not rinse it, because it said it was already rinsed and had problems.

how often they water if there is already salts present in the coco depending on how often you water you may not see a problem because the frequent water helps flush out salts.

 

[phattybudz]

Ok here is an update...

For some weird reason my runoff ph is about 6.5, and the ppm is 750. So the ppm seems normal to me for medium vegges, but the ph is fuct. I have been feeding it at what I thought was ~6.0 and 5.8 the last few days since I got my meter.

This could totally be the problem huh? So assuming my ph is totally fuct, what should I do, keep watering at 5.8, or hit them with something lower to balance it out? I am starting flower in the next few days and don't want to shock them but obviously I need to fix this so I don't ruin another crop!

5.8 w/no nutes? 5.8 w/nutes? lower ph? I plan on using epsom rather than cal-mag because my tap water probably has plenty of calcium which might even be contributing to the problem...

 

[MynameStitch]

I personaly don't see any pH related issue, it looks more like the plant sucked itself dry of magnesium from lack off.... if it was pH you would see any of the following; twisty leaves with brown and crispy feeling, spotting of the leaves nutrient lockout.

With yours, yours are twisty only because the plant sucked it's reserves dry, tan coloration your seeing is dead tissue caused by the plant itself.

I have seen people grow in 6.5 coco with no problem.......
THought I agree it is slightly high, but I don't see the plant having a problem with it right now.

I would lower it a bit, remember as the nutrients are removing from the medium the pH will rise and this is normal.

You can't use a whole lot of pH down, it can build up over time, how much are you using with and without nutrients?

Have you tested your pH when you just plain water and pH adjuster?

Yes, your tap water seems to be in the middle. Tap water can cause the pH to read high after nutrients are removed, this is due to high micronutrient content if the water is hard. RO water pH drops after you let it sit out for a while. IF you use RO water and add nutrients, when the plant removes the nutrients, the RO water pH does not rise like tap water does too, but you will see a much higher rise in the pH when you use tap due to hard water if you have hard water.

I would lower your pH to 5.8, I would also try to get some RO water and mix it with your tap to help lower the pH. If you have to use a lot of pH down it will cause problems.

So I would add some epsom salts 1/2 teaspoon per gallon of 1 tsp per gallon.
I would hit them with the 1 tsp per gallon once and then 1/2 teaspoon there on out.

 

[phattybudz]

Awesome thanks stitch. I will let you know how they turn out... throwing a 4x4 in tomorrow!

 

[MynameStitch]

Good, I will be here

Good Luck!

 

[MynameStitch]

Arg double post

Man did they take away the ability to delete your posts??