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Diary of a bagseed breeder.

kaotic

We're Appalachian Americans, not hillbillys!
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Hello all you potheads out there. Lets start this off with a little introduction and project objective. As for the intro, well I'm not too good at that stuff kind of anti social if you know what I mean. As for the objective, GOOD POT of course. Basicly my thing is bagseed breeding. Now, before I start getting flamed let me explain myself. I know a lot of people think bagseed is a waste of time, but I seem to have it in abundance these days so WTF it's what I like to do. There are untold amounts of quality genetics hidden away in bagseed, especially in my region. I live in the second highest region for production in the U.S. Hence, there are a lot of very underated and unmolested gene pools waiting to be worked over. I've been collecting seeds for years that have come from the growers in the area. This is stuff you can't find anywhere else. Most of these seedlines date back 30 years or more.
This stuff is a family affair in these mountains. Most of the plants are openly pollinated in medium sized plots as it has been since before I was born. The growers always use seeds from the previous harvest and it is a repeating cycle. I can't be positive what the lineage of the seeds are but I'm about 95% sure they came from good ole Mexico. The perplexing thing is they all look to be sativa indica mixes. I've grown a lot of seeds from mexican brick so I feel confident in saying that I see a good bit of difference in the stuff I grow and the brick seeds I used to mess with. Same as with commercial seedlines I've had experience with. My guess is that the stuff grown by the croppers around here originated south of the border but was tinkered with a little bit 30 years ago or it was tinkered with in mexico for production purposes. But anyways, that long ago there were'nt that many major places this stuff was coming in from in large quantitys. I guess they could be Columbian or Jamaican or even African I just don't know. If anyone has any clue as to where most of the imported weed came from in the southeastern U.S that long ago please enlighten me, I would like to know what I'm working with.
Now on with the good stuff. I have a minimal setup, flower cab, mother space, veg cab. I've been doing this for about ten years now and I've found out that I'm just not the type of person to deal with the upkeep of a large operation. It takes me longer for my parental selection for this reason. If you couple that with the fact that you have to go through a lot more seeds to find good breeding material with bagseed you should understand that this is not a fast progressing project. For each run I reach into my seed box and blindly pull out a pack of seeds I saved from some locally grown pot or that was gifted by the croppers. I pop every seed I have from that group and only the strong survive. Sometimes I find a good candidate sometimes I don't. The smoke test says it all.
As for my breeding everything I have done so far are hybrids. That is how I plan to keep it until I run out of unknown genetics, but I don't plan on letting that happen. What I want out of this project is what everyone wants, a short fast flowering plant with killer yeild and potency that is uniquely my own. But we all know how often you find a plant that has it all, I haven't yet. For the first cross I wanted to enure that I could have a short fast flowering indoor sized plant. My selected mother came from a batch of seeds that came from a family on the KY TN border. The plant looked about as indica dominant as any but just refused to grow any large fan leaves, even outside. The largest leaf on this thing was maybe the size of a hand. Not that it matters but I found it appealing. It was short and stocky, extremely branchy, to the point that it was wider than it was tall it's whole lifespan. The potency was average but the taste and smell were what caught me. This plant was just plain dank. It tasted like dirt, rosemary and skunk. And I mean REAL skunk. So here I stood with a perfectly good mother wondering what other traits this beauty was hiding so I needed to find a father. As I said before in this first cross I was looking for a short fast flowering plant. So thats what I needed in my father also. I was not fortunate enough to find a suitable father in the same seed batch as the mother. I decided I wanted to find a father with a known pedigree to start this with so I can ensure better results with the first cross. After poking around for a couple of weeks I decided to use a micro pheno Master Low male. Don't hate, I do what I want. The father was a total of 6.5 inches when it decided it had served it's life purpose. I'm not looking to stabilize the auto flower trait. I wanted to decrease the size and shorten the flower cycle. In the offspring there were two distinct phenos, a columner one that resembled the father but larger and faster to bud with the mothers taste and smell. The other one was branchy and short like the mother but did not taste like either of the parents. It tasted slightly like pine and ammonia but was not a real strong taste. It also yeilded a little more. After the smoke test I decide to use the columner pheno that retained the mothers taste for my next cross. They both had the same potency as the mother and were ready to chop at six weeks.
I'm about written out for tonight so I will bring you guys up to date on the next two generations until the point at wich I am now. Maybe I'll get some pics up if I remember to buy batteries for my cam,,,,,,,,,, and learn how to use it to. I'll also try to give you guys some specs on my setup also. Good night from the top of the mountain.
 

Smoke68

Active member
Hey Kaotic, welcome to ICMag!!!
Looks as though we have another bagseed breeder lol.
So Kaotic, what is your indoor setup?
 

kaotic

We're Appalachian Americans, not hillbillys!
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I'm having issues postin pics here wondering if anyone can help? When I submit it says to remove the URL's from the post. How do I do that without removeing the link to the pics?
 

kaotic

We're Appalachian Americans, not hillbillys!
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Didnt do anything different this time. It seems to be working now. That was a Speed Queen cut. My beautiful F-4 pheno.
 

zappa66

Member
I hear where you are coming from; every strain was a bagseed once! Some people a bit stuck up about names and such…as you say the test is in the smoke.

Oh and about the open pollination, medium size family plot, 30 year old genetics, etc. The “redneck” pot in Vermont is grown the same way except most stuff is afghani in lineage.

I’ll be watching this!
 

kaotic

We're Appalachian Americans, not hillbillys!
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Here's a little more info.

Here's a little more info.

Flower cab: 21" x 21" 8 23 watt cfl's one 70 watt hps in a homebuilt reflector. 120 volt computer fan for ventilation. 16 plants, next run I'm going for 25. 14 S.Q cuts, 2 of my cross Mexican sativa x Masterlow.

mother space: one 42 watt cfl in a reflector made out of a paint can cut in half lengthwise and lined with foiltape. I have 3 mothers right now S.Q, Thunk in reveg and my M.S x M.L.

Seedlings and clones: Mini fridge with a 65 watt flourex. No ventilation I just keep the door open. The seedlings in the fridge are my cross also. They are Local sativa/indica mix x (kentucky indica x Masterlow). I will be picking a father out of this for a cross to the M.S x M.L mother above.
 

kaotic

We're Appalachian Americans, not hillbillys!
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Zappa66

Zappa66

Thats how its been down here as long as I can remember. If the laws were a little bit more lax around here there would probly be a couple good strains that would have become known a little bit more. I read somewhere that a long time ago the commercial growers in mexico crossed there sativas with indicas to up production for export weed. I dont know anything about it but my guess is that that is where these genes come from. When you grow the local strains from seed you end up with a couple sativa phenos every time that resemble seeds grown from mexi brick.
 

kaotic

We're Appalachian Americans, not hillbillys!
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JustinCase

JustinCase

I don't think I'll be stopping this for a while. I grew the seeds from the first sac I ever had, I could not believe people payed money for this stuff when it came with seeds.
 
Great work Kaotic.....some people shun bagseed because all they've ever heard about it is hemp and hermies. I don't think that could be farther from the truth. I've had excellent results from bagseed and grow some every year even if i'm growing clones or bought seeds. I love finding something special and knowing that you found it and someone didn't do it for you.

It's the difference between going fishing and fishing in a stocked pond....some people won't understand that....but some will.
 

Prof Sublime

Hard working pothead
Veteran
Hey Kaotic wats going on over there?
I read your paragraph and I dig what you do. Ive got some bagseed growing right now btw. Keep doing what your doing. Any bud/flower pictures?

Peace :joint:
 

kaotic

We're Appalachian Americans, not hillbillys!
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I just flipped the switch to 12/12 last night. I wont start counting down the flowering period until I see the first signs of new flower growth. These will be ready to chop in 7 to 8 weeks. The two cuts of my cross will be ready in 6 weeks.

Nice purple stems, not a deficiency either. Mandala Mike did a great job with these seeds.


Clones were taken two weeks apart. The taller ones averaged 7 inches when put into flower, the others were 3 to 4. I'm waiting to see how crammed it will get on the high side compared to the low side. I have room to bump the number of cuts up to 25 if I can determine how much veg time time they need before hitting the room.


Fresh cuttings, M.S x M.L on the left and S.Q on the right.
 
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kaotic

We're Appalachian Americans, not hillbillys!
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The good stuff


My mutants, ignore the labels on the cups as they are pretty old. The first are a set of twins from my (Kentucky Indica x Masterlow) x Local Sativa/Indica mix. The second is a seedling with split cotyledons from the same batch.




All the S.Q clones you see here are from a trifoliate mother. It had the three sets up until the third or fourth node. Out of that same pack of seeds there were also two plants with split cotyledons like the one you see here. One of them happened to be a male and it had a light dusting of trichs on the leaves so I pollinated the mother with this male. This was over a year ago, I still have not tryed any of these F2's.

J.R you are wxactly right.

Professor S, sorry I don't have any older pics but I will from here on out.
 

JARofHERB

Member
Wow, thoes f2's sound like they are gonna be really dank for sure. Its always nice to get a great male once and a while. People seem to forget how important it is to breed cannabis. :joint:
 
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kaotic

We're Appalachian Americans, not hillbillys!
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JARofHERB

JARofHERB

A good father is hard to come by, I just might have lucked out and had one fall in my lap. We'll see when I get around to testing his progeny against the mother plant.
 
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