Ceramic Metal Halide (CMH)

[GreenScreen]

so freezer boy would i be better off buying a 250 HPS kit from HTG for 117 because it comes with a HPS bulb ( always nice to have an extra bulb) the ballast already built in a box and a reflector??

http://www.htgsupply.com/viewproduct.asp?productID=47994

then also would a 400 watt CMH be to hot?? because i could upgrade to the 400 HPS on the HTG site for only 2 dollars more.

http://www.htgsupply.com/viewproduct.asp?productID=47929

I would still add a cool tube to this setup no matter what..
thanks for all the help

 

[1love1earth]

I dunno, I had purpling both on my outdoor grow (obviously due to the change in temp), even turned more blackish color. I also had it on my indoor grow under my CMH's, but two things could have come into play: #1. Cutting off nutes for a flush #2. Cutting the day cycle way back, plants were being cut a tiny bit early, so I cut the daylight hours ~1.5 hours per day for about 8 days before harvest, just to squeeze that last drop.

Both of those could have caused the purpling, which I saw on my hashberry mostly.

There was also reddish and yellow hues, typical "fall colors", this came on mostly in the last 2 weeks, again I'd say likely due to the flush and the day cycle. Canna coco, canna nutes.

I don't know where the whole "it's some purps" crap comes from as far as "street quality" benchmarking comes from, but I've always associated purple with mostly outdoor temp changes, though there is always the off-chance of it being inherint to the genetics. Either way, I don't see what purple could possible have to do with quality. Unless of course it's a sign that the plant was simply allowed to mature fully, and not chopped way early, which of course isn't saying a whole ton about the quality to begin with.

Regardless, curious about the coloring.



A final few questions of sorts however:

#1. I'm running SCROG this time around 8 days into 12/12, the dense vegetation below the screen doesn't let much light through. Is there any benefit yield wise to providing light from below (like the floor pointed upwards) to this mass of fan leaves? If so, I've got 2x 5000k 105 watt CFLs would it help them at all? ~~~~Or should I just leave them be?

#2. What about adding a 3rd light, sidefiring/sidemounted? My room is 2.5 ft wide by 6.5 ft long by 6 ft tall. I'd really like to do anything and everything I can to max out my yield this time around. I can grab a 250 watt HPS kit for reasonably cheap, but I'm wondering if it's going to be worth it, and if it'll conflict with my two 400 watt CMH's shining down from above.

#2.

 

[GreenScreen]

hmm well that post above me was just a big waste of space.... lol
anyways nice pics HD look awesome hope i can get purple plants too..

 

[FreezerBoy]

so freezer boy would i be better off buying a 250 HPS kit from HTG for 117 because it comes with a HPS bulb ( always nice to have an extra bulb) the ballast already built in a box and a reflector??

http://www.htgsupply.com/viewproduct.asp?productID=47994

then also would a 400 watt CMH be to hot?? because i could upgrade to the 400 HPS on the HTG site for only 2 dollars more.

http://www.htgsupply.com/viewproduct.asp?productID=47929

I would still add a cool tube to this setup no matter what..
thanks for all the help

Depends on your DIY abilities and interest. Only 20% of the light points towards the garden. The ballast kit has nothing to prevent you from burning yourself or tripping over wires. If you want that other 80% of light, you need a reflector. If you want your wiring to be safe and your feet and hands unburned, the ballast needs to, at least, be mounted if not enclosed. Whether you buy or build is up to you.

I've been looking at the same HTG. It's a cute little unit. My only concern is HTG is known for it's weak ass ignitors. Make sure you keep the wiring between ballast and lamp to a minimum. 10 feet or less.

Is a 400 too hot for ... what? How much suckification you got? Try reading through The 400 Watt Club for clues on what others are doing.

 

[1love1earth]

well, so here's a question:

I've decided I'm definately going to add a single 250 watt to my current setup. I'd go with a 400 watt, but I think it'll push my breaker a bit too much, and be generally overkill.

So that said, the ballast in the kit is digital, which means a no-go on CMH (heard digital compatible bulbs are coming soon, should be really killer?) right?

That said, it includes the 250 watt HPS bulb.

Does anyone see any problems with running the 250 watt HPS in addition to my current 2x 400 watt CMH's?

The plan is to have the 250 watt HPS mounted on the wall, shooting light horizontally, while my two CMH's fire downwards.

My concern is that in mixing the spectrums, the plants could get confused (the shoots like to "tune into" a spectrum right?), and it would do more harm than good, or at least have a "zero effect".

I'm looking at buying soon, so any info would be greatly appreciated.

The kit is going to cost $140 shipped or so, which I figure I should be able to "effectively" make back from the increased yield, althogh this is a purely personal med grow, I always try to track bang for the buck.

Let me know what to do!

 

[GreenScreen]

i have a TD-100 so about 100cfm give or take without a carbon scrubber so im guessing i should stick with a 250. footprint is 2X2

 

[1love1earth]

i have a TD-100 so about 100cfm give or take without a carbon scrubber so im guessing i should stick with a 250. footprint is 2X2

well, to cover a 4 sq ft growspace (2x2 right?), you're hitting 62 watts per sq ft with a 250 watt, very good, 400 would be overkill by alot

 

[messn'n'gommin']

Why? Why would you even respond to that? Why would you respond that way? Why is there sooooooo much ego here.

Some of you are so sensitive.

I think it mostly comes down to pride. Most here put a lot of time and effort into their grows and it becomes (at least in that person's own eyes) a reflection of that individual. Hence, someone bad-mouthing a grow is the same as bad-mouthing the grower. Me? Even though I have responded in kind to the insults of spoiled, petulant children, I now try to avoid trading insults with them and try to stick to the facts. I have learned over the course of my 50+ years that once you get into an argument with a child, you have already lost the argument. What OzWhizzle and his ilk don't realize is, I don't grow for him, or anyone else. I grow for me. So, him calling my setup a "9 cent grow" is a badge of honor of sorts. I am my grandmother's grandson and I love a good bargain and having less than $300 in two 250's and a 2X4 closet growing the dankest bud I have ever smoked is a source of pride to me. If a troll really wants to insult me, it will tell me it is enamored of my persona and wants to be just like me. It will tell me it values my image over any substance to my soul. It will tell me my money is more valuable than what little wisdom I have. To me, the measure of a man (or woman) is counted in the number of their friends and not the size of their bank account. But, I agree, arguing with children doesn't just detract from the thread, it detracts from the, otherwise, decent human beings who have value as a resource to those of us who seek their knowledge and wisdom.

Namaste, mess
(Golden Leaf Award winner)

 

[hoosierdaddy]

I can guarantee you the purple thing is has nothing to do with deficiency.
The light pattern I am seeing makes it perfectly clear what is happening.
When I provide some clearer shots with the stalks turned so you can see, you will also agree with me.
You can even see where a bud was shading a part of the stalk and that part would be bright green...and fade to purple only where the CMH light starts to hit it.

My set-up has a 400CMH on top of a 150HPS vertically in a tube.
The plants down where the HPS is shining, are not showing purple at all...as they did when they were grown under HPS only.
The plant in my last pics has no leaf discoloration where it only sees HPS.
Granted, this plant had been flushed for about 2.5 wks when that shot was taken, and the leaves were lightening anyway, but the only ones that turn color are the ones that are seeing CMH.
That plant was in a 1.5 qt pot, gave me a big fat sack 1/4-1/2oz or so. (dad dont weigh dope)
And Ozwimpple can't have any! HA!

 

[AndreNicky]

The main reason i'm thinkin deficency is because the leaf curl+the discoloration is usually a sign of ph problems. I could be wrong tho, looking forword to some better shots!

 

[GreenScreen]

ok ill grab the 250 I think I'm just gonna do it like i always do K.I.S.S. and just buy the premade ballast from HTG and then if anything goes wrong ill just replace it with the stuff from phillips. that way ill have a box and stuff to put it in .. well now its time to save up and buy the stuff thanks everyone

 

[HairlessCaveApe]

Heres what I noticed bout the purp. This shure the fukk aint no controle tho.. I started with a normal mom under flouros. I tried to put her under my 400hps when she got a bit big. She started purplin on her petoles and yellowin on her leafs. I let her like that for a month and it got like I just said. Her cuttings wouldnt root at this point. They wouldnt root for 3 weeks. None ofem. Then I got the 400 watt cmh on the 6th. Its now the 13th and I see a shure improvment. The purplin has just bout stoped. -But theres still a slight lavender discoloration growin outta her petoles WHEREVER THE CMH HITS THEM. I dont know if this is how the light makes the plant grow, or if this is still my origional purplin on its way out, but I think if it was it woulda beem gone by now. Even new growth under this cmh is commin in slightly purp. Like I said, this is hardly a test, but this is what I saw so far. The green could be commin in a bit lusher too. I kinda like the light but its not as good as flouros for motherin. Not from what I seen so far anyhow. I figure Il know how I feel about it solid in a week or 2. Anybody got any recomendatrions on how far to keep it from my canope?

 

[onegreenday]

400 watt EYE Ceramic Metal Halide (CMH)

400 watt EYE Ceramic Metal Halide (CMH)

In 400 watt (EYE Cera Arc,CMT400/HOR)

The EYE CMH mean lumens (32,800) is over 10% more than the
Phillips CMH at (29,600) in the horizontal position

and over 15% more (32,800) than the Phillips (27,840)
mean lumens in the vertical position (5,000 more lumens).

what's with the big drop in mean lumens for the Phillips CMH versus
the EYE CMH?

Looks like the EYE maintains lumens better than the Phillips

the Phillips has a slightly better spectrum
than the EYE but only slightly.

 

[SB7]

For Me the CMT400/HOR was almost 3 times the cost and much harder to get.
On paper they look good, although looking at the SPD it looks they put more their of their lumens into 3 peaks as opposed to the CDM400/HOR which tends to spread it out alittle more evenly. Granted it has better Lumen maintenance but I wonder if that's just maintaining the peaks ( that don't appear to be at particularly useful wavelengths for our needs.
My CDM400 has produced excellent results for my application (Cab). It keeps them very short/thick andit produces less heat than anything else I've tried. I wonder what the heat is like for the EYE CMT400/HOR ?

SB7

 

[CTSV]

1600w of CMH

1600w of CMH

 

[minds_I]

Hello all,

I have a question...its going on the 9th day of flowering and I have not seen the reaction I am used to seeing at this day in flower.

So to the point, does CMH have a longer flowering period? Is there a delay of flowering onset?

thanks for your replies,

minds_I

 

[messn'n'gommin']

In 400 watt (EYE Cera Arc,CMT400/HOR)

The EYE CMH mean lumens (32,800) is over 10% more than the
Phillips CMH at (29,600) in the horizontal position

and over 15% more (32,800) than the Phillips (27,840)
mean lumens in the vertical position (5,000 more lumens).

what's with the big drop in mean lumens for the Phillips CMH versus
the EYE CMH?

Looks like the EYE maintains lumens better than the Phillips

the Phillips has a slightly better spectrum
than the EYE but only slightly.

Lumens are a function of what humans can see. PAR is a function of what plants can use. Basically, it is comparing apples to oranges. The following links will explain it better than me.

“Lumens and Lux and PAR, Oh My!,” by PreacherManZero
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=17118

From "Reefkeeping," an online magazine
Part I: “What is Light?,”
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/sj/index.php
Part II: “Photons,”
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-03/sj/index.php
Part III: “Making Sense of Light Measures,”
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-04/sj/index.php
Part IV: “Color Temperature,”
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-05/sj/index.php

Effect of Light Quality on Cannabinoid Content of Cannabaceae
http://www.beckleyfoundation.org/bib/doc/crl/Cannabis_the_plant/Mahlberg_1983.pdf

Hope these help some. Good luck!

Namaste, mess

 

[onegreenday]

Messin, thanks for the links.

But you missed the point of the post.

The EYE CMH has more

lumens (light output) of a

very similar spectrum as the Phillips CMH.

More 'very similar spectrum' light output

for your electric $$$$$

Lumens are a function of what humans can see. PAR is a function of what plants can use. Basically, it is comparing apples to oranges.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

Read through this post, or better yet the links that messin is providing, and I think you will see that it's you missing the point, onegreenday.

 

[HairlessCaveApe]

Hey Howdy CTSV! Now theres not a bit of purple on your plants. Did you ever notice any purplin with this light? Im not a purp freak and this aint a criteek. Personaly I see purplin as a sighn of stress unless its strain specific. Im just askin cause I got a slight purplin/stress issue that Im startin to outgrow with the help of a 400 cmh and I could apreciate the referance. Its good to see your plants lookin so good under the cmh. It makes me feal I made the rite choice in lights! How'd yours do in veg?