Feminized seeds

[stagger lee]

plants grown from regular seeds will also often hermi if you stress them with high temps or other stuff they dont like. true females (that will never produce male flowers under stress) are quite rare.

if you got a lot of herms from fem seed then it may well be your environment is off or you have not bought them from a reputable breeder.

personally i have had more herms from regular seeds than from fems.

V.

true standard genetics can herm, but feminized are much more likely, almost known for it!

and did you even read my post?the grow environment(stress) is the main reason behind feminized going herm.So what do you mean by a reputable breeder?

if youve had so many probs w/genetics going herm on you, then was your prob w/stressful environment or was every breeder you got the seeds from at fault(not reputable?)

 

[VerdantGreen]

true standard genetics can herm, but feminized are much more likely, almost known for it!

and did you even read my post?the grow environment(stress) is the main reason behind feminized going herm.So what do you mean by a reputable breeder?

if youve had so many probs w/genetics going herm on you, then was your prob w/stressful environment or was every breeder you got the seeds from at fault(not reputable?)

hi stagger lee - i didnt say ive had 'so many problems' from regular seed, just that ive had about the same amount of herms from regular seeds as i have from fem - which isnt many at all. your post (which i did read) says that fem are more likely to herm and i disagree with that. - if you want to check on the health of my plants then just click on one of my diary links

when i say 'reputable' breeder - i mean one that goes through proper selection process before reversing a female to produce male pollen. the fact that some plants herm more easily than others is well known, and you dont want to select an easily hermable plant to be the mother and 'father' of your seeds. selection is everything in any breeding program.

there are such plants called 'true' females - quite rare - but these will never produce male flowers under stress - UK cheese clone is one example. the only way to get it to produce pollen is by chemical reversal. this would be a good selection for being selfed (making fem seeds from)

cheers

VG.

 

[simon]

personally i have had more herms from regular seeds than from fems.

Same here. Having grown out literally hundreds of femmed beans, I've seen a total of 2 individuals herm (same pack of seeds). Femmed beans serve an important purpose - decreased opportunity cost.

Simon

 

[stagger lee]

verdantgreen, I respect your opinion, too each his own, I dont mean to sound offensive or disrespectful especially when some1s opinion differs from mine. Thats what these forums are for right? its all good.

 

[stagger lee]

simon do you remember the strain and breeder herms came from?

 

[Texicannibus]

can someone explain how the genetic structure of the dna is changed by feminization ... sorry if its a noob question .. thanks for info

 

[cateros]

And you know this to be fact? How? Can you provide any sources?

Okay well feminized seeds are created by finding a pure xx female that will not hermie from stress basically you stress it to hell and if it dont turn its a xx. Afterward you add giberellic acid which is a hormone that is found in plants and increase cell division and germination rates of seeds and has found to have the ability to cause a pure female plant to self polinate itself in essence they create seed clones that will produce genetic duplicates of the original plant. But even though your original plant is a pure female and the seeds are genetic clones they do carry a full dna strand which as we all know has dominant and reccessive traits and all plants do carry a gene to grow male parts in a one sex enviroment so yes down the line plants can hermie as they are duplicates but as they were generated from seed and artifical polination they carry all the genes of the original as recessive traits instead of dormant traits.

Oh I should explain a little further to those who arent familiar with plant genetics recessive genes are plant tendencies that only pop up in some of there offspring for instance how some indica hybrids still turn purple , or how some indica sativa hybrids still require 13 weeks or so to mature. A dormant geene would be best compared to the original mother I describe a pure xx female it carries dormant y chromosones that are passed down to the seeds but because they are seeds there is always the possiblity that they can inherit the xy pattern that is why no seed bank is 100% female the only ones I believe in are the ones who claim 99% as they admit you can get a male or a xxy hermie.

 

[simon]

simon do you remember the strain and breeder herms came from?

I do. Spice Brothers' Green Giant x White Russian.

Simon

 

[jm420]

I've never had an issue with femmed seeds.Do some research on the strain, for instance Trainwreck has a tendency to herm would i buy it feminized ?

 

[stagger lee]

Texi no need to apologize were in newb central! thanx simon, I had good luck w/spice bros c99 yrs back

 

[cannabis59]

A little off topic (has to do with environmental stress)...but just my experience.

I grew Mandala#1 , 8 Miles High, Satori and Hashberry in two locations outdoors last year.

The crop grown at 1,800 ft elevation with no house/street or any other light available produced ZERO viable seeds from any hermi or nanner issue. There were approximately a half-dozen very large white seeds found out of approximately 55 lbs.

These seeds where all hollow large sterile seeds, that would crush in your finger tips from the slightest pressure..

40 miles away in a large city, the same four strains, from the same collection of starter plans produced at least twenty healthy ( and what look to be viable ) seeds from less than 15 lbs off of 6 plants.

Some of those seeds may have been from random pollenation in the neighborhood, yet nanners were spotted on the plants in the city , where none were found on the plants in the foothills.

 

[Texicannibus]

I understand how feminized seeds are made what im unsure of is how that process can effect the actual genetic makeup to promote nanners. I just dont see how this process (added to the plant well after maturation) could actual effect its progeny's dna structure/makeup besides it being female. Thats really the question I have.

 

[cannabis59]

I read someone's theory that cannabis is different, not as simple as an xy make up.

It was an interesting book or article,...i'll see if I can find it in my history.

 

[FreezerBoy]

I understand how feminized seeds are made what im unsure of is how that process can effect the actual genetic makeup to promote nanners.

All MJ has the ability to change sex. Using "fathers" with a greater propensity to change increases the likelihood of progeny having the same characteristics. And then those get "feminized" and those get "feminized" and those get...

 

[Texicannibus]

All MJ has the ability to change sex. Using "fathers" with a greater propensity to change increases the likelihood of progeny having the same characteristics. And then those get "feminized" and those get "feminized" and those get...

Agreed all MJ has the ability to 'change' sex. Your saying that any feminized plant shows greater propensity? I argue this as the methods used have nothing to do with the propensity to change its forced. The propensity is pre programmed and I dont believe using chems to force male flowers can change this as its related to dna coding.

My question still stands unless Im missing something FB. How can the feminization process *(forcing reliable strains to produce male flowers) effect its progenies dna that controls its likliness to produce male flowers?

 

[NFR]

I've been unable to keep any of my mothers from feminized seeds stable enough to keep alive for a lengthy period of time. Even the clones try and flower once the roots take if they are from a mother that has been alive for any lengthy time. This is mother patches of mixed strains usually. Clone only and seed stock both fem and stamdard.

My scenario may not apply to many people on here and I havent had a let down because of it. I play with strains because I love to grow. Because I'm more of a commercial grower, I have to bend the limits on some things occasionally. I can look at all kinds of strains with their phenos etc and compare. If you plant a seed, grow it out and smoke it, fem seeds are great but there is absolutely no doubt that fem seeds are for one reason or another weaker if stressed both in my flower rooms and in my mother rooms.

I don't want to offend anyone and I hope you see my post as reasonable. Fem seeds are a great option for most personal growers. Just because some people havent had problems or some people cant logicly explain why it would happen(mutation maybe?) doesnt change what I have been seeing for a few years now.

 

[stagger lee]

NFR,
I honestly have read So many having the same problem exactly, which is the reason I brought it
up in this section. I would bet most growers that grow w/feminized have the same results. Im not calling any1 a liar, just the ones that say theyve been growing sucessfully w/fems for many generations are the few that havent. And imo and experience fems are much easier to herm than standard . I have really rarely even heard of growers having herm prob w/standard genetics. Seedbreeders and seedbanks, have started offering feminized cause why continue to watch business go elsewhere(supply n demand)! Every grow book and mags(4 the most part) state the same opinion.Jorge,greg green,the Rev,Robert Connel(sp?)DJ,ect.. but it is a topic new growers(seedbuyers)dont know alot about. They know MALES are bad so feminized are good! False paranoia they wont identify and pull males in time

 

[Texicannibus]

we have a few plants that are running on 4th gen and showing no loss in vigor that was fem seeds one from dina fem a moby dick, pineapple express, and ive ran a trainwreck for 4 generations and decided to let her go ... no issues just not the tastiest and im into taste. I didnt buy the fems because of being afraid of males I bought them because some strains are only released as fems. We also ran 2 church phenos for 3 generations and 1 AMS. Our technique doesnt include a mother so we run through them pretty fast.

Anyhow just throught Id drop this info on my experiences with fems.

 

[NFR]

...and there we have it. Not all people's experinces are the same under similiar scenarios. No need for people to arm themselves and raid the nearest villiage. lol

 

[OrientalSplash]

I am not an experienced grower but I have read alot on genetics and biology. Also, a fair share on cannabis in general. It is my understanding to produce "Fems" they first get a female to turn hermaphrodilic and then from there the others are pollinated. It would seem whatever female was the most dispositioned to developing male sex organs would be the first to do so and subsequentally be the one to sire the most seeds. If the breeder took care to induce the expression of male organs in only one specific plant and not all then there should be no increase in the likelyhood of developing male organs in offspring. Ofcourse, this is only speculation as I do not have experience in growing feminized seeds nor do I know of the methods being used by the different breeders.

My two cents in regard to the loss of vigor in clones would be it has to do with where the cutting is taken from. That is to say from the time a plant begins developing as it works its way higher new cells are being born constantly. These cells will have slight mutations than their parent cells which will be mostly unnoticed. If you take from one spot you could possible lose vigor and if you took from another you could gain it. Though, I'd imagine 99% of the time you won't do much of either.

Anyways, this is just my thoughts on the matter.

Take care,
Splash