End of Manned Space flight or only the beginning?

[ParadigmShift]

I hope they find a way to utilize the Constellation infrastructure already built instead of just wasting it. The moon rover especially, there was a working prototype and it was cool! Didn't they have a Pluto probe 90% done, and cancelled it only to build and send another? Did they just "throw away" the old one? This is the kind of start and stop waste I want to see eliminated. Once a project starts it should be prohibited to stop it. Modify ok, but not stop it.

A lot of wasted money, that is forsure...
New Horizons is the last mission in NASA's New Frontiers mission category, larger and more expensive than Discovery missions but smaller than the Flagship Program. The cost of the mission (including spacecraft and instrument development, launch vehicle, mission operations, data analysis, and education/public outreach) is approximately $650 million over 15 years (from 2001 to 2016). An earlier proposed Pluto mission – Pluto Kuiper Express – was cancelled by NASA in 2000 for budgetary reasons. Further information relating to an overview with historical context can be found at the IEEE website and would give further background and details, with more details regarding the Jupiter flyby.
The New Horizons space probe was launched January 19 2006 and is expected to do its fly-by of Pluto on July 14 2015. The probe is expected to leave our solar system come 2029.
This means that the N.H. space probe has to travel at an average speed of 36,360mph(58,536km/h) in order to do it's Pluto fly-by in 8.5 years. When launched it flew the distance of the Moon in 9 hours, it flew the distance of Mars in 78 days. This is an unmanned spacecraft. The fastest manned craft speed is 4,519mph(7,273km/h). The fastest bullet out of a muzzle of a handgun is 2,727mph(4,389km/h), The New Horizons goes 13.3 times faster then the fastest bullet out of a handgun...
To put things into perspective, I can't even get my pizza delivery guy to deliver my pizza within a half hour...
NASA (Never. A. Straight. Answer.) hasn't been able to land another man on the Moon since '72, but now doing out of solar system explorations? Something doesn't add up.
My personal view on this, is that the budget would be better suited to help people here on planet Earth...
Just my 2cents...
Peace
God Speed

 

[whiterabbit9]

we know more about outer space than the planet we live on....as cool as space exploration is, we have a LOT more pressing issues and I'm personally for the elimination of any pork from the national budget...

why ?

 

[sackoweed]

I voted other as well.. I think we need some trendy ass cool looking Tin hats... as well as a possible wardrobe light and trendy for summer and winter.. peace..

sackO

 

[Space Toker]

the military wastes (or uses up) $700+ Billion a year, NASA less than $20 Billion. So I don't understand those picking on NASA when saying something is wasteful spending? Why the hell doesn't anyone mention the f'n military? we do not need all that offense, moreso than even during soviet days! Space Exploration should be funded more, not less, and funding it better and taking care of priorites on earth are not mutually exclusive at all. They compliment each other! I can't believe the ignorance on this topic from some, keep spending on wars and keep pissing away money down the toilet just like the Drug War. Spend it on space and we will get it all back 10 or 100 or 1000 fold or more! where do you think Cat scans came from? We would not have a lot of our technology were it not for the space program. Going into space can help the poor and everyone on earth a lot more than staying here and stagnating can!

 

[swampdank]

It wont be the end of manned space exploration. The Secret Astronaut corps has been all over the solar system already. When the Govt got ahold of that Element 115 or whatever Nasa became obsolete. Nasa is just a front to keep us thinking the technology is infant. In reality the govt has way better vessels to travel with.

 

[alaskan]

Nasa is just a front to keep us thinking the technology is infant. In reality the govt has way better vessels to travel with.

This.

Do people really believe that all of the "credible" ufo videos on youtube are spacemen?

 

[swampdank]

This.

Do people really believe that all of the "credible" ufo videos on youtube are spacemen?

Thats the thing. Its just another round of top secret military operations using the ufo front to cover up. Why do you think the black budget is so much?

 

[Space Toker]

Our country is broke, who gives a shit about space right now?

Our country spends more than it makes, and it makes a lot, so we spend way too much. That is a big difference from being broke, we'd be fine if we didn't waste so much on wars. A lot of countries would like to be as "broke" as the US!

 

[Space Toker]

It wont be the end of manned space exploration. The Secret Astronaut corps has been all over the solar system already. When the Govt got ahold of that Element 115 or whatever Nasa became obsolete. Nasa is just a front to keep us thinking the technology is infant. In reality the govt has way better vessels to travel with.

I would not rule out what you say, but would consider it unlikely. For the sake of argument, let's say the military does have far better space capabilities than NASA. What are they doing with it? Reserving the privelege of space travel for a handful of about 100 super-elite people "in the know"? Conquering backwards alien civilizations for the benefit of these uber-rich? How would they keep something that big a secret and what purpose would it serve? If many more than 100 know, the word would have been leaked. And even if they are super rich, 100 people are not nearly as big a market for space travel as millions and someday billions of people would be. So it would be counterproductive to "deny the masses". So why would they?

Besides, I know aliens exist because I was one in a former life!
I had a dream of strange constellations far more detailed than any we have on Earth, at least 2 of them with stars bright enough to be seen in the daytime. In this dream, one of them had two bright clearly visible nebulas amongst a dozen or so reddish-orange stars and one really bright white one. Someone said "that's the Eel nebula" (it was much like the color of your avatar Paradigmshift, and the white star near it was colored like the center of the galaxy in your avatar and appeared a bit brighter than Venus and was at least twice as big as Jupiter appears). I was looking out on them just after sunset, while having a barbeque at my place (as a human on Earth). They were both bright, but the Eel nebula was as wide as half the full moon and as wide as the sliver moon and it was awesome! Then there was another constellation, also in the southern sky, that had a tremendous amount of orangish stars, maybe 100 or 200, and was highly detailed and took up more space than the Big Dipper. A small offshoot of it or nearby constellation was smaller but densely packed with orangish stars, a vivid open cluster. The stars had a strange habit of appearing orange in dawn or dusk conditions or up to an hour after sunrise. At night they would be yellowish green like a firefly or a mix of yellowish and reddish. It was wild!

OK don't really believe I was an alien
but it was so vivid and familiar!

 

[Space Toker]

what? I was expecting someone mocking my story by now!

 

[Space Toker]

I ain't lettin it go that easily!

 

[Space Toker]

Maybe the private sector will fill the roll nicely, these rockets they have seem to be ready to go. I'd like to go see Mars as a tourist someday or even move there, of course things would have to start progressing a lot quicker for that to happen.

 

[Space Toker]

maybe a probe mission to Neptune? 2030 something, common now I may not be alive then, let's get this show on the road already!

 

[Space Toker]

man I think that probe to Neptune is cancelled too! First Constellation, and this probe, now what? And the funding went UP by $3 billion (16 to 19), where is that money going?
They have to develop some focus and come up with a clear plan!

 

[Space Toker]

well there are private and (ugh dread) military projects launching so maybe there is still hope yet for us common folk space travelling sometime soon!

 

[Space Toker]

robotics, ugh dread the thought, ok where humans CAN'T go they are great but we should go where we can too! Now they are talking Robots everywhere AND humans God knows when! come on, we need to get it together here~!

 

[genkisan]

I agree that NASA is mismanaged financially and the private sector should take the lead. Anything the govenment controls or finances becomes an overgrown ineffcient monster!!!!

Oh yes, and private sector has such a fucking shining record of honesty, efficiency and transparency.......brings things like Enron and the bail-out fiasco to mind.


Bugger space for now...until we learn to live on this planet in a long-term sustainable manner, we have zero right fucking about in space.

Yes it is nice to be able to detect ELE items like big honkin' comets and the like....
Problem is, even if we did spot one headed straight down our gullats, we can't do jack shit about it......
Destroying or even deflecting an object a few miles in diameter moving at 50+ miles a second is SOOOO far beyond our technology level it is not even remotely amusing.

 

[gingerale]

well thats why we have to DEVELOP the capabilities to detect and destroy such objects! it might take 50 years even if we devoted all our resources to it. which is why its imperative we spend the money TODAY to make it happen one little advancement at a time.

the constellation program was garbage anyways, im glad it got cancelled instead of turning into yet another boondoggle.

personally i think private space companies are going to play a bigger and increasing role, as companies like scaled composites and virgin galactic seek to put tourists into orbiting hotels and such. it will be reserved for the extremely wealthy at first of course, but over time the expertise will increase, bugs will be worked out, and costs will come down.

the costs really arent going to start coming down though until we get a permanent colony of some kind established. moon colony is great because its resource rich and we have the advantage of a low gravity well. with a solid ground below our feet, and with rudimentary services such as power and fuel generation in place, we can build far more complicated structures than we could on something like the ISS. we can build real manufacturing facilities to build stuff like spaceships, and then we can launch them FAR CHEAPER from the moon than from earth. a huge percentage of the cost of spacecraft is in launching all that weight from the earth's steep gravity well. if you can make your fuel and mine your iron ore and other materials on the moon, and build the space ship right there in space, you just saved an assload of cash!

once we get to that stage, with a firm foothold off-planet, things will grow exponentially from there. it will then become cheaper and easier to do other things that are near impossible now, such as build mining craft to mine asteroids, set up a supply chain in space. there are unfathomable riches out there in the asteroid belt and other planets, just waiting to be taken.

and at that point it will also get way cheaper to launch people from earth, too. when you no longer need to launch a huge, complicated space ship but instead can launch a simple pod with basic life support and not much else, to rendevzous with another craft in orbit and offload its cargo, the pod weighs much less and takes a hell of a lot less rocket (and fuel) to launch.

oh, and if you can manufacture fuel on the moon (easy to do with all the elements and huge abundance of solar radiation there) you can just drop it in pods down into the earth's atmosphere, and use that to fuel any spacecraft coming up.

 

[Space Toker]

excellent post Gingerale, although I tend to be much more optimistic than you (maybe unrealistically so but hell I am a dreamer). I think if deflecting an asteroid became a real need (like if one is proven to be headed straight for us), we have the technology now or soon to be able to do it. If we know it is going to hit but it is well in the future, we can gradually deflect it with a space probe, inching it away with each pass until it no longer poses a threat. Destroying one would create dangerous debris and is not advisable. Besides they are too valuable to destroy.
Now that they are finding all kinds of planet candidates, people will hopefully get behind efforts to go there. Solar Sails are proving themselves as we speak with a Japanese probe, and they could be used for manned vessels as well. Private companies are progressing nicely. The future is looking brighter and brighter.

 

[treewizard]

Scientific progress is pushed forward by need. Better space than war. If we don't kill ourselves first, it is only the beginning. Otherwise its over but only because we are all dead.