Everyone in Britain could be given a personal 'carbon allowance'

[9Lives]

I don't get these charts..

From here don't we clearly see that methane and CO2 levels are in correlation with temperature ?

I'm sorry i don't see a cooling trend from here at all..im seeing higher lows. If anything this chart imo indicates that it's getting warmer..

Based on my trading experience..

 

[Bobby Stainless]

You don't see the prominent ups and downs in the first graph?

It illustrates, that the Earth has been warming and cooling in phases.

The 2nd graph clearly shows a decline in temp for the last three decades...

 

[sorcival]

cashmunny:

I find it quite hilarious that people like you cant seem to come up with rational logic and
have to fall back on personal slurs and innuendos to try to belittle others into silence
even though they are right and you are wrong.
An insane person in a sane world appears to be insane while a sane person in an insane
world appears also to be insane. The definition of insanity is compiled by the moral
majority of the mass of people in any given world at any given time span in history.
I am quite sure that if a neandertal were to be handed a rational of todays logic
system then he would also react much as you seem to have done over the logistics of
global warming or carbon deficit trading.

The simple fact is that in todays pay-pay-pay world in which you were hatched in, the
mental conclusion of most people, including even you, is that "I can pay and it makes it
all ok."....while nothing could ever be farther from the truth, it is a simplistic answer for
simplistic minds that cant entertain real though processes or endure logic without
having a headache or nervous problems.
Before you go on the attack, dawg, perhaps you should consider yourself in the light
of the world and your insignificant placement in it.
I will be happy to match my IQ, mensa member here - 7 degrees - 24 yrs college, against
your IQ of possible as high as your shoe size any day or night of any given week
anywhere.
You, like so many other blind and stupid people automatically assume that because
someone has fought a war in your freedoms defense that automatically it makes us
insane, well brother - how insane would it be if NO-ONE was willing to fight or die
for their principals as you seem unable or unwilling to do. Are you a vet? Probably
not...and do you also place such an onerous burden of nut-job on the soldiers fallen
and alive with miseries from the War of Independence, Civil war, Indian war, WW 1,
WW 2, Korean war, Vietnam, Gulf war, Desert storm, Iraq war, Afghan war?
OR, are you only to happy to sit down in your taken for granted freedom and 'play'
some stupid war game on your dumb little game machine and think it makes you a 'big
bad person'?
It is truly people with attitudes like yours that I DIDNT fight for, yet I am forced to
have to listen to your drivel BECAUSE I fought for your right to be able to say what
you want to say....even if it is stupid as shit.

Apologies ahead of time to anyone offended by my rant. I get irritated with idiots.

 

[Bobby Stainless]

True American right there^

More of a man than any of us can hope to be. Talk all you want about Health Care and helping people.

The people really putting it on the line, are the armed forces. Despite all the bull shit here, they are dodging bullets.

Dodging bullets, while we sit here comfortable, and arguing about things that have already been decided on.

 

[VerdantGreen]

it shocks me to see that people are still denying climate change. you plug the names of the people who do the research that debunks climate change into google and see who they work for or who their work is funded by - answer = oil companies.

very convenient to deny it - then you can sit on your fat arses doing bugger all about it.

V.

p.s. - its CLIMATE CHANGE NOT GLOBAL WARMING!

 

[SuperHemp]

They've chopped down a lot of our forests, so co2 levels are up. Pretty natural. Chop less, grow more, problem fixed. The recent forest fires are not helping either.

 

[Bobby Stainless]

Al Gore burns more gas, and uses more electricity, than most growers here. However, he is the front man for the Global Warming Swindle. Is there something hypocritical about that?

Carbon is one of the 4 elements that makes up life. Plants take in C02. We are producing far less C02 than we were in the industrial age, however levels remain consistent with the temp swings...

Cap and Trade is a tax on breathing. It will cause power costs to sky rocket.

Do you really think the Govt. is going to let you use your 6k set up, in your illegal grow op?

This is all been planned, and started before many of you were born. There is nothing that can be done now, except prepare yourself. I'd start buying solar panels.

 

[Bobby Stainless]

it shocks me to see that people are still denying climate change. you plug the names of the people who do the research that debunks climate change into google and see who they work for or who their work is funded by - answer = oil companies.

very convenient to deny it - then you can sit on your fat arses doing bugger all about it.

V.

p.s. - its CLIMATE CHANGE NOT GLOBAL WARMING!

Its getting cooler. There is no way to fake that. Facts are facts.

Read the article. It was from Newsweek in 1975, before Climate Change became so profitable.

If you are dumb enough to buy some trees in rural Africa, then Ive got some great Arizona beach front property. Oh and its Green Compliant...

 

[9Lives]

You don't see the prominent ups and downs in the first graph?

It illustrates, that the Earth has been warming and cooling in phases.

The 2nd graph clearly shows a decline in temp for the last three decades...

Well im not sure if looking at past fluctuations really works for climate change in a greenhouse gas sense. If the greenhouse effect is true and more and more greenhouse gases are pumped in to the atmoshphere. The picture would be fundamentally different than in the past.

Just like you could predict what would happen to the dollar and gold ages ago. Price action was not there. But you knew the system was fundamentally flawed..

if you catch my drift..

Either way im on the fence about this not for or against..If it is true. And if the climate is indeed warming we're fucked! If not..i'm sure i can manage to make money with this carbon scheme. That said. I am not against a greener economy. It will eventually create more jobs and better fairer de-centralized production..and de-centrilized energy.

 

[PazVerdeRadical]

I think aliens contracted the jews to enslave all the rest of us to use us to mine gold to give to the aliens.

ok, is this a joke or what?

if not, you are an idiot, plain and simple.

were the spaniards also working for the aliens when they came to america looking for el dorado?



some people...

Paz.

 

[Bobby Stainless]

The graph shows swings over the past 400 thousand years. Way before the concept of Greenhouse gasses, the Earth would still get just as hot...

The Earth has been getting warmer, but RECENT TEMPERATURES have fallen. However, in order to declare a cooling trend it has to last a decade.

You hit the nail on the head. It is all about profits, on something that isn't even real.

 

[VerdantGreen]

Its getting cooler. There is no way to fake that. Facts are facts.

Read the article. It was from Newsweek in 1975, before Climate Change became so profitable.

If you are dumb enough to buy some trees in rural Africa, then Ive got some great Arizona beach front property. Oh and its Green Compliant...

you can always find stats to debunk climate change because there are a lot of companies witha lot of money who have a vested interest in casting doubt.

cooling debunked

another one
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/wires/2009/10/26/ap-impact-statisticians-r_ws_333941.html

its a bit like the tobacco companies knew that tobacco cause cancer like years before it was generally accepted and they spent a lot of money to cast doubt over it for years.


V.

 

[Bobby Stainless]

change.org

Yeah... They aren't biased.

Like I said, send me your money, and I'll plant some trees for you. Bwahahahahahah!

That article is only looking back 10 years. The spikes on the graph, last for 50+ years.

 

[sorcival]

Now that I am past my rant...lol...lets indulge in some REAL logic , "shall we play a game"?

Occam's razor states that when confronted by multiple answers to a given question, then
the most simple may indeed be the correct answer.

While I do believe in climate change, it is more of a belief in natural selectivity of climatic
event change and not man made except in the smallest degree.

Logically, IF the global warming theorist is correct and man has indeed been the causal
event of todays climate model then surely it must stand to reason that man MUST pay
for having a carbon footprint and that will make it ok...EXCEPT for the fact that
mankind is steadily increasing in population and steadily increasing in carbon deficit
usage...therefore, as John Holdren(asshole) so succinctly states, mankind MUST control
the population and decrease the total numbers of people in order to achieve neutrality.
Meanwhile, as global warming increases, the mass population continues to be taxed at an
ever increasing rate of debt to 'offset' their carbon footprint and to pay their debt to
humanity for even daring to be alive and consume a space in the world. These selfsame
Global warming theorists are comprised of persons like John Holdren(eugenicist),
Rockefeller(eugenicist) and many more who have made the statement that we, the
mass population of the world, are 'useless eaters' and need to be carefully culled due
to our genetic propensities. Therefore, according to the Global warming theorists and
eugenicists, we 'useless eaters' OWE a debt to them and we need to pay our taxes
forever till we drop. You of course, being of sound mind and reason can deduce from this
that this line of thought from them leads to mankinds eventual demise after total
debt slavery for a millenia or two.

I say loudly: "BULLSHIT"

Go, if you have intelligent thought, and read the science on the matter. Take into
account who created the vast pollution centers of the world that we all suffer from...
and I believe you will find that it is these self same eugenicists and vastly rich people
who think we are all 'useless eaters'. I believe that you will come to understand the
relationship between the Sun and sunspot activity as it relates to the Earths warming
or cooling phases that have been going on for only like 6 billion years now, even
when the dinos roamed as well as man.
To answer in some small part a statement posted above about the 'oil guys' comment...
it is a fact that most oil companies are now embracing carbon neutrality as a concieved
of means to make vast profits from the 'Green' revolution and carbon neutral deficit
trading derivitave schemes.
You want to see a transfer of wealth FROM the working class of people to the Rich that
will shame the Bankster fraud into tears? Then allow these jerk-off asshole eugenicists
to get the upper hand and implement their carbon trading scam on Global warming, and
you will personally rue the day you ever even heard of such a thing.
Can you say Govt. allowed subsistance earning on a rationed basis for existence while
having to document your reason for being alive and the purpose you serve for your
carbon footprint to be tolerated. Make no mistake, my friends, this is one of the ultimate
goals of thes bastards...to enslave you with your own belief system by giving you
the cause, reasons, and methodology whereby you can pay-pay-pay forever and a day
and NEVER get it paid up. think about all the inherent possibilities in such a pyramidal
scheme...taxes without limits on the individual, penalties and prisons for those too poor
to pay, with eventual egenicide as the end result.
This is not a world I care to try to live in, do YOU?

 

[Bobby Stainless]

Church^

 

[VerdantGreen]

change.org

Yeah... They aren't biased.

Like I said, send me your money, and I'll plant some trees for you. Bwahahahahahah!

That article is only looking back 10 years. The spikes on the graph, last for 50+ years.

no thanks, i just wont create the CO2 in the first place by living my life as sustainably as possible.

the carbon cycle and climate is a very complex thing. sunspots are just one small aspect of that. its the fact that CO2 IS released into our atmosphere through volcanoes at destructive plate margins that our climate is balanced and stable enough to support life. the oil/fuel that has been laid down and stored in the earth's crust over millions of years is getting put back into the atmosphere in a couple of hundred. this WILL have consequences for mankind. the earth will be fine - earth abides - but mankind and many other species will suffer in the short term (short term being the next throusand years or so)

sorcival - the fact you have to cite your IQ as a factor in winning an argument is one of the most tragic things i have seen on an internet forum.

Before you go on the attack, dawg, perhaps you should consider yourself in the light
of the world and your insignificant placement in it.
I will be happy to match my IQ, mensa member here - 7 degrees - 24 yrs college, against
your IQ of possible as high as your shoe size any day or night of any given week
anywhere.

 

[Senor_Bueno]

T.Baggins. No disrepect. Every ass has an opinion. and this donkey says... Carbon allowences has got to be one of the most in your face idiodic seems I have ever heard of.
come on people we are smarter than this.

 

[Bobby Stainless]

Apparently not...

 

[sparkjumper]

I cant believe anyone would willingly support cap and trade and the carbon tax and my only conclusion is people dont understand whats going to happen.

 

[sorcival]

Sorry verdant green, didn't cite my IQ...merely mentioned it in passant...but if you are so
concerned as to hurl epitaphs and slurs...then pm me and I will be glad to quote you a
number, that is IF you can really handle it.
But, point in fact, I am quite proud of the fact that I do have a brain that works and
also that I have the proof from vast testing to offer as proof....and due to the simple
between the lines fact that ALL these years of getting stoned has not impaired my
ability to think or reason in the least, but has instead sharpened my wits to the point of
being able to see through scams and bullshit schemes of wanna be emperors and
dictators that with impunity place such a low value on our lives.
Also, I don't recall having spoken to YOU concerning anything in this thread...or did you just
take it upon yourself to 'boldly go' there and be one of the crowd who belittles those
you cant fathom?
In point of fact, I was not just randomly making a 'brag' statement, but rather pointedly
answering a perceived slight by an opinionated idiot over veterans and their mental
capabilities and capacities for sanity.
I am sorry for your lack of reading and understanding skills, or you would have instantly
picked up on that fact, I mean, it isn't really all that hard to discern now is it?

Shit, I think its time for me to get stoned and forget this thread...path to nowhere.